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The thing you LA boosters just can't seem to understand is that the IOC only cares about what the host city will do for "the Olympic movement." The sports federations are not interested in urban devel

Sigh! I've tried not to get too involved in the tit-for-tatting in the whole LA debate. And tried to give you the benefit of the doubt and allow that you're a passionate and blinkered supporter of LA

I am struck by the statement that "there is no reason to attack LA." There is no reason to attack any city or any people in any city. This is the horror of terrorism. Whichever city wins any Olympi

For someone who "doesn't want the Olympics to come to L.A.", you sure could fool anyone with your facetious Paris posts, you pr!ck. For all your talk that the IOC are a bunch of corrupt cronies, & drain all the resources from the host cities, & blah, blah, blah, & that L.A. has "better things to do anyway", you sure get your panties in a complete bind, though, if someone dare say that Paris is the city to beat. It's like you get irritated at the fact that how could anyone (especially the IOC) reject, "wonderful" L.A., even though you claim that you "don't want" the Olympics there.

Why do you even care what anyone posts about Paris If you "don't want" the Olympics in L.A. Or better yet, even bother posting at all if you can't stand the IOC as much as you say you do. I think that you just enjoy being an "a-hole" with your needless sarcasm, not to mention all of the anti-Rio doomsday sh!t that you've been posting lately. If Paris wins 2024, I'm sure you'll be posting your anti-Paris nonsense from day one, too. 

Anyway, got news for you, though. L.A. is bound to get the Olympics anyway. If not 2024, then very likely 2028. So tighten up your panties, cuz those resource leeching gnomes from Lausaunne are coming to "sunny" L.A. sooner or later. So go hide your tax dollars now. 

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22 hours ago, baron-pierreIV said:

Even in terms of bidding losses w/in the last 30 years, France is ahead there (4 French, including Annecy) whereas the US has only lost in the 2012 and 2016 bids.  So, indeed, that "loss" record favors this Paris bid.  

If we're going to count Annecy then we should count 1992 and 1994 Anchorage, Alaska bid. Also maybe even 1998 bid of SLC, even though we did win in for 2002.

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16 minutes ago, LatinXTC said:

If we're going to count Annecy then we should count 1992 and 1994 Anchorage, Alaska bid. Also maybe even 1998 bid of SLC, even though we did win in for 2002.

 

Yeah, forgot about those.  Was just typing that factoid on the fly.  But those 1990 early winter bids were so minor though compared to the Annecy bid which already cost the French $18 million.  I am sure the 2 Anchorage bids; and the SLC for 1998 bid collectively cost no more than $5 million.  

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The IOC has a very tough decision to make in this race.  Do they turn down Paris for the fourth time when they are in desperate need of bids from Western Europe, or do they reject the U.S for the third time since the 2012 race, which means that in a 12 year span they will have rejected the three biggest cities in the U.S.

Given the Eurocentric nature of the IOC, I think they'll go with Paris, but I do think many IOC members will feel that they shouldn't reject the U.S. again and all of the corporate dollars that staging the Games in the U.S. will bring.

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Voting for or against LA will hurt them either way. Which are they willing to work with.

Who do they want to upset? The US or France?

Paris has lost, but so has the US, and to two of its best cities.

Brushing off an LA loss won't be that easy to shake.

The city boast more venues than the organizers know what to do with, with 2 new stadiums under construction and completed before 2024. It has the Athletes village built and the media village almost complete. A transportation system that will add 3 new lines by 2024 and an unheard of 88% approval rating.

Saying no to LA is almost saying no to logic.

The IOC needs to cut the crap with all the anti american bs... its what got them into the whole Rio fiasco to begin with.

 

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Jesse, it's NOT anti-Americanism or anything like that.  There is ONLY one Games to go around each quadrennium.  By tradition, every 3rd Summer Olympics, whether by design or accident, swings back to the (most compact) continent where it all started, Europe.  And it just so happens it looks like the stars are aligning that way again for 2014.  The IOC knows too that LA will be Olympic-bidding until that word goes out of style.  They'll be back.  

If LA was wise, they could have sat out this 2024 cycle and lined up all their ducks for 2028 instead; but they like the thrill of the chase, the hunt.  So it's damn the torpedoes,regardless of who the competition is.  (The USOC and the IOC know a sucka when they see one.  wink-wink.)  

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If the IOC members are worried about pissing off LA or Paris, they could always go with Budapest :)

The decision is still over a year away. There are still big holes in the bids (namely, who is going to pay for them). 

There's no evidence of "anti american bs" is host city selections. The US has hosted twice in the past 20 years; four times in the past 36. The only nation that comes close to that level of hosting is... Canada (hosting three times in the past 40 years). NYC lost because it was a crappy bid. 

Rio wasn't a fiasco. 

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Lets make a list shall we, of all the Western European Cities that can possibly host the Summer Games, not that want too but that can POSSIBLY do it. Berlin Munich Hamburg, Paris Lyon Marseille, Madrid Barcelona Valencia Seville, London Manchester, Lisbon Rome, Milan, Budapest Prague.

If we have to think of realistic candidates you can cut that list down to Berlin Munich Hamburg Paris Madrid Barcelona Rome

Now I think some of us might be getting a bit dramatic when we say "if you don't give it to Paris then you won't have any interest from any european cities for future bids." There is a problem with that logic. We are basing this off of current climate. Let me explain, right now when we think of the Olympics we think of the last two cycles Rio and Sochi. Both plagued by issues of finances. When the 2022 bid was in full swing all the news coming out from the recently concluded Sochi games were about the cost over runs. To the average  person, or government official in Oslo Stockholm and the other winter cities who dropped out, of course the games would leave a bad taste in their mouth, thus the referendums were doomed to fail. Perception is a huge thing. They all dropped out either the month before or the months right after Sochi's games.

London actually excited a lot of interest in hosting the games the problem with that was that the US was still butthurt about Chicago and to be honest it would be hard convincing the population to go after another bid after losing 2 straight, South Africa just came off of hosting the World Cup and was still recovering from that financially or else they would have been in the race and European cities knew winning the 2020 games would be difficult due to just hosting the 2012 edition but that didn't stop Rome from trying. So fine Paris might not try for a while but the other cities will 

All I am saying is if LA wins 2024 and Tokyo puts on a great Games in 2020 there will probably be an even longer line of European cities trying to host 2028 

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1 hour ago, Jesse Saenz said:

Voting for or against LA will hurt them either way. Which are they willing to work with.

Who do they want to upset? The US or France?

Paris has lost, but so has the US, and to two of its best cities.

Brushing off an LA loss won't be that easy to shake.

The city boast more venues than the organizers know what to do with, with 2 new stadiums under construction and completed before 2024. It has the Athletes village built and the media village almost complete. A transportation system that will add 3 new lines by 2024 and an unheard of 88% approval rating.

Saying no to LA is almost saying no to logic.

The IOC needs to cut the crap with all the anti american bs... its what got them into the whole Rio fiasco to begin with.

 

What anti-American BS?  You think that's why Chicago lost the 2016 vote?  Among other things, the USOC and IOC hadn't come to a revenue agreement yet when that vote happened.  That's what probably hurt Chicago as much as anything.  Hindsight is 20/20 to say they should have known Rio would be a fiasco.  Not the IOC's fault the Brazilian economy went south in the years after Rio got awarded the games.  Plenty of people from Chicago are more than happy they didn't have to deal with all the troubles of trying to host the Olympics.  

As for LA, don't buy into the popular logic here where a lot of the rhetoric is trying to decide which city will be less butthurt if they're not picked.  The IOC needs to pick who they want to say YES to.  And there can only be 1 winner out of multiple cities.  You're only fooling yourself if you're looking at LA and how great they are and not thinking the competition might offer up a compelling argument themselves?  This isn't LA versus themselves.  Put LA up against Paris.  Then talk to us about logic.

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1 hour ago, Barcelona_'92 said:

The IOC has a very tough decision to make in this race.  Do they turn down Paris for the fourth time when they are in desperate need of bids from Western Europe, or do they reject the U.S for the third time since the 2012 race, which means that in a 12 year span they will have rejected the three biggest cities in the U.S.

Given the Eurocentric nature of the IOC, I think they'll go with Paris, but I do think many IOC members will feel that they shouldn't reject the U.S. again and all of the corporate dollars that staging the Games in the U.S. will bring.

NBC's long-term contract is locked in.  They got that money without knowing the host cities of future Olympics.  I'm not sure the argument that a US-hosted Olympics bringing in additional money is necessarily what puts them over the top, especially with a compelling bid from Paris.  Like I said to Jesse, it's about which city the IOC should pick, not which one would be least offended by rejection.

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39 minutes ago, RuFF said:

I think you've said this before a whole bunch of times Rob. LA2024 has made it a point to be humble and not say something like this. For as much as this seems (that word again) obvious, I don't think LA2024 will be going that route. They've put on a face of professionalism, and it appears that is the route that they're going with. A professional bid out on by people who know how to put on events. 

So you're saying the actual LA2024 organization won't act like a bunch of idiots in an Internet forum? (yes, I include myself in that)?  Pretty sure your sarcasm detector needs fixing there.  No one here, Rob included, actually thinks they'd be that stupid.

1 hour ago, RuFF said:

FYI isn't very self aware. He's not the only one though. A lot of the conversations on here are based on what it seems like. A load of projecting going on and I'd throw in some narssicistic behavior, too. A lot of conversations going on in some of these dudes heads and if you don't follow the script...

57203343.jpg

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1 hour ago, zekekelso said:

The decision is still over a year away.

Exactly.  A lot can happen in a year.  

And it's funny how people are talking about hindsight when it comes to the Chicago bid; I didn't think it was a front-runner even back when it was bidding.  

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51 minutes ago, RuFF said:

I think you've said this before a whole bunch of times Rob. LA2024 has made it a point to be humble and not say something like this. For as much as this seems (that word again) obvious, I don't think LA2024 will be going that route. They've put on a face of professionalism, and it appears that is the route that they're going with. A professional bid out on by people who know how to put on events. 

I know, that all goes without saying. I was just taking the piss.

It'd be much, much more fun if these bids were run by their supporters rather than pros. :lol:

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41 minutes ago, alphamale86 said:

Lets make a list shall we, of all the Western European Cities that can possibly host the Summer Games, not that want too but that can POSSIBLY do it. Berlin Munich Hamburg, Paris Lyon Marseille, Madrid Barcelona Valencia Seville, London Manchester, Lisbon Rome, Milan, Budapest Prague.

If we have to think of realistic candidates you can cut that list down to Berlin Munich Hamburg Paris Madrid Barcelona Rome

Now I think some of us might be getting a bit dramatic when we say "if you don't give it to Paris then you won't have any interest from any european cities for future bids." There is a problem with that logic. We are basing this off of current climate. Let me explain, right now when we think of the Olympics we think of the last two cycles Rio and Sochi. Both plagued by issues of finances. When the 2022 bid was in full swing all the news coming out from the recently concluded Sochi games were about the cost over runs. To the average  person, or government official in Oslo Stockholm and the other winter cities who dropped out, of course the games would leave a bad taste in their mouth, thus the referendums were doomed to fail. Perception is a huge thing. They all dropped out either the month before or the months right after Sochi's games.

London actually excited a lot of interest in hosting the games the problem with that was that the US was still butthurt about Chicago and to be honest it would be hard convincing the population to go after another bid after losing 2 straight, South Africa just came off of hosting the World Cup and was still recovering from that financially or else they would have been in the race and European cities knew winning the 2020 games would be difficult due to just hosting the 2012 edition but that didn't stop Rome from trying. So fine Paris might not try for a while but the other cities will 

All I am saying is if LA wins 2024 and Tokyo puts on a great Games in 2020 there will probably be an even longer line of European cities trying to host 2028 

It's not just perception though.  Look at Norway and the 2022 bid.  That was handed to them on a silver platter and they still pulled out, not just because of the concern of cost overruns, but because they simply didn't want to deal with the IOC and their bullshit.  A lot of other cities feel the same way.  That's part of what fuels cost concerns.  No one thinks a city in a democratic country is going to wind up with the price tag of a Sochi or a Beijing.  That's not their concern.

And that's dead wrong about the United States.  They weren't butthurt.  When the deadline came along to submit bids for 2020, the USOC and IOC hadn't reached their revenue agreement yet.  Sitting out that race was about getting their house in order rather than trying to push through another bid for the sake of bidding.  Look at how calculated their process was to go over 2024.  That's a product of them taking a step back and re-evaluating things.  At this point now though, I think they're in it until they win it.

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1 hour ago, RuFF said:

Here are some other renderings:

 

CqkGKU8UMAA-G6z.jpg

 

Cqj4VFGVYAABxQ-.jpg

 

14089220_643341492491134_173859777936759

 

 

 

 

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57 minutes ago, Jesse Saenz said:

The IOC needs to cut the crap with all the anti american bs... its what got them into the whole Rio fiasco to begin with.

Rio wasn't a "fiasco". It was only a fiasco by the people who enjoyed "bagging" those Games at every opportunity that they could get, especially on these boards. When the IOC awarded Rio those Games seven years ago, the picture in Brazil was a much prettier one than the one today. And economist were actually predicting a brighter future for the Brazilian economy. So can't really blame the IOC on the information that they had at the time.

41 minutes ago, alphamale86 said:

If we have to think of realistic candidates you can cut that list down to Berlin Munich Hamburg Paris Madrid Barcelona Rome

So fine Paris might not try for a while but the other cities will 

All I am saying is if LA wins 2024 and Tokyo puts on a great Games in 2020 there will probably be an even longer line of European cities trying to host 2028 

Just bcuz there MIGHT be "a longer line" of European cities that could potentially go for 2028, if L.A. were to win 2024, doesn't necessarily mean that those cities are viable. Some people are still bitching that Rio was a "fiasco", but yet you're advocating the likes of Rome &  Madrid? There's a reason why Rome pulled out of 2020, & why there might be a danger of them pulling out of 2024, too.

But that one is not bcuz of the IOC's image or reputation, but rather it has moreso to do with the dire state of the Roman/Italian economy. Not to mention, Rome would need soooo MUCH work to do, infrastructure wise, & couple that with the natural corruption that goes on in Italy, & you could  have yourself Rio 2.0

And our German friends here have attested that Berlin is pretty much a non-starter, for internal political reasons. Their 2000 bid (at a time where the Olympics didn't have such a bad wrap) still faced very vocal domestic protest. Munich & Hamburg, which have both just recently rejected Olympic bids of their own, I don't see them returning anytime soon. Cuz it probably will take more than just a couple of smoothly run Olympics to turn around perception of the IOC within Germany.

Sure, Tokyo 2020 could host great Games & perhaps rekindle interest in the Games. But one major problem with that logic - the 2024 vote happens a full three years PRIOR to the 2020 Games. So the IOC has to think of the here & now. And I don't think that they would want to take that gamble, when they have the creme-de-la-creme of all the European capitals banging on their door right now that's ready & willing to showcase their expensive circus.

 

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17 minutes ago, Quaker2001 said:

It's not just perception though.  Look at Norway and the 2022 bid.  That was handed to them on a silver platter and they still pulled out, not just because of the concern of cost overruns, but because they simply didn't want to deal with the IOC and their bullshit.  A lot of other cities feel the same way.  That's part of what fuels cost concerns.  No one thinks a city in a democratic country is going to wind up with the price tag of a Sochi or a Beijing.  That's not their concern.

And that's dead wrong about the United States.  They weren't butthurt.  When the deadline came along to submit bids for 2020, the USOC and IOC hadn't reached their revenue agreement yet.  Sitting out that race was about getting their house in order rather than trying to push through another bid for the sake of bidding.  Look at how calculated their process was to go over 2024.  That's a product of them taking a step back and re-evaluating things.  At this point now though, I think they're in it until they win it.

If my memory serves me correct the rev sharing deal was handled by the time they needed to submit cities for 2020 I remember because LA was pushing for the USOC to bid and Las Vegas decided to jump in without the USOC. But public sentiment in general was too low for USOC to jump in after Chicago so maybe not butthurt but buttsore. 

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5 minutes ago, zekekelso said:

I just read the article on LA's new MLS stadium. Is that - a 22k seat stadium - really the proposed site for Olympic football?? I can see it as a prefect hockey or rugby stadium, but shouldn't football go someplace with more seats - a LOT more seats?

I assume this new soccer stadium would be used as one of a number of stadiums for the football/soccer prelims.  The Rose Bowl would be where they have the big medal-winning game.  At least that's the plan for now.  

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22 minutes ago, Quaker2001 said:

It's not just perception though.  Look at Norway and the 2022 bid.  That was handed to them on a silver platter and they still pulled out, not just because of the concern of cost overruns, but because they simply didn't want to deal with the IOC and their bullshit.  A lot of other cities feel the same way.  That's part of what fuels cost concerns.  No one thinks a city in a democratic country is going to wind up with the price tag of a Sochi or a Beijing.  That's not their concern.

And that's dead wrong about the United States.  They weren't butthurt.  When the deadline came along to submit bids for 2020, the USOC and IOC hadn't reached their revenue agreement yet.  Sitting out that race was about getting their house in order rather than trying to push through another bid for the sake of bidding.  Look at how calculated their process was to go over 2024.  That's a product of them taking a step back and re-evaluating things.  At this point now though, I think they're in it until they win it.

and to your point about Norway your example is purely perception. "they simply didn't want to deal with the IOC and their bullshit." what does that mean? If that was the case why even bid? They dropped out moments after Sochi's postmortem was conducted and moments before the IOC decided to chose a city. That kind of tells me they saw what went down in Sochi and said no I'm not going through that.

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