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London 2012 Olympic Cauldron...


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But why? You have to think of the gas lines...where they are already laid out. That is the key.

Do we know that there aren't gas lines anywhere in the Olympic Park besides the northern end of the stadium? Because I can see them having one inside the stadium and another outside somewhere in the park. I doubt we'll see a tall tower, no signs of a foundation for one at this point.

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Do we know that there aren't gas lines anywhere in the Olympic Park besides the northern end of the stadium? Because I can see them having one inside the stadium and another outside somewhere in the park. I doubt we'll see a tall tower, no signs of a foundation for one at this point.

Then how do you know there are several gas lines lying around to place a cauldron willy-nilly? Do you think they threw a dart, blindfolded, at the map of Olympic Park and then said: That's it! That's where we'll place a cauldron? :rolleyes:

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Then how do you know there are several gas lines lying around to place a cauldron willy-nilly? Do you think they threw a dart, blindfolded, at the map of Olympic Park and then said: That's it! That's where we'll place a cauldron? :rolleyes:

No. Read again. I don't know. That's why I'm asking.

Notice the question mark there?

I guess you don't.

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It's been documented per official 'permit' papers that the gas lines laid for inside the stadium--in the infield--and to that spot just on the northern outside of the stadium. It's either one or the other; or both. They were laid there before a Ceremonies team was picked. It's just up to the Ceremonies people now to come up with a scenario using one or the other, or both, to make a dramatic lighting...or not. I don't think that's very difficult to comprehend, is it?

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Thank you for the information. I wasn't aware that the location of the gas lines were laid out before the ceremonies team was chosen.

And yes, pretty easy to comprehend. This goes without saying, but I definitely prefer clear answers from you over condescending misinterpretations.

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Thank you for the information. I wasn't aware that the location of the gas lines were laid out before the ceremonies team was chosen.

And yes, pretty easy to comprehend. This goes without saying, but I definitely prefer clear answers from you over condescending misinterpretations.

Sorry 'bout that. I really could not understand the thrust of your earlier post. It's only Sydney where the cauldron location/placement was pre-conceived before and alongside the planning of their new stadium. Every other situation, the Ceremonies teams come in afterwards and make do with the physical situation presented them. For Sochi, they've supposedly held up or changed the roof design because shortly after Vancouver, someone supposedly began thinking what sort of a cauldron-lighting moment they would attempt. So that one is a hybrid situation in that mid-way through the erection of the stadium, they paused to try and incorporate a unique lighting m.o. within the infrastructure of their stadium.

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It looks like London is using the same template as Vancouver insofar as a raised center stage. TO accommodate the interior brazier when it rose to its full 25 feet, they had to break through BC Place' concrete floor and still dig an 18-foot hole in order to accommodate the brazier, plus another 6 feet for the raised stage, so there was just enough room there for the hydraulic left. I feel it's going to be the same because what else would a center hole be used for, esp since there are no other tunnels underneath than infield. The cauldron will rise from there...and then be transferred later to some other higher tower-cauldron.

P.S. I mean the outside cauldron doesn't have to be seen that very night. Other than the people in the stadium, everyone else will be watching it on TV, so there is NO need to light an exterior cauldron that night. The whole world would've already seen the stage cauldron lit during the show.

I don't think the raised stage gives us any probability, as yet, of a Cauldron rising up from that centre hole given that there are many wires currently strung above the arena and they will likely draw up props and maybe people to go flying. A Cauldron coming up too is a possibility I guess but no sign of that yet given the expected link between the wires and props beneath the stage.

Edited by AustralianFan
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I will be really surprised if there's a cauldron in the middle of the field. It would obviously have to be temporary and then where would it go? A mobile cauldron seems very far-fetched.

I'm suspecting there will be one cauldron and that it will stay in one place. That may be wishful thinking on my part. I just really disliked Vancouver's dual cauldrons. The second one seemed like an afterthought. It wasn't publicly accessible or easily viewable. The fencing was off-putting. The first one was then hidden from view inside BC Place throughout the Games. I just really didn't care for it at all. Couldn't hold a candle to a single visible beacon.

I still suspect that the ceremony ticket design means something -- quite possibly connected to the cauldron -- but I dont think we're going to be able to piece it together until after the fact.

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Hmmm... War of the Worlds probably isn't the best thing to get people to think of during the Olympics.

The staging area being setup in the middle right now isn't very tall (maybe 2 meters). It would be tough to hide something large like a cauldron (I'd hope it would be larger than 2 meters) under the stage, unless it's some sort of collapsible cauldron. The stage on the right looks very intriguing, but the picture on Jason's site isn't very large (at least the free one isn't), so I can't get a close look.

Overall, London's stadium provides a lot of limitations. I would hope they considered the cauldron when designing those limitations, but everyone makes mistakes.

In my mind, I haven't ruled out something that might come out of the top of the stadium because I can't find a high res picture or diagram of the wires running across the stadium. They could setup some rigging that could carry the cauldron up the the outer structure of the stadium. The structure looks strong enough to support additional weight from a preliminary inspection. Then again, a "flying" cauldron would basically have to be a flying propane tank on fire, and that doesn't sound very safe.

Perhaps my description of the War of the Worlds like structure was a bit over the top, lol. After your idea, the canals remain on my shortlist of suspect Cauldron spots. About the wires, the complexity of the flying wires network suspended now above the arena are visible in these photos, including their outboard anchor points in the first photo and the inner ones.

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Edited by AustralianFan
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Bra' Tac and any others interested, just found this Jason Hawkes photo showing a close-up of the top of the Orbit from this different overhead angle.

It's interesting that the large metal loop, which I thought previously was looped directly above the centre of the Tower, in reality bends off to one side. This is a bit of a surprise.

I was looking for any clues in photos all around and inside the Stadium, including the Orbit and any signs of it's possible participation in the OC in a minor or major role through such effects as lighting, fireworks or other theatrical gadgetry. Setting aside the "Heatherwick Cauldron-versus-Orbit-design-clash" argument for the moment, Bra-Tac what do you make of this tower structure?

Despite what the Director of the Olympic Park is quoted as saying about gaslines and Cauldron locations, I do find it odd and questionable that he appears to be saying there are no gaslines in the Orbit Tower at all. I would have thought that a restaurant in a prominent tourist tower like this would need gaslines leading to it, since most restaurants anywhere cook on gas stoves, not electric - unless its going to simply be a coffee shop style operation with no freshly cooked food.

Does anyone know of the type of restaurant that will be in this tower?

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Edited by AustralianFan
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. About the wires, the complexity of the flying wires network suspended now above the arena are visible in these photos, including their outboard anchor points in the first photo and the inner ones.

Beijing also had a whole network of criss-crossing wires there. Those are primarily zip lines for cablecams & as you saw, other flying stunts (i.e., that "flying sheet of paper," the 5 rings on netting, the flying fairies, etc., etc. London's roof is so much lighter that I doubt there will be as many 'heavy' flying objects as Beijing and/or Athens. But I guess good Luck on trying to uncover other clues. Just keep us posted on what and when you find it.

Does anyone know of the type of restaurant that will be in this tower?

I think it's going to be called "The Other Cauldron." The servers will be strung on wires and float onto your tables with the menus and your orders. There will be a special room for those who fancy sneaking in a little nookie 150-ft above the ground and viewing the OTHER cauldron. :lol::lol:

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I think it's going to be called "The Other Cauldron." The servers will be strung on wires and float onto your tables with the menus and your orders. There will be a special room for those who fancy sneaking in a little nookie 150-ft above the ground and viewing the OTHER cauldron. :lol::lol:

And, of course, the option to BBQ your own food at the table :P

Shrek - there was a piece around the 100 days to go mark which said the cables could support around 40 double-decker buses.

Not all restaurants cook with gas. The Gordon Ramsay place, Plane Food, at Terminal 5 has to use alternatives since there's no gas allowed at Terminal 5.

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I just really disliked Vancouver's dual cauldrons. The second one seemed like an afterthought. It wasn't publicly accessible or easily viewable. The fencing was off-putting. The first one was then hidden from view inside BC Place throughout the Games. I just really didn't care for it at all. Couldn't hold a candle to a single visible beacon.

Really? Most journalists and visitors in Vancouver said the cauldron was the most accessible they ever encountered as most are locked away in the stadium behind layers of fencing and security.

I don't think it was an 'afterthought' either. They couldn't keep the flame in BC Place lit throughout the games as it was a fully enclosed venue at the time. I attended the OC and even after a few minutes, the whole stadium smelled of gas exhaust. As you may have noted during the CC, the gas was turned down and the flames were a lot smaller. They were likely planned together, but I would think the idea and location of the permanent cauldron was planned long ahead of time - the setting on the waterfront is prime location and made for great photos. People flocked there throughout the games and indeed they still snap their photo in front of the glass and steel structure.

The fence, I will give you, was ugly and unfortunate. No doubt, they couldn't have people climbing on the structure, so something was needed...but did it have to be so damned ugly? Thankfully, when they opened the roof viewing location from was is soon to be a Cactus Club Restaurant, it provided 'fence-free' views of the cauldron.

As for the ceremonial cauldron, it was basically extinguished and folded away after the OC. It wasn't present or viewable at all during any of the Victory Ceremonies at BC Place Stadium.

Edited by Kenadian
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Not all restaurants cook with gas. The Gordon Ramsay place, Plane Food, at Terminal 5 has to use alternatives since there's no gas allowed at Terminal 5.

Yes but I can't see why there would be any need for airport style or other restrictions on the use of gas in London's Olympic Park or it's Orbit Tower restaurant.

Just read on their website that Balfour Beatty is the appointed operations agent for the Tower. It states also that among Balfour Beatty's services is the provision of utilities infrastructure such as water and gas.

However, it's not clear when the restaurant will open. Boris talks on the website about having the costs of the Tower being "recouped from a very attractive dining facility at the top" which will be a "corporate money-making venture".

Edited by AustralianFan
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The tower is such an eyesore that Zeus should throw a lighting bolt at it and burn it to the ground before the Games get underway. That's the only type of 'Olympic fire' worthy of that mess.

Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Look here at how Cinderella glams it up after sunset with a glittering evening gown!

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Edited by AustralianFan
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Beauty is in the eye of the beholder. Look here at how Cinderella glams it up after sunset with a glittering evening gown!

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Notice the floodlights in this picture are only at 33% (2/3rds are off) and yet it's still incredibly bright. I don't think it's got anything to do with the cauldron, but it's interesting.

12 floodlights for 2012. Cute.

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Are there other spots on that are attached to the inner ring of the stadium though below the banks of floodlights - it looks like there are some spots of lights below some of the unlit floodlights which might be helping to boost the impact. Still impressively bright though!

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Are there other spots on that are attached to the inner ring of the stadium though below the banks of floodlights - it looks like there are some spots of lights below some of the unlit floodlights which might be helping to boost the impact. Still impressively bright though!

I was wondering that myself. Not sure if installation of the stadium lighting rigs has started yet(?). Waiitng for updated pics from Jason Hawkes collection. The flood lights operating at reduced capacity would be so the workmen installing the stage have sufficient safe working light.

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London's Big Party Cauldron

After watching the outpouring of national pride on tv here over the last few days, I am more convinced than ever that, in their Big Party Year (Summer Olympics and the Queen's Diamond Jubilee), that the London organisers and Heatherwick will be thinking big and majestic when it comes to the Cauldron. They are not going to, even for one second, entertain the idea of pouring water on their own party atmosphere by suddenly turning intraverted at the biggest global moment of the entire Opening Ceremony and igniting an underwhelmingly 'short cauldron' inside the Stadium (and repeat Seoul's inwardly focussed cauldron mistake).

I'll bet my left whats-it that the Cauldron is not going to rise up from the centre stage, the side stage or anywhere at all inside London's Olympic Stadium. I do think the stadium audience will witness the final torchbearer being dramatically lifted or flown up to whereever the Cauldron or it's fuse is located.

Lets face it, we have all seen the photos of the complex network of overhead theatrical wires and they are not going to go away and nor can they be ignored. They are very limiting as to the Cauldron options available inside the Stadium, as are the stage structures and the Stadium roof. In order for London's Cauldron to rise up from a position inside the Stadium, it would still be an anti-climax and short at it's final height. Otherwise, the wind or other environmental conditions inside the Stadium could lead to the Cauldron's flames and/or heat dangerously affecting the overhead wires.

Lord Coe has said several times from the beginning that the London organisers want to recreate the fun outgoing carnival party atmosphere with huge good natured crowds that they loved throughout the Sydney 2000 Games. That atmosphere has clearly started spectacularly in London and is continuing to build with the Torch Relay and the Diamond Jubilee events of the past few days.

So all in all, I agree with those who predict that London's Big Party Year Cauldron will:

  1. be a Single Cauldron,
  2. with a Big Robust Flame
  3. Outside the Stadium,
  4. Fixed in the same position after the final torch bearer ignites it, and
  5. High enough that it can be seen for miles.

While its a creative thought, they are also not likely going to be the first Summer Games organisers who move their big Cauldron around from one part of the city to another.

The Organisers built this big Olympic Park and somewhere in that Park outside the Stadium, will be the Cauldron's big throne (goodness knows where) and looking down on eveyone.

Even with its Stadium limitations, this is after all the Summer Olympic Games, the Greatest Show on Earth.

Edited by AustralianFan
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