Copenhagen and Havana

[pcelica]

Really? Good for Goethe. I wonder where that got him.

That brought him to be one of the most famous writes all over the world and Faust became one of the most popular plays.

[baron-pierreIV]

That brought him to be one of the most famous writes all over the world and Faust became one of the most popular plays.

Well...if u like that kinda stuff. Doesn't make my boat float.

[pcelica]

Well...if u like that kinda stuff. Doesn't make my boat float.

It's not about liking, it's elementary knowledge

[baron-pierreIV]

It's not about liking, it's elementary knowledge

Oh Baloney. U're so full of sh*t. U're 18 and u think u know the world.

U haven't lived yet, m'dear.

[reindeer]

Portugal is in dire straits at the moment with tens of thousands of people, mostly young and educated, emigrating so even suggesting that the country should bid in near future is pipe dreaming. There is talk of today's youth of being a lost generation. I think it could take decades for them to recover from the crisis and if for Madrid in a much larger and to start with more prosperous country the economic situation is a critical issue, then I don't understand how Portugal could do it. There have already been massive infrastructure projects in the Iberian peninsula and those places are now rotting without use.

I like the idea of a Lisbon/Copenhague Olympic games is a nice one though, but it's just not very realistic. However, comparing these two with the likes of Leipzig, Lille or even Baku and Doha shows a certain lack of understanding.

[pcelica]

Again the lowest instincts rice to the surface in the absence of arguments

[baron-pierreIV]

Again the lowest instincts rice to the surface in the absence of arguments

Come back to me when u've put it another 20 yrs under your belt -- and then I'll see if u've matured and worth more of my time.

Right now, it ain't.

[pcelica]

Funny. Supposed to be mature and in late 30s can't control himself of swearing. Maturre, really?

''Conversation for me is over''', don't want to Goethe tumble in grave when ''see'' that some people learnt nothing from his work

[markun]

I don't think that Lisbon has the capacity and Copenhagen doesn't have the will but given the right circumstances and improved economic climate both could easily host.

As for those who compare them to middle-ranking provincial cities in the States or say they lack glamour... really??? They are both elegant, sophisticated and cultured - and glamorous.

[pcelica]

I don't think that Lisbon has the capacity and Copenhagen doesn't have the will but given the right circumstances and improved economic climate both could easily host.

As for those who compare them to middle-ranking provincial cities in the States or say they lack glamour... really??? They are both elegant, sophisticated and cultured - and glamorous.

I've heard that previous Copenhagen major started idea of hosting games

[FYI]

I see that some people enjoy reading what's not there, or just enjoy twisting what is there. Has anyone said that Lisbon & Copenhagen "lack" glamor & "sophistication"? No, at least I didn't.

Are Paris, Rome, Berlin, Istanbul, London, New York, Moscow & Tokyo, etc not moreso? Last I checked, those cities receive many more international vistiors (than the two in question) bcuz they offer "more" of that "elegance, sophistication" & glamor (which actually what was initially meant).

And the main reason why Baku was even brought up, was because of the argument that Lisbon would be "willing to invest heavily". Which case in point, is not always a convincing attribute.

[baron-pierreIV]

Funny. Supposed to be mature and in late 30s can't control himself of swearing. Maturre, really?

''Conversation for me is over''', don't want to Goethe tumble in grave when ''see'' that some people learnt nothing from his work

U're nothing but a pretentious "know-nothing" trying to converse with your elders. Go back to your desk, infantile one.

[Athensfan]

Come back to me when u've put it another 20 yrs under your belt -- and then I'll see if u've matured and worth more of my time.

Right now, it ain't.

Sadly, for some number of years is no guarantee of increased wisdom.....

[baron-pierreIV]

Sadly, for some number of years is no guarantee of increased wisdom.....

Speaking from personal experience, I see.

[Roger87]

I see that some people enjoy reading what's not there, or just enjoy twisting what is there. Has anyone said that Lisbon & Copenhagen "lack" glamor & "sophistication"? No, at least I didn't.

Are Paris, Rome, Berlin, Istanbul, London, New York, Moscow & Tokyo, etc not moreso? Last I checked, those cities receive many more international vistiors (than the two in question) bcuz they offer "more" of that "elegance, sophistication" & glamor (which actually what was initially meant).

And the main reason why Baku was even brought up, was because of the argument that Lisbon would be "willing to invest heavily". Which case in point, is not always a convincing attribute.

Agree. Lisbon is one of my favorite cities in Europe, but I don't think it has the proper infrastructure, the other comment is right about the economic situation -Greece has a bigger GDP than Portugal and look what happened-; and finally I tend to add another point. While Portugal has presence in football (Soccer), in terms of Olympics, they have disappointed results: London: 1 silver; Beijing: 1 gold and 1 silver, Athens: 2 silver, 1 bronze and Sydney: 2 bronze. Maybe in another context it doesn't mean a lot, but Europe is full of big boys by the Olympics -Great Britain, Germany, France, Russia, Italy, Hungary, Netherlands- and most of them are "due" of having another SOG.

Take an example of Hungary. A country with a long and rich Olympic history, one of the most visited cities in Central Europe (Budapest), a debt for a proper SOG and then they pull off the idea because it would be a potential disaster. With this new global order, they are new players with proper resources and narratives.

[markun]

You said that Paris, Rome, Berlin and Moscow are more glamorous.

I never said that, mr. "arrogant, clueless", omniscient one. What I said was, if these medium-sized cities ever found themselves in competition on par to themselves, then perhaps they can host. So don't put words in my mouth.

What compelling argument could a place like Lisbon or Copenhagen have over their larger, more glamorous neighbors like Paris, Rome, Berlin or Moscow. Or new continents like South America & Africa or 1/5 of humanity like China> Or new winter frontiers like South Korea & Sochi.

Whenever the IOC has been presented with these type of cities before i.e. Manchester, Birmingham, Seville, Lille, Leipzig, Prague, they have effectively shoved all of them to the wayside in favor of more compelling places & projects (see London 2012). So what makes Lisbon so special besides being the capital of a European country & more than "3,000 years old".

Again, if they're bidding against the likes of Minneapolis, Hiroshima & Stuttgart, then yeah, there's a chance there. But when up against bigger shows & players, I don't see it playing out their way.

[FYI]

You said that Paris, Rome, Berlin and Moscow are more glamorous.

Well aren't they? Being more glamorous isn't saying "lacking" glamour. There's a distinct difference there.

[markun]

Paris and Rome perhaps but not Berlin and Moscow and in Lisbon's case its climate, architecture and culture and connections with Africa and Brazil give it a glamour and exoticism which Paris on a rainy day certainly lacks.

[FYI]

Well gee, if a sunny climate, architecture & culture automatically gives a city 'glamour' , then why get bent outta shape when San Diego is brought into the comparison. San Diego is one of the most scenic cities in the country, with a virtual year-round wonderful "sunny" climate. And has plenty of 'architecture' from the Old World left over from the Spanish. And San Diego also has plenty of culture, but still, do any of those things make the city "more glamourous" than it's bigger, more glamourous neighbor, Los Angeles. No, not really.

And if rain makes a city "lack" glamour, then why was London & Paris the two most visited cities in the world last year. And interesting how you dropped Copenhagen from the equation now, when you brought in sunny skies & rain into the mix, which then would just undermine your own argument. Places like San Diego, Lisbon, Copenhagen etc are nice places in their own right & no one is saying that they lack their own glamour, but to try to put them on par with likes of London, Paris, New York, etc is beyond a stretch, to say the least. We could do that with virtually any city, if that's the case, not just Lisbon.

[markun]

I'm not arguing, I just question your definition of glamour. Copenhagen and Lisbon do compare with London and Paris. They don't compare with some of the provincial US cities you were talking about.

[baron-pierreIV]

I'm not arguing, I just question your definition of glamour. Copenhagen and Lisbon do compare with London and Paris. They don't compare with some of the provincial US cities you were talking about.

I like Copenhagen and Lisbon...but if I were going to go on a first round visit of European capitals, those 2 would be like #7 and #8. I've visited those 2 only once (Kobe in 1968; and Lisbon in 1990) and I haven't been back toeither since, even though I have returned to France at least 3x, Italy 2x, Greece & Turkey on my last visit. They are SMALL cities but certainly NOT among the first half-dozen Glamour Capitals that come to mind. Listen to this classic song...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=52Pnu9V4VXQ

No mention of Copenhagen, Lisbon or Havana!!

[Quaker2001]

I'm not arguing, I just question your definition of glamour. Copenhagen and Lisbon do compare with London and Paris. They don't compare with some of the provincial US cities you were talking about.

I've only been to Europe 3 times in my life and only once since I was a little kid, so I can't speak to these cities from personal experience. That said..

This is the Olympics. It's an event held once every 4 years (at least in terms of the Summer version) and comes through Europe at best every 8-12 years. If the choice comes down to Lisbon or Paris, which of those 2 is more likely to win? Which is to say.. if you can only visit 1 city in Europe in the next decade, which of those are you choosing? That's why this comes down to.. pick 1 city you're probably not picking another one for a while. That's what a city like Lisbon is up against, especially if their competition is Paris.

[FYI]

I'm not arguing, I just question your definition of glamour. Copenhagen and Lisbon do compare with London and Paris. They don't compare with some of the provincial US cities you were talking about.

For starters, the 'comparsion' was an indirect one, that was simply to be one of perspective. It went to a direct comparison bcuz someone else in the thread decided to misinterpret it & took it that way. What I initinally meant is that these smaller European cities are 'like' the San Diego's, Minneapolis' & Charlotte's of Europe, not that they actually are like them. In other words, those same smaller "provincial" U.S. cities (as you call them) don't compare to the likes of their larger sister cities of New York, Los Angeles or even Washington DC. But if you think that Lisbon & Copenhagen "compare" to London & Paris, then we'll just have to agree to disagree.

As has been pointed out by others in the last page, whenever first-time or repeat travelers to Europe make their endeavors, they take their first or most trips to the top glamour capitals of Europe, & those aren't Lisbon & Copenhagen. On the opposite side of the token, those first & repeat travelers to the U.S. are going to make their first & most trips to the 'glamour' cities of the U.S., & those aren't San Diego, Minneapolis & Charlotte. Again, there's a reason why cities like New York, London, Paris & Rome were in the top 10 of most visited cities in the world & not the ones in question here.

[Rob2012]

I thought Copenhagen was small and underwhelming when I visited a couple of years back. It has nowhere near the level of glamour or interest of bigger European cities. Lisbon I don't know.

[baron-pierreIV]

I thought Copenhagen was small and underwhelming when I visited a couple of years back. It has nowhere near the level of glamour or interest of bigger European cities. Lisbon I don't know.

Brussels and Geneva are more important, higher prestige cities than Kobenhaven & Lisboa. But probably more boring than C&L.