agenthuggles/agentr Posted January 4, 2008 Report Share Posted January 4, 2008 Yes, the jumps look good, and will serve as great venues during Vancouver 2010. But I do have a problem whit them, and probably not the same one that EWO, Agent... and the rest of the username-way-to-long-to-remember-club. Its simple; building the smaller jumps (like they did for Calgary 1988) would have mean that we can finally get Canadian Ski Jumpers developed in another region that Calgary. Sure, we have world class facilities in Vancouver now, but you can't use them in the winter and it will be impossible for beginners to use them. Vancouver 2010 would have been a great way to develop Ski Jumping in Canada. Its a shame that Vancouver's youngsters will still have to go to Calgary if they want to try out the sport. Oh, and hopefully this Ski Jump will be kept in good shape, not like the Calgary one... I agree !!! Thank you for putting this on the Forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
SpikeyT Posted January 4, 2008 Report Share Posted January 4, 2008 I agree !!! Thank you for putting this on the Forum. I also agree. It was a shame they let the ski-jump in Calgary go to waste, but I'm glad they are putting more money back into it to at least keep up something they already built. How does that work...will VANOC keep owndership after, or will it go to the government? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cfm Jeremie Posted January 4, 2008 Report Share Posted January 4, 2008 How does that work...will VANOC keep owndership after, or will it go to the government? VANOC will be gone within a year or so after the Games. The way it works usually is that the venues are either transfered to a public agency or a dedicated Olympic legacy body is created to manage the venues after the Games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baron-pierreIV Posted January 4, 2008 Report Share Posted January 4, 2008 Isn't it strange that agentmuggles always appears when ears-orifices-wideopen also shows up? I agree. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenadian Posted January 4, 2008 Report Share Posted January 4, 2008 I wonder what role 2010 Legacies Now will play in such cases? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
agenthuggles/agentr Posted January 4, 2008 Report Share Posted January 4, 2008 Isn't it strange that agentmuggles always appears when ears-orifices-wideopen also shows up? I agree. Like I said I am not James, from another thread. If you want to hasstle and put us down...do it on the Gay Streight Thread....It is interesting, who all is there..Hang out together. What I do is none of your business, but since you made it your business, I will be putting more on here of your doings. This Forum has nothing , absolutely nothing to do with you or your cronies. Yes , I do come back when more is on this from eyesearswideopen, as he is doing the foot work for me. News articles, going back 20 years ago and up to date now. So Baronpiss, get on with your life on your own Forum. When you decide to respect here...but that is not becoming of you.... I gave you the benifit on the fake Date of Birthday Wishes yesterday.. That won't happen again.. I don't know what country your from, as you can hide ,and falsify...but please leave us alone... man to man. if that is what you are. I do not attack Olympic players, this Forum is about , WHAT YOU DON'T GET. Agentmuggles Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baron-pierreIV Posted January 4, 2008 Report Share Posted January 4, 2008 Like I said I am not James, from another thread. If you want to hasstle and put us down...do it on the Gay Streight Thread....It is interesting, who all is there..Hang out together. What I do is none of your business, but since you made it your business, I will be putting more on here of your doings. This Forum has nothing , absolutely nothing to do with you or your cronies. Yes , I do come back when more is on this from eyesearswideopen, as he is doing the foot work for me. News articles, going back 20 years ago and up to date now. So Baronpiss, get on with your life on your own Forum. When you decide to respect here...but that is not becoming of you.... I gave you the benifit on the fake Date of Birthday Wishes yesterday.. That won't happen again.. I don't know what country your from, as you can hide ,and falsify...but please leave us alone... man to man. if that is what you are. I do not attack Olympic players, this Forum is about , WHAT YOU DON'T GET. Agentmuggles Yes, Baby Jane... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fisher Posted January 4, 2008 Report Share Posted January 4, 2008 I don't mean to alarm you Marge, but there may be a boogeyman or men in the house. Really.. to the two of your who shall not be named your presense on this website alone means you are opening yourself and your story up for PUBLIC debate. You brought the story, you should be able to defend it. But wait.. that wasn't your job. Your job is apparantly to act like a megaphone to broadcast your magical fairy tale like story across this great land. Don't ask questions though because that means you aren't smart or you just can't see it. Holes in the story, well that just must mean that you can't read well enough because it's ALL there. And don't try to act all innocent. You've hidden your true intentions since you got here. That's why everyone doesn't trust a word that you say. Why are you so passionate about this story; if you want to find and talk about government corruption, there are MUCH bigger stories to follow. How do you know so much about these 'players' if no one publishes anything about this story? I've looked.. trust me. The only person I've found that has talked about the Callaghan Valley is... wait for it... YOU! Even advanced knowledge of the original breaking story... please share your secrets of clair voyancy because I've got some lotto numbers I need. I'm more surprised though by the fact that YOU think we don't know. Keep those eyes and ears open my dear, but try keeping the mouth shout. Maybe you might learn something from listening to others. Lord knows we've all had to listen to you since you got here. Have a smurf-tastic day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
agenthuggles/agentr Posted January 4, 2008 Report Share Posted January 4, 2008 I don't mean to alarm you Marge, but there may be a boogeyman or men in the house.Really.. to the two of your who shall not be named your presense on this website alone means you are opening yourself and your story up for PUBLIC debate. You brought the story, you should be able to defend it. But wait.. that wasn't your job. Your job is apparantly to act like a megaphone to broadcast your magical fairy tale like story across this great land. Don't ask questions though because that means you aren't smart or you just can't see it. Holes in the story, well that just must mean that you can't read well enough because it's ALL there. And don't try to act all innocent. You've hidden your true intentions since you got here. That's why everyone doesn't trust a word that you say. Why are you so passionate about this story; if you want to find and talk about government corruption, there are MUCH bigger stories to follow. How do you know so much about these 'players' if no one publishes anything about this story? I've looked.. trust me. The only person I've found that has talked about the Callaghan Valley is... wait for it... YOU! Even advanced knowledge of the original breaking story... please share your secrets of clair voyancy because I've got some lotto numbers I need. I'm more surprised though by the fact that YOU think we don't know. Keep those eyes and ears open my dear, but try keeping the mouth shout. Maybe you might learn something from listening to others. Lord knows we've all had to listen to you since you got here. Have a smurf-tastic day. Ii hear you , I have seen and read all about you on other Forums. so as in your last paragraph. That is exactly what I am saying to you..SHUT YOUR MOUTH AS YOU DON'T EVEN KNOW //// ALL WE HAVE HEARD IS YOU MRS FISH HEAD... DEFINITELY YOU ARE WOMEN ...Such whiners ...get another Forum ..... This is for the Vancouver and Canada people.....not the players. Seems your interested otherwise you would leave it alone. You and Mrs Baronpiss should get together....looks like you are...LOL I have better things to do and a life....answering the idiots, are a waste of my time. Non of this was directed to any of you UNTIL you harrassed this Forum.. Were you bored all the months ??? Guess not because you harrasse on the other Forum too. LOL LOL LOL LOL Go ski down a Mtn and cool off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canuckfan Posted January 5, 2008 Report Share Posted January 5, 2008 Ii hear you , I have seen and read all about you on other Forums. so as in your last paragraph.That is exactly what I am saying to you..SHUT YOUR MOUTH AS YOU DON'T EVEN KNOW //// ALL WE HAVE HEARD IS YOU MRS FISH HEAD... DEFINITELY YOU ARE WOMEN ...Such whiners ...get another Forum ..... This is for the Vancouver and Canada people.....not the players. Seems your interested otherwise you would leave it alone. You and Mrs Baronpiss should get together....looks like you are...LOL I have better things to do and a life....answering the idiots, are a waste of my time. Non of this [random bolding]was directed to any of you UNTIL[/random bolding] you harrassed this Forum.. Were you bored all the months ??? Guess not because you harrasse on the other Forum too. LOL LOL LOL LOL Go ski down a Mtn and cool off. Looks like even agenthuggles/agentr is fed up of his little trolling game and just wants out... No really ,the best way to fight harassement is to call everybody idiots. It makes sense. And the thing about the gay/str eight thread is so on topic! You're a such a great debater! You must be a star in the courtroom! [random HTMLcolor coding ]Oh I forgot... ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZhmmmmmmmmmmmmm[/random HTMLcolor coding ] and Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
agenthuggles/agentr Posted January 5, 2008 Report Share Posted January 5, 2008 Looks like even agenthuggles/agentr is fed up of his little trolling game and just wants out...No really ,the best way to fight harassement is to call everybody idiots. It makes sense. And the thing about the gay/str eight thread is so on topic! You're a such a great debater! You must be a star in the courtroom! [random HTMLcolor coding ]Oh I forgot... ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZhmmmmmmmmmmmmm[/random HTMLcolor coding ] and Thanks I am a star.. I don't have to deal with this kind of abuse..LOL .Glad your here welcome aboard.. It is a free for all... ZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZZhmmmmmmmmmmmmmmmm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenadian Posted January 5, 2008 Report Share Posted January 5, 2008 So what will this investigation turn up and result in? If anything is found in favour of the Hartwicks, it will likely just mean more court battles and since the property has now beed developed for the 2010 Olympics - which are 2 short years away - isn't it kind of late? Or will the just get a big cash settlement from the Government of BC (ie taxpayers)? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
earseyeswideopen Posted January 6, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 6, 2008 Isn't it strange that agentmuggles always appears when ears-orifices-wideopen also shows up? . . . Baron 'what's his name' Answer: "Strange" you ask???? . . . WHY???. . . Agenthuggles is clearly keen on the focus of this topic at hand, obviously, as are the large number of viewers who read this thread but do not comment re: the growing Callaghan Valley Nordic Venue Scandal. This topic is very relevant to this GamesBid site for the 2010 Olympic forum, as the Nordic Venue in the Callaghan Valley, is the largest taxpayer funded Vanoc development & involves Land bureaucrats & private Nordic operators, according to the media reports. Interesting, Baron, I have often asked the same question about WHY the small band of you, have persisted in 'circling' together to attack on this topic , with a sole intent to shoot down the new information/facts provided on this developing scandal vs sensible input???? Both agenthuggles & I have encountered a barage of stupid attacks/threats/insults since day one - back to the first thread I started. No one is forcing you to read the information posted on this thread. What do you think you contribute other than throwing darts??? What is it that brings you back again & again ad naseum to post nonesense content???? You have so many other threads to play on . . . go play, please. I don't get it. . . . DOES it have something to do with the thread on the Off topic section- that I didn't know existed until recently - about Gay participants on this site . . . that a participant on GamesBid has to belong, as many of you regulars do according to what you wrote - to some kind of secret club to be able to be able to post a new meaty thread on GamesBid ????? What on earth does this aspect have to do with the Olympics????? But maybe on reflection it answers a lot of my puzzlement about your responses . . . who knows. . . The RCMP Commercial Crime probe IS big news to anyone, who has followed the high profile public saga of the shocking derailment . . . by a former Premier forced to resign from his Office assisted by a group of BC Govt. Land Bureaucrats. . . . of a proponent who won the govt. rights through a public proposal call, to build an international destination ski resort in the entire Callaghan Valley adjacent to Whistler/Blackcomb. All of us downhillers yearn for deep powder bowls & mega runs that this company's high profile plans offered from the private sector NOT the Government $$$$$$, as is now being poured into the Nordic Venue. I started this thread with media stories that suddenly started to appear last Fall of 2007 expecting to be met with an enthusiastic, at least curiosity based discussion, based on the meaty facts printed & copied here. Personally, I WAS taken aback by the crass comments & responded. In my view, the only 'trolls' as per the definition provided on this site - are the persons who have ulterior motives re: this thread vs constructive comments about the topic of this specific scandal. What is NOT to be interested in with these latest developments ? I agree with agenthuggles wholeheartedly, about the attitude of your small group. For the RCMP Commercial Crime to re-open a major file for the third time - something is very wrong with shenanigans in the Callaghan Valley. With their resources stretched to the max, common sense says they wouldn't do this unless there was ample reason given the 'players' involved now with the Callaghan Valley Nordic facility. You are so right, agenthuggles, you don't have to take the abuse. I appreciate your input & interest whereever you hang - maybe you can give me a heads up off this site????. . . HAPPY NEW YEAR - get them boards ready to join your ace skier sons. Yes thanks, the family & I did have a great Christmas - the boys off to Seattle - no skiing this trip - big time shopping in Seattle LOL, but we all caught Brooker on NBC at the Worldcup - he knows how to call them curves. I WILL keep my eyes & ears wide open & update. So many questions are bursting in my head surrounding this Nordic scandal, but that last Pique article was a doozy, wasn't it? BTW, your detective skills are sharp - court training perhaps??? I & many others reading this site are glad to see you back - just let the 'drips' run right off you Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
earseyeswideopen Posted January 6, 2008 Author Report Share Posted January 6, 2008 So what will this investigation turn up and result in? If anything is found in favour of the Hartwicks, it will likely just mean more court battles and since the property has now beed developed for the 2010 Olympics - which are 2 short years away - isn't it kind of late? Or will the just get a big cash settlement from the Government of BC (ie taxpayers)? Happy New Year, Kendegra - good questions . . . now if it wasn't so late I'd respond but time to hit the sack, in my part of the world before the sun rises! Tomorrow is another day - I may consult some of my legal beagle buddies/politico junkies in the next few days to get their input on your ponderings . . . seems to me that the last Whistler Pique article I copied here may give some possible answers . . . It is all very fascinating - glad to see your musings here . . . anything can happen with this juicy scenario . . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
canuckfan Posted January 6, 2008 Report Share Posted January 6, 2008 Hi earseyeswideopen! I have an honest question for you. If this story is such a scandal, why does a google search with the words "Callaghan Valley" and "Hartwick" only lead us here, and to some other places where you post the same articles (like the London 2012 board and the westcoast women blog)? It looks like you are one of the few people talking about it on the web. Why? I doubt a simple citizen of BC would care that much if there weren't personal implications. There are so many battles to fight. Why did you pick this one specifically? I'm sure the readers here would be more receptive if you would tell us your motives (beside the pursuit of the truth ) Have a nice day. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fisher Posted January 7, 2008 Report Share Posted January 7, 2008 Hi earseyeswideopen!If this story is such a scandal, why does a google search with the words "Callaghan Valley" and "Hartwick" only lead us here, and to some other places where you post the same articles (like the London 2012 board and the westcoast women blog)? It looks like you are one of the few people talking about it on the web. Why? I doubt a simple citizen of BC would care that much if there weren't personal implications. There are so many battles to fight. Why did you pick this one specifically? I'm sure the readers here would be more receptive if you would tell us your motives (beside the pursuit of the truth ) Good question canuckfan. We've all been looking for and asking the same thing for a long time. If patterns continue, the response will either be a long winded response pointing fingers at everyone else for being treated so unfairly (now it seems to be the gamesbid.com gay mafia ) or will just completely ignore your response because it can't be answered. The fact that I've pointed this out will mean you WILL get a response, but it will be directed at my comments vs what you want clarified. The only reason why they are posting here is because they think that some IOC members visit here regularly and they think that this is the way to get an audience with them. They make it sound like they are championing this cause that everyone is talking about, but no one is talking about it and no one knows any details except themselves. Oh well it's great for a laugh or two. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
earseyeswideopen Posted February 4, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 4, 2008 Hi earseyeswideopen!I have an honest question for you. If this story is such a scandal, why does a google search with the words "Callaghan Valley" and "Hartwick" only lead us here, and to some other places where you post the same articles (like the London 2012 board and the westcoast women blog)? It looks like you are one of the few people talking about it on the web. Why? I doubt a simple citizen of BC would care that much if there weren't personal implications. There are so many battles to fight. Why did you pick this one specifically? I'm sure the readers here would be more receptive if you would tell us your motives (beside the pursuit of the truth ) Have a nice day. Welcome, Canuckfan, 'newbie'! I am a "semi newbie" to this forum. I haven't had the time to play in this sandbox of late; - never a dull moment these days, since 2008 launched! With a quiet evening at home, I want to reply to your post because it is worth discussing properly. BTW, such a relief to learn your "question" - in fact, 3 focused questions . . were "honest" - always a good start! All that focus on crediting me with spreading the news on this scandal, albeit thanks to that busy bee 'Google' with frequent 'drop ins' to this site, has gone to my head; perhaps I have missed my true calling in life! The relevance of this topic re: a scandal & police probe into evidence surrounding Vanoc's Callaghan Valley Nordic Venue fits the theme of this site. After my initial gleeful, shock from the articles in the independent media, I came across this site & decided to spice up this forum!! The rapid growth in popularity in comparison to the majority of fluffy threads in this section, speaks volumes. Clearly there is no problem with 'reader receptivity' Canuckfan, LOL - unless you are referring to a handful of 'flamers' that get their knickers in a twist on a regular basis. I am pleased to see your specific interest in this thread, given the many threads to choose from. However, why you are not questioning any of the key elements of this scandal written in two well circulated newspapers that would be more than obvious to a "simple citizen of BC" ???? With that inquiring mind of yours I'm honestly puzzled with your lack of analytical questioning . . . . You raise the issue of "personal implications": Where multi millions of Canadian taxpayers dollars are being funnelled via Vanoc into a Nordic Venue where private interests are benefiting; where serious allegations of conflict of interest surrounding the derailment of an international Alpine ski resort exist; where land bureaucrats & private Nordic operators are meshed in long term relationships; with an RCMP Commercial Crime file on this case being reopened for the third time with new evidence. . . . . I suggest that the "implications" are are obvious why ALL citizens should "care" & do by the interest this topic has generated - don't you? A quick read of my profile puts my 'motives' clearly in context. (Additionally, admittedly I am a 'powder hound' who has salivated alojg with every skier I know, since the winning proponent (the Hartwicks) won the govt. rights to develop a major new alpine ski resort; massive open bowls of powder snow, available year round in the micro climate of the Callaghan Valley - man, I can feel it. Ok, I'm a huge Todd Brooker fan! That guy brings a whole new meaning to riveting dialogue to his NBC ski analyst telecasts!) What really happened here? With the specific allagations & govt. players involved in the derailment of this project, there was widespread perception that something was rotten in Denmark. Then I read the breaking news - wow - high fives to the Hartwicks! So what do you say that we do poll on everyone's motives on this forum - including yours? Seems equitable to me? Seriously, your focus albeit probably not intended, did serve a wider purpose in focusing on an issue currently discussed on blogs across the Internet; an prevalent problem that helped fuel my thread topic here based on factual reporting by well known journalists. Here is the root of the problem: Rampant sanitizing/screening of the REAL news by big Media, driven by agendas & vested interests directly connected to big money - connected to big government connected to private interests. Investigative journalism has gone the way of the dinosaur; instead the powers that be use their influence to suppress at all costs to integrity of journalism & the best interests of the people . . . any truth that is a threat to these private agendas & high profile players that are all interconnected for the wrong reasons. The result is an inverse relationship that exists with big Media: The more important an scandal is involving big money, vested interests, connected to Govt. assets & big agendas with their private sector pals, the greater the effort to suppress. such as the situation with Vanoc & the BC Govt. Given the content in those articles that gave birth to this topic, the recent absence in the 'Main Stream Media' of stunning new developments in this scandal with more legs than a centipede . . . . is a no brainer. You must have also noticed a similar pattern of the suppression of the truth that has prevailed in the MSM re: a massive political scandal involving a 2003 drug Raid on the Gordon Campbell BC Govt. Legislature which spiralled into a corruption case over the sale of our BC Railway, involving the Premier's Office? This case is coming to trial in March yet the news has been thin in the MSM over the past 4 yrs, while informative Blogs have surface to uncover/discuss the truth. Now they are being forced to report albeit on the back pages of the paper & nary a whisper on the radio or TV news. A recent post on one of the well known Blogs on the Raid on the Leg summed it up: "Most of the press had been grape-vined, . . . . . . Anyhow, the major press appears to be cooperating with the Gordon Campbell government and pretending there's nothing of interest in the most important "trial" in B.C. in the last many years. The major press never asks key questions, and it appears to do what it can to cover them up. Which, in itself, raises all kinds of questions." I think citizens like you & me deserve better, don't you, Canuckfan? Key Questions: 1. How did the Callaghan Valley suddenly shift to a focus on NORDIC skiing with little to no return for the "simple citizen of BC" in the first place (yet we see one private Nordic 'player' handed a license by his friends, the land bureaucrats) AFTER the sole proponent had won the final, legal Government proposal call for the exclusive rights to develop an international destination ALPINE ski resort, utilizing the huge alpine, year round potential in the microclimate of the Callaghan Valley? 2. Why is this Nordic private operator, who worked hand 'n hand with his pals the Vanoc land bureaucrats on the Callaghan Nordic Venue & Bid, suddenly trying to sell his Nordic license, benefitting from taxpayer funded infrastructure & Legacy trails, immediately after the RCMP confirm they are working on the new evidence, reopening the original allegations of corruption? 3. As one of the articles pointed out, why didn't Vanoc & the Land bureaucrats on the 2010 Bid/Vanoc, put the Nordic Venue at the obvious location of Cypress Mountain where other Olmypic events will be held & where extensive Nordic infrastructure already exists very close to Vancouver? Have a productive week. Keep those peepers open for the truth - it comes when you least suspect it! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
earseyeswideopen Posted February 4, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 4, 2008 For ease of reference, given this thread is so long, here are the key recent newspaper articles where key points are underlined: Business in Vancouver August 14-20, 2007; Issue 929 Powder Mountain ski resort controversy exhumed in lead-up to 2010 Olympics- West Vancouver mother/daughter duo hoping RCMP investigation will get to bottom of Callaghan Valley dispute 2010 Gold Rush 130 weeks until opening of the 2010 Winter Olympics . An Expo 86-era scandal may live again on the road to 2010. The RCMP is reviewing new evidence surrounding the aborted Powder Mountain ski resort in the Callaghan Valley near Whistler. Proponents Nan and Dianne Hartwick, a mother-daughter West Vancouver duo, hope RCMP will investigate how and why the Callaghan is becoming a $120 million, taxpayer-funded Nordic sports venue for the 2010 Winter Olympics. RCMP Commercial Crimes Insp. Kevin deBruyckere confirmed that a review is underway to determine whether to launch an investigation. "We're going to the wall on this," said Dianne Hartwick, "because we know that project was stolen from us." Hartwick-owned Powder Mountain Resorts won a 1985 public call for proposals and gained approval in principle from government. Forests and Lands Minister Jack Kempf claimed Premier Bill Vander Zalm told him in 1987 to "cease and desist" with the Hartwicks and favour Callaghan Resorts Inc., which was backed by ex-Social Credit attorney general Les Peterson. The B.C. Court of Appeal refused to overturn the B.C. Supreme Court's 1999 dismissal of the Hartwicks' breach of contract and abuse of office lawsuit. A special prosecutor's criminal investigation was halted in 2003, just three weeks before Vancouver was elected 2010 host at the International Olympic Committee session in Prague. Because of insufficient evidence, no charges were laid. The Hartwicks had visions of the Callaghan Valley becoming the sequel to Whistler. It's remained an under-promoted playground for cross-country skiers and snowmobilers. Brad Sills' Callaghan Country Wilderness Adventures opened a Nordic lodge there in 1998, just in time for the Canadian Olympic Committee's selection of the Vancouver-Whistler bid over proposals from Calgary and Quebec City. Sills was an early campaigner for Olympic ski jumping, cross-country skiing, biathlon and Nordic combined to be held in the Callaghan. Critics said West Vancouver's Cypress Bowl could've been 2010's temporary Nordic site for much less. The Callaghan won't displace Calgary as the national training centre, but it could someday be what Cypress can't be: a four-season destination resort with all the amenities enjoyed up the road in Whistler. The Hartwicks haven't given up their dream. They claim backing from 75 private investors. Former Olympic downhill skier Todd Brooker is their vice-president of resort development. "We're not against the Olympics; we're against what has happened," Dianne Hartwick said. Where are they now Who were the players in the Powder Mountain saga in the 1980s and where are they now? Nan and Dianne Hartwick: Then: mother and daughter duo active in real estate with Social Credit party connections. Had provincial government approval to turn Powder Mountain in the Callaghan Valley into a ski resort until Premier Bill Vander Zalm intervened on behalf of a former attorney general. Now: still trying. Bill Vander Zalm: Then: Social Credit B.C. premier from 1986 to 1991. Resigned after Fantasy Gardens conflict of interest affair. Now: retired. Jack Kempf: Then: maverick Social Credit MLA for Omineca. Appointed lands minister by then-premier Bill Bennett in 1986 and assumed the same role in Vander Zalm's cabinet until he was fired in 1987 over a travel expenses scandal. Died July 1, 2003. David Emerson: Then: Vander Zalm's deputy minister. Now: federal Conservative minister responsible for the 2010 Games. Colin McIver: Then: attorney general's ministry lawyer. Now: partner with Fraser Milner Casgrain. Represented VANOC in Callaghan Valley Nordic venue development. Jack Hall: Then: Burnaby regional land office director. Later became vice-president of development and marketing for Land and Water B.C., the lead agency providing Crown land and water resources to VANOC. Now: director of Property Assessment Appeal Board and Real Estate Foundation of B.C. George McKay: Then: was alpine ski development project manager for LWBC predecessor B.C. Assets and Lands Corporation in 1990s. Became director of the Callaghan Valley Master Plan during 2010 bid stage. Now: VANOC's director of environmental approvals. Also listed in B.C. Government Directory as tourism ministry's manager of special projects. 2010goldrush@gmail.com August 24/07 article from the Whistler Pique: RCMP reviewing Callaghan Valley dispute, again Powder Mountain Resorts hopes investigation will uncover past conflicts of interest, revive ski resort plans By Andrew Mitchell The proponents of Powder Mountain Resorts got a boost last week with confirmation that the RCMP is reviewing the facts of their case with an eye toward reopening an investigation into how their resort proposal was quashed 20 years ago. Several other recreation tenures in the Callaghan Valley — site of the Nordic Centre for 2010 Olympic and Paralympic Winter Games — have since been awarded. Business in Vancouver magazine reported the newest developments last week, and according to Nan Hartwick — who co-owns Powder Mountain Resorts with daughter Dianne — the possibility of a new investigation was welcome news. "This is the third time that the RCMP have taken up this investigation, but this time, because of all the terrible conflicts of interest everywhere, we think this is something that should move ahead," she said. "We went through three different public proposal calls until we won the third one clearly. Now our lawyer is joining us for a meeting with the new provincial ombudsman to give him our information, and all the proven details. We haven't spent 20-some-odd years for nothing." At the heart of the Hartwicks' complaint is the province's decision to award development rights to Callaghan Resorts in 1987, two years after Powder Mountain Resorts was the sole company to answer a request for proposal process to develop the area. According to Nan Hartwick the Forest Minister was about to approve their application when it was quashed by cabinet. The province said they quashed the Powder Mountain proposal over doubts that the Hartwicks had sufficient financial backing, which Hartwick says was not the case. At the time they had more than 75 investors behind them, all of which continue to back Powder Mountain to this day. Instead, the Hartwicks allege that cronyism was at play, and that then-Premier Bill Vander Zalm intervened on behalf of a friend who was involved in Callaghan Resorts. What has followed is more than 20 years of legal wrangling, lawsuits and appeals that have so far been unsuccessful. During that period the province has issued several land use tenures in the Callaghan Valley — including Callaghan Country, Powder Mountain Catskiing and Canadian Snowmobile Adventures — and aided in the establishment of the Whistler Nordic Centre as a venue for the 2010 Games. All of it is illegal, according to Nan Hartwick, who asserts that Powder Mountain had an agreement in principle with the province. "It's very important to repeat that we are not against the Olympics," she said. "We do think it's important for taxpayers to know that we never did ask for any government money, and we could have saved millions of dollars that were spent illegally in the Lower Callaghan Valley. We had the rights from the government, in documentation, to develop the entire valley, and still hold those rights." Hartwick believes that her resort could have hosted some of the Nordic events on privately funded facilities, or that the events could have been hosted far more easily at Cypress Mountain. She says the review will reveal that some of the same people who were involved in quashing her proposal in the 1980s are currently involved in the development of the Callaghan. If they can prove that conflict of interest as well as allegations of cronyism, Hartwick believes it will be a short leap to have the Powder Mountain Resorts' proposal for the area reinstated. "We don't need another lawsuit, it's the commercial crime group of the RCMP that's working on this investigation," said Hartwick. "They're going over everything, the entire history and everything that has happened. We're counting on them to be able to prove what we know and have known for many, many years." A previous criminal investigation by the RCMP was closed in 2000, shortly after the B.C. Court of Appeal dismissed a lawsuit for $5 million against Callaghan Resorts and others the Hartwicks allege were behind the decision to quash their resort proposal. Following the lost appeal, they applied to have their case heard at the Supreme Court of Canada — a process that is still ongoing. Hartwick said the RCMP's decision to re-open the case is based on new evidence of conflict of interest. The Pique: Whistler's Newsmagazine Published 2007-12-12 15:28:44 RCMP investigating Hartwicks' claims Review of Powder Mountain decision now an official investigation By Andrew Mitchell The RCMP has completed its review of a provincial decision to quash a resort proposal for Powder Mountain more than 20 years ago, and has referred to the case to senior investigators. For the mother and daughter team of Nan and Dianne Hartwick, lead proponents for a ski resort on Powder Mountain in the 1980s, the decision to open an investigation gives weight to their own claims that their project was sidelined by backroom dealings and government employees with conflicts of interest. They will meet with the RCMP's special investigators this week to share their documents, as well as new developments that have come to light. "Through all this time, we've never given up hope, we've never stopped investigating on our own, and now the RCMP has assigned some very senior investigators to our case," she said. "We're not looking for money, we just want the truth to come out and have our proposal recognized." This is the third time that the RCMP have investigated the Hartwicks' case, which stems from decisions made in government to quash their Powder Mountain proposal more than 20 years ago. At the time the Hartwicks won three different calls for proposals to develop the area in the Callaghan Valley, and were the sole bid for the project. In 1987 the province quashed the project because the Hartwicks did not have adequate financial backing, which the Hartwicks to this day deny. They had more than 75 financial backers when they applied for tenure, many of whom are still supporting the project. The Hartwicks claim to have documents that show then-Premier Bill Vander Zalm intervened on behalf of a friend who was involved in another proposal called Callaghan Resorts, and was supported by senior bureaucrats in the land use office — some of which continue to be involved in Callaghan development through agencies like the Vancouver Organizing Committee for the 2010 Olympics (VANOC). The most recent criminal investigation into the case was closed in 2000, shortly after a B.C. Court of Appeal dismissed a lawsuit by the Hartwicks against Callaghan Resorts and other parties. During the litigation, Land and Water B.C. issued several tenures for operations in the Callaghan, something the Hartwicks say should not have happened while court proceedings were ongoing. One of those tenures was for Callaghan Country, which is currently for sale at $5.95 million. The Hartwicks also allege that several documents that back their claims were not considered as part of the appeal, and were not included in the judgment. "That's all coming in to play now," said Dianne Hartwick, who has put together a detailed file with all of their court documents and instances where she feels there were conflicts of interest. She believes that everything that has happened since the province quashed their proposal has been a cover-up. "We won as the legal proponent to develop a ski resort in (the Callaghan), which we still want. That's what we're going for. Not for damages, but to get our rights back. We were derailed through deceit, unethical conduct. Now it's up to the RCMP to decide if it was criminal. "We're really thrilled, as all our investors are, that we stuck to our guns with the support of so many good people, and we're determined to right this wrong… we never gave up because we knew we were right, and have the evidence to prove it." 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earseyeswideopen Posted February 13, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 13, 2008 So Canuckfan, just for fun, I took your lead & googled the words you did, which of course turned up the recent discussion on this board along other sites posting the BIV articles plus the Pique articles. Interesting to note that all of the huge articles on this scandal up until a few years ago, printed prior to CanWest taking over both major papers in BC & all of the smaller community papers, have now been sanitized from the Internet & inaccessible in archives. Why aren't they reporting the big opening of the RCMP file now or doesn't it suit their private agendas? But, alas, your tip uncovered a front page story I remember well (which included a dramatic picture of the powder bowls in the Callaghan Valley that would be opened up at private sector cost by the sole proponent for this resort . . . . all being discussed with great excitement across the country over in Vermont - clearly ecstatic with the prospects of a massive new Alpine Resort coming onstream for the Olympics. Soak up these words with the descriptionthen go back to my questions above to put things in context. Just how did the Callaghan suddenly switch to a Nordic facility & who is behind it?????? Everyone is raving about the conditions of the Callaghan Valley. Looks like the Hartwicks as the winning proponent were ahead of everyone. So what happened???? Pretty obvious why the RCMP have reopened this hot scandal!!!!!! SKIVT-L Archives View: Next Message | Previous Message Next in Topic | Previous in Topic Next by Same Author | Previous by Same Author Chronologically | Most Recent First Proportional Font | Monospaced Font Options: Join or Leave SKIVT-L <A href="http://209.85.173.104/cgi-bin/wa?P1&D=0&L=skivt-l&T=0">Reply | Post New Message Search Archives Subject:Possible new ski area in BC (no Vt content)From:Geoff Devine <[log in to unmask]>Reply-To:Vermont Skiing Discussion and Snow Reports <[log in to unmask]>Date:Wed, 12 May 1999 18:44:46 -0400Content-Type:text/plain From today's (May 12, 1999) Vancouver Courier: Powder Blues Picture it: a resort five times bigger than Whistler, endless dry powder and twice as much snow as the dream season of 19999, not to mention golf courses, mountain biking, hiking, horseback riding and sailing. It's Powder Mountain Resort -- well, maybe. Next Monday, one of the longest-running dramas in B.C. history will come to a head in B.C. Supreme Court. Nan and daughter Diane Hartwick of Powder Mountain Resorts Inc. have been fighting for the right to develop Powder Mountain for 20 years. Powder Mountain towers over the Callaghan Valley, an area two and a half times the size of Whistler-Blackcomb, some 20 kilometers southwest of Whistler Village. Glaciers adorn the five mountain peaks-- Powder, Brandywine, Callaghan, Cayley and Metal Dome -- that encircle the 18,000-hectacre valley. A rough logging road leads to the valley from Highway 99, where signs point to Mad River cross-country ski area. <snip about 5 columns of text> Wow! 5 times bigger than Whistler-Blackcomb? That would put it in the class of Val d'Isere/Tignes, Les Trois Valles, or the Arlberg. There's some chance it could be up and running by the 2010 Winter Olympics. - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - SkiVt-L is brought to you by the University of Vermont. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
fisher Posted February 13, 2008 Report Share Posted February 13, 2008 Your ramblings are literally exhausting and make no coherent sense and give me a head ache. To your true form, you did the exact same thing you did every other time you posted - regurgitate the same information. Nothing new to add at all. & the conspiracy theories that you place around the Hartwicks make the whole Kennedy assassination look effortless. The internet is 'sanitized' that nothing is elsewhere... wow. If this is all that can be added to this dialogue maybe it's time to have this topic closed. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
earseyeswideopen Posted February 14, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 14, 2008 Here's a short little 'ramble' just for you, Fisher . . . I have every confidence even you, will be able to grasp: "I refuse to enter a battle of wits with an unarmed man." - unknown Hang in there, my friend - get a grip . . . . unravel your knickers. Everything is going to be OK. I am worried about you . . . . Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenadian Posted February 15, 2008 Report Share Posted February 15, 2008 So, lemme guess...you aren't signing up to be a volunteer? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baron-pierreIV Posted February 15, 2008 Report Share Posted February 15, 2008 So, lemme guess...you aren't signing up to be a volunteer? The UFOs in his/her sig should be a sign. Ready to ship out!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
earseyeswideopen Posted February 15, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 15, 2008 So, lemme guess...you aren't signing up to be a volunteer? Well. . . . . . I dunno, Kendegra - if the price is right . . . . Do we all get paid like all of the civil servants that are being forced to 'volunteer' by Czar Campbell for his pet project - after the big bombshell dropped today - quite the definition of 'volunteer' isn't it? Now we know what swelled the ranks of the volunteers How about you? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
earseyeswideopen Posted February 15, 2008 Author Report Share Posted February 15, 2008 The UFOs in his/her sig should be a sign. Ready to ship out!! Word has it, Baron, that the little green guys are leaving Texas to sample some of the specimens from this site . . . . . . maybe Fisher. BTW, Happy Valentines Day to you & Kendegra. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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