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Vanoc Scandal: Callaghan Valley Nordic Venue


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Erm, it hasn't actually. The budget of LOCOG (who are responsible for the event, not the venues) is mainly from the private sector and is £2bn. It hasn't changed and is unlikely to.

The ODA (Olympic Delivery Authority) is responsible for the venues. It's their budget that has risen but this is mainly because since we won in 2005, the government have decided to do more with the regenerative aspects than was originally planned. The costs of the venues has risen a bit but the main cost rise is for infrastructure that will be ready for 2012 but is only indirectly related to the games. There has also been a rise in security costs, but that's understandable given what's happened since 6/7/05. Plus, over a third of the £9bn is contingency; i.e. money that is available but that shouldn't be used.

So, when people say the costs of the Olympics is 9.3bn, they're only half right. Take the contingency off and what we should spend is £6bn. And a huge chunk of this £6bn is only indirectly related to the games anyway. Direct Olympics costs (venues and security) are about £4bn, less than half what people claim they are.

But I don't wish to derail this topic as it's not about London. Just thought I'd set these things straight.

I stand corrected then. But there was an article in Gamesbids awhile ago that did say an increase from 4 to 16 billion.

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Honestly speaking, I feel sorry for you, 'thatsnotmypuppy'. That you believe you needed to use such foul language to make your point known, is sad.

Do you think you look credible or strong when you resort to this garbage talk? Think again. Your gutter expressions only serve to tell the hundreds of viewers, soon to be thousands, all about YOU, my friend. Do you think that anyone is going to bother weighing your opinion after that?

In fact, your choice of words doesn't belong on any forum, as 'agenthuggles' pointed out.

Please note: You'd be wise to reflect on all the possibilities of who others posting on this site "are VERY well connected to" . . . Now, please, go wash your mouth out with soup & water & clean up your act.

P.S. Where are the Administrators on this site? I am very surprised that you leave foul language on your site. It's disappointing. I have a distinct feeling that many viewers are going to find posts like 'thatsnotmypuppy' distasteful - even those people that differ in their points of view from myself.

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TNMP is probably the most knowledgeable and well-connected member on these forums. His opinion is one of the most respected of all the members on this site. People won't start questioning his opinions because of a few little swear words.

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TNMP is probably the most knowledgeable and well-connected member on these forums. His opinion is one of the most respected of all the members on this site. People won't start questioning his opinions because of a few little swear words.

You must be one of his buddies ==HUH.. You don't get it either...!!!

Like the puppy doesn't. When injustice is done , and thievery , wether 20 yrs ago or now , and the Hartwicks have proof, wouldn't YOU and little puppy like to know the truth...????

I would, like millions of other people would...Your in London ==HUH doesn't affect you ???

Have a nice day.. I am

:rolleyes::D

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You must be one of his buddies ==HUH.. You don't get it either...!!!

Like the puppy doesn't. When injustice is done , and thievery , wether 20 yrs ago or now , and the Hartwicks have proof, wouldn't YOU and little puppy like to know the truth...????

I would, like millions of other people would...Your in London ==HUH doesn't affect you ???

Have a nice day.. I am

:rolleyes::D

Stop using two accounts, Earseyeswideopen, its annoying...

Your whole argument doesn't hold much water. Its, in all, a big conspiracy theory. Come back someone is formally charged in this case (which I doubt will ever happen), and we might be willing to discus this.

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Rob & Fox334

Please do your homework, Fox334. I only post under 'earseyeswideopen'. If you check under Profiles on this site, you will see 'Options' & under 'Options' there is a history of site names used by each poster. Always a good idea to check things out before shooting from the hip, don't you think?

If you are in fact 16 yrs. old then perhaps your excuse is that you will later learn from life experience & understand that the more information one has on an issue, the more one can make an informed opinion.

It's great to be cheerleader but very unwise to have blinders on & just drink joint bath water - it puts one in a distinct disadvantage particularly when making public statements, as on this forum.

Neither you nor Rob appear to 'get it', as other people have commented: that I am not arguing anything. I simply posted factual information that stunned me because this issue has been a highly public issue for years in British Columbia, regarding a large scandal surrounding the Vanoc & the Callaghan Valley; it is common knowledge here in BC that something is stinky & these articles clearly added to that perception.

Obviously this scandal does set off alarms as the Nordic Venue is the most expensive, taxpayer funded Venue of Vanoc in conjunction with private interests that directly benefit from the Venue and the Legacy plans with the massive layout of Nordic trails, all at TAXPAYERS expense.

People won't start questioning his opinions because of a few little swear words.

Rob, I suggest, most readers WILL.

For anyone to attack my fact based posts, with foul language, this is not appropriate, nor adds anything constructive to this thread.

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I'd like to know more about who the Hartwicks are. They've been investigating, lamenting and sueing over this deal for over 20 years:

CBC story from 1999

It seems as if they have lost this case numerous times. They must have money to keep putting up a stink like this and paying the legal fees to lose. I can't help but feel they are opportunists. Hard to feel they have been done a great injustice when they keep refusing to let go of something they didn't seem to have in the first place.

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:rolleyes:

I'd like to know more about who the Hartwicks are. They've been investigating, lamenting and sueing over this deal for over 20 years:

CBC story from 1999

It seems as if they have lost this case numerous times. They must have money to keep putting up a stink like this and paying the legal fees to lose. I can't help but feel they are opportunists. Hard to feel they have been done a great injustice when they keep refusing to let go of something they didn't seem to have in the first place.

:rolleyes:

Yes, Kendegra, they have lost cases, and if you would read the article, like I had to do, it states WHY THEY LOST IT... Corruption in your Goverment...as in my Goverment.

Maybe theyhave a document showing they own it....or can devolop...., and proof of lying and deception.

This is what is all about. !!!!

I am glad you are showing some interest. Hopefully more will come out, for one I want to see some of them get what they deserve.

Taxpayers, or not Taxpayers deserve some clean Goverment, not all are corrupt.

Have a great evening..

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Stop using two accounts, Earseyeswideopen, its annoying...

Your whole argument doesn't hold much water. Its, in all, a big conspiracy theory. Come back someone is formally charged in this case (which I doubt will ever happen), and we might be willing to discus this.

And Mr Fox, I am my own person...I joined and really am interested...on the outcome.???

ARE YOU ???

And if this matter comes to the formally charged, do you plan to put an appology on the posts???

I doubt you would, but will give you the satisfaction of the doubt..

It's your Taxes Not mine....Your Goverment !!!! You Go For IT !!!! Stay tuned... ;)

You have a nice evening.....I am enjoying seeing your post. :rolleyes:

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TNMP is probably the most knowledgeable and well-connected member on these forums. His opinion is one of the most respected of all the members on this site. People won't start questioning his opinions because of a few little swear words.

:rolleyes: Rob, I differ with you. In my political world, we don't have to swear. The Judges don't either. Justice and discussion can be WITH OUT the swear words.. Do agree??? Men usually watch the language, they want to be gentleman. I don't see anything that warrented the foul language used.. B---- was not at all good.. nor the rest. Read it again.....Sorry that you approve of that kind of language.

Have a good evening. :blink::o

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Fancy meeting you here, Johnny Furlong :rolleyes: !

Ha, :lol: ha, :D ha, :rolleyes: ha :D . . . .

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I'll give you one thing, you sparked up the Vancouver discussion forum for the first time in a long while. But I think your audience is off. This whole forum is populated by people who are passionate about the Olympics - discussing, analyzing, predicting and pondering the whole thing. If you are looking to get some attention to your cause, you might want to try some place like www.discovervancouver.com - it offers a public forum.

The Olympics are never devoid of controversy and scandal, but when you think of the Israeli murders in Munich, the SLC bribery scandal, Ben Johnson, the Athens construction delays, the Montreal finances, the Moscow boycott, and the dozens of way more interesting things out there, this story you have brought to the forum is kinda weak and really just a problem for a few people that are involved in the suit. And it is just one group of developers attacking another group of developers. Rather boring stuff, really.

But as much as this group loves the Olympics, we also do love a scandal and a good scoop. As long as it is interesting. So if you find any dirt on Jack Poole or know what the mascots look like, do tell!

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First of all, thank you Kendegra, for responding on a more reasonable basis. I look forward to heating up this thread plenty, if I see anything further developing on this story. Let's just say that we agree to disagree on this scandal over the Callaghan Valley Nordic Venue, Vanoc & linkages connected to the British Columbia Govt. You stated:

. . . this story you have brought to the forum is kinda weak and really just a problem for a few people that are involved in the suit. And it is just one group of developers attacking another group of developers. Rather boring stuff, really.

With all due respect, there is nothing weak about what I read in those two articles. Sorry, but you are wrong this story is NOT about "one group of developers attacking another group of developers. It is about a cover-up of conflicts of interests involving high levels of the Federal & BC Govt., its crown land bureaucracy, former crown lawyer & Vanoc ; a serious enough situation where the RCMP and the Ombudsman are actively involved on this case with new evidence.

Those facts in themselves tell us that this is no "weak" story, so please, reread the stories with an open mind.

Regardless of what country, what government is involved, where crown land, & billions of taxpayers dollars are being used under a local organizing committee for the Olympics, where it comes down to connections within networks of people that have been kissing cousins for years, the public must be vigilant & informed about what is happening behind closed doors. I am one of that group.

This story has been widely reported: the Callaghan Valley is crown land which the original company had won the legal rights to develop an international ski resort & that that their rights were stripped from them by a disgraced former Premier who had inserted his friend, a former Attorney General (with lots of pals in the court system) & land bureaucrats. From what I read, many of those same people are directly involved through Vanoc & the governments with the Callaghan Valley Nordic Venue. Of course this picture smells dirty.

That fact that the private company involved has persisted to speak up, speaks volumes to me & my friends, on a common sense basis, especially where Vanoc & govt. land bureaucrats are involved with crown land where a scandal has simmered for years.

I say to that company, good on you! I hope the full truth will out. Strong voices against corruption within government at both the bureaucratic & political level is an necessity in this world we live in, even into our courts where politics reigns ubiquitously. It is all too easy for the nudge, nudge, wink wink 'game' to go on behind closed doors.

When I read it firstly in BIV, not the mainstream media which has become notorious for sanitizing the truth worldwide, I believed this factual reporting should be shared to a wider audience, particularly an international audience that IS interested in all things Olympic.

One can still be "passionate about the Olympics," Kendegra, & still want to be fully informed. I suspect from the large number of viewers reading this thread, that I fall into a group of people who are very vigilant about the secrecy of Vanoc (all organizing committees) & the secretive dealings when it is the taxpayers paying the piper.

By for now.

P.S. I will check out the other site you mentioned when I get time - thanks.

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wideopen - 1st off - STOP putting your posts in colour. Actually, disregard that, please continue to put your posts in colour as they help me identify which posts to ignore.

Like most of us here that have been members for some time (long time member, but a 'silent' one :rolleyes: I was drawn to this thread because I like to read about what is going on in my 'host city' or the Olympics in general. Somewhere around the 2nd paragraph of your 1st post I went 'blah blah' and decided to read all of the replies to your post to get a summary of what you were trying to say.

Other then the fact your posts are wonderfully worded, they lack a great deal of substance with alot of conjecture and not much else. I know you will take this as an invitation to tell me how I am misinformed and you have every right to do so. But don't think I am fooled by what you are doing http://www.wetcoastwomen.com/wc-forum?foru...c=29&page=1 (Mr X, Kendegra, Minaturesnickers check this out - I figure you should know all the facts about earseyeswideopen as we at GB apparantly are cronies for Vanoc & Gordon Campbell) Tsk tsk earseyeswideopen. Such mean spirited language for a lady. It's not very nice to pretend to be something that you are not.

It is NOT common knowledge in BC that these games are stinky as many of the people that you are in 'dispute' of your posts are in fact from BC (myself included). Unless your poll of people come from the DT Eastside, the APC, or other already known opponents to the games. So do not try and lump me in to the group of malcontents that you are representing.

So to all of us, let us all hit the 'ignore' button and maybe she will find some other cause to bother people about. (oh, and take agenthuggles with you)

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Man oh man, this has been a real experience since I first posted those two factual stories!! I have been sworn at, dictated to re: what color & size of font to use, etc. - Heavens . . is this a cult operating on this site? Is there some rule that I missed stating that a wide variety of opinions & factual information are not allowed to be posted?

Getting involved here serves two purposes: firstly, to post some interesting media articles on the internet that are outside of the mainstream media (Rob the founder of this site - wasn't that part of your intent?); secondly, the "little group of posters who got their knickers in a twist" have provided me some light entertainment that make me chuckle.

Fisher, at least I have shaken you out of your "silence" & I am glad that at least you like the wording LOL Thank heavens for small mercies! :lol: Re: the "us" you refer to when you state:

So to all of us, let us all hit the 'ignore' button and maybe she will find some other cause to bother people about. (oh, and take agenthuggles with you)

Let me be clear: Are you suggesting that if someone isn't a member for a long time & doesn't share your views then they must be ignored. Isn't this a forum that Rob asks for discussion & input? Don't you & the others that have attacked me & agenthuggles want to be in step with the original flavour of this Forum???? You guys sound like the Gestapo - one poster suggesting I will be removed . . . good grief!

There are 1,000+ viewers to this topic, yet only a small group have focused on trying to discredit my & agenthuggles (high five for not being a sheep) comments. No one is making you & your pals read this thread. In fact, it would be good if you would ignore this topic because every time you post I feel compelled set the record straight from all this spin & my fingers are getting tired :rolleyes:

Fisher, also, thanks for posting that site link - there is a lot good issues posted here that I discovered through Google Alert which give a broader perspective to the dealings of Vanoc & how they are impacting British Columbians.

Kendegra if you explore a little, you will see some further info re: Poole that may interest you re: his linkages. I congratulate you for opening your mind to let some fresh air in. I encourage all viewers to read about the ridiculous narrow sampling taken during the referendum held on the Bid & other issues that are deeply affecting people. It would be fascinating to see a country wide poll where all taxpayers have a voice on Vanoc & how they have/are operating. People were seriously misled during the Bid phase.

I have NO problem posting the following from that site. It reflects exactly my experience here on THIS site with the unreasonable attacks & the perception created:

I discovered a site called GamesBids where there seems to be a ton of spin going on with the whitewash!!! Sort of like a media/PR site for Vanoc & the Campbell cronies agenda.

So I decided to drop some factual bombshells with the 2 stories above - sure seemed to get their knickers in a twist. . . but the topic has become HOT.

There are 3 posters that immediately teamed up to attempt to shoot down any factual information that raises big questions: Mr. X, kendegra & miniaturesnickers (who claims to be from the media???).

My intuition suggests that they just might have some of those paid media contracts unearthed in the pre-trial evidence for the Raid on the Leg - that stack the radio shows -it makes sense that Vanoc & the Govt. would try to quell any truth surrounding the 'Games' via this internet site.

I'd love for you & your readers to also post some reality checks on this site as it appears that many internet viewers check in:

You could even link to your site.

Have fun!

You wrote:
Such mean spirited language for a lady. It's not very nice to pretend to be something that you are not. . . . . . But don't think I am fooled by what you are doing"

Please understand that both men & women post to this other site. Seems to me you are making assumptions :rolleyes:

How am I pretending to be something that I am not?

How am I being mean spirited, pray tell? (I can tell you are not mean spirited, just perhaps in need of a broader perspective, dare I say that?)

What do you think I am trying to do?

I am completely upfront about my intent: I want to hear & share information beyond spin & blind acceptance surrounding Vanoc. I want the Games to be clean & run ethically. Discussing & sharing information, along with questions raised on issues is healthy. Ultimately this process ferrets out the truth- this is my focus.

I am not representing any group of malcontents, Fisher. But I have a heart for persons less fortunate & loathe deceit & unethical conduct in our systems designed to protect the public from abuse. I speak for myself. How about you?

I am so grateful for my life & the gifts I have received. Not everyone is lucky. I have learned to value what is important in life; that sticking ones head in the sand is no solution at all. Many people are suffering in BC - our social network of basic services like health, programs for children with special needs, overcrowded classrooms, low income housing falling to bits. . . . . . . & then I hear about millions of dollars being funneled into projects that benefit a small circle surrounding Vanoc - you bet I'm disgusted. So there are some more facts about me.

I hope to see some more thinkers around the world like agenthuggles (where are you from BTW) to speak up & dare to be counted beyond the spin.

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Before I go to bed - one more item:

I see the operator of this site claims that IOC reps are members of this Forum. GOOD.

Perhaps those IOC members would please ponder the following questions for starters, that I now have, after doing some further 'googling' on this topic & ask themselves if things were hidden to them as well as the public at large at the Bid stage by a circle of political pals? (I admit, I am a trained, professional researcher) - this stinks, folks:

1. Were they aware, (as per one article posted that began this thread) that there was an active, RCMP Commercial Crime investigation canceled just days before the Prague Bid selection re: this scandal surrounding the Callaghan Valley & the Nordic Venue? Doesn't this bother any of you people in retrospect?

2. Did the IOC fact finding committee that came to Vancouver in the Spring of 2003, during the Bid stage know that information surrounding this scandal was blocked by high ranking reps from the Bid Corp connected to Poole & Campbell?

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Further to the above questions:

Here are the links from the internet, that gave me the shivers:(Kendegra you might be interested, too) along with the excerpt below from my search:

http://72.14.253.104/search?q=cache:1Nigmy1eDMkJ:www.rafeonline.com/archive/straight/199403-1.shtml+paul+manning,+jack+poole&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=3

http://www.canada.com/cityguides/vancouver/features/vancouver2010/story.html?id=765cb98f-0162-4412-aa2d-d7705c1d407e

NO GAMES 2010 Coalition has been informed indirectly via Paul Manning of

the Vancouver-Whistler 2010 Bid Corp that some members of the NO GAMES

Coalition will be allowed to meet with the IOC Technical team.

The members chosen were 'invited' based on letters sent to the IOC by

various members of the NO GAMES 2010 Coalition. However, the list

excludes a number of other citizens who have raised critical issues that are

pertinent to the Vancouver-Whistler Olympic Bid.

These include:

Phil Lyons, Seniors Network

Nan and Diane Hartwick, Powder Mt Resort

a representative from the arts community

NO GAMES 2010 Coalition believes that the due diligence of the IOC

requires that they consult with the broadest possible spectrum of citizens and that all views be heard.

I am curious to know from any IOC members if they knew of these connections in the Bid Corp/Vanoc & further if they knew about the RCMP investigation active when they had this meeting? Many thanks in advance.

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wideopen - 1st off - STOP putting your posts in colour. Actually, disregard that, please continue to put your posts in colour as they help me identify which posts to ignore.

Like most of us here that have been members for some time (long time member, but a 'silent' one :rolleyes: I was drawn to this thread because I like to read about what is going on in my 'host city' or the Olympics in general. Somewhere around the 2nd paragraph of your 1st post I went 'blah blah' and decided to read all of the replies to your post to get a summary of what you were trying to say.

Other then the fact your posts are wonderfully worded, they lack a great deal of substance with alot of conjecture and not much else. I know you will take this as an invitation to tell me how I am misinformed and you have every right to do so. But don't think I am fooled by what you are doing http://www.wetcoastwomen.com/wc-forum?foru...c=29&page=1 (Mr X, Kendegra, Minaturesnickers check this out - I figure you should know all the facts about earseyeswideopen as we at GB apparantly are cronies for Vanoc & Gordon Campbell) Tsk tsk earseyeswideopen. Such mean spirited language for a lady. It's not very nice to pretend to be something that you are not.

It is NOT common knowledge in BC that these games are stinky as many of the people that you are in 'dispute' of your posts are in fact from BC (myself included). Unless your poll of people come from the DT Eastside, the APC, or other already known opponents to the games. So do not try and lump me in to the group of malcontents that you are representing.

So to all of us, let us all hit the 'ignore' button and maybe she will find some other cause to bother people about. (oh, and take agenthuggles with you)

Silent Fisher..... Welcome to the discussion. :unsure:

I came aboard like you did,except I am not silent. I am not going anywhere, and glad your not silent anymore. Must be got your shirt in a wrinkle LOL. Can't stand the truth can you. I know Politics, do you ? Maybe you are one of them who are in the article???

I am a friend to myself, not people on the posts. I do agree with Eyes,earswideopen, that upsets you?

I like to see how this is devolping into hopefully a case for the courts. I can smell dirty politicians. Can you? Are you so blind after reading articles like I did and still am from all that is happening. You don't have to agree, nobody is asking that. But maybe you should do some research like eyesearswideopen does, and post that.. OH and I didn't use color,,might ruin your eyes..., can't believe you picked on that on the post...

You have a nice weekend. ;)

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Further to the above questions:

Here are the links from the internet, that gave me the shivers:(Kendegra you might be interested, too) along with the excerpt below from my search:

http://72.14.253.104/search?q=cache:1Nigmy1eDMkJ:www.rafeonline.com/archive/straight/199403-1.shtml+paul+manning,+jack+poole&hl=en&ct=clnk&cd=3

http://www.canada.com/cityguides/vancouver/features/vancouver2010/story.html?id=765cb98f-0162-4412-aa2d-d7705c1d407e

NO GAMES 2010 Coalition has been informed indirectly via Paul Manning of

the Vancouver-Whistler 2010 Bid Corp that some members of the NO GAMES

Coalition will be allowed to meet with the IOC Technical team.

The members chosen were 'invited' based on letters sent to the IOC by

various members of the NO GAMES 2010 Coalition. However, the list

excludes a number of other citizens who have raised critical issues that are

pertinent to the Vancouver-Whistler Olympic Bid.

These include:

Phil Lyons, Seniors Network

Nan and Diane Hartwick, Powder Mt Resort

a representative from the arts community

NO GAMES 2010 Coalition believes that the due diligence of the IOC

requires that they consult with the broadest possible spectrum of citizens and that all views be heard.

I am curious to know from any IOC members if they knew of these connections in the Bid Corp/Vanoc & further if they knew about the RCMP investigation active when they had this meeting? Many thanks in advance.

Nice job on the research Eyesearswideopen,,,enjoyed reading the articles. Gave me a better insite and know I am right , in agreemnt.. Keep up the good work. B)

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Silent Fisher..... Welcome to the discussion. :unsure:

I came aboard like you did,except I am not silent. I am not going anywhere, and glad your not silent anymore. Must be got your shirt in a wrinkle LOL. Can't stand the truth can you. I know Politics, do you ? Maybe you are one of them who are in the article???

I am a friend to myself, not people on the posts. I do agree with Eyes,earswideopen, that upsets you?

I like to see how this is devolping into hopefully a case for the courts. I can smell dirty politicians. Can you? Are you so blind after reading articles like I did and still am from all that is happening. You don't have to agree, nobody is asking that. But maybe you should do some research like eyesearswideopen does, and post that.. OH and I didn't use color,,might ruin your eyes..., can't believe you picked on that on the post...

You have a nice weekend. ;)

When will you stop talking like a lunatic? :rolleyes:

That article is ancient history, tell us something we don't know. Concert Properties is one of the largest real estate developers in the city. With or without Jack Poole on the VANOC team, the company would've wanted to submitted a bid to build the Athletes Village.....but I'm glad they didn't, as indeed it would be a conflict of interest.

Getting involved here serves two purposes: firstly, to post some interesting media articles on the internet that are outside of the mainstream media (Rob the founder of this site - wasn't that part of your intent?); secondly, the "little group of posters who got their knickers in a twist" have provided me some light entertainment that make me chuckle.

I'm afraid you're the one that's entertaining us and wasting all your time posting here. ;) And yes, VANOC is responsible for $580 million of your tax dollars.....not "billions". Provide some actual proof if you will that VANOC is responsible for your "billions"....it does not exist. :)

There are 1,000+ viewers to this topic, yet only a small group have focused on trying to discredit my & agenthuggles (high five for not being a sheep) comments. No one is making you & your pals read this thread.

A small group? You mean all the long-time BC members at GameBids? :rolleyes:

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When will you stop talking like a lunatic? :rolleyes:

That article is ancient history, tell us something we don't know. Concert Properties is one of the largest real estate developers in the city. With or without Jack Poole on the VANOC team, the company would've wanted to submitted a bid to build the Athletes Village.....but I'm glad they didn't, as indeed it would be a conflict of interest.

I'm afraid you're the one that's entertaining us and wasting all your time posting here. ;) And yes, VANOC is responsible for $580 million of your tax dollars.....not "billions". Provide some actual proof if you will that VANOC is responsible for your "billions"....it does not exist. :)

A small group? You mean all the long-time BC members at GameBids? :rolleyes:

LOL LOL Lunatic...look who is talking MR X, the almighty MR X, the know it all with the good language,,, :lol::lol:

I am glad your pants are in a wad over the article this is proof of who you are... Proof, it is right in front of you everyday of your Taxes. Vanoc probably pays you to harrase people who don't do as MR X wants.. or they want...oh yes they are watching here.....how much are you paid??

Go take a ride down the Ski Hill will you ... You still don't get what it is all about !!!!!!! Go back to your people who sent you, as I am not backing down...now for sure can see the dirty politics, and you are one of them, :o Pick on your Vanoc people..

Mr Lunitic too you ;)

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Don't put a lot of emphasis on the number of "viewers" to this thread. Every time someone views this thread, the number goes up - even if you've read it 9 or 10 times. I'm sure about 70% of the views are from the 7 or 8 people who have replied in the thread. The rest are the regular gamesbids crew just taking a peek.

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Don't put a lot of emphasis on the number of "viewers" to this thread. Every time someone views this thread, the number goes up - even if you've read it 9 or 10 times. I'm sure about 70% of the views are from the 7 or 8 people who have replied in the thread. The rest are the regular gamesbids crew just taking a peek.

Thanks Kendegra, I appreciate you letting me know. that's fine by me. I just am interested in justice, as I work in Justice system.

Hope you are enjoying this three day Holiday. I sure am.

You are Sunshine to these posts..

Have good weekend !!

Agenthuggles

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