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Sir Rols

Rugby World Cup 2015

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I wouldn't necessarily disagree with that, but if the French really wanted to stage games elsewhere, surely Italy would have been a better option.

Something tells me it would have been more about getting the voting support of those unions.

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It was. I just like the idea of France and Italy, rather than France, Wales, Scotland and Ireland which will just be the same disjointed piffle as previous tournaments.

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No your right, Italy would be logical. 1995 and 2003 have been by far the best world cups and both were the only to be staged in one country.

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It would be interesting to see what kind of crowd turn out you would get for large international rugby matches in Japan. It's surprising just how many All Black's shirts, caps etc. you see in Tokyo and giving theyre large population, I wonder if they could full one of there largae stadiums for a rugby international.

As I said during the 2011 campaign, a World Cup's a World Cup, it would draw in the crowds, and Japan's close enough and welcoming enough to Oz and NZ anyway to bring in many of our diehards.

Actually, I quite like the idea with a Japan hosting of also having pool games in China and HK. I know it was suggested in the 2011 race, but I don't know if it was in their final bid. HK, I'm sure, with their huge expat population and experience with the World 7s, would bring some big crowds out too.

And yeah, the whole France-Scotland/Wales/Ireland thing was dictated solely by the need to get votes rather than the best interests of the Rugby in general and the tournament in particular. I don't know what the magic answer is, but the IRB is long, long overdue for some sort ofr shake-up if Rugby really is to proper beyond its traditional bases.

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I was just slowly catching up on news ffrom over the Christmas-NY period and came across this little snippet it appears we may have missed:

Scotland Considers 2015 "Celtic Cup" Bid

Hmmmm. I must admit that I've always liked the notion of a Celtic World Cup. I wonder how this would affect the votes against Japan and possibly England for 2105?

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Same problems for Scotland as with Euro 2008. Where are they going to play the games?

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I really would like to see and end to these regional bid that keep popping up.

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I really would like to see and end to these regional bid that keep popping up.

So do I _ but at least a pan-Celtic Cup would be better than most.

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I really would like to see and end to these regional bid that keep popping up.

yea i agree with you

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And yeah, the whole France-Scotland/Wales/Ireland thing was dictated solely by the need to get votes rather than the best interests of the Rugby in general and the tournament in particular. I don't know what the magic answer is, but the IRB is long, long overdue for some sort ofr shake-up if Rugby really is to proper beyond its traditional bases.

Yes, England was sold out for very little in return by the other home nations.

I mean when I heard that France won 2007 and got votes from places like Wales, Scotland, Ireland, because the French agreed to let these countries host a few matches in the 2007 tournament, I thought "OK- the final will be in Paris with one semi-final will be in Cardiff perhaps, the other in Marseilles and some quarter finals will be held in Dublin and Edinburgh etc..."

However, if we look at the world cup fixtures we can see that all they got in return is some pool games, and only 1 QF in Cardiff. The other 3 QF's will be played in Paris and Marseilles (x2). Cardiff is getting 2 pool games. Edinburgh is getting 2 pool games. That's it.

Paris is hosting the finals, both semi-finals and the 3rd place match.

http://www.rugbyworldcup.com/EN/Home/RWC+Finals+Matches/

In contrast, for the 1999 RWC, 1 QF was hosted at Dublin, Paris and Edinburgh. Also lots of pool games were held in scotland, Ireland, France and England. It was very well spread out and shared.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/1999_Rugby_World_Cup

And then the Scots wonder why the national lottery doesn't want to sponsor Glasgow 2014.

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A tournament for the future of the sport or one to look after the present. That was the choice and when they voted for 2007, they made the wrong one. There's a pattern developing.

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An update on Japan's chances:

PARIS, Jan 30, 2007 (AFP) - Japan may have been bitterly disappointed to have narrowly lost out on hosting the 2011 rugby World Cup but they have certainly learnt from any mistakes made during that process and are moving in the right direction to host the 2015 renewal.

Greg Thomas, director of communications for the sport's ruling body the International Rugby Board (IRB), believes the development of rugby in Asia is vital to the sport and will be boosted by Japan hosting the showpiece event.

``Losing the vote to host the World Cup isn't the be all and end all of things,'' Thomas told AFP.

``It's the four year cycle in between. The international form of the game hasn't been the focus in Japan, it has been the corporate clubs and the university structure.

``Japan has a long history of rugby and has an IRB council member. We have strong ties with Japan.''

He added: ``The Japanese Rugby Football Union (JRFU) is small but at the same time I don't think that the Japanese have done enough to promote rugby across the continent.''

However, Thomas believes that a page may have been turned following the defeat to New Zealand in the vote for the 2011 World Cup and that after recovering from the huge disappointment they have taken on board why they did not prevail.

``The clubs and the JRFU are talking for the first time which is great. The release of players for international tests is vital as it is this form of the sport that drives the game.

``We have encouraged Japan to go again for hosting the World Cup.

``They are making strides and taking on board advice from outside.''

Thomas said that Japan as a tier two side would receive vital funding from the 30million pounds earned from the past World Cup and this year's renewal.

And he added that Japan would gain vital experience from competing regularly in the annual Pacific Cup which also involves the Pacific Islands of Samoa, Fiji and Tonga as well as Australia A for the first time and for the first time the Junior All Blacks.

``That is the level that Japan are at and they know that,'' said Thomas, a former centre for Swansea and London Welsh.

``It will give them a chance to see if they can match the All Blacks Junior side and the Aussies.

``However at the moment Japan (who are now coached by former All Black playing great John Kirwan) are a little bit behind the likes of Fiji and Samoa because of their club structure.''

Thomas, though, added that an even greater boost to the sport and for Asian teams would be the introduction of the sevens version of the game into the Olympics, which narrowly failed to gain its place when it was voted on in Singapore in 2005.

``If we get the 7's into the Olympics then it will be huge for the Games.

``Access to athletes and coaches would double and triple in traditional Olympic countries and increase the exposure of the sport and the funding would increase.

``The sevens would also give countries on the African and Asian continents extra hope for winning medals. Their physique is better suited to that form of the game.''

While Thomas admits that the game has stagnated in Korea (who play-off for a place in the World Cup against Tonga in February) he believes there is huge potential to come from China.

``China is showing interest in the game and we have a regional director (one of eight round the world) based in Hong Kong who is looking at China.''

However Thomas acknowledges that Asia is not set to rock the boat at international level for a while to come.

``We are not talking about turning Asian rugby round immediately. It is a long term project.

``But I would reiterate that Asia is hugely important for us.''

AFP

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PARIS, Jan 30, 2007 (AFP)

Greg Thomas, director of communications for the sport's ruling body the International Rugby Board (IRB), believes the development of rugby in Asia is vital to the sport and will be boosted by Japan hosting the showpiece event

Well that's big of him......
``Losing the vote to host the World Cup isn't the be all and end all of things,'' Thomas told AFP

Well actually it could be the end of the major promotion of Rugby in Asia in the near future. Things like Rugby 7's in Hong Kong is not an equivalent to hosting a Rugby World Cup in Japan with some games in China- a country with a population of ~1.2billion.

``It's the four year cycle in between.
Yes- we can count.
``Japan has a long history of rugby and has an IRB council member. We have strong ties with Japan..............We have encouraged Japan to go again for hosting the World Cup.''

But the Japan has even stronger ties with the IOC. Osaka 2008 was shortlisted ahead of national capitals like Cairo, Bangkok, kuala Lumpar (the latter 2 having hosted the asian games and commonwealth games).

Why should Japan be interested in the Rugby World Cup when just one year later the 2016 olympics is up for grabs? Tokyo is one of the front runners. The IOC respects Japan, the IRB does not.

He added: ``The Japanese Rugby Football Union (JRFU) is small but at the same time I don't think that the Japanese have done enough to promote rugby across the continent.''
Um hello? Japan would have had an excellent opportunity to promote Rugby across Asia had they been awarded 2011.
However, Thomas believes that a page may have been turned following the defeat to New Zealand in the vote for the 2011

Yes a page may have been turned, possibly. However it could be a different page - a page where Japan may be thinking: "screw the Rugby world cup, who wants to host it anyway?" What other Asian country will be interested in bidding for the Rugby World Cup in the near future? China? I don't think so. China will be thinking about bidding for the FIFA world cup. India? Malaysia? Thailand? Indonesia? South Korea? I don't think so.

``But I would reiterate that Asia is hugely important for us.''

Yawn......whatever. Established rugby playing nations like Australia, NZ, England, France and other 6 nations members etc....are important to the IRB, that's about it.

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Yes a page may have been turned, possibly. However it could be a different page - a page where Japan may be thinking: "screw the Rugby world cup, who wants to host it anyway?" What other Asian country will be interested in bidding for the Rugby World Cup in the near future? China? I don't think so. China will be thinking about bidding for the FIFA world cup. India? Malaysia? Thailand? Indonesia? South Korea? I don't think so.

But they ARE bidding, and the whole point of the articile seems to be that they are doing it well. And certainly comments from Japan and the JRU over the past few months have indicated they are in the race very seriously this time.

Yes, though, it is going to be intersting to see if the Old Boys lock them out again this time. I do think, however, there was such outrage over the 2011 vote that the IRB can't afford to do that again. At this stage, only Scotland seems to have declared they're also going for it. England and South Africa would be the other possibles.

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Did it get personal after 2011, though?

I wonder how the English Union will approach the race. England, with Australia, were after all the biggest backers of Japan for 2011. But if England makes a bid for it, well, it will certainly conflict with what they were saying in terms of spreading the game in the lead-up to the 2011 vote. And if they don't bid themselves, would they support a Japan bid over a Scottish-led Celtic bid?

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It doesn't seem to me like England are in the race. There haven't been any bid like noises from the RFU, so you have to assume they're looking longer term.

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But they ARE bidding, and the whole point of the articile seems to be that they are doing it well. And certainly comments from Japan and the JRU over the past few months have indicated they are in the race very seriously this time.

Are you 100% sure that Japan will most definitely bid for 2015? Have they officially submitted their bid yet? What is the deadline? Otherwise, between now and 2008/9 they could change their mind and decide not to bid. I mean SF 2016, was a suprising U-turn in the American domestic race.

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Are you 100% sure that Japan will most definitely bid for 2015? Have they officially submitted their bid yet? What is the deadline? Otherwise, between now and 2008/9 they could change their mind and decide not to bid. I mean SF 2016, was a suprising U-turn in the American domestic race.

Yes they have, they officially launched their bid in November last year. There were quite a few news clips about it here at the time. And they seemed quite determined in the intervbiews at the time.

Planet Rugby - Japan Launches 2015 Bid

Anyway, considering that only Scotland seems to have made any other musings about a bid, and the outrage from so many quartyers over the 2011 decision, Japan's likely in a very good position to win it this time around.

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At this stage. It's still pretty early days, though, so I'm sure there will be other bids. Scotland and Ireland perhaps.

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Just thought I'd bring to everyone's attention a mention at the end of a story about England's 2018 World Cup plans and the FA's role in it. I won't include all the story _ that's being discussed in another thread, but there's a comment that is relevant to this discussion that I've put in bold:

The Football Association will not be allowed to run England's likely bid to host the 2018 World Cup because of the inept way they handled the ill-fated attempt to secure last year's tournament. The government is not prepared to let Soho Square organise and control any campaign for 2018 because senior figures do not believe the FA's top brass can handle a task of such scale and complexity.

.....

bla bla

.....

Meanwhile, with London staging the Olympics and so many other big sporting events coming or possibly coming to Britain in the decade from 2009, the government may appoint a Minister for Major Events to oversee progress. Cricket's Twenty20 World Cup is coming in 2009, with the full World Cup in 2019. The Rugby World Cup is likely to be held in Britain in 2015 and Glasgow is in the running to stage the 2014 Commonwealth Games.

Guardian Newspapers

Hmmm. Counting chickens before they're hatched? Inside information? Hopeful guess?

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DUBLIN, May 3, 2007 (AFP) - Dubai has won the right to host the Rugby World Cup Sevens in 2009 and the tournament will be the first to incorporate a women's competition, the International Rugby Board (IRB) announced on Thursday.

The Gulf state beat off stiff competition from Australia as well as bids from the Netherlands, Russia and the United States to secure the right to host the fifth Rugby World Cup Sevens. Dubai follows in the footsteps of Hong Kong (2005 and 1997), Argentina (2001) and Scotland (1993).

Dubai, which successfully hosted the world under-19 championships last year, secured the backing of 12 of the 24 members of the IRB council in the first round of voting, one short of the overall majority required.

The Emirate then emerged victorious 14-10 in a run-off against Australia, who had secured eight votes in the first round.

IRB Chairman Syd Millar voiced confidence that Dubai would stage a ``spectacular'' tournament.

``Dubai has a proven track record of staging major international events and has both the infrastructure and ability to stage a tournament of this scale,'' he said.

``There is a strong rugby community within the city and the annual Dubai Sevens has grown to become one of the most popular, colourful and well attended on the world sevens series, attracting capacity crowds.''

David Skidmore, the chairman of the Arabian Gulf Rugby Football Union and leader of Dubai's bid, said Dubai would be aiming to match the success of the 2005 event in Hong Kong.

``We are confident that we will deliver a tremendously successful tournament. Dubai has a strong history of hosting successful and well attended sevens tournaments and I am sure that everyone in the city will be extremely excited with today's news.''

Millar underlined that Hong Kong 2005 had set a new benchmark for the event.

``Hong Kong 2005 was an outstanding success,'' he said. ``A capacity crowd of 120,000 fans attended the three competition days, while the event was broadcast to over 450 million homes, breaking all previous tournament records. Over 10 million hits were recorded on the tournament's website and we anticipate 2009 being even more successful.''

The women's tournament in Dubai will be a 16-team event and run alongside the 24-team men's competition in an initiative that the IRB hopes will increase the chances of rugby sevens winning a place at the Olympic Games in the future.

AFP

Well, not directly related to 2015, but maybe this could be a stepping stone for Dubai to throw in its hat.

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