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dave199

Loose Change: 9-11 Conspiracy Movie

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Well the whole pentagon theory is being discussed in the other thread. I felt like making a new thread about this video called "Loose Change" about the 9-11 attacks. If you haven't already seen it view the video, it's really interesting and makes you think. It's 1h and 21min long so you need time to view it. Once your done, let us know what you think of the whole situation

http://video.google.com/videopl....+change

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as I replied in the other thread, these so called conspiracy theories are pure garbage and really way off base and extremely far fetched...things like JFK's assasination etc. are legitimate to speculate about like this...but unlike those events the events that undolfed on 9/11 are 100% concrete and WTC, the Pentagon, and Flight 93 were all the work of terrorists...nothing more.....and such theories completely undermine the thousands that died that day at the hands of 19 evil individuals...it is fine to speculate in many cases, but in this one it isn't necessary nor legitimate

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I think this film goes a bit too far, but they do ask interesting questions and I don't think it is disrespectful to ask those questions.  The people who died on 9-11 were treated with great disrespect as unfortunate pawns in someone else's game and if there is more to it than what meets the eye, then seeking the truth isn't disrespectful.

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of course not, but it is absolutey ridiculous to think that this was none other than a horrible act by 19 evil men who victimized thousands of innocent Americans on 9/11....

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of course not, but it is absolutey ridiculous to think that this was none other than a horrible act by 19 evil men who victimized thousands of innocent Americans on 9/11....

Exactly.

I stopped watching it after they were talking about the Boeing, United and American put options because that was when I could see the whole thing was going to be ridiculous.  Most of the airlines and Boeing were in trouble prior to 9/11, so of course there were put options.

And as for this whole thing about Silverstein putting an insurance policy on the towers in the event of terrorism hello  :rolleyes: does the 1993 WTC bombings ring a bell? Of course, that wasn't mentioned in the prelude segment to the actual attacks, nor was there any mention of Clinton's earlier intelligence on bin Laden.

And to say that Capt. Burlingame's American airlines plane "allegedly" crashed into the tower is disgusting.  

Pretty obvious to me that there is no "conspiracy" and this is merely a few amateur few film makers trying to be the next Michael Moore.   :rolleyes:

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Guest ryan04
Well done movie by what looks to be fresh out of college kids, but it is disgusting and repulsive.

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The WTC thing didn't make sense at all, though the accussations of explosives used does raise some eyebrows:

11%20-%20tower2-pre_ex.jpg

15%20-%20tower1-geyser.gif

16%20-%20tower1-charge.gif

This is a closeup of an ABC video. You can see a shaped charge/mini-explosion that shoots out of the Tower, well ahead of the leading wave of falling debris. Are these explosions caused by demolition charges?  You can clearly see the explosives bursting out of the Tower. A geyser-looking shaped charge shoots out of Tower 1, well ahead of the leading wave of falling debris. These type of explosions from buildings are the exact same ones you see from building demolitions.

but on the other hand the Pentagon thing does light up a few bulbs:

Clean cut building, no broken connecting steel gurters or rebar. It appears that none of the concrete structure was connected to the collapsed part of the building. Only wires and plumbing seem to be broken, and some minor damage to the walls face.

073_4a.jpg

The black circle in the photo below shows point of impact.  This is before the collapse of the wall. Where are the wings, where is the plane? Where is the damage to the wall from the wings  

facade-intacte-s.jpg

^ The tail of plane should have hit above the impact hole, but clearly, there was no damage to the area above the hole. The tail should have hit up to the third, or even fourth floor. The windows are still intact at this point.

A Boeing 757 is about 20-25 ft wide (fuselage) about 150ft long and over 150ft wing tip to wing tip. The tail section is 40ft tall. Where is the Plane ? It surely did not squeeze into that small hole shown. IT IS A BIG PLANE.

pentagon.jpg

The columns on each side of the hole do NOT seem to be seriously damaged.  Notice no damage to the area above the hole where the tail section should have hit. What happened to this tail section? It should have sheared off and fell to the ground at this point.

facade-intactesma.jpg

Why is there a central point of explosion? The gas tanks are located on the outer part of the wings of a Boeing 757 or 767.  The tanks are about 90ft apart. What caused the central explosion? Why were there not two explosions on either side where the gas tanks were?

SIPA.jpg

767a.jpg

I don't believe in any of this, but like Kendegra it does ask some interesting questions...especially what happened at the Pentagon.

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of course not, but it is absolutey ridiculous to think that this was none other than a horrible act by 19 evil men who victimized thousands of innocent Americans on 9/11....

Everyone is entitled to their own opinion but to simply believe that everything that happened was true and accurate is being delusional. These men indeed are involved but what if specific people within the U.S. government were involved as well? We will never find out.

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of course everyone is, and there will always be conspiracies regardless of the event...ALL major events have their fair share of ridiculous conspiracy theories, that is nothing new....

however, it is absolutely ridiculous and extremely far fetched to believe that 9/11 was none other then the work  of 19 evil men...you all saw EVERYTHING with your own eye's live what was unfolding that day, and there are thousands of photos, first hand accounts, etc. that prove it....including one's published by the Pentagon yesterday that completely show the "conspiracy theorie" are just complete rubbish....jeez the United States can't seem to do anything right in some people's eyes...not even when it comes to being attacked  :rolleyes: ...and I am sorry but sitting here speculating when there are a million things that show you otherwise, is ignorant and will do nothing to stop the terrorists still out there...luckily the majority of people do not pay any mind to these ridiculous theories.....

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of course everyone is, and there will always be conspiracies regardless of the event...ALL major events have their fair share of ridiculous conspiracy theories, that is nothing new....

however, it is absolutely ridiculous and extremely far fetched to believe that 9/11 was none other then the work  of 19 evil men...you all saw EVERYTHING with your own eye's live what was unfolding that day, and there are thousands of photos, first hand accounts, etc. that prove it....including one's published by the Pentagon yesterday that completely show the "conspiracy theorie" are just complete rubbish....jeez the United States can't seem to do anything right in some people's eyes...not even when it comes to being attacked  :rolleyes: ...and I am sorry but sitting here speculating when there are a million things that show you otherwise, is ignorant and will do nothing to stop the terrorists still out there...luckily the majority of people do not pay any mind to these ridiculous theories.....

Yeah these 19 men were involved, but do you think it is even possible that they might have been helped out by certain government officials?

And that video they released yesterday had been on the Internet. And you can't even see a plane flying into the pentagon. The Pentagon terrorist attacks seem to me to be the most confusing one of all. If a plane did indeed crash into it, why was the grass nicely trimmed and clean, no mess whatsoever when a plane just comes crashing down right into the Pentagon? The building didn't even look like a plane smashed into it. There was no debris from the plane to be seen. There was a circular whole going through the building. Where were the wings of the plane after smashing into the building? Wouldn't we be able to see the damage the wings caused to the building, they would have left an imprint in the building which we do not see. Can one of you please explain to me how this was indeed an actual plane when there is no physical evidence whatsoever at the site.

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believe whatever you want....what it boils down to it is 100% ridiculous to try and point the finger at none other then the evil men who did this by themselves...the evidence coupled with what we all saw unfold that day correlate that this was a terrorist attack...nothing more....much of the evidence pointed out like the grass, etc. is garbage....we have nothing to compare it to in the past (I mean when was the last time commercial planes crashed into such buildings)...and therefore who is anyone to say the grass had to be burnt or whatever?....and that tape does show a plane going into the building, and was enough to silence many who were supporting some of these ridiculous conspiracy theories.....

and again, there will always be conspiracy theories after ANY major event...I am sure there are people who think London and Madrid were made up too.....but again with all these attacks we saw what happened, and the evidence and following events all point to one group, and one group only..despite what a few little amature college students may have to say about it  :rolleyes:

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believe whatever you want....what it boils down to it is 100% ridiculous to try and point the finger at none other then the evil men who did this by themselves...the evidence coupled with what we all saw unfold that day correlate that this was a terrorist attack...nothing more....much of the evidence pointed out like the grass, etc. is garbage....we have nothing to compare it to in the past (I mean when was the last time commercial planes crashed into such buildings)...and therefore who is anyone to say the grass had to be burnt or whatever?....and that tape does show a plane going into the building, and was enough to silence many who were supporting some of these ridiculous conspiracy theories.....

and again, there will always be conspiracy theories after ANY major event...I am sure there are people who think London and Madrid were made up too.....but again with all these attacks we saw what happened, and the evidence and following events all point to one group, and one group only..despite what a few little amature college students may have to say about it  :rolleyes:

Plane crashes leave behind destruction. They leave behind plane debris all over the place and messes up the ground around impact. Take a look at the impact site, you do not see any of this. There is no wing imprints on the building where the impact took place which is also weird. If they broke off before hand where are they? The ground is nice and neat around impact which is very odd. You keep mentioning that its the evil 19 men that did this and all the evidence points to them. What about this evidence being presented here? Your not addressing it properly, your just saying its bullsh1t. Saying that this is all garbage is pretty ignorant. I would like for you to prove me wrong.

And I'm sorry, that video that they released yesterday isn't much. I can't even see a plane crashing into the building. All I see is a flash then a big explosion. That video has been on the internet for some time. I wonder why they are releasing it on media outlets now.

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and I think it is ignorant and idiotic to believe such a conspiracy theory proposed by a bunch of stupid college kids....

but whatever if you want to believe that there is this huge conspiracy by the once again evil USA and sneaky USA government who hired terrorists to strike then whatever...that's your problem  :rolleyes:

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and I think it is ignorant and idiotic to believe such a conspiracy theory proposed by a bunch of stupid college kids....

but whatever if you want to believe that there is this huge conspiracy by the once again evil USA and sneaky USA government who hired terrorists to strike then whatever...that's your problem  :rolleyes:

Why is it ignorant to question things? That's what I am doing with the Pentagon situation. It is igornoant when you ignore things such as this. Ok, you've found 19 guilty men, lets end it like this and thats it. Let us not question anything then. And by the way you still aren't answering my questions man.

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it is fine to question things....if they need to be questioned....

I heard those college students are making a sequal to their wonderful work on how the US also caused Diana's death, as well as the Madrid and London bombings as well :rolleyes: ....you should work with them on that

and to answer your question, there is plenty of documented proof that the evets unfolded that way, we SAW it and it's after math, and the arguments presented are EXTREMELY far fetched....nothing like this has ever happened before, how the hell could someone say what they would have "expected to see"....I say these conspiracy people should get a life

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it is fine to question things....if they need to be questioned....

I heard those college students are making a sequal to their wonderful work on how the US also caused Diana's death, as well as the Madrid and London bombings as well :rolleyes: ....you should work with them on that

and to answer your question, there is plenty of documented proof that the evets unfolded that way, we SAW it and it's after math, and the arguments presented are EXTREMELY far fetched....nothing like this has ever happened before, how the hell could someone say what they would have "expected to see"....I say these conspiracy people should get a life

Maybe you should work on improving your arguments besides being "farfetched" than personally poking a jab at me with that remark that I should work with them on a new movie.

Your point makes no sense. You still didn't refer to why these was no plane debris at the scene and why the ground wasn't messed up. Plane crashes have happened before, yes, into buildings as well. The damage left over you could tell was caused by an airplane, for example, just like the World Trade Centre. You see the plane flying into the building and you see the imprint of the plane on the building after impact. Something that you do not see on the Pentagon. No wing marks at all. I will state it once again, I just find something wrong with the way these Pentagon attacks took place. The World Trade Centre attacks I believe, Flight 93 I want to believe but it'll be hard to prove anything else otherwise. Then we got the Pentagon, no evidence of a plane debris, does that make any sense at all?

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And the Holocaust was caused by Zionists themselves so that they wouldn't have 10 million European Jews all migrating to Israel and gobbling up the small country.  So, the early Zionists went there and bought up all the land so they could speculate and make a fortune in future years, having missed out on the Florida boom.  

I'd like to see them take a stab at that theory.   :rolleyes:

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And the Holocaust was caused by Zionists themselves so that they wouldn't have 10 million European Jews all migrating to Israel and gobbling up the small country.  So, the early Zionists went there and bought up all the land so they could speculate and make a fortune in future years, having missed out on the Florida boom.  

I'd like to see them take a stab at that theory.   :rolleyes:

Ok, now your just going out of context here and being dumb. I'm just questioning one of the events that took place. Don't tell me that it isn't weird that there's no plane debris at all.

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sadly baron,yours makes even more sense then this 9/11 one....

after all these conspiracies what will the USA think of next!

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Just because something is seen does not necessarily mean it’s true. Pictures and video in our time can be changed and altered. And it’s perfectly within the US government’s agenda to lie about things, or to withhold information. Throughout the last 50 years our governments have withheld and manipulated information to be feed through the media to achieve a message that is suitable to them. It took people asking questions and demanding answers in order for the governments to come clean. Two major examples include the affects of DDT and other pesticides in the 1960's after Rachel Carson's book and in the late 80's when the Surgeon General finally came clean about the affects of smoking and the addictive nature of nicotine.

Not to mention with organizations like the CIA, FBI, Mossad, whatever the Brits intelligence is, the former KGB and Stasi and the numerous other intelligence agencies out there that manipulation and forced interpretation of the truth is prevalent and within most governments moral compass. Our governments, even in free and democratic nations, can control and alter the information we receive. Through publication bans, material bans, strong-arm tactics, and other means governments suppress and control information. To not think this is happening is laughable. We probably receive 1/100th of the actually information coming out of Iraq and the middle-east. Governments keep secrets, it’s in their nature.

In regards to Sept. 11th, it is quite possible that the US government reported manipulated or false findings in order to make people prouder (a la Flight 93) or to not scare them as much (a la the numerous bomb reports from the WTC especially in Tower 4, 5 and 7). Not to mention it was reported within the first few days that the hijackers got into the US from Canada, when in fact they were direct entry for the most part and in fact trained at US based flight schools. This information like most about Sept. 11 came from the US government in the days and weeks following the attacks until the media started to get information more then one source.

I wouldn’t put it past a government, but in this case I really hope not.

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Don't tell me that it isn't weird that there's no plane debris at all.

uhmm...too bad Boeing didn't make planes of indestructible titanium so that there would be many pieces left as souvenirs whenever a plan crashed.  

Or better yet, that the plane would be whole when it crashed.  

But then of course, it would never have gotten off the ground.  Duh?   :rolleyes:

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Just because something is seen does not necessarily mean it’s true. Pictures and video in our time can be changed and altered. And it’s perfectly within the US government’s agenda to lie about things, or to withhold information. Throughout the last 50 years our governments have withheld and manipulated information to be feed through the media to achieve a message that is suitable to them. It took people asking questions and demanding answers in order for the governments to come clean. Two major examples include the affects of DDT and other pesticides in the 1960's after Rachel Carson's book and in the late 80's when the Surgeon General finally came clean about the affects of smoking and the addictive nature of nicotine.

Not to mention with organizations like the CIA, FBI, Mossad, whatever the Brits intelligence is, the former KGB and Stasi and the numerous other intelligence agencies out there that manipulation and forced interpretation of the truth is prevalent and within most governments moral compass. Our governments, even in free and democratic nations, can control and alter the information we receive. Through publication bans, material bans, strong-arm tactics, and other means governments suppress and control information. To not think this is happening is laughable. We probably receive 1/100th of the actually information coming out of Iraq and the middle-east. Governments keep secrets, it’s in their nature.

In regards to Sept. 11th, it is quite possible that the US government reported manipulated or false findings in order to make people prouder (a la Flight 93) or to not scare them as much (a la the numerous bomb reports from the WTC especially in Tower 4, 5 and 7). Not to mention it was reported within the first few days that the hijackers got into the US from Canada, when in fact they were direct entry for the most part and in fact trained at US based flight schools. This information like most about Sept. 11 came from the US government in the days and weeks following the attacks until the media started to get information more then one source.

I wouldn’t put it past a government, but in this case I really hope not.

Exactly, like I mentioned earlier. Whoever believes everything their government tells them is completely delusional.

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sadly baron,yours makes even more sense then this 9/11 one....

after all these conspiracies what will the USA think of next!

The government is also responsible for Katrina hitting New Orleans.  It's true!  GWB and a top group of scientist decided that new Orleans should be wiped off the map in order to force the price of oil up so that his friends could get richer.   :oo:  :rolleyes:

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big plane goes through small window. men on moon with no stars in the background...footprints on the moon lol believe what u like i spose...

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