iceman530 Posted September 2, 2021 Author Report Share Posted September 2, 2021 3 hours ago, baron-pierreIV said: Actually, LA 2028 and USOPC can have their 2028-30 cake and eat it too. Confront the possibility of "Olympic overkill w/in 2 years' time" head-on. For the two bi-seasonal sportsfans, offer them "priority ordering" position for the popular Winter Events like Opening Ceremony, the Figure Skating finals, the Hockey finals -- for those who will order special 2028 packages, they'll get first crack at the 2030 events and ALSO have an option to profit a little from the early moves by offering them on a supervised re-sale, auction site. The US/Canada by 2027 are a large enough market of 375 million, relatively wealthy people who can buy what? 10,000 of those premium packages -- and get the excitement for 2030 going, relatively early just as LA 2028 starts to peak. Obviously, for those special packages, LA 2028 and SLC 2030 will have to have a shared database for those 2-for-1 premium packages. That's the sort of creativity and resourcefulness that is going to need to be required. I hope the people in higher positions are thinking of stuff like this. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FYI Posted September 3, 2021 Report Share Posted September 3, 2021 On 8/29/2021 at 12:53 PM, iceman530 said: Almaty basically looks like the Former USSR's Denver, and from a climate and cultural standpoint, Denver aint too bad. Sure, & we all know what happened with Denver. Even the USOC passed them up this last time around in favor of SLC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iceman530 Posted September 12, 2021 Author Report Share Posted September 12, 2021 Well, we now have our official bottom rung fallback plan: Lviv. I guess I can put the silly Sochi emergency plan to bed now. For Lviv to get it the following needs to happen: 1) SLC would have to insist on 2034 2) Vancouver gets referendum downvoted 3) Sapporo gets LOLnoped 4) Lviv it is If you are reading the tea leaves like me..........that is incredibly realistic. Certainly more realistic than Barcelona. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iceman530 Posted September 12, 2021 Author Report Share Posted September 12, 2021 Lviv is now the contingency scenario Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanMUC Posted September 13, 2021 Report Share Posted September 13, 2021 Lviv is hardly the contingency plan, given its lack of venues & experience. Pyeongchang hasn‘t been mentioned yet in this thread. After all, Innsbruck was the fall back option only 12 years after it hosted, so that could be a secret way out for the IOC, going back to PC. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faster Posted September 16, 2021 Report Share Posted September 16, 2021 Y'all speak of Norway; but the IOC has 5 other European countries it could come to hat-in-hand with a bag of money to get going. France (Grenoble and surrounding) Germany (Munich and surrounding) Switzerland (f-ck it, the whole country) Sweden (Stockholm with a side of Are and Latvia) Austria (Vienna with their mountain regions) If the IOC was struck, they could easily get one of these to host at shorter noticed if the money was right. It would probably take a package of concessions similar to what Norway asked for and the financial package that is being given to LA. But it could be done. Especially overtop of the Milano-Cortina model. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanMUC Posted September 17, 2021 Report Share Posted September 17, 2021 To bring politics and public on their side here, I guess the IOC would need to go bankrupt first. As for Switzerland, remember the referendum obsession. That‘s very unlikely to produce a pro-Olympics result whatever they throw in. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iceman530 Posted September 17, 2021 Author Report Share Posted September 17, 2021 People need to give up on the western European dream bids. Enjoy Milan/Cortina. That is gonna be it for that region for quite some time. Maybe for many of our lifetimes. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris_Mex Posted September 17, 2021 Report Share Posted September 17, 2021 21 minutes ago, iceman530 said: People need to give up on the western European dream bids. Enjoy Milan/Cortina. That is gonna be it for that region for quite some time. Maybe for many of our lifetimes. We can straight up conclude IOC messes up olympics reputation wherever it goes Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
stryker Posted September 17, 2021 Report Share Posted September 17, 2021 The IOC can throw all the money they want at the likes of Switzerland, Germany, etc. The IOC still has a PR problem and they have failed to address that with any of their reforms to the bidding process, and when they have tried it's been comedic (see what happened with Calgary's failed 2026 bid). With a skeptical public, the IOC needs to have a pitch to answer the question "What benefits do hosting the Olympics provide?" The answer needs to go beyond the feel good national pride stuff. 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iceman530 Posted September 17, 2021 Author Report Share Posted September 17, 2021 Im pretty much ready to give up on this Agenda 2020 stuff, at least for winter, minus the whole Continuous Bid thing. The only ones left are the likes of Lviv who yes would have to build it from scratch. If they wanna build it for scratch for national prestige, eff it. Let them do it. If they want to do a budget compact bid with sustainability, let them do that too. But lets be real, Agenda 2020 has swayed no one, especially not Europe, of any change, and Im not sure even a 20 year campaign of "agenda 2020-ing" will sway Europe of any change of mindset. Rejecting the Olympics is as engrained in "old Europe" as vaccines are in the American confederacy. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FYI Posted September 17, 2021 Report Share Posted September 17, 2021 I don't think even the IOC itself believes too much in their own so-called Agenda 2020. In the end, all it is, is mere lip-service. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanMUC Posted September 17, 2021 Report Share Posted September 17, 2021 10 minutes ago, FYI said: I don't think even the IOC itself believes too much in their own so-called Agenda 2020. In the end, all it is, is mere lip-service. That‘s why they rather talk about the wonderful New Norm now. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
iceman530 Posted September 17, 2021 Author Report Share Posted September 17, 2021 1 hour ago, FYI said: I don't think even the IOC itself believes too much in their own so-called Agenda 2020. In the end, all it is, is mere lip-service. Agreed. If Sapporo doesnt want in or Vancouver gets voted down, let Lviv build their Sochi Jr. in Bukovel Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris_Mex Posted September 17, 2021 Report Share Posted September 17, 2021 1 hour ago, StefanMUC said: That‘s why they rather talk about the wonderful New Norm now. Yeah also comment on ¿its forcing a country to host the olympics during the middle of a pandemic part of the agenda 2020?. I know olympics are business, but that move will be remembered as one of the worst decisions IOC could have made. As barcelona organizing comitee once said, olympics should be at service of the city, not the other way. But nowadays it seems like cities are not only at service of the olympics, but of the IOC and its partners 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FYI Posted September 17, 2021 Report Share Posted September 17, 2021 57 minutes ago, iceman530 said: Agreed. If Sapporo doesnt want in or Vancouver gets voted down, let Lviv build their Sochi Jr. in Bukovel That shouldn't be the answer either, & is just asking for even more trouble than the IOC already has. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faster Posted September 19, 2021 Report Share Posted September 19, 2021 Imagine: It is late 2022 and the IOC has the news that SLC, Sapporo and Vancouver are not bidding. Leaving them with Lviv and Sochi The ExCo meets and puts out feelers to local governments in the major winter European countries. What concessions it would take, what Euro figure would be required. I cannot imagine a scenario where Switzerland/Austria/France/Norway/Sweden would not at least try to get their populace on board if that IOC was willing to negotiate a true host city contract and provide at least 1.5 billion euros in funding. If you look at the model of Milano/Cortina; possibilities of Zurich-Lausanne-St Moritz-Davos or Salzburg-Klagenfurt-Graz-Innsbruck don't seem all that impossible. The only one where I think their might be issues Is Munich-Garmish because Garmish seemed to go down more on the environmental issue. The cost to accommodate a Western European host should be the lesser pill to swallow for the IOC then Sochi 2.0. And I can only imagine the pressure the IFs (who are already unhappy) would bring to bear on the IOC. I also think the IOC would likely prefer accommodating European demands then to have to negotiate SLC wanting 2030 instead of 2034. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanMUC Posted September 19, 2021 Report Share Posted September 19, 2021 Of those above, Austria would probably be the easiest to persuade as there‘s less referendum pressure and the Austrian Skiing Federation is like a state in the state, being highly influential in politics. But it would still take the IOC a huge lot of convincing work to make it happen. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faster Posted September 19, 2021 Report Share Posted September 19, 2021 It would take the IOC to eat humble pie. Its like on an individual basis most of the main functioning members of the IOC are normal, rational people. But put them in the same room with the other idiot hangers-on that somehow continue to become members and everything goes out the window. The IOC should have had this meal and accepted Oslo's demands for 2022 instead we have what is coming next. They need to actually learn from this instead of trying to duct tape over everything. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FYI Posted September 19, 2021 Report Share Posted September 19, 2021 Well, yeah. The IOC 'should've' (key word there) accepted Oslo's conditions, but obviously the IOC was too proud at the time to swallow that pill. Do they regret that now, though? Maybe, but then again, maybe not, since it's the IOC afterall. That said, I can see France giving it a go, but only after Paris 2024, & if it goes off without too much fuss. So that means 2034 at the earliest for them. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Chris_Mex Posted September 20, 2021 Report Share Posted September 20, 2021 13 hours ago, Faster said: Imagine: It is late 2022 and the IOC has the news that SLC, Sapporo and Vancouver are not bidding. Leaving them with Lviv and Sochi The ExCo meets and puts out feelers to local governments in the major winter European countries. What concessions it would take, what Euro figure would be required. I cannot imagine a scenario where Switzerland/Austria/France/Norway/Sweden would not at least try to get their populace on board if that IOC was willing to negotiate a true host city contract and provide at least 1.5 billion euros in funding. If you look at the model of Milano/Cortina; possibilities of Zurich-Lausanne-St Moritz-Davos or Salzburg-Klagenfurt-Graz-Innsbruck don't seem all that impossible. The only one where I think their might be issues Is Munich-Garmish because Garmish seemed to go down more on the environmental issue. The cost to accommodate a Western European host should be the lesser pill to swallow for the IOC then Sochi 2.0. And I can only imagine the pressure the IFs (who are already unhappy) would bring to bear on the IOC. I also think the IOC would likely prefer accommodating European demands then to have to negotiate SLC wanting 2030 instead of 2034. OK I wouldn't rule out Barcelona. Following sanchez declarations towards the bid, it seems like in spain's governement they think they can carry on a world cup and an olympic games in the same year. Now they only need to get aragon's government on their side to concrete what I would think is, a pretty strong bid. The only factor against tghe bid, I believe, could be public support, and madrid's goverment, pushing for their 4th bid in 2036. Also if this bid goes on with enough government support and lose the bid, considering 2036 will probably be elected in 2025 and 2030 in 2023, maybe they will do a russia and use the momentum to push towards a summer bid 2 years later, like rome and torino, or moscow and sochi. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baron-pierreIV Posted September 20, 2021 Report Share Posted September 20, 2021 Annecy? How about a rebuilt Sarajevo? There's that great "Re-Birth" theme!! Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanMUC Posted September 20, 2021 Report Share Posted September 20, 2021 43 minutes ago, baron-pierreIV said: Annecy? How about a rebuilt Sarajevo? There's that great "Re-Birth" theme!! I absolutely love Sarajevo, it's such an amazing city with all its history, but they would need immense spending too for it to happen, and Bosnia-Herzegovina is not only a political mess but also an economic disaster, much worse so than Ukraine. Certainly not a contingency plan at all, but maybe they make a sentimental and hopeless bid for the 50 year anniversary 2034. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quaker2001 Posted September 20, 2021 Report Share Posted September 20, 2021 On 9/19/2021 at 11:28 AM, FYI said: Well, yeah. The IOC 'should've' (key word there) accepted Oslo's conditions, but obviously the IOC was too proud at the time to swallow that pill. Do they regret that now, though? Maybe, but then again, maybe not, since it's the IOC afterall. That said, I can see France giving it a go, but only after Paris 2024, & if it goes off without too much fuss. So that means 2034 at the earliest for them. The IOC having regrets would imply that they thought they made a mistake in the first place. And given how they responded to Norway's withdrawal, I'm less than convinced that the IOC actually believes they did anything wrong. On 9/17/2021 at 1:35 AM, iceman530 said: People need to give up on the western European dream bids. Enjoy Milan/Cortina. That is gonna be it for that region for quite some time. Maybe for many of our lifetimes. We heard that after 2022 was awarded and look what happened with 2026. Not 1, but 2 European bids. So to write off Europe for decades to come is premature. I don't know what the Winter Olympics will look like long-term. They're in trouble right now, we all acknowledge that. Tough to figure how to fix that. But as the story goes, all the IOC needs is 1 willing participant and they're covered. Given what they just did with Brisbane, it's far from inconceivable that they'll find a European country they decide they want to work with and figure out how to make it worth their while. Easier said than done and obviously it requires the IOC to own up to their reputation. I'm certainly not holding my breath waiting for that to happen, though Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
AustralianFan Posted September 24, 2021 Report Share Posted September 24, 2021 Opposition rises, pushes for referendum to stop Pyrenees-Barcelona 2030 Winter Olympics bid - 23Sep21 - Gamesbids.com Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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