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Your Say on Toyko 2020 (2021)


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if the IOC is really going to insist on holding the games come hell or high water, as these news stories suggest, then it is the responsibility of NOCs to vaccinate their athletes and send them, given every precaution is taken.

i think spectators are a non-starter -- thank heavens the US isn't hosting. journalists and volunteers should also be vaccinated. 

if NOCs or martyr athletes decline vaccinations, the games will still go ahead, just with a big asterisk a la 1984 so i don't see the point of holding back.

honestly, the world could use the distraction and with 3+ vaccines available i don't really get the drama.

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hey, this may be canada's once in a generation chance to vaccinate its athletes and actually win a summer gold medal or two.

maybe they can give that poor trampoline girl a rest for once. 

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14 hours ago, Ikarus360 said:

As much as I would love to, IOC is just another of the hundreds of puppets of Uncle Winnie the Pooh right now, sadly. The whole Olympic movement is a farce as it laughts at the hundreds of Uyghur girls getting raped.

Cancelling Beijing would require the IOC to put someone else's humans rights issues ahead of their own financial interests.  I think we all know that's not going to happen

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11 hours ago, krow said:

if the IOC is really going to insist on holding the games come hell or high water, as these news stories suggest, then it is the responsibility of NOCs to vaccinate their athletes and send them, given every precaution is taken.

i think spectators are a non-starter -- thank heavens the US isn't hosting. journalists and volunteers should also be vaccinated. 

if NOCs or martyr athletes decline vaccinations, the games will still go ahead, just with a big asterisk a la 1984 so i don't see the point of holding back.

honestly, the world could use the distraction and with 3+ vaccines available i don't really get the drama.

There's a lot of people out there who want a vaccine, so where on the priority list are athletes and journalists and volunteers?  At this point, anyone who doesn't want to get vaccinated is a fool, but that's a discussion for somewhere else.  I trust Japan to have their health and safety regulations in a pretty solid place to allow the event to happen, even though it clearly won't come with the usual pomp and circumstance, which will be a crying shame.  But yes, just for Japan to host the Olympics will be a monumental accomplishment for the world, so here's hoping they find a way to make it happen.

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7 hours ago, Quaker2001 said:

There's a lot of people out there who want a vaccine, so where on the priority list are athletes and journalists and volunteers?  

high up, i should think.

think of it this way: should the games be canceled? probably, yes. will they be? probably not. so with that in mind, the best course of action would be to vaccinate everyone involved.

the worst case scenario is that the games go on as planned but nobody is vaccinated. that could be very bad but is entirely preventable. 

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13 hours ago, krow said:

high up, i should think.

think of it this way: should the games be canceled? probably, yes. will they be? probably not. so with that in mind, the best course of action would be to vaccinate everyone involved.

the worst case scenario is that the games go on as planned but nobody is vaccinated. that could be very bad but is entirely preventable. 

I get what you're saying, but that's asking an irresponsible decision with another irresponsible decision.  It's basically saying that Tokyo shouldn't be having the Olympics, but they are anyway, so let's reward them by throwing a ton of resources in their direction that could go to other people.  And if that worst case scenario were to come to pass where the games happen and there's a lot of COVID spread, the hindsight argument won't be "well, we should have vaccinated all of the athletes"

The "best course of action" as you describe it needs to consider the needs of the entire world, not just those that might be affected by the Olympics.  If that means the Tokyo organizers need stricter protocols and athletes can't randomly hook up in the Olympic village, so be it.

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3 hours ago, Quaker2001 said:

I get what you're saying, but that's asking an irresponsible decision with another irresponsible decision. 

i'm not going to re-litigate this for days but i feel it's answering an irresponsible decision (to host the games at all) with a responsible decision (to vaccinate everyone). 

not sure you can find a more high priority group than these thousands of people who will be gathering together no matter what. sometimes priority decisions must be made not based on the age or health of the person but the best way to reduce community spread. 

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1 hour ago, krow said:

i'm not going to re-litigate this for days but i feel it's answering an irresponsible decision (to host the games at all) with a responsible decision (to vaccinate everyone). 

not sure you can find a more high priority group than these thousands of people who will be gathering together no matter what. sometimes priority decisions must be made not based on the age or health of the person but the best way to reduce community spread. 

I'm very sure we can find several more high priority groups than people who will be going to the Olympics.. teachers, restaurant workers, transportation workers.  Things every country needs right now, not "well, people are going to gather for the Olympics, so let's make sure they're taken care of first."

More importantly though.. we don't know who is going to the Olympics yet.  Should the Croatian basketball team get priority access for vaccines because they *might* qualify for the Olympics?  Not sure how you can create a priority system at this point.  Now if we get to June and vaccines are more readily available, maybe that's a different story.  But I wouldn't count on that happened.  And if there are people and countries whose access to vaccinations is still limited because Japan and the IOC insists that the Games must go on and this is necessary to reduce community spread, that's going to be a really bad look for the IOC.

Again, the spirit of what you're suggesting makes sense, but if you have a situation were demand far out-paces supply, I don't think an organization that already has a pretty bad reputation such as the IOC want to put on an event they're going to promote as the world coming together if that comes at the expense of other people missing out on access to a vaccine.  I love the Olympics as much as anyone, but even I think that's a bad road to travel down.

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"No matter what"...I still don't think it's a done deal the IOC gets it wish and the Olympics will go ahead. Scenes from the Super Bowl last night show again that not even standard hygiene rules are applied when there's emotions during a sports event.

And realistically, to get the vaccine to work properly (no matter if it's a one or two-shot variety), it will take a few weeks after vaccination to create immunity. June may be when the vaccines are more readily available, but that's too late for athletes to get it - they would need it in May. Fat chance that will happen.

It will seriously be the death blow to the Olympics and an absolute disaster for Japan if they decide to go ahead at all cost even without everyone vaccinated but a so-called sophisticated hygiene playbook, and it turns out four weeks after the Olympics that there's a global surge again starting out from the Olympic village and carrying into each and every country around the globe. The IOC would never recover from that, even more so with China as their next trading partner waiting in line.

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The games should be cancelled. The IOC is at serious risk of losing its credibility and the support from the TOP programme, local sponsors and broadcasters. What would happen if there is a games-time outbreak in Japan? What if the games are held safely but a few days after the OG finish, some athletes, officials or journalists test positive and face complications with Covid? (as we all know, if the virus sneaks into the respiratory system, you can consider geniuinely screwed) The biggest scandal associated with the IOC and the OG could be igniting, impacting Beijing 2022, and probably Paris 2024.

We all know it´s all about the cancellation / force majeure clauses within contracts with sponsors and broadcasters. It´s probably the most complicated decision in Sports in decades but the so called "celebration of triumph agains the virus" could turn into a global fifth wave".

Proposal (the obvious one): Paris 2024, LA 2028, Tokyo 2032

Host cities and years cannot be swapped out. Apart from the direct revenues the IOC receives (sustaining NOC), you cannot tell the staff at restaurants, or hotels expecting thousands of visitors in Paris that the games will be postponed to 2032 in order to reschedule Tokyo to 2024.

It would be insane not to award the games in 2032 to Tokyo. In case games are held this Summer, I would also award 2032 games to Tokyo, as in 2021 Tokyo will be hosting an event which goes ahead to secure contracts and longstanding deals.

 

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12 hours ago, olympicgeek said:

The games should be cancelled. The IOC is at serious risk of losing its credibility and the support from the TOP programme, local sponsors and broadcasters. What would happen if there is a games-time outbreak in Japan? What if the games are held safely but a few days after the OG finish, some athletes, officials or journalists test positive and face complications with Covid? (as we all know, if the virus sneaks into the respiratory system, you can consider geniuinely screwed) The biggest scandal associated with the IOC and the OG could be igniting, impacting Beijing 2022, and probably Paris 2024.

We all know it´s all about the cancellation / force majeure clauses within contracts with sponsors and broadcasters. It´s probably the most complicated decision in Sports in decades but the so called "celebration of triumph agains the virus" could turn into a global fifth wave".

Proposal (the obvious one): Paris 2024, LA 2028, Tokyo 2032

Host cities and years cannot be swapped out. Apart from the direct revenues the IOC receives (sustaining NOC), you cannot tell the staff at restaurants, or hotels expecting thousands of visitors in Paris that the games will be postponed to 2032 in order to reschedule Tokyo to 2024.

It would be insane not to award the games in 2032 to Tokyo. In case games are held this Summer, I would also award 2032 games to Tokyo, as in 2021 Tokyo will be hosting an event which goes ahead to secure contracts and longstanding deals.

If the Games can't be held this Summer, then Tokyo needs to be asked if they want 2032.  And that's not a decision they're likely to be able to make right away.  2032 is 11 years off.  They would need to create a new plan since their current plan probably would need some major adjustments, especially with regard to the Olympic village plans.  It would be insane to simply hand 2032 to Tokyo and assume they're good with incurring another 11 years worth of costs on top of the 8 already.

Easy for us to say it's an obvious solution.  Much hard to make that work in practice.  And if you're talking about the IOC losing credibility and support from sponsors.. Tokyo is the least of their concerns.  Because there's a major shitstorm coming as we get closer to Beijing 2022 that's going to make COVID seem.. well, like a mild case of the flu.

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Japanese health officials back use of COVID-19 vaccine as first batch arrives in Tokyo

Credit:  Inside The Games

By Geoff Berkeley

Saturday, 13 February 2021

Japan looks set to use coronavirus vaccines for the first time after a panel of Japanese health officials recommended the use of the Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine.

According to Japanese news agency Kyodo News, Health Minister Norihisa Tamura said the Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine could receive formal approval in Japan as early as tomorrow.

The backing from a Health Ministry panel comes after around 400,000 doses from Brussels in Belgium arrived at Narita International Airport, near Japanese capital Tokyo, yesterday.

Japanese Prime Minister Yoshihide Suga pledged to inoculate citizens "as soon as possible", with 20,000 health workers from across 100 hospitals expected to be vaccinated by the middle of next week.

The rollout of the vaccine will be an important boost for Japan's fight against the virus..

It may also change the attitude of some Japanese residents towards the staging of this year’s Tokyo 2020 Olympic and Paralympic Games, with public support appearing to wane due to the global health crisis.

Yesterday, a group of protesters in Japan held banners calling for the Games to be cancelled.

"We've long known that vaccines would play a large role in fighting the novel coronavirus," said Tamura.

"This approval is very significant for that battle going forward, for safeguarding the health of the people."

Japan has reportedly bought 114 million doses of the Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine and signed deals with AstraZeneca, Modern and Novavax to secure more than enough of their inoculations to vaccinate the population of 126 million.

The doctors and nurses set to receive the first shots next week will be asked to take part in a study aimed a tracking possible side effects of the vaccine, according to Kyodo News.

By the middle of March, around 3.7 million health workers are scheduled to start receiving their first jab, with people aged 65 and older in line to follow in April.

The next two priority groups include people with pre-existing conditions and those working in care homes, before the vaccine is offered to the rest of the population.

The Pfizer-BioNTech vaccine - which needs to be stored at a temperature of about -75 degree Celsius - has been found to be 95 per cent effective against coronavirus.

The Olympics and Paralympics were originally scheduled to be held last year before being postponed to 2021 because of the pandemic, but doubts still linger over the staging of the event later this year.

Earlier this month, the Japanese Government announced it would extend the state of emergency in Tokyo and 10 other prefectures until March 7 due to a high infection rate.

Tokyo reported a further 369 new coronavirus cases over the past 24 hours, making it the 16th straight day the capital has registered fewer than 1,000 infections.

Yesterday, Japan reported 1,300 new cases and 63 deaths.

While the International Olympic Committee (IOC) and Tokyo 2020 have stressed vaccines will not be a "silver bullet" for the Games, their development has nonetheless boosted hopes of competition going ahead.  

The IOC has repeatedly said it will not jump the queue ahead of those who need a vaccination most and has insisted it will not be mandatory for athletes to compete at the Games.

A playbook released by the IOC and the International Paralympic Committee for International Federation and technical officials has reiterated vaccines will not be mandatory for participants to attend Tokyo 2020, with measures such as frequent testing, masks and social distancing set to be in place instead.

National Olympic Committees have been encourage to enquire about having athletes vaccinated, however.

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On 2/12/2021 at 8:36 PM, olympicgeek said:

The games should be cancelled. The IOC is at serious risk of losing its credibility and the support from the TOP programme, local sponsors and broadcasters. What would happen if there is a games-time outbreak in Japan? What if the games are held safely but a few days after the OG finish, some athletes, officials or journalists test positive and face complications with Covid? (as we all know, if the virus sneaks into the respiratory system, you can consider geniuinely screwed) The biggest scandal associated with the IOC and the OG could be igniting, impacting Beijing 2022, and probably Paris 2024.

We all know it´s all about the cancellation / force majeure clauses within contracts with sponsors and broadcasters. It´s probably the most complicated decision in Sports in decades but the so called "celebration of triumph agains the virus" could turn into a global fifth wave".

Proposal (the obvious one): Paris 2024, LA 2028, Tokyo 2032

Host cities and years cannot be swapped out. Apart from the direct revenues the IOC receives (sustaining NOC), you cannot tell the staff at restaurants, or hotels expecting thousands of visitors in Paris that the games will be postponed to 2032 in order to reschedule Tokyo to 2024.

It would be insane not to award the games in 2032 to Tokyo. In case games are held this Summer, I would also award 2032 games to Tokyo, as in 2021 Tokyo will be hosting an event which goes ahead to secure contracts and longstanding deals.

 

You are spot on, although in my opinion the IOC lost it's credibility quite a while ago, support from TOP sponsors and other major stakeholders rests with the popularity of the event itself. The striking thing to me is that the Japanese people are not really down with holding the event this year, and I've seen I think three different reports (possibly from the same poll, I didn't delve too deep) showing that the majority are not supportive of going through with it this year. It has all the makings of a disaster about to unfold simply because of the financial rewards that may flow to certain organizations. Undoubtedly I'll watch though, and I expect a lot of people will, the aftermath is what will be the big story of Tokyo 202(0/1) and if there's any lasting carnage or if they managed to unwisely go forward. 

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On 2/6/2021 at 10:07 PM, krow said:

if the IOC is really going to insist on holding the games come hell or high water, as these news stories suggest, then it is the responsibility of NOCs to vaccinate their athletes and send them, given every precaution is taken.

i think spectators are a non-starter -- thank heavens the US isn't hosting. journalists and volunteers should also be vaccinated. 

if NOCs or martyr athletes decline vaccinations, the games will still go ahead, just with a big asterisk a la 1984 so i don't see the point of holding back.

honestly, the world could use the distraction and with 3+ vaccines available i don't really get the drama.

bingo........its gonna go through, the IOC will pull out the stops for it.  "for the sake of healing of the world"

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On 2/15/2021 at 7:20 PM, GoNutz said:

You are spot on, although in my opinion the IOC lost it's credibility quite a while ago, support from TOP sponsors and other major stakeholders rests with the popularity of the event itself. The striking thing to me is that the Japanese people are not really down with holding the event this year, and I've seen I think three different reports (possibly from the same poll, I didn't delve too deep) showing that the majority are not supportive of going through with it this year. It has all the makings of a disaster about to unfold simply because of the financial rewards that may flow to certain organizations. Undoubtedly I'll watch though, and I expect a lot of people will, the aftermath is what will be the big story of Tokyo 202(0/1) and if there's any lasting carnage or if they managed to unwisely go forward. 

I read similiar aritcle. In Dezember above 50 % of japanese people criticized the goverment for not taking the Covid-19 pandemic serious enough ( NHK World TV). New surveys say, that 80 % Japanese represent the opinion the Oylpic Games should be postponed or cancelled. I think that is a huge majority of the of the japanese society. 

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I think the essential list is a red herring.

There are a lot of people  that don't  want the vaccine.

Shortage of any item is because of high demand verses short supply.  Demand for the groups they are giving it to now, is not as high as they thought it would be.

There is a limit to how many people governments can actually vaccinate in a day. It is not like they are not manufacturing more and there are new vaccines coming on the market . May will be a completely different picture. So will June. 

There will be more than enough vaccine for all by June.

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With Johnson & Johnson's vaccine authorization, things are looking much more optimistic.  It has only a 74 percent reliability rating compared to the pfeiser and moderna 90-92 percenters, so thats the obvious one that should go to the olympians.  Combine that, and the curve in the United States, Canada, and Japan is trending downward at a relieving pace.  I think its starting to look like summer we should be cautiously optimistic that this actually works out.  

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