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ghost1

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It´s not a problem for Salzburg to get into the shortlist. Maybe they will reach the final. But this is nothing. Only the winner takes it all. PC ist working on the bid during years. Have a look at PC´s website and compare the information with Salzburg´s. The videos are very impressing also the information given is ok. What has Salzburg except it´s edelweiss? Maybe we should sniff on the screen?
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Without doubts - Salzburg the most real applicant for games 2014! To Korea will not give! There can not be it! And from the Europe only Sofia and Sochi. Here chances are approximately equal (if to not consider, that Sochi, it nevertheless Russia!!!), but at Austria nevertheless where above... Though also it would be desirable to see games in the homeland, in Sochi. But in 2014 it it is impossible... ((((
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Without doubts - Salzburg the most real applicant for games 2014! To Korea will not give! There can not be it! And from the Europe only Sofia and Sochi. Here chances are approximately equal (if to not consider, that Sochi, it nevertheless Russia!!!), but at Austria nevertheless where above... Though also it would be desirable to see games in the homeland, in Sochi. But in 2014 it it is impossible... ((((

I think that this time Jaca has the same chances as the others strong bids. The project has changed a lot since 2010 with the support of Zaragoza and Huesca and other improvement has been developed. The "black points" in 2010's bid are now the stronger points (lodge, transport, support...)

There aren't hardly negative things about Jaca's bid so I think that Jaca will pass the shortlist.

I also think that people discards Jaca's bid because they think that nothing has changed since 2010, but they are so mistaken....

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It´s not a problem for Salzburg to get into the shortlist. Maybe they will reach the final. But this is nothing. Only the winner takes it all. PC ist working on the bid during years. Have a look at PC´s website and compare the information with Salzburg´s. The videos are very impressing also the information given is ok. What has Salzburg except it´s edelweiss? Maybe we should sniff on the screen?

Let's just wait and see how the mini bidbooks are evaluated. Slick videos and colourful websites don't mean that a bid is better than the others _ and it's certainly not what the IOC will base their decision on. Salzburg has the experience of other past bids to build on, so it knows exactly what the IOC wants and needs for a host.

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Reach the final, zenica? Once Salzburg is officially a candidate city, it is an all-out fight to decision day in 2007 against whichever city that are chosen against it. Of course, PC is almost a guarantee to be one, too. Just hope that little fiasco reported from the other side of Korea didn't distract PC's chances.
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Sure, Salzburg also has it´s chance. But I think the European candidates are bidding for the "wrong" games. After Torino, London another European city get the Games 2014 - I think this won´t be possible. When bidding for 2018, the Europeans will all have a strong bid. But don´t forget that then there are a lot more bidders from Europe (Grenoble, Munich etc)
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The mini-bid book from Salzburg is now available. It is based on Salzburg´s 2010 bid. Several points improved since 2010. It´s a very compact bid (end-to-end in 55 min.), they only have to build 3 new venues. So technical everything is ok. But the other bid cities will also show excellent venues as some of them working since years for the bid. Salzburg only need some odds and ends. But these odds and ends maybe the knack on this bid. If all of the cities are close together this may has an impact on the decision. Salzburg has to differentiate from the other cities to have a chance as I think the other cities are also not bad. I don´t want to critisize to much, but when I fail twice I would argue only with facts and doings, besides the obligatory homework form IOC, which is mandatory for all candidates.
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when looking at Sochi with it´s investments in the whole region this is far over that ehat we expect for Olympic Games. IOC want or better should decrease the costs and should not honour these doings. We have to stay in a normal financial frame. To spend such a lot of money is not in the sense of Olympic movement. Most of the athlets are amateurs, only a few are professionals.
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You only have to look at the bid book to see how much has gone into the Salzburg bid already.

The concept is radically improved, with more easily accessible venues (no skating venues in Rif and Hallein that were 30 minutes from the OV) and new venues to be built with a clear purpose.  Most of the venues are right on the Autobahn.

The focus is more balanced.  Rather than just saying that Salzburg is a musical city, the bid book focuses on Salzburg's international status and Austria's sporting heritage.

All in all, it's looking to be a very solid, secure bid, that could very well be leaps and bounds ahead of the other six.  At least from what I've seen in the mini bid book, Salzburg is taking this bid very seriously.  You tell them to get on the ball and to come out with everything at once....but you'll see that even the Austrians, with their much improved and more seamless bid, will have tricks up their sleeves.

Relax.

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Montreux will be an excellent candidate for 2018. 2022 the Games will possibly go to America. As far as I remember Montreux was a candidate for 2010(?) but decided to stop the bid. Jean Pierre Sepey was chief of the committee with an excellent bid book.

Regarding Salzburg: it´s the third try so everything should be better than in last time. But most of the other candidates also did a good job (PC, Jaca, Sofia). Not to talk about Sochi which want to invest a huge amount. All jobs from IOC has to be done. At the end the decision will be made by nuances, not by the beauty eyes. Others also have a great sport legacy. I can´t see why one candidate should be much better than the others. That´s the moment the real race begins. What makes the difference between the candidate cities?

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Montreux will be an excellent candidate for 2018. 2022 the Games will possibly go to America. As far as I remember Montreux was a candidate for 2010(?) but decided to stop the bid. Jean Pierre Sepey was chief of the committee with an excellent bid book.

Regarding Salzburg: it´s the third try so everything should be better than in last time. But most of the other candidates also did a good job (PC, Jaca, Sofia). Not to talk about Sochi which want to invest a huge amount. All jobs from IOC has to be done. At the end the decision will be made by nuances, not by the beauty eyes. Others also have a great sport legacy. I can´t see why one candidate should be much better than the others. That´s the moment the real race begins. What makes the difference between the candidate cities?

Montreux was my "fantasy" bid for the contest going on in other parts of this forum; I like to keep it around to amuse myself.  As for the 2010 Swiss bid, Montreux was really not included in the Bern concept except as "hey, Montreux is on this really long way from Bern to the mountain venues", but the presence of a Montreux bid for 2010 does explain that same ridiculously spread out concept.  Realistically, I would be surprised to see a bid from SwissOlympic any time soon, but one can dream....

as for now, Salzburg is finally taking shape, and the bid is quite formidable in this stage.

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Should PC get the Games 2014, I´m sure a Swiss city will bid besides Grenoble and Munich. The chance will be excellent. 2022 will go to America, after Vancouver 2010, I´m pretty sure.

Regarding Salzburg: have a look at my comment "Cost explosion". The money Vancouver wants to invest is absolutely impossible for Salzburg. Even Vancouver has big financial problems. I think this will be a problem for Salzburg.

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Should PC get the Games 2014, I´m sure a Swiss city will bid besides Grenoble and Munich. The chance will be excellent. 2022 will go to America, after Vancouver 2010, I´m pretty sure.

Why are you sooo sure that there is a continetal rotation? Ok, maybe, there's such by the summer bids, but for winter - I doubt it. And this is because not every continent has the same geographical conditions to host WOG, so continents with better conditions could host WOG's several times in a row, like EUROPE or AMERICA

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Should PC get the Games 2014, I´m sure a Swiss city will bid besides Grenoble and Munich. The chance will be excellent. 2022 will go to America, after Vancouver 2010, I´m pretty sure.

Why are you sooo sure that there is a continetal rotation? Ok, maybe, there's such by the summer bids, but for winter - I doubt it. And this is because not every continent has the same geographical conditions to host WOG, so continents with better conditions could host WOG's several times in a row, like EUROPE or AMERICA

You're right ghost _ there IS no continental rotation for the WOGs. For exactly the reason you said _ outside of Europe (which has dozens of potential hosts), there are only about five countries that can do it _ USA, Canada, Japan, Sth Korea and maybe China (I won't count the southern hemisphere yet, that is a concept yet to be tested even in a bid and the season difference may be too great an obstacle to surmount). So far, apart from 1998-2002, Europe has had AT LEAST every second WOG. There is no reason to think this will change soon.

Don't worry about zenica _ he actually doesn't really want Salzburg to win _ he wants it to lose so that Munich can bid for 2018.

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When looking at the last distribution og WOG´s there are changes from Lillehammer until Nagano. from Salt Lake City to Torino, from Vancouver until ...

It´s not correct that I don´t want that Salzburg wins. But looking at Salzburg I see that Salzburg´s behaviour is not that of a city that want to win. So I say another European city will win 2018. Does there exist an European city to win 2014, with all the necessary power? That´s a question that has to be answered. For me Salzburg it is not.

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When looking at the last distribution og WOG´s there are changes from Lillehammer until Nagano. from Salt Lake City to Torino, from Vancouver until ...

It´s not correct that I don´t want that Salzburg wins. But looking at Salzburg I see that Salzburg´s behaviour is not that of a city that want to win. So I say another European city will win 2018. Does there exist an European city to win 2014, with all the necessary power? That´s a question that has to be answered. For me Salzburg it is not.

So going for a third attempt at a games with a bid book that is excellent, well planned, well thought out and probably ahead of the rest is a sign they don't want the games? Get real! It's the lead challenger!

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If there would be no "rotation" Europe or North America could have the Games 5 times in a row. What do you think would all the other countries say if Winter Games are a private party. We should keep the general principle of a "rotation", whatever this could mean.
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At the moment nearly all bid cities for 2014 only go into public when there is something official like mini bid book. Can we expect nothing to hear until June 2006 when the shortlist will be presented? How can we find out the difference between the bid cities? Programs are very close together so we need other criterias to decide. Whom to choose for 2014? It´s ok to listen to IOC but sometimes it is better to do more to be prepared for the job. Only to do what IOC expects seems not to be enough. Like in school only the one who knows more than the others will get the best quotation.
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At the moment nearly all bid cities for 2014 only go into public when there is something official like mini bid book. Can we expect nothing to hear until June 2006 when the shortlist will be presented? How can we find out the difference between the bid cities? Programs are very close together so we need other criterias to decide. Whom to choose for 2014? It´s ok to listen to IOC but sometimes it is better to do more to be prepared for the job. Only to do what IOC expects seems not to be enough. Like in school only the one who knows more than the others will get the best quotation.

official statements are no good for us - they are all favourable for the bid, of course. We need articles in newspapers like the one in NY Times (in the overall 2014 discussion), where unbiased and objective info is porvided about the bids. Other sources are the ratings/indexes the best one of which is the BidIndex

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At the moment nearly all bid cities for 2014 only go into public when there is something official like mini bid book. Can we expect nothing to hear until June 2006 when the shortlist will be presented? How can we find out the difference between the bid cities? Programs are very close together so we need other criterias to decide. Whom to choose for 2014? It´s ok to listen to IOC but sometimes it is better to do more to be prepared for the job. Only to do what IOC expects seems not to be enough. Like in school only the one who knows more than the others will get the best quotation.

The bidding cities don't NEED to tell us anything beyond what is needed to lift public support for their respective plans. It is not us who make the decision _ it's the IOC's choice.

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