Those empty seats

[SkiFreak]

We're well into the second week and still a ton of empty seats. I thought they'd fill-up more now, but no. Lots of seats at the Women's Downhill right now. The other day I had CBC's VR app going, and goggles on and was watching the ice dancing competition. I was looking around in the stands, and a lot of empty seats there too. Ouch.

Bring the games back to North America. We'll fill the seats here.

[anthonyliberatori]

27 minutes ago, SkiFreak said:

We're well into the second week and still a ton of empty seats. I thought they'd fill-up more now, but no. Lots of seats at the Women's Downhill right now. The other day I had CBC's VR app going, and goggles on and was watching the ice dancing competition. I was looking around in the stands, and a lot of empty seats there too. Ouch.

Bring the games back to North America. We'll fill the seats here.

You should change the channel to the USA-Czech Republic hockey game. I think I saw more people at a local high school's basketball game this weekend. It's pretty upsetting, especially considering they claim to have over 90% of the tickets sold. 

 

Hopefully China can fill events, at least the stadium events based in Beijing, as they have the population.The alpine ones out in the distance are still up in the air though, we'll see. But you're correct. Calgary 2026 and Salt Lake 2030 are both looking better and better every day.

[BigVic]

Empty seats were also an issue in Sochi four years ago. Watching Vancouver 2010 replays on YouTube and seeing every venue filled to the brink makes me sad watching the last two Winter Olympics. 

 

[intoronto]

Alot of seats are reserved seating which are not being used.

[SkiFreak]

4 hours ago, anthonyliberatori said:

You should change the channel to the USA-Czech Republic hockey game. I think I saw more people at a local high school's basketball game this weekend. It's pretty upsetting, especially considering they claim to have over 90% of the tickets sold. 

 

Hopefully China can fill events, at least the stadium events based in Beijing, as they have the population.The alpine ones out in the distance are still up in the air though, we'll see. But you're correct. Calgary 2026 and Salt Lake 2030 are both looking better and better every day.

Tune into the Norway vs Team Lance Armstrong (OAR) hockey game right now. So many seats its unbelievable. 

[cube]

are you guys really surprised?

 

everyone knew this even before they awarded the Games to PC

look at all the events they hosted ahead of the games

Like the biathlon worlds in 2009 - but yet the International federations and IOC pushed for this games and just get what they asked for.

South Koreans are just into shortTrack, speedskating and figure skating 

 

[AmaniS]

But the question is who has these tickets? If Korean can not sell them, release them to those who can. If Federations are holding on to tickets the same.

Also, they need to bring down the surcharges of tickets bought online.

[Tulsa]

9 hours ago, SkiFreak said:

We're well into the second week and still a ton of empty seats. I thought they'd fill-up more now, but no. Lots of seats at the Women's Downhill right now. The other day I had CBC's VR app going, and goggles on and was watching the ice dancing competition. I was looking around in the stands, and a lot of empty seats there too. Ouch.

Bring the games back to North America. We'll fill the seats here.

Since 2009 i say : Korean don't care about WoG, they don't like Alpine/Freestyle/Nordic ski and the main part of other winter sports. IOC shouldn't have give WoG to Korea, It isn't a place for WoG. It will be the same in China. 

 

Like you say comeback in North America or Europe. 

[SkiFreak]

1 hour ago, AmaniS said:

But the question is who has these tickets?

The dear leader north of the DMZ. 

[Ikarus360]

Not surprising, considering the leadup was filled with lot of bad news regarding the low ticket sale and general interest of the games. When PC was awarded the games in 2011, the situation was very different. Winter sports were kind of popular thanks to popular figures like Kim Yuna and the SK Speedskating team of back then. A lot of things have changed ever since: Many of those original idols have retired so the populace still haven't found someone who can fill these roles as well as they did, since they're also prone to look for charismatic athletes they can root for (Kim Yuna is still adored almost to a godhood/K-Pop status in her country)

I don't think these games were badly organized, but I agree it's better to give the games to Northern Europe and North America. At least people there have a genuine love for winter sports. Even if they manage to fill all the seats in Beijing 2022 (and they will, even if they have to encourage people from day one like they did for 2008) it won't count for me, since I know they will do it more as a matter of national pride than for actual interest for the games. 

So yeah. I really hope Canada gets the games in 2026. Problem is we have to see if Calgary citizens want to go through the plans. 

[nowuniverse]

In this new age, it's very good and necessary to spread the love of sports (especially new kind of sports) to many new regions. Winter sports have been so restrictive in its nature but that doesn't mean people in certain areas shouldn't be hosting or promoting it. It's not going to take just one Olympics event to spark the interest with this kind of sports but it's a very good start to change such culture. I don't like the idea of keeping the games in certain regions all the times because they're more popular there than elsewhere and in the end the rest of the world will continue to perceive Winter Sports as something impossible and distant that only Europeans and North Americans can master. They have been hosting Winter Games there for a long time. It's very rare to have Asian countries to host Winter Olympics and after Beijing 2022 I don't think there will be more anytime soon so it's a good thing to promote this kind of games here in this continent. 

[anthonyliberatori]

9 minutes ago, nowuniverse said:

In this new age, it's very good and necessary to spread the love of sports (especially new kind of sports) to many new regions. Winter sports have been so restrictive in its nature but that doesn't mean people in certain areas shouldn't be hosting or promoting it. It's not going to take just one Olympics event to spark the interest with this kind of sports but it's a very good start to change such culture. I don't like the idea of keeping the games in certain regions all the times because they're more popular there than elsewhere and in the end the rest of the world will continue to perceive Winter Sports as something impossible and distant that only Europeans and North Americans can master. They have been hosting Winter Games there for a long time. It's very rare to have Asian countries to host Winter Olympics and after Beijing 2022 I don't think there will be more anytime soon so it's a good thing to promote this kind of games here in this continent. 

Good points. The IOC had similar ideas when it elected Rio to for the 2016 Olympics, Pyeongchang for the 2018 Olympics, and Beijing for the 2022 Olympics. The goal of all of those Olympics was to spread sport, specifically sports that are not common, to new areas and encourage athleticism globally. It also gave the host country, more so Brazil and South Korea than China, a chance to show the world its culture in its past, current and future state (Beijing recently hosted the Summer Games so that's why I didn't include it). With Russia being a large Winter Sports nation, as well as the city of Sochi having a very smart bid completely based around encouraging tourism to an already-tourist-popular area, it made logical sense to award them the 2014 Olympics. However, the corruption and overspending have now pushed these typical host countries, like Switzerland, Austria, Germany and Norway, who continuously do well in Winter Olympics and would (and have) easily host successful Games, away. So while the few Olympics bouncing around to new locations has been good to help grow different sports in other countries and expose new cultures on the world stage, it is critical for the Olympic movement that 2026 is awarded to a city/country that already has popular winter sports, and can prove to the rest of those veteran countries that hosting the Winter Olympic Games and being successful is not a thing of the past. I am hoping for a Canadian, Swiss or Austrian Olympics in 2026, not because I want an Olympics back in the "veteran countries", but, quite frankly, I just want future Winter Olympics 

[nowuniverse]

Yeah. I'm more into the openness. That's why I see thing a bit differently. Asian countries are not known for good athleticism or proactive lifestyle. Often time, that's really a western thing regardless winter or summer sports. Bringing more sports will promote healthier and more active lifestyle in the region which can help a lot for their people. Therefore, whenever I hear people wishing to keep something exclusively to themselves, it almost sounds like hey only westerners are cool and VIP, so only them should host cool and VIP sports where the rest of the world is not enough so they're not supposed to promote or have access to it. It just sounds somewhat selfish and arrogant IMO. If they want people to have genuine love about something, they should bring and promote those things more in place where they're not dominant not take away a chance for people to experience or be inspired by it. I don't know how many people will actually be inspired by having Winter sports being brought to their area but if they go watch, it shows that sports have touched them somehow or at least they have interest in watching and even if that's not the intention hopefully from that they or their kids will be inspired and do something about it so we're not in any position to be doubtful about the power or bringing the sporting event there even if national pride is what brings them to it in the first place. 

[Tulsa]

11 hours ago, nowuniverse said:

In this new age, it's very good and necessary to spread the love of sports (especially new kind of sports) to many new regions. Winter sports have been so restrictive in its nature but that doesn't mean people in certain areas shouldn't be hosting or promoting it. It's not going to take just one Olympics event to spark the interest with this kind of sports but it's a very good start to change such culture. I don't like the idea of keeping the games in certain regions all the times because they're more popular there than elsewhere and in the end the rest of the world will continue to perceive Winter Sports as something impossible and distant that only Europeans and North Americans can master. They have been hosting Winter Games there for a long time. It's very rare to have Asian countries to host Winter Olympics and after Beijing 2022 I don't think there will be more anytime soon so it's a good thing to promote this kind of games here in this continent. 

It's a good argue but it doesn't work in Korea or China to promote and develop winter sports there. WoG are cultural more than SoG. And it isn't in the Asian culture except Japan to practice or to appreciate Alpin, Nordic etc. sports.  After WoG what's happen in Korea ? Nothing, many venues will become white elephant and they won't develop winter tourism in their country because isn't a good place for. Since the beginning of WoG there are a lot of criticism in newspaper or at the TV about the lack of popular fervor, fake snow. The facts are Korean is a really a bad place to practice the main part of Winter sports because they don't have high quality ski resort or even real mountains like in Europe, Japan or North American. In Asia the place to be it's Japan for this sport, weather and snow condition are better and tourists go there.

Pyeongchang is artificial place for winter tourism, it will remain after WoG. And IOC should stop with this kind of WoG, artificial with public who doesn't care. Stay in Europe or North America, sometimes in Japan, and it's enough. 

WoG should be :

Europe, North America, Europe, North America, Japan, Repeat. Sorry for the other but they don't care, it's the reality about WoG.  

[paul]

.......it doesn't matter if a city is in an inappropriate region, or is underdeveloped for the task, the only thing that is important is if they will pay for everything and keep their citizens hypnotized while they are taxed for the "privileged" to host a party for the corrupt IOC. South Koreans are very ambitious and they live for revenge......so finally winning after 3 tries was the perfect trap for them to go all out to deliver a nice games, and I think they did a great job providing arenas and hills to slide on. So maybe there is nothing above tree-line.....whatever, they were willing to clear the primitive forest for a pretty decent downhill where we got to see Lindsey Vonn poorly represent her country.....the same would have happened in France so it's a wash.

....anyway Soohorang is so cute, nothing else matter!

Edited February 22, 2018 by paul

[nowuniverse]

2 hours ago, Tulsa said:

It's a good argue but it doesn't work in Korea or China to promote and develop winter sports there. WoG are cultural more than SoG. And it isn't in the Asian culture except Japan to practice or to appreciate Alpin, Nordic etc. sports.  After WoG what's happen in Korea ? Nothing, many venues will become white elephant and they won't develop winter tourism in their country because isn't a good place for. Since the beginning of WoG there are a lot of criticism in newspaper or at the TV about the lack of popular fervor, fake snow. The facts are Korean is a really a bad place to practice the main part of Winter sports because they don't have high quality ski resort or even real mountains like in Europe, Japan or North American. In Asia the place to be it's Japan for this sport, weather and snow condition are better and tourists go there.

Pyeongchang is artificial place for winter tourism, it will remain after WoG. And IOC should stop with this kind of WoG, artificial with public who doesn't care. Stay in Europe or North America, sometimes in Japan, and it's enough. 

WoG should be :

Europe, North America, Europe, North America, Japan, Repeat. Sorry for the other but they don't care, it's the reality about WoG.  

Isn't it the reason why those Sports are not popular there in the first place? The weather and the geography don't support it. That's why people don't play or care about it much. The idea here is not to make those countries immediately fall in love with Winter Sports or become Winter Sports powers like NA or Europe. The idea is to spread it to more country where it hasn't been practiced and well known before (regardless the reason) so that people there could be inspired by it especially younger generations so the goal is to introduce the Winter Sports and hopefully spark the interest about those sports there. Legacy of the venues has always been the problem not only with Winter Olympics or South Korea. One can't validate the success of bringing Winter Sports there by simply looking at the seats. The seats only indicate the people who are already interested in it. Inspiring a generation will take longer than just an Olympics to see its effect. That's why they bring it there now so from that point onward more people would know and be inspired about it. It's there for a more philosophical reason than a practical reason. And even so, I don't think it's a big problem because only a few north Asian countries can host it and after Beijing, it would probably go back to NA or Europe.... We probably won't see it being host in a country like Singapore, Thailand, because it's obviously not possible there. In the end, I'm more about well if they want to bring Winter Sports there for a few occasions, cool, let them do it and support them fully and see how it goes rather than why bringing it there or it's not supposed to be there... It may not be a perfect place for Winter Olympics, but still possible and it's good to try something new sometimes. I mean they're rich, they can host it well, they want to bring it there for the first time so let them... They're not going to host it forever but some people start to have problem with it like life and death issue. 

[anthonyliberatori]

11 hours ago, nowuniverse said:

Yeah. I'm more into the openness. That's why I see thing a bit differently. Asian countries are not known for good athleticism or proactive lifestyle. Often time, that's really a western thing regardless winter or summer sports. Bringing more sports will promote healthier and more active lifestyle in the region which can help a lot for their people. Therefore, whenever I hear people wishing to keep something exclusively to themselves, it almost sounds like hey only westerners are cool and VIP, so only them should host cool and VIP sports where the rest of the world is not enough so they're not supposed to promote or have access to it. It just sounds somewhat selfish and arrogant IMO. If they want people to have genuine love about something, they should bring and promote those things more in place where they're not dominant not take away a chance for people to experience or be inspired by it. I don't know how many people will actually be inspired by having Winter sports being brought to their area but if they go watch, it shows that sports have touched them somehow or at least they have interest in watching and even if that's not the intention hopefully from that they or their kids will be inspired and do something about it so we're not in any position to be doubtful about the power or bringing the sporting event there even if national pride is what brings them to it in the first place. 

I hope you didn't take me to be a supporter of exclusively North American/European bids, as that is not the case whatsoever. I fully supported Pyeongchang on its road to the Games, and I'm very excited for Beijing's 2022 Games as well. I think many of us, though, who enjoy the long lasting legacy of the movement, are leaning more towards a North American or European bid. It's justified because 2026 will mark the end of either a 16 year break from the Rockies or a 20 year break from the Alps, so it's understandable why people are more supportive of Calgary and Sion than they are of Sapporo. However, after many Olympics in repeat areas, the mood of the IOC and on this website will shift to bringing to Games to new areas. After the US and Australia, the Games were brought to Greece and China. After England, the Games were brought to Brazil.

 

However since the turn of the century, It has actually been a balance of typical hosting areas vs new hosting areas for the Winter Games. 2002, 2006 and 2010 were all in the Rockies/Alps, but 2014, 2018, and 2022 were all given to new hosting area. That is solely based on a mathematical approach, we haven't even factored in personal reasoning, the country's existing presence of Winter Sports, or the bid's longevity plan. I do agree that the Olympics need to see new places and new horizons, but for 2026, I would be almost contradicting myself as a supporter of the movement to not get behind a North American or Alps bid, it is just too risky at this point in time. Luckily, every area that is bidding has hosted as some point in time, with the only real bad choice being Stockholm. 2026 is looking optimistic. Hopefully, a successful 2026 and 2030 in the traditional areas can bring back another winter olympics to Japan in 2034.

[nowuniverse]

4 minutes ago, anthonyliberatori said:

I hope you didn't take me to be a supporter of exclusively North American/European bids, as that is not the case whatsoever. I fully supported Pyeongchang on its road to the Games, and I'm very excited for Beijing's 2022 Games as well. I think many of us, though, who enjoy the long lasting legacy of the movement, are leaning more towards a North American or European bid. It's justified because 2026 will mark the end of either a 16 year break from the Rockies or a 20 year break from the Alps, so it's understandable why people are more supportive of Calgary and Sion than they are of Sapporo. However, after many Olympics in repeat areas, the mood of the IOC and on this website will shift to bringing to Games to new areas. After the US and Australia, the Games were brought to Greece and China. After England, the Games were brought to Brazil.

 

However since the turn of the century, It has actually been a balance of typical hosting areas vs new hosting areas for the Winter Games. 2002, 2006 and 2010 were all in the Rockies/Alps, but 2014, 2018, and 2022 were all given to new hosting area. That is solely based on a mathematical approach, we haven't even factored in personal reasoning, the country's existing presence of Winter Sports, or the bid's longevity plan. I do agree that the Olympics need to see new places and new horizons, but for 2026, I would be almost contradicting myself as a supporter of the movement to not get behind a North American or Alps bid, it is just too risky at this point in time. Luckily, every area that is bidding has hosted as some point in time, with the only real bad choice being Stockholm. 2026 is looking optimistic. Hopefully, a successful 2026 and 2030 in the traditional areas can bring back another winter olympics to Japan in 2034.

None of my words go against you. I understand your reasoning. I just want to elaborate a bit more about it. I'm not talking anything about 2026 onward. I just explained the purpose and the reason of bringing it to PC and Bejiing. So I only discussed about 2018 and 2022 games. It has nothing to do with 2026 or future games to be honest.

[Tulsa]

1 hour ago, nowuniverse said:

Isn't it the reason why those Sports are not popular there in the first place? The weather and the geography don't support it. That's why people don't play or care about it much. The idea here is not to make those countries immediately fall in love with Winter Sports or become Winter Sports powers like NA or Europe. The idea is to spread it to more country where it hasn't been practiced and well known before (regardless the reason) so that people there could be inspired by it especially younger generations so the goal is to introduce the Winter Sports and hopefully spark the interest about those sports there. Legacy of the venues has always been the problem not only with Winter Olympics or South Korea. One can't validate the success of bringing Winter Sports there by simply looking at the seats. The seats only indicate the people who are already interested in it. Inspiring a generation will take longer than just an Olympics to see its effect. That's why they bring it there now so from that point onward more people would know and be inspired about it. It's there for a more philosophical reason than a practical reason. And even so, I don't think it's a big problem because only a few north Asian countries can host it and after Beijing, it would probably go back to NA or Europe.... We probably won't see it being host in a country like Singapore, Thailand, because it's obviously not possible there. In the end, I'm more about well if they want to bring Winter Sports there for a few occasions, cool, let them do it and support them fully and see how it goes rather than why bringing it there or it's not supposed to be there... It may not be a perfect place for Winter Olympics, but still possible and it's good to try something new sometimes. I mean they're rich, they can host it well, they want to bring it there for the first time so let them... They're not going to host it forever but some people start to have problem with it like life and death issue. 

I have some doubts about your word "inspiring". Korean destroyed a millennial forest to build a track that will only be used once... Where is the inspiration ? 

Even some young generation are inspired the problem is also geographical, the places where you can practice winter sports in Korea are very limited and they have a dry weather in winter it's the reason why they used only fake snow, it's a problem, in fact they don't have the potentiel to develop these sports there... And you can't inspire European or North america winter sport culture with 15 days of winter sports events... Moreover how would like inspire something if public don't care, it's a no-sense.

It will be quite similar in China, they have dry weather in winter around Bijing, it's a desert area without natural snow or water. 

I think some asian countries need to show they can do like occidental countries they want to have the same kind of leisure to say : "We are like you, we can do the same" it's like an inferiority complexe. Even you spend billions you can't buy culture or tradition and WoG can't spread this. You will never have winter sports culture in Korea or China even in 50 years or 100 years. 

 

[baron-pierreIV]

On 2/21/2018 at 3:01 AM, cube said:

are you guys really surprised?

 

everyone knew this even before they awarded the Games to PC

look at all the events they hosted ahead of the games

Like the biathlon worlds in 2009 - but yet the International federations and IOC pushed for this games and just get what they asked for.

South Koreans are just into shortTrack, speedskating and figure skating 

 

The populations of Gangneung & PC just might not be enough to come and fill the empty seats.  Include local peoples who are also working the Games, security, the hotels, the restaurants, etc.  Obviously several thousand of those cannot justsdrop their duties to fill in seats simply for cosmetic appearances.  

[Tulsa]

27 minutes ago, baron-pierreIV said:

The populations of Gangneung & PC just might not be enough to come and fill the empty seats.  Include local peoples who are also working the Games, security, the hotels, the restaurants, etc.  Obviously several thousand of those cannot justsdrop their duties to fill in seats simply for cosmetic appearances.  

Why in Europe when you have this kind of events is it full of public and supporters ? It's not an excuse, it's just Korean don't have fervor for winter sports. 

[nowuniverse]

48 minutes ago, Tulsa said:

I have some doubts about your word "inspiring". Korean destroyed a millennial forest to build a track that will only be used once... Where is the inspiration ? 

Even some young generation are inspired the problem is also geographical, the places where you can practice winter sports in Korea are very limited and they have a dry weather in winter it's the reason why they used only fake snow, it's a problem, in fact they don't have the potentiel to develop these sports there... And you can't inspire European or North america winter sport culture with 15 days of winter sports events... Moreover how would like inspire something if public don't care, it's a no-sense.

It will be quite similar in China, they have dry weather in winter around Bijing, it's a desert area without natural snow or water. 

I think some asian countries need to show they can do like occidental countries they want to have the same kind of leisure to say : "We are like you, we can do the same" it's like an inferiority complexe. Even you spend billions you can't buy culture or tradition and WoG can't spread this. You will never have winter sports culture in Korea or China even in 50 years or 100 years. 

 

I don't really know if you can read the words correctly but when did I tell you that the whole population of these Asian countries would definitely go for Winter Sports just because of one event itself? I said "hopefully". I just explained that it was the intention of IOC to bring more different kinds of sports to new regions whenever possible. Inspiration comes from the action of bringing sports to the region but if you're cherry picking about pointing all the negative aspects of the game then feel free to do it. You don't inspire sports in the place where it's already popular but a place where it seems like something new and distant. We're not here to discuss about should they host it now because the decision is already made in stone but to see why thing happens that way. I never said Asian countries need to be as good in term of Winter Sports and they probably won't be due to different locations. It wasn't their intention to achieve that though. Hosting a game is not only to promote sports but also many other aspects of their country. Hosting winter games there for a few occasions doesn't kill anyone or destroy anything. It doesn't ruin the spirit and the love for winter sports in NA or Europe. The only thing it does is to give different region a chance to get exposed to new things. This is where a lot of close-mined people have problem. To keep something exclusively to certain regions instead of allowing it to spread more to the world sounds too much like an arrogant and selfish point of view. I never said that they should host more Winter Olympics in Asia. I just said it's okay for only a few occasions so people there can know more or associate those sports with themselves more. The spirit of sports and IOC is not to keep sports exclusively in certain places but bringing it to more places whenever possible and as I said above it's more of a philosophical than practical aspect. BTW, I didn't say Asian countries are throwing out the money to buy sports culture here or to be the same with anyone else.  You're the one who think that way. I just said they have good money to host a game well. I never said they throw money out to be great in Winter Sports. In the end, you have your point. IOC has their point and I'm with them. 

[SkiFreak]

Lots of empty seats at the women's gold hockey game last night. Couldn't believe it. Thought it would be more full than that. There's even a hashtag #EmptySeats going on Twitter.

Back in Vancouver, VANOC was giving out free tickets for preliminaries to fill the stands at the beginning of the first week. In the second week when I went down for 4 days, my dad and I scored free tickets from a blue coat volunteer for a medal ceremony at BC Place. As a bonus, we ran into Jaromir Jagr outside of the Saskatchewan pavilion after the ceremony. How come the PyeongChang organizing committee didn't at least give out some tickets like VANOC did?

[nowuniverse]

7 minutes ago, SkiFreak said:

Lots of empty seats at the women's gold hockey game last night. Couldn't believe it. Thought it would be more full than that. There's even a hashtag #EmptySeats going on Twitter.

Back in Vancouver, VANOC was giving out free tickets for preliminaries to fill the stands at the beginning of the first week. In the second week when I went down for 4 days, my dad and I scored free tickets from a blue coat volunteer for a medal ceremony at BC Place. As a bonus, we ran into Jaromir Jagr outside of the Saskatchewan pavilion after the ceremony. How come the PyeongChang organizing committee didn't at least give out some tickets like VANOC did?

Those sports are not popular there which is why we don't see much enthusiasm regardless free tickets or not. But I don't think we have the same problem with Beijing 2022 because people would attend at any costs lol

[baron-pierreIV]

1 hour ago, Tulsa said:

Why in Europe when you have this kind of events is it full of public and supporters ? It's not an excuse, it's just Korean don't have fervor for winter sports. 

Don't even talk Europe.  NO European city wants to host the WOGs, so your arguments are really quite empty and moot.