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Nice find! This should put any reasonable suspicion of foul play to rest.

Not if his office already confessed to earlier instances of "plagiarism" in the Suntory project. The courts may NOT buy TOCOG's story. That doesn't make Debi'e suit go away. His and TdL's logo was out there first.

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https://tokyo2020.jp/en/emblem/

I like it. Being a regular visitor to Tokyo and knowing it's skyline and the colours of the cityscape it just works. It is industrial, perhaps even with a touch of steampunk. I think as westerners

You guys better quit this crap now before me or one of the other mods puts an end to this.

Not if his office already confessed to earlier instances of "plagiarism" in the Suntory project. The courts may NOT buy TOCOG's story. That doesn't make Debi'e suit go away. His and TdL's logo was out there first.

Did you not read the story? They passed their logos through trademark checker, kept having to modify the design until nothing looked similar enough. And I'm pretty sure the process can be reproduced. Conspiracy types will never be satisfied, of course.

And they may even end up settling with Debie, but they have cleared their name in my book. I'm sure they're not having trouble getting a good night's sleep.

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Did you not read the story? They passed their logos through trademark checker, kept having to modify the design until nothing looked similar enough. And I'm pretty sure the process can be reproduced. Conspiracy types will never be satisfied, of course.

And they may even end up settling with Debie, but they have cleared their name in my book. I'm sure they're not having trouble getting a good night's sleep.

Of course, I read the story. Have you worked in legal settings or taken legal classes? So you have cleared them in your book, but are you the court the suit was filed with? Does your "solution" clear the case?? :blink::rolleyes:

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Of course, I read the story. Have you worked in legal settings or taken legal classes? So you have cleared them in your book, but are you the court the suit was filed with? Does your "solution" clear the case?? :blink::rolleyes:

I know this much: everything is open to interpretation. However, any sensible interpretation of trademark law should not be so unreasonably inflexible that it won't account for similarities perceived as unintentional to a reasonable degree. Even more so in a case like this, where it is not the case that the logos may be mistaken for each other by the general public. If you know anything about trademark infringement, you know that the chance of confusion is the number one issue.

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I know this much: everything is open to interpretation. However, any sensible interpretation of trademark law should not be so unreasonably inflexible that it won't account for similarities perceived as unintentional to a reasonable degree. Even more so in a case like this, where it is not the case that the logos may be mistaken for each other by the general public. If you know anything about trademark infringement, you know that the chance of confusion is the number one issue.

I understand the concept of 'creative synchronicity' of which this clearly is a case. However, I do not know what rules the court in Belgium will go by for as JMark has said, per the European concept of trademark law, the first one out there (regardless of the technicalities of whether it was registered or not) has the 'moral right.' (And I guess, Japan, Belgium and Switzerland are all signatories to the most current Copyright Conventions.) So we shall see how this is adjudicated.

My guess is that the IOC, TOCOG and Sano just settle, pay Debie & the TdL a satisfactory amount of money, without admission of guilt and at the same time getting Debie/TdL to retract their demand that TOCOG change the logo. (Or maybe even give Debie a special accommodation to have his designs for the pictograms be given special consideration by TOCOG.) It may come to that sort of accommodation or compromise.

Edited by baron-pierreIV
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Here's a couple of things I've found searching online. The quality of some of the photos are bad, so I apologize in advance.

As we've read, the "first stage" of Sano's design wasn't used because it looked too similar to an already trademarked logo. It appears that Time Force Watches may have been the company with an emblem similar, as shown below.

uUesGV8.jpg

However, others have pointed out that a set of posters for what seems to be a musical event hold a similar design as well.

DPj2g9E.jpg3aBIkng.jpg

(This is just something I saw. The "g"s are similar to something Debie designed which I remembered from his sight. Just an observation. ;) )

1Z2HMJy.jpg

Finally, if you remember TOCOG asked for emblem designers to show how the emblem would be used in a "look-of-the-games" way. This is what Sano submitted.

jYUQTHj.jpg

Yhb7oxD.jpg

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Yeah, the logo looks hideous in the look of the games renderings.

Cuz it's mainly a black slab. What does that say about what should be a joyous sports event? Death...that's what is says.

I mean (and I hope) when Africa gets around to hosting -- they won't make "black" the predominant color of their Games. They would probably highlight the varied colors of the continent (as they did with World Cup 2010) -- NOT black!!

Edited by baron-pierreIV
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Hopefully the actual look of the games is more colorful. Maybe they'll approach it like Rio by using different parts of a single piece of artwork, or like London by using basically the same general design but a bunch of different colors. Either way this will be the focal point in most venues.

VqGOkeZ.png

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For what i'm reading, right now many japanese people seem to be displeased with the Tokyo 2020 logo to the point they're doing their own proposals and are actually hoping the belgians win the case. (also I even saw some acussing Sano of being half-korean to explain all of this. No really :lol: )

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I don't know how London's was received, but it seemed that a lot of people hated it but it just stuck around and that was that. If that's the case, that's probably what will happen with Tokyo.

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However, others have pointed out that a set of posters for what seems to be a musical event hold a similar design as well.

DPj2g9E.jpg3aBIkng.jpg

(This is just something I saw. The "g"s are similar to something Debie designed which I remembered from his sight. Just an observation. ;) )

1Z2HMJy.jpg

Not a musical event. That was an exhibition at the Ginza Graphic Gallery, in Tokyo, of the work of Jan Tschichold, the guy who designed the "look" for classic Penguin Books, and literally wrote the book on 20th century typography (Die Neue Typographie, 1928).

I don't know how London's was received, but it seemed that a lot of people hated it but it just stuck around and that was that. If that's the case, that's probably what will happen with Tokyo.

The more I see of "The Great British Bake Off" the more I'm convinced that the pornographic double-meaning of the London logo was a deliberate joke rather than an accident which nobody in LOCOG spotted.

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While i'm glad they got rid of this logo, it's amazing how 2020 is not even here and the organizing comittee of this games is already shaping up to be one of the worst and most clueless in olympic history. What a disaster.

I expected much more of Japan, tbh.

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This is a crazy epic move.

While I don't dislike the current logo, I really do hope they completely part ways now as opposed to temporarily suspending its use until this can all be sorted. We are still 5 years out and can certainly put together a good Games mark for 2020 (Sydney hadn't even revealed their logo at Atlanta's closing).

While I know there is a lot more to organising a Games than a logo and main stadium (and it would appear everything else is moving along nicely), they are too biggies. It's hard to believe NAOC were given the kudos of producing the best organisation in the history of the winter games with Nagano.

I still have huge faith that the Japanese will pull it off, more bad PR than anything at this point.

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I think I didn't really hate the logo mainly because it was so safe. If you were someone who really only watched the big events, and you only saw the logo a few times, you wouldn't really notice it and think of what a bad logo that is, like London's. But for an Olympic Games, it was to meh to like. I think to make a logo great you have to make it your own, personalise it so that everybody knows where you are. Look at Beijing, Rio, Athens and Sydney's logos. You can look at them and say "that's Brazil/China/Australia/Greece". And the only logo in recent history that hasn't done that is London's the most hated logo in Olympic and Paralympic History.

Where can I look at Tokyo's and say "that's Japan"? Maybe they wanted to show a new Japan, but they probably should not use a logo that's like and similar to ones in Europe, Asia and Australia.

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This was probably the best idea to save face at this point. Even though the logo could have worked, the public was definitely not behind it. I feel like, with the stadium, this is an example of a small board selecting something that will represent the entire nation worldwide that the people should have honestly been involved with.

I don't even know what they'll do now. They could release a poll with the original submitted designs, or possibly do something similar to the bid logo, where they went to the public and refined a design created not specifically by an award winning designer.

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