breathesgelatin Posted January 24, 2014 Report Share Posted January 24, 2014 Heiberg is marketing director for the IOC. Sounds like he is getting the message that Sochi is "too much." http://www.themalaymailonline.com/sports/article/winter-olympics-must-reduce-cost-says-ioc-marketing-chief Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olympikfan Posted January 24, 2014 Report Share Posted January 24, 2014 The cost is the cancer of the games. I have been saying this all along and have taken heat for this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Rols Posted January 24, 2014 Report Share Posted January 24, 2014 I'm quite sure the IOC executive committee is quite aware and sensitive to the message of Sochi. Bach's said as much, if not so pointedly, himself. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olympikfan Posted January 24, 2014 Report Share Posted January 24, 2014 Talk is cheap. Lets see if the IOC will do something. (I doubt it) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Rols Posted January 24, 2014 Report Share Posted January 24, 2014 The IOC aren't stupid. They know they have to do to protect the future of their major asset. It's pretty clear from many members' statements they know what sort of criticisms they're attracting. What they learn from Sochi will be factored into what the Executive Committee will encourage and accept and how they make their future host choices. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FYI Posted January 24, 2014 Report Share Posted January 24, 2014 Talk is cheap. Lets see if the IOC will do something. (I doubt it) They can. And they can start by selecting the most practical of the 2022 bidders, which in this case would be Oslo (if the Norwegians still stay in the Game, that is). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gangwon Posted January 24, 2014 Report Share Posted January 24, 2014 I read earlier today the Korean government and POCOG is still looking to keep costs under $10 billion for 2018. I would be ecstatic if they could do that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanMUC Posted January 24, 2014 Report Share Posted January 24, 2014 They can. And they can start by selecting the most practical of the 2022 bidders, which in this case would be Oslo (if the Norwegians still stay in the Game, that is). Maybe Heiberg was also aiming at his compatriots to actually stay in, he might be worried of an Oslo pull out too in face of the megalomania discussions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mr.bernham Posted January 24, 2014 Report Share Posted January 24, 2014 I read earlier today the Korean government and POCOG is still looking to keep costs under $10 billion for 2018. I would be ecstatic if they could do that. I can see that...during last years meeting in Buenos Aries didn't POCOG say that 50%-60% of their venues were already ready and that the rest would be complete in 2016-mid 2017? I see Pyeongchang as the LA'84 of the Winter Olympics and possibly even the Summer Games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4gamesandcounting Posted January 24, 2014 Report Share Posted January 24, 2014 Maybe Heiberg was also aiming at his compatriots to actually stay in, he might be worried of an Oslo pull out too in face of the megalomania discussions. I expect you are right and he is sending a message home as much as to the world at large. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gold Coast Lions Posted January 24, 2014 Report Share Posted January 24, 2014 But they can't really bring back the Winter Games back to how it was in 1994 with PyeongChang South Korea 2018 they are hosting it in a small resort but hosting the ice events nearby in a city of 250,000 people and Seoul has 24 million people just 80 mins away 90 countries and 3000 athletes are now apart of the winter games, The Winter games will grow even more and the times of the small villages hosting the main Winter Olympics are over that's why we have now the Youth Games as the places that is not bigger enough to host the main event get's the Youth Games. The Innsbruck Austria 2012 Youth Games was the size of the Lake Placid 1980 games the winter games reaching popularity from non winter countries now and they will grow there winter sporting programs like Jamaica, Ghana, Thailand, The Philippines, Brazil also the growth of winter sports in central Asia the winter games can't just contract now theses days it's the truth and will be sad for people with the out mindset for the winter games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athensfan Posted January 24, 2014 Report Share Posted January 24, 2014 But they can't really bring back the Winter Games back to how it was in 1994 with PyeongChang South Korea 2018 they are hosting it in a small resort but hosting the ice events nearby in a city of 250,000 people and Seoul has 24 million people just 80 mins away 90 countries and 3000 athletes are now apart of the winter games, The Winter games will grow even more and the times of the small villages hosting the main Winter Olympics are over that's why we have now the Youth Games as the places that is not bigger enough to host the main event get's the Youth Games. The Innsbruck Austria 2012 Youth Games was the size of the Lake Placid 1980 games the winter games reaching popularity from non winter countries now and they will grow there winter sporting programs like Jamaica, Ghana, Thailand, The Philippines, Brazil also the growth of winter sports in central Asia the winter games can't just contract now theses days it's the truth and will be sad for people with the out mindset for the winter games. Well, it's very nice that there are lots of options for the Youth Games, but who will host the adult version? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanMUC Posted January 24, 2014 Report Share Posted January 24, 2014 But they can't really bring back the Winter Games back to how it was in 1994 with PyeongChang South Korea 2018 they are hosting it in a small resort but hosting the ice events nearby in a city of 250,000 people and Seoul has 24 million people just 80 mins away 90 countries and 3000 athletes are now apart of the winter games, The Winter games will grow even more and the times of the small villages hosting the main Winter Olympics are over that's why we have now the Youth Games as the places that is not bigger enough to host the main event get's the Youth Games. The Innsbruck Austria 2012 Youth Games was the size of the Lake Placid 1980 games the winter games reaching popularity from non winter countries now and they will grow there winter sporting programs like Jamaica, Ghana, Thailand, The Philippines, Brazil also the growth of winter sports in central Asia the winter games can't just contract now theses days it's the truth and will be sad for people with the out mindset for the winter games. I'm already seeing the Ghana luge team taking the gold in Almaty 2022, followed by Jamaica's ski jumping gold in Beijing 2026 and the Thai curling triumph in Pyongyang/Masik 2030. Old Europe is dead, Asia is the future. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanMUC Posted January 24, 2014 Report Share Posted January 24, 2014 Well, it's very nice that there are lots of options for the Youth Games, but who will host the adult version? Actually, also, if there are alledgedly so many more options for YOG than for the real deal, I wonder why there's even less bidders for them, both in Summer and Winter? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
yoshi Posted January 24, 2014 Report Share Posted January 24, 2014 I think Ostersund might be what the IOC needs. A Lillehammer sized games in a winter sports crazy country that's never hosted before. They could push the reset button. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FYI Posted January 24, 2014 Report Share Posted January 24, 2014 It's too late to push the "reset button". The Winter Games have ground almost twice as much since '94. And even then, Lillehammer still had to build almost everything, much like Sochi in a way. So an Ostersund Winter Games is certainly way outta bounds now. What is a sparsely & vast populated area like that going to do with so many added venues. There's already talk how many white elephants are gonna be left post-Sochi 2014. That's why Stockholm made the most sense for Sweden, even with the Are distance issue. And them pulling out now, in a race where they coulda had a very decent shot at it, I can't see them coming back 'til a very long time from now, if ever again. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gangwon Posted January 24, 2014 Report Share Posted January 24, 2014 Sadly, I agree with FYI. I was always holding out hope for an Ostersund bid, but I've come to realize their time really has passed. The Games are just too big now. Ostersund would've been perfect in the 1980's. I'm not sure what the magic number is, but I'd say you'd need at least 100,000 people to build these venues without turning it into a waste after the Games. Only in the Alps can I see a smaller town hosting the Games without a bigger centre. Makes you wonder. At a time when the number of possible summer hosts keeps growing, we are left with lesser and lesser numbers of possible winter hosts. Because of size. Because of warming weather. And some capable countries holding out for a summer games. We might see some imaginative hosts one day. If Stockholm can work with Are (distance), and if Krakow can work with Jasna (cross border) then might we see a Helsinki-Lillehammer host one day (distance AND cross border). Then, might we see a Munich-Amsterdam bid, having speed skating in the Netherlands. You can host the Winter Olympics anywhere in the world if you put all the indoor ice events there. You could have a Denver-Mexico bid. The above would be ways to either reward traditional strong nations (Finland, Netherlands) or bring the Winter Games to the tropical countries. Seems silly now, but all you'd have to do is open one door at a time. Not saying I'd like it, but could become reality. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul Posted January 24, 2014 Report Share Posted January 24, 2014 ∆ denver/mexico Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gangwon Posted January 24, 2014 Report Share Posted January 24, 2014 The reasoning behind that is with a Stockholm-Are Games, very few people will even visit both sites anyway. They're essentially two separate games. So what difference does it make if the two clusters are 600km apart or 1200km apart. And we've already established that it would be ok to use two countries. It would open the door to the whole world, using truly hot climate places. LA already has a hockey team and hosts figure skating world championships. If LA can host winter sports, anywhere in the world could potentially do it. Denver-Acapulco 2080! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FYI Posted January 24, 2014 Report Share Posted January 24, 2014 That's getting to a point of absurdity, though. And totally then dilutes of what makes the Olynpic Games so special in the first place, having as much as possible conentrated to the full Olympic experience. There's a huge difference of making an " "exception" for a compelling bid having two-clusters 330 miles apart in the SAME country, versus one being 1,800 miles apart in DIFFERENT countries (& where there's no compelling argument in the first place for such an idea) where the two-clusters aren't even "nearby". Totally unfeasible & might as well just kiss the Olympic Games goodbye then. *concentrated for the full.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athensfan Posted January 24, 2014 Report Share Posted January 24, 2014 Actually, also, if there are alledgedly so many more options for YOG than for the real deal, I wonder why there's even less bidders for them, both in Summer and Winter? Just because there are more possible hosts doesn't mean they all want to bid. They know that the YOGs are the red-headed stepchild. The Winter Games used to be most enjoyable for their intimacy. It was as if the whole world gathered around a fireplace. You can't have that any more. The likes of Sochi and PC certainly aren't "fireplaces." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gangwon Posted January 24, 2014 Report Share Posted January 24, 2014 That's getting to a point of absurdity, though. And totally then dilutes of what makes the Olynpic Games so special in the first place, having as much as possible conentrated to the full Olympic experience. There's a huge difference of making an " "exception" for a compelling bid having two-clusters 330 miles apart in the SAME country, versus one being 1,800 miles apart in DIFFERENT countries (& where there's no compelling argument in the first place for such an idea) where the two-clusters aren't even "nearby". Totally unfeasible & might as well just kiss the Olympic Games goodbye then. *concentrated for the full.. I was being somewhat facetious but the logic is there. You just have to follow the logic rather than simply dismiss it by going straight from A to D without considering points B and C. Sweden might be compelling today, but on another day Finland, Netherlands, or a tropical country might be compelling. Just because there are more possible hosts doesn't mean they all want to bid. They know that the YOGs are the red-headed stepchild. The Winter Games used to be most enjoyable for their intimacy. It was as if the whole world gathered around a fireplace. You can't have that any more. The likes of Sochi and PC certainly aren't "fireplaces." I think Pyeongchang will be that fireplace. Certainly about as close as you can get to being a fireplace nowadays. The Games are significantly focused on the smaller Alpensia cluster rather than the larger Gangneung cluster, and in any event are only 20 minutes away. You'd have to go back to Lillehammer to find another small town so central to the Winter Games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FYI Posted January 24, 2014 Report Share Posted January 24, 2014 But there's no "logic" in what you're proposing. It's illogical, as far as the Olympics are concerned. And even with "exceptions" (& there's a reason why they're called exceptions in the first place), you have to draw the line somewhere. While Sweden's case could've been an exception, in Finland's case for example, it's not. Even though Finland is also a winter sports power, they have many more obstacles to overcome then the Swedes do. More than twice the distance & also crossing borders. And next month we're gonna have our first sub-tropical Winter Olympics. So that's been checked off already. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
olympikfan Posted January 24, 2014 Report Share Posted January 24, 2014 The IOC aren't stupid. No they are just full of ( )fill in the blank. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Gangwon Posted January 24, 2014 Report Share Posted January 24, 2014 Then where you draw the line is up for debate. What makes Sweden so special that we make an exception for them any more than we do for Finland? Sweden's 600 km distance is more than twice the difference of any previous host or any of the current bidders. For some, 600 km is a deal breaker, yet you're ready to make an exception for them. What's so logical about having two clusters 600 km apart? Nothing. We're just making an exception. Problem with making an exception is one exception leads to another. While you have no problem drawing the line after Sweden's 600km, others have already drawn the line at 200km, give or take. The distance of an easy day trip. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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