Tony E Loves Architecture Posted January 12, 2014 Report Share Posted January 12, 2014 So they won't have the same issue 8 years later? I think that even if Krakow didn't do multi-country, then Stockholm or Oslo would still win. I can kind of see now that I might of been a bit over the top with the multi-bid saga. But even if the IOC has no problem with multi-country, Stockholm or Oslo (Still think Stockholm) will win. That just restates the question without an answer. WHY won't the IOC support a bid with a discipline in another country. The thing is, is that excluding the Melbourne 1956 Co-Hosting with Stockholm because of circumstances, the Olympics has never been Multi-Country. But with Fifa, The World Cup in 2002 was co-hosted by Japan and South Korea. UEFA has co-hosted Euro's 3 times, Holland and Belgium 2000, Austria and Switzerland 2008 and Poland and Ukraine 2012, which shows they would accept a joint bid again in the future, where the IOC hasn't in the past before. But I suppose, I might of been over the top with the multi-country bid saga with Krakow. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quaker2001 Posted January 12, 2014 Report Share Posted January 12, 2014 The thing is, is that excluding the Melbourne 1956 Co-Hosting with Stockholm because of circumstances, the Olympics has never been Multi-Country. But with Fifa, The World Cup in 2002 was co-hosted by Japan and South Korea. UEFA has co-hosted Euro's 3 times, Holland and Belgium 2000, Austria and Switzerland 2008 and Poland and Ukraine 2012, which shows they would accept a joint bid again in the future, where the IOC hasn't in the past before. But I suppose, I might of been over the top with the multi-country bid saga with Krakow. There's the thing.. it very explicitly states that a bid can incorporate a venue from another country is geography or other circumstances make it necessary. Doesn't mean IOC voters have to select the bid, but to push the idea that simply because there's no precedent in terms of a winning Winter bid that it wouldn't happen isn't giving them their due. And as many people have said, this is setting up a lot like the 2020 race where there isn't necessarily 1 compelling candidate and everyone in the field has their flaws and shortcomings Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baron-pierreIV Posted January 12, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 12, 2014 The thing is, is that excluding the Melbourne 1956 Co-Hosting with Stockholm because of circumstances, the Olympics has never been Multi-Country. Holland and Belgium 2000, Uhmmm...one of the sailing finals of Antwerp 1920 (so in 6 years, that's going to be a Centennial), was actually held in Dutch waters -- in the very TWO countries you mention later in your post -- and that is in the Official Records. You think you know everything, Mr. 66-year old??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pillan Posted January 13, 2014 Report Share Posted January 13, 2014 Uhmmm...one of the sailing finals of Antwerp 1920 (so in 6 years, that's going to be a Centennial), was actually held in Dutch waters -- in the very TWO countries you mention later in your post -- and that is in the Official Records. You think you know everything, Mr. 66-year old??? Wow, are you from Poland or what? Why are you so defensive about Krakow? I wonder if YOU are really 38 years old? You act as a child. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baron-pierreIV Posted January 13, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 13, 2014 Wow, are you from Poland or what? Why are you so defensive about Krakow? I wonder if YOU are really 38 years old? You act as a child. It was much calmer before u got here. I was MERELY stating fact. Why don't u just shut up?? U know nothing about what's going on, here. Antipatica!! Keep it up and I will slug with you each step of the way... I f*cking 4 sure hope Stockholm doesn't make the CUT!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pillan Posted January 13, 2014 Report Share Posted January 13, 2014 I hate how some people that now praise and defend Krakow as the best bid ever is also those people who bash Stockholm. How do it feel when your favorite is bashed? Must feels good right. Lol! It was much calmer before u got here. I was MERELY stating fact. Why don't u just shut up?? U know nothing about what's going on, here. Antipatica!! Keep it up and I will slug with you each step of the way... I f*cking 4 sure Stockholm doesn't make the CUT!!! A 38 years old that's saying shut up to a person that just say her opinion? You surely act as a child more than Tony E. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baron-pierreIV Posted January 13, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 13, 2014 U make no sense whatsoever. No wonder u defend that little trip called Tony E. Actually, you're a little worse. He plays a game -- u don't. Actually, I'm NOT 38. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baron-pierreIV Posted January 13, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 13, 2014 I hate how some people that now praise and defend Krakow as the best bid ever is also those people who bash Stockholm. How do it feel when your favorite is bashed? Must feels good right. Lol! A 38 years old that's saying shut up to a person that just say her opinion? You surely act as a child more than Tony E. Her opinion? Sure didn't sound like that to me -- the first time. yeah, calling me a child. Ever heard of "takes one to know one, Pillan"? And frankly, I DON"T care what you think of me. And UNTIL u showed up...show me WHERE I bashed the Stockholm bid??? S H O W M E!! It's your warped, twisted pro-Swedish slant again working...thinking every one who points out the main weakness of the Swedish bid, is "bashing" it. I guess Krakow's got you shaking in your boots, huh??? Stupid, hysterical responses like yours deserve the same, Pillan. Way to win friends & influence people for your cause. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pillan Posted January 13, 2014 Report Share Posted January 13, 2014 Her opinion? Sure didn't sound like that to me -- the first time. yeah, calling me a child. Ever heard of "takes one to know one, Pillan"? And frankly, I DON"T care what you think of me. Not good to have you back, dear. And UNTIL u showed up...show me WHERE I bashed the Stockholm bid??? S H O W M E!! It's your warped, twisted pro-Swedish slant again working...thinking every one who points out the main weakness of the Swedish bid, is "bashing" it. I guess Krakow's got you shaking in your boots, huh??? Way to win friends & influence people for your cause, Pillan. The same for you that bash people that points out Krakow's weakness. Why YOU can't accept that your beloved Krakow has a main weakness? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baron-pierreIV Posted January 13, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 13, 2014 The same for you that bash people that points out Krakow's weakness. Why YOU can't accept that your beloved Krakow has a main weakness? Yeah, Pillan, Krakow's gonna beat the sh*t outta Stockholm. 180 km vs. 530 km. Is there even a question there?? DUH!! [Quake, y aren't u saying anything?? U've been lurking there all this while??? ] Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pillan Posted January 13, 2014 Report Share Posted January 13, 2014 Yeah, Pillan, Krakow's gonna beat the sh*t outta Stockholm. 180 km vs. 530 km. Is there even a question there?? DUH!! [Quake, y aren't u saying anything?? U've been lurking there all this while??? ] Krakow needs an another country to help them. Not sure if that is positive. Sweden will do everything alone. I see a big problem with to countries host the games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
intoronto Posted January 13, 2014 Report Share Posted January 13, 2014 I think distance of about 600km is more of an issue to overcome then a bid with one venue over its borders. However I think Sweden has more of a sell then Poland does a) because of winter tradition Sweden is a winter power c) it is the last frontier for winter sports to have not hosted. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quaker2001 Posted January 13, 2014 Report Share Posted January 13, 2014 [Quake, y aren't u saying anything?? U've been lurking there all this while??? ] I'm just amused by this topic and this forum in general, as usual. I don't get why so many people here take these things so freaking personally (and I don't even mean you in this case). Funny thing.. I went into the Stockholm/Are thread to see the genesis of that discussion. This amuses me (note the date)... When did I ever bash Sweden? Sweden has done nothing bad towards me; why should I hate her? I am ridiculing the 'Anchorage / Bozeman' dreams of others here who state that a 10-hour flight to Anchorage is just the blink of an eye. Aside for some posts in that thread from vomit.. I mean gromit (close enough), guess who was getting in a heated discussion with Pillan on Sweden before you got there? Yours truly! This is why I tend to stay away from these city-specific discussions. Say something positive and a bid and it's "you love that bid so much, how can you be so blind to their problems." Say something negative and it's "how can you bash the bid so much, you don't know what you're talking about." Sorry to go off on a mini-rant there, I know I've done that a lot lately it's just the general nature of this for everyone to get so defensive and pissy at each other. I am so glad I don't have a dog in the fight on this one. Krakow needs an another country to help them. Not sure if that is positive. Sweden will do everything alone. I see a big problem with to countries host the games. So did Salzburg. They managed to get 25 out of 95 votes. Didn't win them anything, and them using Königsee is a simpler setup than Poland's bid using Jasna. But still, at least to have it within driving distance makes things a lot simpler than Stockholm using Are. I know it's in the rulebook that they can do that because of geographical issues, but I still don't think the IOC is going to be too thrilled with that, particularly that it's a venue and a sport that is easily affected by the weather. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
petrpetr Posted January 13, 2014 Report Share Posted January 13, 2014 We made hell here totally without reason. Im aware of weakness of Krakow bid. Alpine disciplines in Slovakia are handicap for bid. Cant disagree. IOC wont be delighted with this, but this is really good motivated. Not economical reasons, just geographical and ecological ones. IMHO better reasons than Salzburg had. I just feel that calling it 'multibid' isnt fair. Its Polish bid including one venue abroad. Someone here mentioned language and currency issues. Actually polish and sloviakian language are similiar and understandable in both directions. Also I can bet a lot of money on fact that in 2022 Poland will use Euro as Slovakia. The biggest problem i can see here are law issues and high discontent of Slovaks with fact that their country participate in Polish bid. I support Krakow bid with whole my heart. But as well as most of You I feel its not going to happen in 2022. I knew cases in OG bidding, I knew that both Norway and Sweden have more roots in winter sports and more influence in international organizations. But still, sometimes dreams come true, youll never know untill you'll try. I think that would be great experience if Krakow will make it to the short list. And Im sure if only Stockholm will treat their bid seriously they will made it too. But still im afraid I see moves of Oslo and Krakow and silence from Sweden. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FYI Posted January 13, 2014 Report Share Posted January 13, 2014 [Quake, y aren't u saying anything?? U've been lurking there all this while??? ] Network, media 'conversation' is a more interesting topic. :-/ • Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony E Loves Architecture Posted January 13, 2014 Report Share Posted January 13, 2014 @Baron why can't you accept that not everyone has the same opinion. If we all believed the same thing, there would be no forum. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olympic Fan Darcy Posted January 13, 2014 Report Share Posted January 13, 2014 Both Krakow-Jasna AND Stockholm-Are have major issues! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baron-pierreIV Posted January 13, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 13, 2014 As does Oslo-Kvitfell. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Lord David Posted January 14, 2014 Report Share Posted January 14, 2014 ^^ How so? Unlike Krakow or Stockholm, at least Oslo can boast on how transport between Oslo and Lillehammer was really not an issue. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baron-pierreIV Posted January 14, 2014 Author Report Share Posted January 14, 2014 ^^ How so? Unlike Krakow or Stockholm, at least Oslo can boast on how transport between Oslo and Lillehammer was really not an issue. Still the distance and 'been-there/done-that' factor - 2x already. Time to open up the Games to other places if the IOC wants a truly global following. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
zekekelso Posted January 14, 2014 Report Share Posted January 14, 2014 Still the distance and 'been-there/done-that' factor - 2x already. Time to open up the Games to other places if the IOC wants a truly global following. Take a look at the 2020 voting. The IOC voters are fine with the been-there / done that. (Side note - anytime you have to claim "2x" on Stockholm, to make a point, you've automatically lost." Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FYI Posted January 14, 2014 Report Share Posted January 14, 2014 Time to open up the Games to other places if the IOC wants a truly global following. If that were simply the case, Istanbul would've won 2020. It takes more than just saying "go to new places to keep the Games truly global". If it's really that simple, the IOC needs to rush to India ASAP to keep up with a true "global following". Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenadian Posted January 14, 2014 Report Share Posted January 14, 2014 But the Olympics do have a global following. Take a look at this silly board. Every continent has been represented at some point. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quaker2001 Posted January 14, 2014 Report Share Posted January 14, 2014 Always find it interesting how we all here never can seem to come to a consensus on how to view a former host city/country that is bidding. Is it a positive that they hosted a successful Olympics before? Or is it a negative because the IOC wouldn't want to return there? I've said plenty of times that I'm not sold on a future Los Angeles summer bid unless I see something different out of them. That said, the United States did land another Olympics 12 years later because they put up a city in a field of less than compelling candidates. I wouldn't count out Oslo on the basis of 1994 and certainly not 1952. Stockholm's bid is flawed. Krakow's bid is flawed. Beijing almost can't be taken seriously. And then it's Almaty or Lviv? After all that, Oslo doesn't look so bad. And again, 2020 showed that the IOC is more than happy to move away from their new frontier trend. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FYI Posted January 14, 2014 Report Share Posted January 14, 2014 All of that pragmatism means nothing when a certain you know who is set in their own bias ways. So many here have already outlined the 2022 scenario, but it never sinks in when you have krakow blinders on. With that said, I definitely give the Polish bid more credit than Lviv & Almaty, but it's certainly not a slam-dunk like a certain someone wants to portray it. And as far as Beijing goes, like I've said all along, they're the reliable back-up plan just in case the top 2022 applicants falter in anyway shape or form (i.e. lack of government backing, etc). Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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