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breathesgelatin

Lviv 2022

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You act as if it's a certain science, and given the proper variables you can determine the outcome with certainty. I'm merely arguing that - as I see it - Almaty is seriously underestimated. Oslo is the most likely to receive the games, but I believe - for reasons I've given and can expand upon - that Almaty is likely the current runner-up with Krakow being the only other serious contender. If I come off overly enthused about Almaty, part of that is attributable to a personal interest in seeing regions and cultures of the world that have generally been ignored given this level of attention and part of it that I simply believe that people generally strongly underestimate the significance of Kazakhstan's rise and the seriousness of Almaty's bid.

It's not a science it's an art. Stay a while and listen to the people telling you that your wrong, you'll learn something. Become more open-minded and look into the real history and politics of the games. It is then that you will understand why come 2022 the world will congregate in Oslo.

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Really bad news, not only for the Lviv bid, but for the whole country :-((

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/world-europe-26249330

It would be an absolute miracle if Lviv made it through as a Candidate. IF Lviv won, it would be a Salt Lake City style scandal IMO.

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With the capital burning like the Olympic flame, this surely cannot be good for the Lviv bid. I expect we'll be down to four before we know it.

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Don't be silly. "Olympic sports are higher than politics. And the 2022 Games are still eight years away". Never mind the fact that the short-list is announced in less than five months. Denial, anyone. The "bid committee" should be releasing another PR stunt soon, I'm sure. :-/

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I can't see this ending any way but civil war, sadly. The country would presumably split, but what would happen to the halves?

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Civil war seems very unlikely, but it would be even worse than it sounds if it happens because it would soon become a proxy war between Russia and NATO. The Olympics are insignificant compared to the problems facing the country right now. And saying that the bid is going to reunite the country is advocating rearranging the deck chairs on the Titanic.

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I can't see this ending any way but civil war, sadly. The country would presumably split, but what would happen to the halves?

Could the country be officially split as north and south Ukraine? Like Ireland, Korea or Sudan?

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Could the country be officially split as north and south Ukraine? Like Ireland, Korea or Sudan?

When it comes to Ukraine, it's more like Western and Estern split.

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IOC rejects Ukraine request to wear black armbands

SOCHI, Russia (AP) — Ukraine's Olympic Committee says the IOC has rejected a request for its athletes at the Sochi Games to wear black armbands honoring those who died in violent protests in Kiev.

The committee says on its website it wants to "share deep pain over the loss of fellow countrymen" and wear armbands as an "expression of sorrow and sympathy."

The committee says the IOC replied that this was "impossible according to the Olympic Charter." The IOC reprimanded Norwegian cross-country skiers earlier in the games for wearing black armbands in tribute to an athlete's brother.

The violence in Ukraine between riot police and protesters has left at least 25 people dead and 241 injured. The Ukrainian delegation in Sochi is led by Sergei Bubka, the Olympic pole vault great who has urged both sides to lay down their weapons.

AP

http://wintergames.ap.org/article/ioc-rejects-ukraine-request-wear-black-armbands

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At least the IOC is consistent there, though I think this is different to a private loss and mourning like in the Norwegian case.

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When it comes to Ukraine, it's more like Western and Estern split.

True, but you get what I mean. Will Ukraine officially split up like Sudan, Korea and Ireland did? Also, from what I've seen and heard, the only way this violence in Ukraine will end is if the President resigns.

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And then there were four...

3 if Oslo Norway pulls out which is likely it will be a race between Krakow Poland, Beijing China and Almaty Kazakhstan to host the 2022 winter games in that case Beijing China would win the only safe bid, Poland is too close to the conflict and a joint country bid is unstable who knows Slovakia could be the next Ukraine. So it could be a close race between Beijing China and Almaty Kazakhstan/Kazakh Nation to host the 2022 winter games.

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3 if Oslo Norway pulls out which is likely it will be a race between Krakow Poland, Beijing China and Almaty Kazakhstan to host the 2022 winter games in that case Beijing China would win the only safe bid, Poland is too close to the conflict and a joint country bid is unstable who knows Slovakia could be the next Ukraine. So it could be a close race between Beijing China and Almaty Kazakhstan/Kazakh Nation to host the 2022 winter games.

"You know nothing, Jon Snow"

Game Of Thrones, meet Gamesbids.com

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who knows Slovakia could be the next Ukraine.

Oh, dear Lord... :rolleyes: Like Hungarian minority from the south go to Bratislava and start revolution?

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3 if Oslo Norway pulls out which is likely it will be a race between Krakow Poland, Beijing China and Almaty Kazakhstan to host the 2022 winter games in that case Beijing China would win the only safe bid, Poland is too close to the conflict and a joint country bid is unstable who knows Slovakia could be the next Ukraine. So it could be a close race between Beijing China and Almaty Kazakhstan/Kazakh Nation to host the 2022 winter games.

Uh, no. Beijing is not a safe choice. Slovakia could not be the next Ukraine. It will not be a two-way race between Beijing and Almaty.

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@GCL, how can you think a country with poor human rights records, poor environment issues and political tension with Hong Kong, Taiwan, Macau, Tibet and Japan? That is not a safe choice. As far as I am concerned, Oslo is the safe choice out of the 5. If for some reason Oslo withdraws their Bid, then Krakow would be the next best choice. THEN if Krakow also pulls out, then Beijing would have a chance as far as I am concerned. I really want to know your definition of safe GCL.

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3 if Oslo Norway pulls out which is likely it will be a race between Krakow Poland, Beijing China and Almaty Kazakhstan to host the 2022 winter games in that case Beijing China would win the only safe bid, Poland is too close to the conflict and a joint country bid is unstable who knows Slovakia could be the next Ukraine. So it could be a close race between Beijing China and Almaty Kazakhstan/Kazakh Nation to host the 2022 winter games.

Poland and Slovakia are both part of the European Union, you can hardly do more stable than that.

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It depends on what you mean by safe choice. Beijing and Kazakhstan are guaranteed to do a respectable job of holding the actual events, and any protests would be crushed within hours. I don't think you would see many international visitors to Almaty, though, and it would be a PR nightmare. And Beijing's smog is even worse during the winter.

If Oslo pulls out I really hope Poland wins.

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It depends on what you mean by safe choice. Beijing and Kazakhstan are guaranteed to do a respectable job of holding the actual events, and any protests would be crushed within hours. I don't think you would see many international visitors to Almaty, though, and it would be a PR nightmare. And Beijing's smog is even worse during the winter.

If Oslo pulls out I really hope Poland wins.

Why are people so sure Beijing will do a respectable job of holding the actual events? How many ski jumping events have they hosted? Bobsledding? Downhills? Hockey touraments?

They'll get lots of help and probably do a bang up job. But so would anyone else. Why should we have more confidence in them than in anyone else?

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@GCL, how can you think a country with poor human rights records, poor environment issues and political tension with Hong Kong, Taiwan, Macau, Tibet and Japan? That is not a safe choice. As far as I am concerned, Oslo is the safe choice out of the 5. If for some reason Oslo withdraws their Bid, then Krakow would be the next best choice. THEN if Krakow also pulls out, then Beijing would have a chance as far as I am concerned. I really want to know your definition of safe GCL.

So how is any of that any different from when China was bidding for the 2008 Summer Olympics, besides not much.

Why are people so sure Beijing will do a respectable job of holding the actual events? How many ski jumping events have they hosted? Bobsledding? Downhills? Hockey touraments?

How many of any those did Sochi have before, besides none.

They'll get lots of help and probably do a bang up job. But so would anyone else. Why should we have more confidence in them than in anyone else?

If you have to ask such a question, then it really doesn't deserve an answer.

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So how is any of that any different from when China was bidding for the 2008 Summer Olympics, besides not much.

I never said China was a safe option for the 2008 Summer Olympics, anyway we are talking about now. Also, China has proven that the Olympics didn't teach them any lessons on how to improve the situations they are in. The smog is still bad, and as many have claimed, is far WORSE in the winter, they are still in conflict with Hong Kong, Macau, Taiwan, Tibet and Japan, and they STILL have poor human rights records. So, I was just asking GCL how he thinks Beijing would be a 'safe choice', and what his personal definition is of safe. China is on the same level as Russia when it comes to political issues, Russia and China both have poor human rights records, and they both have major political tension with a number of Countries and States. So, to answer your question, it's no different to the 2008 Summer Olympics from what I can see, if anything, it's worse now, because smog is worse in the winter, and they haven't learned any lessons from the 2008 Summer Olympics. It was China's fault that the Olympic Torch Relay is not Worldwide, and it's just in the Host Country and Greece now. It's China's fault there was so much disruption in the 2008 Summer Olympic Torch Relay. It's China that's stopping Chinese Taipei competing as Taiwan, and why Tibet can't be independent. Russia and China are so similar in such many ways. Yes, they get the job done, and yes they host successful Games, in the end, but at what cost? Affecting peoples lives, affecting land and the environment.

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