Kraków 2022

[petrpetr]

A quite interesting rumour about last one polish bid for WOG was confirmed by Andrzej Person in radio interview yesterday.

In 1999 before election of 2006 WOG host city, european part of members of IOC ( about 20 persons) voted for their choice in official semifinal vote.

There Torino had 8 votes and Zakopane 7.

After election in Poland Zakopane bid was totally destroyed by media, but maybe there want as far distant for Zakopane as we all thought those times.

[baron-pierreIV]

A quite interesting rumour about last one polish bid for WOG was confirmed by Andrzej Person in radio interview yesterday.

In 1999 before election of 2006 WOG host city, european part of members of IOC ( about 20 persons) voted for their choice in official semifinal vote.

There Torino had 8 votes and Zakopane 7.

After election in Poland Zakopane bid was totally destroyed by media, but maybe there want as far distant for Zakopane as we all thought those times.

Welcome, petrpetr. Good to have a Polish poster here.

But in the 1999 selection for the 2006 WOGs, Zakapone didn't even make it to the Short List. It was only Torino vs. Sion for 2006. So I don't understand the stats you have there for Zakapone.

[petrpetr]

Hi, Im reading this forum for a long time, now Im going to be active part of it. I'm a little bit involved in Krakow bid, so I hope i'll be able to share some exclusive and fresh news here. Now I'm preparing long post with details of polish bid, and we're going to start Krakow 2022 bid watchblog.

Sentence of Person was about getting to the shortlist. Andrzej Person suggested that Torino won battle for getting to shortlist against Zakopane only by 1 vote. Its hard to believe, and even harder to confirm. Andrzej Person is rather reliable man, but still that could be some kind of mitology. 2006 elections is Seul was a little bit strange. Even Torino was suprised by this choice. Switzerland had problems because they accused some IOC members of corrupiton.

[PaStKaz]

Results of poll made 28.10-3.11.

Kraków: 66% yes
Małopolskie Voievodeship: 79% yes
Poland: 81% yes

Nice. Better than i expected. Generally media in Poland criticized idea of Kraków 2022 but maybe people in Poland starts believe in our country after EURO 2012. Especially generation born after communism fall.

[baron-pierreIV]

Results of poll made 28.10-3.11.

Kraków: 66% yes

Małopolskie Voievodeship: 79% yes

Poland: 81% yes

Nice. Better than i expected. Generally media in Poland criticized idea of Kraków 2022 but maybe people in Poland starts believe in our country after EURO 2012. Especially generation born after communism fall.

Those are great numbers. What about a poll over at Jasna??

[baron-pierreIV]

Krakow's as European and as picturesque a city as Salzburg, Prague or St. Petersburg.

Edited November 16, 2013 by baron-pierreIV

[FYI]

And yet the IOC has rejected picturesque places like Prague & Salzburg. Until they unveil their complete plans, I'm still quite skeptical. Although I will say, that out of all the other 2022 newbie applicants, Krakow intrigues me the most.

[baron-pierreIV]

And yet the IOC has rejected picturesque places like Prague & Salzburg.

Well, that line is for "Tulsa." He heads the "pristine forest" forces. Krakow bid will need him.

Edited November 16, 2013 by baron-pierreIV

[StefanMUC]

Did anyone ever take the Prague bid seriously? I have family ties to Czech Rep, and they were shaking with disbelief. I was staying for a few days at their proposed sailing venue last year and found the idea of having Olympic races there quite amusing.

Anyway, this is about Krakow, so back to that one: It certainly would make a great choice one day, and if the Scandis fail for government support, that day might already come in 2022.

[Kenadian]

I don't think anyone can argue the historic value and beauty of Krakow. I've heard nothing but great things about the city and am planning on going there some day.

Anwyay...this bid. Not much is known yet, but I'm curious why they are doing this with the Slovaks. What mountain did the Zakopane 2006 bid propose? And why isn't that an option now?

And with the two countries in this bid, how will the events be split between the two? Kinda like the ice and snow split of Vancouver and Whistler? Or is the Slovak side just there for the big mountain? It would seem to me that the Polish side of the Tatry Mountains would have lots of snow for cross country and the like.

Anyone have answers?

Edited November 17, 2013 by Kenadian

[Lord David]

I think Jasna will just host the Downhill events (Men's and Women's). Myślenice, on the way to Zakopane will supposedly have the sliding venue. Krakow will supposedly host all ice events, though given that Zakopane has some indoor venues, surely one ice sport like Curling could be held there.

[PaStKaz]

Alpine skiing in Slovakia. This and nothing more is allowed by Olympic Charter.

I don't know what alpine skiing venue was proposed in 2006. All polish mountains which are big enough are in National Park. Probably in 1999 noone cares.

All ice eventes (maybe exepct one ice hockey venue) will take place in Kraków. Sliding in Myślenice, as Lord David said.

[yoshi]

I was going to ask how come they need to use Slovakia. Could Bratislava bid in the future for a games held entirely in Slovakia?

[StefanMUC]

I was going to ask how come they need to use Slovakia. Could Bratislava bid in the future for a games held entirely in Slovakia?

Bratislava - Jasná is about 300km on current roads, and there's no direct motorway but lots of secondary roads to take until you get there.

So, unless there's a better link in the future, I doubt it.

[munichfan]

I don't know what alpine skiing venue was proposed in 2006. All polish mountains which are big enough are in National Park. Probably in 1999 noone cares.

I've found the following:

The construction of certain facilities, particularly the skiing venues, to be located totally or partially in the Tatra National Park, will be a big challenge due to its special international ecological status. [...]

For alpine skiing the slalom event will be held on an existing ski slope close to the town centre for which permission to widen the slope must be obtained. The proposed venue for the downhill super-G and giant slalom events will be Kasprowy Wierch, another existing ski area. At present, snowmaking facilities, cable car, lift and spectator capacities, are insufficient and acccess to the stadium is non-existant.

Source: http://library.la84.org/OlympicInformationCenter/OlympicReview/1999/OREXXVI27/OREXXVI27z.pdf

[baron-pierreIV]

I was going to ask how come they need to use Slovakia. Could Bratislava bid in the future for a games held entirely in Slovakia?

@Yoshi, y do you KEEP spinning things way out? Like if the talk were about Venus-Earth-Mars, you would ALWAYS throw in...well, what about PLUTO??? Please stay w/in immediate and rational limits of the topic. It is quite irritating. I am sure if Slovakia wanted to bid, they would. But obviously, Bratislava is in the picture! STAY FOCUSED!!

[yoshi]

Ok, ok, Krakow certainly looks nice enough, strong in winter sports, far enough from Sochi to feel fresh, Eastern Europe without the rights problems AFAIK. I very much doubt that Stockholm will get govt support, & I'm not sure if Oslo will. If we end up with Krakow, Almaty & Beijing, there's a good chance for Krakow. But I still have the awful feeling that the IOC will go for Beijing's $ when it comes to the vote.

[baron-pierreIV]

Not gonna happen w/ Beijing. The IOC wasn't too happy in their working relationship with China in 2008. Among other things, tt took those nuts 2 YEARS to bring out the Official Report -- after being rejected the first time...and then the 2nd time, it was essentially the same thing...w/ things just glossed over. They just wore out the IOC...but I believe it was a rather dishonest, GLOSSY, PRC-propaganda Official Report.

[Gangwon]

@Yoshi, y do you KEEP spinning things way out? Like if the talk were about Venus-Earth-Mars, you would ALWAYS throw in...well, what about PLUTO??? Please stay w/in immediate and rational limits of the topic. It is quite irritating. I am sure if Slovakia wanted to bid, they would. But obviously, Bratislava is in the picture! STAY FOCUSED!!

Dude. He IS on topic. At least Pluto's a planet. Going off topic would be like Earth-Mars-Pluto...Revolving restaurants.

[yoshi]

^^^ :lol:

[p85]

Could Bratislava bid in the future for a games held entirely in Slovakia?

Bratislava - Jasná is about 300km on current roads, and there's no direct motorway but lots of secondary roads to take until you get there.

So, unless there's a better link in the future, I doubt it.

Slovaks don't need to use Jasna in their Olympic bids, I don't think they even listed it in 2002 and 2006 Poprad-Tatry bid. They have great selection of mountain slopes to choose. Slovakia's problem might be more or less similar to Sweden - they don't have bigger city situated near the mountains. Poprad is 52,000 inh., it could have been OK for 2006 bid, but it's insufficient for future bids, especially for newbies.

Bratislava is out because of the reasons StefanMUC listed. The nearest bigger city is Kosice, 2013 European Capital of Culture, big when it comes to hockey (they co-hosted 2011 IIHF WC), but there are probably financial problems/doubts.The next one bigger city is Presov (91,000).

Poland really seems like the best choice if we consider the whole Central-East European/post-Soviet/Carpathian chunk.

- Czech Republic may be OK with financing the whole thing but they lack an alpine skiing venue (I might be wrong). But if they had one, they'd bid for Winter Games before, instead of having pushed that Praha 2016 bid. Furthermore, they don't have bigger-mountain city that could handle it. The best choice would be, what? Liberec?

- Ukraine will come back after the 2022 defeat. Lviv is good and compact bid but more suited for 2040s.,

- Hungarian mountains are to small.

- Romania could bid with Brasov, but they have bigger problems than staging WOG. They don't really have a big medal account in Winter Games, which really suprised me.

Staying in post-Soviet area we are left with:

- Bulgaria has the same problems like Romania. They bid for 2014 and got rejected. Their best shot was def 1992.

- Slovenia, preferably Ljubljana. Didn't they withdraw a bid for Winter Universiade or something, for financial reasons? They're out, unless the IOC let them stage half of olympic competitions in Klagenfurt, or Italy.

- B&H, Sarajevo, they bid for 2010. Sorry, nope...

- Serbia is out for the same reason as Hungary,

- Albania, Macedonia - they're OK with natural conditions (mountain slopes) but they're out for numerous of political and financial reasons.

What's really wonders me is Croatia. They have a considerable medal account in WOG, Zagreb is bigger than Krakow, and it's located at mountain slopes (national park though...) They might be a contender in 2040s, even earlier.

[StefanMUC]

If we're talking Czech Rep, they could bring in Prague: Liberec as Nordic center would be a bit small to bid by itself maybe, but it's not much more distant from Prague than e.g. Garmisch from Munich. Alpine is more difficult, don't know whether Spindleruv Mlyn fulfills the downhill requirements, and it's in a completely different, less well-linked direction from Prague, compared to Liberec.

[baron-pierreIV]

Dude. He IS on topic. At least Pluto's a planet.

On topic right, just like 528km isn't a concern...and 923 billion light years away is ON TOPIC.

Going off topic would be like Earth-Mars-Pluto...Revolving restaurants.

#1 - It's tongue-in-cheek; and #2 - It's a bellweather indicator which did work out for the 2020 race. And isn't finding out who the eventual winner be the raison d'etre of this board? So therefore that Index isn't all that out-there as you think it is.

[p85]

If we're talking Czech Rep, they could bring in Prague: Liberec as Nordic center would be a bit small to bid by itself maybe, but it's not much more distant from Prague than e.g. Garmisch from Munich. Alpine is more difficult, don't know whether Spindleruv Mlyn fulfills the downhill requirements, and it's in a completely different, less well-linked direction from Prague, compared to Liberec.

"If we're talking Czech Rep, they could bring in Prague" I though the same way. Prague for opening/closing ceremonies and most of ice events, Liberec/Harrachov as a snow zone centers. Is there any slope near Harrachov that fulfills the downhill requirements? Spindleruv Mlyn surely looks really small and not well-linked.

[StefanMUC]

Don't think the mountains between Liberec and Harrachov are high enough for the downhill vertical drop. A Czech winter bid seems unlikely in the future, but not as laughable as their summer bid.