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Exactly, here is the map:

152541.jpg

In my opinion, pavillon 5 could be the shooting venue because there is an existing shooting center exactly at this place.

(this center renewal could be a legacy of the games).

1, 2 and 4

It seems pavillons 1, 2 and 4 are temporary pavillons (pink) and pavillon 3 seems to be permanent (red).

So, if we don't consider pavillon 5 (shooting), it makes 9 arenas for indoor sports:

2 in arena 92

Bercy arena

Halle carpentier

Grand Palais

4 pavillons at le Bourget.

Is that enough? (there are 11 arenas for Tokyo 2020)

maybe, the Zenith (concert hall) could be added to this list?

Why build all those temporary pavilions when Paris has two large convention centers that could hold events such as boxing and handball while the other could be for the MPC and IBC? Seems like it would be much more economical. That's more or less what London did. London originally had four temporary arenas (three in the Olympic Park for volleyball, fencing, and basketball and one in Greenwich Park for badminton and rhythmic gymnastics). Only the arena for basketball was built and plans for it's proposed reuse never came to fruition. London ended up using Earls Court for volleyball, Wembley Arena for rhythmic gymnastics and badminton, and fencing was moved to EXCEL. It takes away from the compactness a bit but it makes more sense especially in a climate where the public is much more conscious of where their tax money is being spent.

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Rendering of the Olympic stadium (stade de France) and the aquatic center. 

Because Baron.

Why build all those temporary pavilions when Paris has two large convention centers that could hold events such as boxing and handball while the other could be for the MPC and IBC? Seems like it would be much more economical. That's more or less what London did. London originally had four temporary arenas (three in the Olympic Park for volleyball, fencing, and basketball and one in Greenwich Park for badminton and rhythmic gymnastics). Only the arena for basketball was built and plans for it's proposed reuse never came to fruition. London ended up using Earls Court for volleyball, Wembley Arena for rhythmic gymnastics and badminton, and fencing was moved to EXCEL. It takes away from the compactness a bit but it makes more sense especially in a climate where the public is much more conscious of where their tax money is being spent.

I couldn't agree more. It doesn't make sense at all. Paris actually have 3 convention centers. A big one at Porte de Versailles (which would be fairly close to Roland Garros, the Parc des Prince and the Versailles venues). The other one is Le Bourget convention center, where they have planned to have the MPC and IBC (this is where the COP21 is currently being held. And the last on is the Villepinte Convention center, very close to Le Bourget and the Charles de Gaulle Airport. This is actually the biggest one in France and the number 6 in Europe. So, talk about saving costs..... What's the obsession with arenas when you don't even need them?

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I couldn't agree more. It doesn't make sense at all. Paris actually have 3 convention centers. A big one at Porte de Versailles (which would be fairly close to Roland Garros, the Parc des Prince and the Versailles venues). The other one is Le Bourget convention center, where they have planned to have the MPC and IBC (this is where the COP21 is currently being held. And the last on is the Villepinte Convention center, very close to Le Bourget and the Charles de Gaulle Airport. This is actually the biggest one in France and the number 6 in Europe. So, talk about saving costs..... What's the obsession with arenas when you don't even need them?

Maybe too many posts in those convention centers?

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http://www.venuesinparis.com/Viparis/images/sites/PNV/dossier_technique.pdf

In that document it is written: "pillars on a 39 x 39 m grid" for almost all halls.

Can that suits for an olympic venue?

Maube onlu Hall 5B can be used? (no pillars)

Nevertheless, it should be possible to put at least 3 olympic venues there:

2 in Hall 5B (27000 sqm pillar free)

1 in hall 8 (6000 sqm pillar free)

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One chance of the Paris bid is that France remains a monarchy and as long as the President supports the bid there should be no serious challenge to it. I have checked and I am not even sure that such a local referendum could legally be organized. I have seen the mention of elections in 2017 but the most likely outcome is that our current center left president (Hollande) will be replaced by a center right president (Juppé or Sarkozy). All three are known people, two are or have been President and one has been Prime Minister and I would not expect a surprise from any of them.

Related of that, I wonder if we'll finally see a real big triumph of the FN that people are really scary for that. They won the small battles but when it's becoming the big leagues they never pass the 20% barrier. Even during the 2002 elections, when Jean-Marie Le Pen was the second name for the second round, the French people prefered to vote for the "lame duck" in a full 82%. I'm questioning how of "this FN advance" is real and how it's just paranoia.

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Related of that, I wonder if we'll finally see a real big triumph of the FN that people are really scary for that. They won the small battles but when it's becoming the big leagues they never pass the 20% barrier. Even during the 2002 elections, when Jean-Marie Le Pen was the second name for the second round, the French people prefered to vote for the "lame duck" in a full 82%. I'm questioning how of "this FN advance" is real and how it's just paranoia.

Well, Jean-Marie Le Pen was a fool who had no self-control and certainly not the finesse, tactical skill or rhetorical talent of his daughter. So that alone makes her more dangerous. Secondly, she knows how to put her case and it shows - she's been consistently placed in the second round of the 2017 French presidential election, across all opinion polls. Third, the situation in 2002 was different: France (despite all the talk about a lack of security on TF1) was a relatively strong country; its relationship to Germany intact, its foreign policy skilled and its economy in comparably decent shape...and the effects of the Euro not showing.

Today, a look at the newspapers will show you why Marine is going to be a tough nut to crack: the two terrorist attacks in Paris (Charlie Hebdo and 13/11) play right into the narrative which she has been advancing for years now (i.e. that, in her view, Muslims constitute a security risk and that the French state has become way too weak); then there's the Greek crisis (which reminds everyone of the disaster of the Euro); we've had the whole banlieue issue break out into the open multiple times (something that hadn't happened in France; oh, and France still had the beautiful 1998 World Cup in mind when its multicultural team won the tournament...the team literally served as a reminder of how successful France could be if it stuck together). If Marine gets into round 2, expect her to score 35-40% (depending on turnout and whether her opponent is Sarkozy/Hollande or Juppé). If it's Alain Juppé in round 2, he will thrash Marine. If it's Sarkozy, everyone will remember his "bling-bling" presidency and get tired of him before the campaign officially starts. Hollande isn't even able to assemble more than 50% of French in a major terrorist crisis and despite NOT making any major mistakes...he won't win.

In short, the FN or rather Marine is not a media phenomenon. This is real.

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So you think there's a chance of Marine actually becoming President? Is that election before the IOC's vote on 24?

Not a chance. At all. France might not bat at its strongest, but even if she passes the first round and make it to the second round, it would be all like 2002 (with her probably getting a higher score, true).

The French just need a charismatic leader, and that's not happening at the moment from the left or from the right. But when I think about that day, January 11th, with 4 milllion people in the street, demonstrating in silence, with words like "We are all Jewish and Muslims".....

We are tired of racism and religious wars.

So no, the bitch shall not pass.

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Marine Le Pen has zero chance to win in 2017. That being said, if French mainstream political organizations continue to behave like idiots after the election of the next president, it could be a different story in 2022.

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Not a chance. At all. France might not bat at its strongest, but even if she passes the first round and make it to the second round, it would be all like 2002 (with her probably getting a higher score, true).

The French just need a charismatic leader, and that's not happening at the moment from the left or from the right. But when I think about that day, January 11th, with 4 milllion people in the street, demonstrating in silence, with words like "We are all Jewish and Muslims".....

We are tired of racism and religious wars.

So no, the bitch shall not pass.

Don't get me wrong: I detest far-right fascism and far-left extremism as much as the next guy. That said, I'm getting the feeling that Marine is playing the long game. She's been rebranding the FN and making it much more respectable across party lines - to the extent that the parliamentary right feels comfortable making deals in certain departments and regions with them. She has a core support of 20-25% - and she is driving the media agenda. Essentially, she will use the 2017 election as a first goalpost to make herself a serious contender - edge out the socialist/conservative candidate in Round 1 and run the kind of campaign that her father could never run. In other words, she will run with the classic FN appeal to nationalism, paired with more moderate language and an anti-establishment, populist feel. Her father was intemperate and not in control of himself. She is, which is why her appeal is more effective and dangerous.

I disagree: What France needs right now is an effective leader who is elected because of what he or she wants to accomplish - not because s/he isn't the other guy. I'm not as optimistic as you guys about the FN losing by a landslide. Yes, their parliamentary group will never grow substantially due to France's two-round system, but the presidency is a different kettle of fish: the disaffected, the unemployed, the apathetic, disappointed Republicains, non-voters, law-and-order voters, Islamophobes - they could all make up a chunk of MLP's "coalition" in a first and second round election. She may lose in 2017, but she may set herself up quite nicely in 2022. Especially now that her father is history.

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Yep, Marine won't win in 2017 (And even if so, it won't be a full victory, because she also need the triumph of the party in the parliament). If anycase, the polls can determinate a potential predilection, but not the real tendency of voting. If some of the polls were 100% true in the last years:

-The Liberals would have a narrow advantage in these recent Canadian elections

-Macri wouldn't have won in Argentina

Among the recent examples. Now, in 2022, I agree with you guys this can be a different story, especially with this recent dissolution for many European parties.

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I'm thinking Sarkozy goes back in.

My money's on Alain Juppé. Sarkozy is damaged good, reputed as theatrical, a loose cannon and has high disapproval ratings - and can't broaden the centre-right base. He'll also play into MLP's argument that with both major parties, it's "business as usual". Juppé is experienced, a tad staid in his manner, but a steady moderate who has proven his mettle in French politics. He won't polarize the French as much - and from what my French friends tell me, what France needs more than anything right now - after Sarkozy and Hollande - it's a Chirac-like president who will offer a steady, responsible hand at the tiller and not cause distracting drama by exposing the presidency to ridicule. Juppé would be the best bet.

*damaged goods

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My money's on Alain Juppé. Sarkozy is damaged good, reputed as theatrical, a loose cannon and has high disapproval ratings - and can't broaden the centre-right base. He'll also play into MLP's argument that with both major parties, it's "business as usual". Juppé is experienced, a tad staid in his manner, but a steady moderate who has proven his mettle in French politics. He won't polarize the French as much - and from what my French friends tell me, what France needs more than anything right now - after Sarkozy and Hollande - it's a Chirac-like president who will offer a steady, responsible hand at the tiller and not cause distracting drama by exposing the presidency to ridicule. Juppé would be the best bet.

*damaged goods

Juppe just has to beat out Sarkozy to be his party's candidate.

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Jacques Chirac(Paris mayor from 1977 to 1995 and then french president) had promised it in 1988:

"within five years, we can again swim in the Seine. And I'll be the first to do so"

Will Paris 2024 do it 36 years later?

Tony Estanguet (Co-President of Paris 2024) will outline the city's sustainable bid plans today at the COP21.

http://www.sportsfeatures.com/olympicsnews/story/52007/paris-2024-to-outline-sustainable-bid-plans-at-cop21

One of the legacy of the games would be to make it possible to swim in the Seine river.

"The Seine is also undergoing a large-scale clean-up program, and our ambition is to host Triathlon in the river that runs through the heart of the city in the shadow of the Eiffel Tower,"

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Please correct me. Is the living / residential zone for the Olympic Village planned on an island. Will it present similar security threats to the concerns around the NY and Tokyo Olympic Village or is this a completely different scenario?

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Well, what we kind of feared is now a reality. The far right, ultranationalist party FN has became the first french political party after a landslide victory on the elections, gaining more than 30% and surpassing both Republican and Socialist parties.

Le Pen should be very thankful to IS. <_< I wonder how is this going to affect the bid now.

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Well, what we kind of feared is now a reality. The far right, ultranationalist party FN has became the first french political party after a landslide victory on the elections, gaining more than 30% and surpassing both Republican and Socialist parties.

Le Pen should be very thankful to IS. <_< I wonder how is this going to affect the bid now.

First, these are local elections. Usually the FN has good numbers on the first round in these type of elections

And then, as Frenchy said, there's still the second round to make the final numbers.

You are really extremist/visceral related to political news.

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