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Rendering of the Olympic stadium (stade de France) and the aquatic center. 

Because Baron.

I must say that I am a bit surprised by how much Rome is ignored in all this discussion. Last time they bid they fared extremely well against what was the overwhelming favorite, and since then Italy has staged excellent Games in Torino. I think they would be a very strong European contender.

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I must say that I am a bit surprised by how much Rome is ignored in all this discussion. Last time they bid they fared extremely well against what was the overwhelming favorite, and since then Italy has staged excellent Games in Torino. I think they would be a very strong European contender.

Are you ready to support a Rome bid after the undercover schemes operated by the Pescante/Berlusconi duo (and another candidate city btw, which wasn't the winner) against Paris 2012? You're so forgiving.

Nice to see there still are some people who wouldn't mind helping persons who plunged their head in the water a few years ago. Not sure if that's your case.

Likewise, if you expect French IOC members to back a Rome bid, then I think you have a very fertile imagination. Which can be a quality, don't get me wrong.

Anyway, after so much absence in North America and total absence in Africa, I can't imagine 2024 to go back to Europe. Especially with the memorable trace left by London 2012. Hence why people were not talking much about the city you mentioned. :)

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I don't think Rome is being ignored as this is a Paris thread, really.

But yeah, as of right now, CONI & the mayor there have stated that they'd like to bid. And while I would also say that Rome would be a strong contender as well, other would cite those Turin Games as a negative for Rome.

And while I think a Rome Games would be awesome (the prospect of an Italian Games actually excites me more than Paris), the French would have the edge in a head-to-head race IMO.

And while Rome did do well last time they bid, Paris actually did better in their respective final round than Rome did. And I'd also dare to say that Paris would fare better against a possible South African bid. And Rome was actually the favorite for 2004, not Athens as the "overwhelming favorite". And the Italians still lost by a good size margin of 25 votes.

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The Italian economy isn't out of the woods yet either. And after fellow-Latin city, Madrid's 3rd drubbing, and going up against a pre-race favorite, Durban, I think the Italians would be wise to be cautious like they did in the 2020 race and not be reckless like Madrid. Let the Bakus and the Dohas be the sacrificial lambs.

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You have a fertile imagination, since you think that I said the French IOC members would vote for Rome. But they are only three.

I think the Italians are very gifted lobbyists. Remember, they invented modern politics and warfare while your ancestors and mine where still running naked in the plains with spears and knives. So I would make them my favorites if they bid.

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You have a fertile imagination, since you think that I said the French IOC members would vote for Rome. But they are only three.

I said "if" you think so, then your imagination is fertile. If you don't, it's ok. But whatever...

I think the Italians are very gifted lobbyists. Remember, they invented modern politics and warfare while your ancestors and mine where still running naked in the plains with spears and knives. So I would make them my favorites if they bid.

:lol: I'd have more doubts if I were you though...The 125th IOC session showed that those who executed schemes & plots against naive and honest opponents in the past tasted the dust quite badly. And I'm not saying that for Istanbul of course. Rome's fate could well be the same... ;)

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I think the Italians are very gifted lobbyists. Remember, they invented modern politics and warfare while your ancestors and mine where still running naked in the plains with spears and knives. So I would make them my favorites if they bid.

We also had word here from somebody who works in the IOC that the Italians have a reputation within the organization of being a little pushy, i.e., throwing their weight around more than should be. So that 'gifted lobbying' may actually backfire. Within the halls of the IOC, I think they prefer a gloved vs. an iron hand.

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Are you ready to support a Rome bid after the undercover schemes operated by the Pescante/Berlusconi duo (and another candidate city btw, which wasn't the winner) against Paris 2012? You're so forgiving.

Nice to see there still are some people who wouldn't mind helping persons who plunged their head in the water a few years ago. Not sure if that's your case.

Likewise, if you expect French IOC members to back a Rome bid, then I think you have a very fertile imagination. Which can be a quality, don't get me wrong.

Anyway, after so much absence in North America and total absence in Africa, I can't imagine 2024 to go back to Europe. Especially with the memorable trace left by London 2012. Hence why people were not talking much about the city you mentioned. :)

I know how you feel Pixie.

I very well remember the grubby agreement Bliar had with the lecherous Berlusconi back in 2004/5 which gave way to the Jowellgate affair.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Tessa_Jowell_financial_allegations

Those two clowns will go down in history as the most despised post-war politicians in their respective countries.

And the Brits would still have you believe that they played clean!! :D

Still, if the games had to go to Europe sometime in the future Rome would be as good a place as any. I believe it’s one of the most stunning cities in the world………after Paris! :P

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Still, if the games had to go to Europe sometime in the future Rome would be as good a place as any. I believe it’s one of the most stunning cities in the world………after Paris! :P

Doesn't even compare. Rome, like Athens, has all those glorious and historic rocks, that's all. At least, Paris is a living, breathing monument; and always setting the pace for style (except those cut-rate opening ceremonies of the Francophonie Games in Nice a few weeks ago. But then , that was in Nice.) ;)

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IDK - but something about Rome just appeals to me so much more than any of the other major European capitals. You always hear of Milan as "the Paris of Italy", but that doesn't do anything for me either. I just think about sitting in an outdoor cafe in Piazza Navonna, filled with Olympic revelers, having a "cafe con latte"! :lol:

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I think Paris will bid in the 2060s to commemorate the centennial of Grenoble 1968. :)

More seriously, I do not think that Paris will be the next European host city, and probably not the following one either. Countries such as Italy and Germany seem to me more likely next European hosts.

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  • 4 weeks later...

French must stop showing "arrogance" if Paris bid for 2024 Olympics is not to fail again, warns Killy

October 20 - If Paris bids for the 2024 Olympics and Paralympics then they need to show "humility, of listening and of perseverance", instead of being arrogant, they have been warned by Jean-Claude Killy.

Killy is France's most senior member of the International Olympic Committee (IOC), and claimed that the country needs a fresh approach if it is to finally succeed after five consecutive unsuccessful bids.

Three of these have come from Paris.

They were for 1992 which were awarded to Barcelona, 2008 to Beijing and 2012 to London when the French capital was the overwhelming favourite only to be beaten in one of the biggest upsets in Olympic bidding history.

This was then followed by a bid for the 2018 Winter Olympics and Paralympics from Annecy, when they polled only seven votes as the Games were awarded to South Korea's Pyeongchang, the second lowest total in recent history.

Lille had also bid for the 2004 Olympics but were not even chosen as a candidate city for a Games awarded to Athens.

The last successful French Olympic bid came from Albertville, who were awarded the 1992 Winter Games.

A bid from Paris for 2024 is widely expected, especially as it would mark the centenary of the 1924 Games which were held there and immortalised in the Oscar-winning film Chariots of Fire.

But Killy, a former skier who won three gold medals at Grenoble in 1968, has cautioned that Paris needs to adopt a new attitude if it is to come out in front of what is expected to be the most competitive bid campaign since 2012 which also featured Madrid, Moscow and New York.

"We must stop putting ourselves forward as something we're not," Killy told French newspaper Journal du Dimanche in an interview published today. .

"We can't turn up once every ten years and tell the whole world what the Olympic Movement is about, that shows arrogance, and then go and repeat that ten years later."

Killy, who gave his lukewarm support to Annecy's bid for the 2018 Winter Olympics, gave Paris a word of advice should they emerge as 2024 host city candidates.

"They should create a Team France obviously backed by the Mayor [of Paris]," said Killy, who is currently head of the IOC Coordination Commission for Sochi 2014.

"It also helps to pay attention to the competition.

"The Americans will be hard to beat.

"France should adopt a position of humility, of listening and of perseverance."

If Paris pinned its hopes of being awarded the Games because it is the centenary of 1924, then it is doomed to fail, Killy warned.

"Never [should they adopt this strategy], looking at its scope and responsibilities a romantic IOC no longer exists," he said.

But, even if Paris does bid, then Killy does not wish to be part of its campaign.

"Out of the question, or only a helping hand," he said.

Insidethegames

Hmmmm. This is bound to re-open some wounds from the 2012 campaign. For what it's worth, I don't think arrogance was the problem at all with the bid - the complete opposite, in fact. Rather, I think they were hamstrung by trying not to be seen as the over-confident front-runner, but by doing so went too low key. The French were sure in a bit of a bind in that race - damned if they did campaign hard, damned when they didn't.

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Hmmmm. This is bound to re-open some wounds from the 2012 campaign. For what it's worth, I don't think arrogance was the problem at all with the bid - the complete opposite, in fact. Rather, I think they were hamstrung by trying not to be seen as the over-confident front-runner, but by doing so went too low key. The French were sure in a bit of a bind in that race - damned if they did campaign hard, damned when they didn't.

One might not fault the bid for arrogance, but one could fault Chirac.

Also, we have to acknowledge that there's a widespread perception issue that comes into play. The stereotypical French person is snooty and superior, just as the stereotypical American is materialistic and self-centered, and the stereotypical German is intense and perfectionistic and the stereotypical Japanese person is smart, but boring. These stereotypes are not universally true by any means, but they do grow have some basis in a pattern of collective experience.

I myself have had multiple encounters with insufferable French people (all of them Parisians) who were incredibly haughty and rude. If a French bid is going to succeed, they will need to play on the strengths of their stereotype and minimize the weaknesses -- just as Tokyo 2020 had to do. Instead of being boring, they became "safe." Similarly, instead of appearing arrogant, the French need to come across as "classy and sophisticated."

I think it's very interesting that Killy cited the Americans and not South Africa as the country to watch. Not necessarily sure I agree with his assessment.

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. If a French bid is going to succeed, they will need to play on the strengths of their stereotype and minimize the weaknesses -- just as Tokyo 2020 had to do. Instead of being boring, they became "safe." Similarly, instead of appearing arrogant, the French need to come across as "classy and sophisticated."

And yet, that's what they did try to achieve in the 2012 bid - only to come across as "boring technocrats in grey suits".

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And yet, that's what they did try to achieve in the 2012 bid - only to come across as "boring technocrats in grey suits".

How did they try to present themselves as "classy and sophisticated"? I didn't get that from the 2012 bid.

The reality is that the campaign starts long before the bid deadline. A lot depends on how the French are perceived within the upper echelon's of elite sports organization. Do they interact with colleagues in a way that is respectful and positive or are they off-putting and holier-than-thou? Yes, the image can be managed some during a campaign, but the groundwork has to be laid many years in advance.

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"We can't turn up once every ten years and tell the whole world what the Olympic Movement is about, that shows arrogance."

Hmmm, this can be applied to a certain 2020 losing bidder as well. Don't go dictating to the IOC how they should be "more efficiently" running their big show. That's bad manners.

I think it's very interesting that Killy cited the Americans and not South Africa as the country to watch. Not necessarily sure I agree with his assessment.

Well, I'm sure that's bcuz the IOC doesn't wanna scare off the USOC (not to mention anyone else) by already touting the "final frontier". I'm sure they want as many bidders as possible for 2024, unlike 2020. Certainly can't accomplish if they're gonna start showing their favoritism this early on.

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That article is just an extract from a much longer interview given in last Sunday’s ‘Journal du Dimanche’ (JDD).

It’s been put online at the following page (for French speakers only!).

http://www.lejdd.fr/recherche?query=Jean-Claude%20Killy

I mentioned elsewhere the importance of domestic politics when presenting a bid and the statements made by Killy come as no surprise.

He’s never hidden his right wing views and even sings Putin’s praise in that article brushing away any comments regarding the anti-gay laws in Russia. He’ll also be leaving the ioc after the 2014 WOGs at the ripe old age of 70.

The fact that a winning bid could be presented at a time when the country is being run by a socialist government probably sticks in his throat. Hence the swipe.

Then again, he’s got nothing to worry about as there will probably be no bid.

One last remark. He claims that the French are perceived as, <yawn>, ‘arrogant’. Seeing as he’s one of the longest serving Frenchman at the ioc, he probably contributed to that image by his own attitude….and by this interview!

I wish him a long and bile free retirement. :P

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