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6 minutes ago, FYI said:

I see that mentioned from time-to-time. But why is that? The French after all, voted for him twice. What specifically do the French "hate him" for? And is that an over-reach TBW?

It's like when certain Americans say that "the 'people' are tired of Biden", when in actuality, that's not really the case. It's only a certain sub-set of people that really like to say that.

Because he faced far-right at the run-off of his two presidential wins, and a lot of people hated more Le Pen than him. To compare with the US, a lot of people may be tired of Biden, but they may still vote for him because they really don't want Trump.

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Something more lighthearted: Paris' mayor planned to swim in the Seine on Olympic Day to show that the river is clean. But the flow of the river is too high right now because of the heavy rains in recent weeks, so her "bath" was planned to be delayed by one week... on June 30, the day of the election's first round. Guess she won't swim, after all.

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1 minute ago, Cyriln said:

Something more lighthearted: Paris' mayor planned to swim in the Seine on Olympic Day to show that the river is clean. But the flow of the river is too high right now because of the heavy rains in recent weeks, so her "bath" was planned to be delayed by one week... on June 30, the day of the election's first round. Guess she won't swim, after all.

And so for Macron, who also had to bathe, let's not even talk about it...

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Like FYI, this was a bit of weird news to me to wake up to and find on GBids ths morning.

But don’t the European elections always tend to become a bit of a protest platform against incumbents across the continent? I seem to remember the extremists and loonies always seem to get a few people sent to Strasbourg. And anyway, it seems the centre-right and moderate parties still have a pretty comfortable majority in the parliament.

Whatever, surely whatever happens, it’s still Macron and Estanguet who’ll be calling the shots at the games. If the rightists still complain, they can still rub their noses into the ultimate festival of “woke”.   

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25 minutes ago, sebastien1214 said:

Biden's popularity rating in the USA is around 45-50% (is that right?). For Macron, in France, we are around 25-30%, which is almost half as much.

And? You know what Trump's average approval rating was during his presidency? 41% - so that's even lower than the current U.S. President. I still wouldn't say, though, even in either case, that is "the people".

28 minutes ago, sebastien1214 said:

And yes, indeed, he won the elections in 2017 & 2022. But don't forget that in France, in the first round we choose, and in the second round we eliminate. He had 58.55% in the second round in 2022, but that does not mean that 58.55% of French people supported his project, on the contrary. A larger number of people (including me) did it so as not to see Le Pen as president.

That sounds like our primary elections (where here is where we "choose" who we want as our party presidential candidate), which are generally held about eight months before the general election. Then on election night, you vote for the lesser-of-two-evils.

32 minutes ago, sebastien1214 said:

As for the hatred: in 2018, Macron was so afraid that he had planned a helicopter to escape in case the demonstrators managed to storm the Elysée.

Do you, personally, "hate" Macron?

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34 minutes ago, Cyriln said:

Because he faced far-right at the run-off of his two presidential wins, and a lot of people hated more Le Pen than him. To compare with the US, a lot of people may be tired of Biden, but they may still vote for him because they really don't want Trump.

Exactly my point. Again, you vote for the lesser-of-two-evils. If anyone thinks that the previous U.S. president (heaven forbid again) for example, can do a "better" job than the current U.S. president has, when the previous U.S.' president's approval rating was even lower than the current U.S. president's, then as the saying goes lately - 'you get what you fu@king deserve'.

6 minutes ago, Sir Rols said:

Like FYI this was a bit of weird news to wake up to and find on GBids ths morning.

Yeah, I was like WTF is this two-weeks before Olympics start drama about. Did I fully wake up yet. Am I still dreaming? Maybe I need an extra espresso this morning or something.

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8 minutes ago, Sir Rols said:

Like FYI this was a bit of weird news to wake up to and find on GBids ths morning.

But don’t the European elections always tend to become a bit of a protest platform against incumbents across the continent? I seem to remember the extremists and loonies always seem to get a few people sent to Strasbourg. And anyway, it seems the centre-right and moderate parties still have a pretty comfortable majority in the parliament.

Whatever, surely whatever happens, it’s still Macron and Estanguet who’ll be calling the shots at the games. If the rightists still complain, they can still rub their noses into the ultimate festival of “woke”.   

It depends on the country. I can hardly speak about other countries in the European Union, because the context remains different.

Also, yes Estanguet will remain in charge. But if we enter a phase of cohabitation, that is to say with a government which is not on the same political side as the president, then ultimately the president will no longer have executive powers. It's the government that will get them. And therefore, even if he will declare the games open, in the end he will have the position of Elizabeth II, because it is Le Pen (or Bardella) who will decide, not Macron.

6 minutes ago, FYI said:

And? You know what Trump's average approval rating was during his presidency? 41% - so that's even lower than the current U.S. President. I still wouldn't say, though, even in either case, that is "the people".

That sounds like our primary elections (where here is where we "choose" who we want as our party presidential candidate), which are generally held about eight months before the general election. Then on election night, you vote for the lesser-of-two-evils.

Do you, personally, "hate" Macron?

Yes, but 40% is still more than any of our presidents in 10 years. Afterwards, you have a system with only two real parties, therefore fewer possible alternatives. And beyond that, I find that our two political systems are too different to draw parallels, in any case I find it risky. And anyway, in France, we are more likely to hate our leaders than in other countries, that's how it is, it's our history.

For the rest, yes I hate Macron, and probably the future government, for reasons that I will not detail because it would be too off-topic.

I still want to make a point about the Olympic Games; many people who hate Macron also hate the Games, particularly because it is Macron who organizes them. As for me, I think you have seen enough messages from me to see that I am enthusiastic about Paris 2024 and that I find that there are many competent people who are in charge of it. But I'm afraid that these people's future bosses (future ministers) will make bad decisions that would impact the Games.

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7 minutes ago, FYI said:

Yeah, I was like WTF is this two-weeks before Olympics start drama about. Did I fully wake up yet. Am I still dreaming? Maybe I need an extra espresso this morning or something.

Oh, don't worry, we're in the same situation: we're in shock too, no one expected it, and we're all having a little trouble sleeping... (so we're going to avoid coffee)

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I would add something else: during these last few weeks, we felt that enthusiasm was starting to slowly build in France in relation to the Olympics.

There we are in for a hellish month, with an absolutely disgusting campaign and where everyone will only think about the legislative elections. Perhaps the Olympics will even be a campaign object, to denigrate them (or not). In short, all this to say that I am afraid that everything that has happened will put a stop to the enthusiasm which was starting to build slightly. And I would have liked that on July 26, we opened the Games with joy, not with a heavy and heavy atmosphere. I hope it won't be felt too much abroad France.

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6 hours ago, FYI said:

I see that mentioned from time-to-time. But why is that? The French after all, voted for him twice. What specifically do the French "hate him" for? And is that an over-reach TBW?

It's like when certain Americans say that "the 'people' are tired of Biden", when in actuality, that's not really the case. It's only a certain sub-set of people that really like to say that.

Okay, thanks. But this still seems a bit confusing, since I'd never really considered the EU having that much political influence/power within it's member states. 

The EU is VERY influential in law-making, which is either denied or giving the EU the blame by the anti-EU folks, depending what serves them best.

EU parliament is voted every five years actually, and of course while it should be about Europe, it often is an indicator at national level too. It also is - almost - representative of country population size, so German or French results have a bigger impact on the EU parliament than e.g. Maltese or Estonian. We also vote for our national parties (who then form groups with those foreign parties in the EU parliament aligned mostly with their own programmes).

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Paris 2024 and the IOC announced that this new political context won't disturb the Games. https://www.lequipe.fr/Tous-sports/Actualites/Paris-2024-et-le-cio-assurent-que-le-contexte-politique-ne-va-pas-perturber-les-jeux/1473799

Almost everything should be planned now and all that remains is to do what has been planned, teams on sites won't need a politician-on-chief so everything should go according to the plan. But if something goes wrong during the Games, right now, Estanguet doesn't know who he will have to call.

In the linked article, Estanguet lists the values that Paris 2024 wants to celebrate: respect, friendship, excellence, diversity, inclusion. Unfortunately, these values are completely opposed to Le Pen's ones.

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And here it is in English:

Political turmoil won't derail Games, IOC and Paris 2024 say

 

https://www.reuters.com/world/europe/political-turmoil-france-wont-affect-paris-games-ioc-head-says-2024-06-10/

And Anne Hindalgo really didn’t mince any words. 

I think the summary of this story though, (which has also been discussed on here before in relation to the new-norm) is that so much can happen just with the regular (“old norm”) lead-time of seven years.

So with the IOC now awarding Games 10, 11 years out (with the “new-norm”), or maybe even longer, can Bach & Co. really be opening up a can of worms that they won’t be able to shut back if things really get outta hand with far & distant future host.

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23 hours ago, sebastien1214 said:

I still want to make a point about the Olympic Games; many people who hate Macron also hate the Games, particularly because it is Macron who organizes them.

This statement seems so much like a catch-22. Because the IOC of course loves to see as much host city gov't support for a Games as possible. And Macron definitely showed that support throughout the lead-time of Paris 2024. As an outsider looking in, I thought that was a good thing.

Japanese PM at the time, also showed great support for Tokyo, even making a surprise appearance at the Tokyo 2020 handover in Rio 2016, dressed up as Super Mario. It's a sad state of affairs when some people are starting to dislike the Games simply because they don't like the current gov't that's in their host country. Again, making the distinction that "sports & politics shouldn't intertwine" laughable. I also have a feeling that come L.A. 2028 will also be used as a political tool here in the U.S., particularly from the anti-'woke' mob. 

23 hours ago, sebastien1214 said:

For the rest, yes I hate Macron, and probably the future government, for reasons that I will not detail because it would be too off-topic.

Perhaps you should start another thread on the topic. Because I'm particularly curious on your disdain of Macron, especially since you don't like Le Pen either. Is it that you're just simply an independent (or a centrist) as we call those type of voters here in the U.S.?

23 hours ago, sebastien1214 said:

Oh, don't worry, we're in the same situation: we're in shock too, no one expected it, and we're all having a little trouble sleeping... (so we're going to avoid coffee)

But French roast is so good, though!! :D

17 hours ago, StefanMUC said:

The EU is VERY influential in law-making, which is either denied or giving the EU the blame by the anti-EU folks, depending what serves them best.

I've always thought of the E.U. as more of an internal organization, much like the IOC or the U.N. rather than a policy making one that can directly & greatly effect it's members.

I've never been much of a political observer TBW (I also think many Americans, particularly the younger ones, are not as much in-tune with politics, especially when it comes to global affair, as our European counterparts), but ever since Chump came into the picture, I've become much more interested because some of the sh!t that's been going on within the last decade alone is absolutely ASSinine!! 

9 hours ago, Cyriln said:

In the linked article, Estanguet lists the values that Paris 2024 wants to celebrate: respect, friendship, excellence, diversity, inclusion. Unfortunately, these values are completely opposed to Le Pen's ones.

As Rol's noted a couple of weeks ago, those are all values that the far-right don't like anyway.

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1 hour ago, FYI said:

So with the IOC now awarding Games 10, 11 years out (with the “new-norm”), or maybe even longer, can Bach & Co. really be opening up a can of worms that they won’t be able to shut back if things really get outta hand with far & distant future host.

That’s certainly something I’ve expressed concerns about a few times, and I think magnifies the risks in the strategic organisations of a games from years out. You only have to look at 2032 how even petty political policy squabbling can derail things years out. There was also that video posted recently from the former IOC VP, Kevan Gosper, expressing exactly those concerns.

In Paris’ case, as I said yesterday and as the official messaging is saying today, we’re well past those stages. All major decisions - technical and artistic - have long been made and set and we’re now well in the operational phase. To all intents and purposes the games have already begun, and it’s now just a matter of following the main script or any contingencies that might be needed to be activated. It’s really too late for anything major to change now. I can understand and empathise withe the anxieties and concerns of Sebastien and Cyriln and co, but just as Rio played out in probably even more highly charged late minute political upsets, Paris will play out to the plans in place.

Short of a full-on civil war or really major political unrest (and I guess there is the fact that this is France, where the national pastime is setting up barricades), I think the main pity is it is a bit distracting when the focus should be on the torch relay and building up the excitement and anticipation. Then again, for a large part of the campaign, the torch is off in the overseas departments anyway. And it’s still likely to cut through the political grumbling.

32 minutes ago, FYI said:

But French roast is so good, though!! :D

Maybe it speaks to how much Aussies are now coffee snobs, but my sister’s one complaint about her recent trip to France was how hard it was to get a decent coffee ;)

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18 minutes ago, FYI said:

Is it that you're just simply an independent (or a centrist) as we call those type of voters here in the U.S.?

We can't compare the US political groups, where only two of them have an influence, and the French ones. Right now, I'd say there are five important groups:

  • a coalition of left-wing parties that has been confirmed a few hours ago, they don't like each other but they really don't want a far-right government
  • center-left individuals, mainly dissidents from left-wing parties but with enough influence to be taken account
  • Macron and his allies an the center-right, he'd say he's centrist but his decisions since he's been elected are more on the right
  • the French conservative party, that has been crushed in recent years between Macron and Le Pen
  • far-right, gaining votes at each new election
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28 minutes ago, Sir Rols said:

There was also that video posted recently from the former IOC VP, Kevan Gosper, expressing exactly those concerns.

Yep, I had brought that up in the Brisbane thread a couple of months ago, where he was being interviewed by a woman who was going to be releasing her podcast. I ponder, though, what our (former) 'new-norm' pariah would've said about that. lol

29 minutes ago, Sir Rols said:

Maybe it speaks to how much Aussies are now coffee snobs, but my sister’s one complaint about her recent trip to France was how hard it was to get a decent coffee ;)

Oh, really? Now that's VERY interesting! 

24 minutes ago, Cyriln said:

We can't compare the US political groups, where only two of them have an influence, and the French ones. Right now, I'd say there are five important groups:

Maybe, but we also have many of those groups within our two parties:

25 minutes ago, Cyriln said:

 

  • center-left individuals, mainly dissidents from left-wing parties but with enough influence to be taken account

The Senator from West Virginia, Joe Manchin, is one of those. He sometimes holds up a lot of policy-making because often times he goes against the majority of the Democrats. 

28 minutes ago, Cyriln said:

 

  • Macron and his allies an the center-right, he'd say he's centrist but his decisions since he's been elected are more on the right

Really? Not that's interesting. You'd think that someone who has a wife 25-years his senior would be a little more open-minded. ^_^

29 minutes ago, Cyriln said:

 

  • far-right, gaining votes at each new election

It seems the trend over on this side of the pond is the opposite, for the moment anyway. Let's just hope & pray that continues in this year's general elections here.

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11 minutes ago, FYI said:

Really? Not that's interesting. You'd think that someone who has a wife 25-years his senior would be a little more open-minded. ^_^

He's open-minded on that kind of topics: pro-LGBT+, pro-abortion, pro-women's rights... But economically, he's a former banker that raised retirement age (a very sensible topic in France) despite huge protests last year and he was planning to reduce unemployed rights.

Oh yeah, he also just made a huge gamble that may bring a far-right party founded by former members of Waffen-SS to govern France for the next three years just because he lost political momentum. Oopsie...

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2 hours ago, Cyriln said:

But economically, he's a former banker that raised retirement age (a very sensible topic in France) despite huge protests last year and he was planning to reduce unemployed rights.

Ah yes, I remember those protests last year. Although, IMO, what Macron did seems to be quite modest in comparison to what the republicans here want to do with SS retirement benefits, & push the age up from currently 67 to 70 yo!

And also wanting to cut benefits to Medicare & to the ACA. All while at the same time, they also want to give big corporations & the wealthy huge tax cuts. But ugh, anyway, I digress, since that's starting to veer off-topic.

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23 minutes ago, FYI said:

Ah yes, I remember those protests last year. Although, IMO, what Macron did seems to be quite modest in comparison to what the republicans here want to do with SS retirement benefits, & push the age up from currently 67 to 70 yo!

And also wanting to cut benefits to Medicare & to the ACA. All while at the same time, they also want to give big corporations & the wealthy huge tax cuts. But ugh, anyway, I digress, since that's starting to veer off-topic.

And you know what? Unless Trump gets in this year and abolishes elections, you’re likely to have another big, bitter, divisive, fate of democracy in the balance election  campaign going on all during the Olympics in 2028.

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5 hours ago, FYI said:

This statement seems so much like a catch-22. Because the IOC of course loves to see as much host city gov't support for a Games as possible. And Macron definitely showed that support throughout the lead-time of Paris 2024. As an outsider looking in, I thought that was a good thing.

Japanese PM at the time, also showed great support for Tokyo, even making a surprise appearance at the Tokyo 2020 handover in Rio 2016, dressed up as Super Mario. It's a sad state of affairs when some people are starting to dislike the Games simply because they don't like the current gov't that's in their host country. Again, making the distinction that "sports & politics shouldn't intertwine" laughable. I also have a feeling that come L.A. 2028 will also be used as a political tool here in the U.S., particularly from the anti-'woke' mob. 

Perhaps you should start another thread on the topic. Because I'm particularly curious on your disdain of Macron, especially since you don't like Le Pen either. Is it that you're just simply an independent (or a centrist) as we call those type of voters here in the U.S.?

But French roast is so good, though!! :D

I've always thought of the E.U. as more of an internal organization, much like the IOC or the U.N. rather than a policy making one that can directly & greatly effect it's members.

I've never been much of a political observer TBW (I also think many Americans, particularly the younger ones, are not as much in-tune with politics, especially when it comes to global affair, as our European counterparts), but ever since Chump came into the picture, I've become much more interested because some of the sh!t that's been going on within the last decade alone is absolutely ASSinine!! 

As Rol's noted a couple of weeks ago, those are all values that the far-right don't like anyway.

The political offer in France, and even in Europe, is really different from that in the United States. You talked about Joe Manchin; in the United States, we would say that he is in the center, leaning towards the right, in our country, we would say that he is on the right, leaning towards the extreme right. What you call the "left" in the United States, for us, is at best the center (if Biden was European no one would call him left-wing), and apart from Sanders/AOC, if we look at your political life with a European perspective, we can hardly say that the left exists in your country according to our standards. If I lived in the United States, I would probably be called a nasty communist (which will always make me laugh, because on the European left today there are really few people who advocate a "communist" political program).

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4 hours ago, Sir Rols said:

And you know what? Unless Trump gets in this year and abolishes elections, you’re likely to have another big, bitter, divisive, fate of democracy in the balance election  campaign going on all during the Olympics in 2028.

Ugh, heaven forbid. But I'm sure. L.A. 2028 would be dubbed the "woke" Olympics as I've mentioned before. I was surprised though when Paris 2024 was dubbed that first (the silly word traveled 'across the pond'). lol

3 hours ago, sebastien1214 said:

What you call the "left" in the United States, for us, is at best the center (if Biden was European no one would call him left-wing), and apart from Sanders/AOC, if we look at your political life with a European perspective, we can hardly say that the left exists in your country according to our standards. 

Oh, I agree with that. But try telling that to all the buffoons here who keep listening to a certain, deranged clown who keeps saying "the radical left". That the Dems here are nothing but socialist/communists trying to take people's rights away, when it reality, it's all total projection coming from the far-right here. 

It still astonishes sometimes, when some in the Latino community here (& particularly many of the Cubans), who have voted for exactly the type of thing which they claim they were escaping from, or that their parents were escaping from.

3 hours ago, sebastien1214 said:

If I lived in the United States, I would probably be called a nasty communist (which will always make me laugh, because on the European left today there are really few people who advocate a "communist" political program).

Not only a nasty communist/socialists (& yes, those certain 'Americans' really don't know what that exactly even means, other than to try to use it as an epithet these days towards things they don't like), but also call you "woke", a fascist & whatever other petty thing they can think of to denigrate you if you don't think or act like them, or accept whatever their orange deity says as gospel. 

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The official Paris 2024 video game has been released, Olympics Go! Paris 2024. Goodbye Mario and Sonic, it's a mobile game now: the IOC changed its strategy concerning video games, which are now just another way to promote the Olympic brand. So lower your expectations.

I tried the game 20 minutes. Graphics are bad, but I thought it would be even worse. Gameplay is bad too, with a special award to the shooting game where you have to aim, wait for the target to slowly reach the point you aimed at and then shoot, so hilarious.

Also, it's a mix between sports mini-games and a city builder: haven't you ever dreamed to build a fast-food stand in front of the Stade de France? And there are micropayments too, it's a mobile game after all.

At least, it's free, so you can give it a try.

Wait wait wait: there are Phryges in the game. Best game ever!

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