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Would you be saying this if it was Rome vs Toronto or Paris vs Toronto. Toronto has never hosted the Olympic Games obviously, so wouldn't that give the edge to them? And considering there hasn't been a North American summer Olympics this century and Europe has already hosted twice this century you can say it's North America's time too.

But seriously, are you guys aware that the rotatating system for the Olympics is not betwenn Europe, Oceania, Asia, Africa, the US and the rest of America? You do know that, right? I won't have this debate here over and over again, but to me, Rio 2016 counts as American Games. Yes, they will be held on the AMERICAN continent.

Oh and by the way, the US hosted in 2002, so...not in that century? ;)

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But seriously, are you guys aware that the rotatating system for the Olympics is not betwenn Europe, Oceania, Asia, Africa, the US and the rest of America? You do know that, right? I won't have this debate here over and over again, but to me, Rio 2016 counts as American Games. Yes, they will be held on the AMERICAN continent.

Oh and by the way, the US hosted in 2002, so...not in that century? ;)

There's no "system" for rotation. If there was, we wouldn't have wound up with 3 straight Olympics in Asia and be looking at a decade with no Olympics in Europe. Probably also wouldn't have seen an Olympics in Atlanta in 1996, now would we.

Rotation is an illusion. No question a continent that has hosted an Olympics more recently is less likely to get the next one. But it's never so simple than to presume that the country or the continent that has gone the longest without hosting an Olympics is automatically the favorite to get the next one. And yea, probably smart not to re-open 1 of the favorite debates of Gamesbids.. "Are North America and South America considered 1 continent."

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Well, they're all splashing around in the water; and you don't always know which head belongs to which torso.

That was my thought too. At least what I've seen on TV anyway, you really only mostly see bobbing heads above the water, and then only occasionally will you see an underwater shot, with headless bodies.

That's nothing. In fact, that's probably an imposition on the NBC-Universal's park operations. And I don't really see where they're going to try and fit that in the Universal/Burbank/Studio City area.

I also think this proposed IBC is part of/could be incorporated into NBC Universal's plan for their new west coast headquarters. NBC sold their studios in Burbank a number of years ago (in 2007, I think?) in order to move and consolidate all of their operations to one area, namely Universal City. When Conan O'Brien did The Tonight Show, he did it out of Universal City, not Burbank, and in 2014, LA's local KNBC-Channel 4 news studios moved from Burbank to the new Universal City location (news story: KNBC Channel 4 leaves Burbank; moves to new L.A. broadcast center).

Universal City is also actually unincorporated county territory, so I would imagine that permitting building demolition/building new structures might be somewhat easier than in an incorporated city, particularly a big city like Los Ángeles; fewer hoops to have to go through, in other words. But I could be wrong.

Edited by ejaycat
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But seriously, are you guys aware that the rotatating system for the Olympics is not betwenn Europe, Oceania, Asia, Africa, the US and the rest of America? You do know that, right? I won't have this debate here over and over again, but to me, Rio 2016 counts as American Games. Yes, they will be held on the AMERICAN continent.

Oh and by the way, the US hosted in 2002, so...not in that century? ;)

To me PyeongChang 2018, Tokyo 2020, and Beijing 2022 are all Eurasian games on the EURASIAN continent. Obviously, it's gonna be too soon for a France Olympiad to come so soon after after THREE CONSECUTIVE GAMES on the same geographic landmass. Might as well throw Africa in there too. Sorry, no Durban 2032. It'll all be too soon since they're on the AFROEURASIAN continent. Afroeurasia has already taken, like, what? Eight out of the 12 games so far this century? It's obviously LA's to lose this cycle.

/salty s

What I'm trying to say is that the idea rotation is too arbitrary and inconsistent at times (kinda like what Quaker said, I guess?). Ultimately, it's what the voters think is the best bid. If they're aching to go on vacation to Paris in the next decade, so be it. Not all voters will be analyzing and scrutinizing every single aspect of the bid just to determine whether or not it would be "too soon" to pick city A, or be "time for" city B -- there are too many different, and sometimes too little, things involved in their thought process sometimes. People, especially bid leaders, like to say "it's time" to themselves to drum up support and give themselves a sense of (sometimes flase?) confidence, motivation, and justification. At least that's what I think.

Universal City is also actually unincorporated county territory, so I would imagine that permitting building demolition/building new structures might be somewhat easier than in an incorporated city, particularly a big city like Los Ángeles; fewer hoops to have to go through, in other words. But I could be wrong.

I always thought it would've been harder? LA County handles a lot of unincorporated areas, and they're busy enough already. But I could be wrong also.

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Its rubbish like this which is why I refuse to renew my paid membership. Free forums have greater respect for their participants by actually moderating trolling behaviour.

On principle, I'm not paying money for an Internet forum like this one. And yes, I'll say it again that the moderators on this site need to do a better job of policing the site and keeping order. When they do nothing, it encourages the kind of discord that makes this a less than ideal place to be a part of.

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Its rubbish like this which is why I refuse to renew my paid membership. Free forums have greater respect for their participants by actually moderating trolling behaviour.

With all due respect - and I'll only post this here once because your post is also off-topic, there is a function to block posters whom you feel are trolls. Unfortunately Olympic bids as a topic is not mainstream enough to support a full-time forum business and we offer it as a mostly free service unless you need the extra features. We feel it is important to give a voice to people around this process so we continue to offer it. There are many here who have been here from the start 18 years ago and they manage to make it work. Many get great value from their participation here and also provide valued contributions. I hope you can find the balance you are looking for and take advantage of the tools we provide at no charge.

Also - many thanks to the dedicated volunteer moderators here who help keep this space free of spam! Housekeeping on a site like this is a very time-consuming task.

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Current venue plan for LA 2024.

12771841_10204335311021549_3395893019681LA2024

I don't know why I'm so intrigued with the archery event being held on Bunker Hill. Just for shits and giggles, I think I'll go to Bunker HIll and do a site survey of my own...

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LA2024

I don't know why I'm so intrigued with the archery event being held on Bunker Hill. Just for shits and giggles, I think I'll go to Bunker HIll and do a site survey of my own...

Do scope it out for us, ejay! Remember, it's got to be in some sort of "canyon" where winds and drafts are at a minimum. They couldn't mean inside Disney Hall, do they?? :lol:

The only spaces I can see around there that are possibly convertible are the empty parking lots (two blocks) on Hill and Broadway or Grand Park. I'd like to see the plans in how to hem it those spaces so they become an acceptable Archery venue. And I guess, just all temporary seating.

Edited by baron-pierreIV
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Its rubbish like this which is why I refuse to renew my paid membership. Free forums have greater respect for their participants by actually moderating trolling behaviour.

I think everyone's been doing a great job ignoring Team Flake's inanities. The taco posts are about the only appropriate response to a troll who's not very good at trolling anyway and makes Tony sound insightful.

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Still more important than what the USOC know, the IOC knows that alienating its strongest market might slap them in the face.

Los Angeles has lost seven times before and it did not stop them from bidding again, and again, and again. Why should this time be any different?

But of course ultimately the decision is the USOC's. It's quite possible that if LA loses 2024, the USOC might want to sit out the Summer Games and concentrate on going for a Winter Olympics.

The challenge is that the winter games facilities don't exist in most American regions. There are no ski jumping hills or speed skating rinks anywhere in Colorado, New England, or the Pacific Northwest. (Or at least according to Wikipedia.) So the only cheap option for a winter games is a return to Salt Lake City.

Beyond that, people in those three regions (New England, Colorado and the Pacific Northwest) are all vehemently opposed to corrupt sporting bodies. Boston just scrapped an Olympic bid. Seattle refused to build a new arena and thus lost its NBA team, and is currently planning on demolishing another arena to build a second opera house. Portland has not been very cooperative with its MLS team's stadium plans.

There's absolutely no chance that either Washington or Oregon will vote to cut down protected forest land to expand roads to Crystal Mountain or Mount Hood. And I suspect Denver sees things the same way, as it showed in 1976.

Edited by Nacre
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This plan for the Athletes' Village seems to imply that negotiations for conversion of the Piggyback Yard are going nowhere. That suggests LA would get relatively little of the "Olympic excuse for gentrification of a decaying area" effect.

When I first saw the plan to create an Olympic Village at the Piggyback Yards, my knee-jerk reaction was 'Oh wow! It would help revitalize the river and create new housing.' But then of course there was the issue of cleanup, the cost... And then the more I thought about it, I didn't like it anymore. If anyone's been in that area, it's very industrial, and a housing complex there would feel very isolated. The design essentially looks like a bunch of apartment buildings in a park; from an urban planning point of view, that seems like such an outdated model, basically suburban. I would prefer a neighborhood that engaged with and livened up its streets.

UCLA was planning on building more housing on campus anyway, so this fits in with the Olympic Village thing.

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There are 1920's buildings in Los Angeles, but city hall and the Columbia Building are the only large Art Deco buildings I can recall in LA. Art Deco is far more associated with New York.

You're kidding, right? Los Angeles has tons of examples of Art Deco and Streamline Moderne architecture. The Wiltern, Bullock's Wilshire, Union Station (a fusion of Spanish Revival and Art Deco, of course), Coca Cola Bottling Plant, buildings in the Miracle Mile District, Hollywood, the Sunset Tower...

With some of your comments in regards to LA, I feel like you don't really know about it.

IIRC from when I went there, UCLA's administration buildings are right in the middle of campus housing, for example, so they would presumably either have to relocate UCLA's administration staff for the summer or allow non-athletes into the village complex.

I could very well be wrong, though.

If you're referring to the Housing Administration office, yeah, that's located within campus housing, but if you're referring to the actual University administration building, that is clear on the other end of campus (Murphy Hall, I believe, is UCLA's admin building, or at least it contains undergraduate admissions and the registrar's office). UCLA's on-campus housing is actually perfect as an Olympic Village, being that it's in one corner of the campus, and is easily secured on its perimeter, unlike USC's on-campus housing, being that USC is in a more urban setting, and their dorms are practically near the city streets.

Here's a screen capture from the LA2024 bid of the UCLA dorms. It practically screams Olympic village, and it's adjacent to Drake Stadium, the tennis courts, and Pauley Pavilion is to the east, out of frame:

12034194_10204338001368806_7877014418570

As a former resident of the metro area who goes back there every year or two I think Los Angeles desperately needs housing, a more diversified economy and solutions to its water problems. It does not need more sports and entertainment.

LA definitely needs more housing, and it does need to address solutions to water source, but LA already has a very diversified economy, probably one of the more diverse economies of any large city in the US. LA is the largest manufacturing center west of the Mississippi--apparel being one of many things manufactured in LA. And people seem to forget that LA is also a big oil producer; it has the largest/busiest shipping container port in the nation (when you combine it with Long Beach); it has shrunk of course, but aerospace technology is still present here, healthcare industry is pretty big, as well as education. People seem to not realize that the LA metro area has a multitude of colleges and universities, public and private, and some pretty prestigious ones. And of course there's the entertainment industry, but it's actually a small fraction of LA's economy.

Here's an NPR article from last November: What Gets Made in LA is Way More Than Movies

I'm not being an LA booster, either. I'm just responding to your comments, which like I've said before, lead me to think that you actually don't really know a lot about Los Angeles.

Yourself being a "former resident of the metro area," where exactly did you live, and for how long, if I may ask?

Edited by ejaycat
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Do scope it out for us, ejay! Remember, it's got to be in some sort of "canyon" where winds and drafts are at a minimum. They couldn't mean inside Disney Hall, do they?? :lol:

The only spaces I can see around there that are possibly convertible are the empty parking lots (two blocks) on Hill and Broadway or Grand Park. I'd like to see the plans in how to hem it those spaces so they become an acceptable Archery venue. And I guess, just all temporary seating.

I went to Bunker Hill today, and... yeah, the only place I could think of to possibly hold Archery, was Grand Park...

12764438_10204338254255128_5194263824598

Photo by me

It would have to be at the lower tiers, though, of the park.

12764872_10204338263055348_1384429625456Photo by me

Of course the lowest tier would be right near City Hall, which incidentally would also be where the Marathon would start and end, according to the bid book. But I've imagined Grand Park to be a large gathering space for Olympic festivities, and not for a sport venue.

12419127_10204338269855518_6744765487582

Photo by me

Walked by the Broad Museum, too, just to see if there was still a line for it.

12715849_10204338146932445_3763358710501

Photo by me

There was.

12747356_10204338101691314_4044045224894

Photo by me

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i thought the giant alice-in-wonderland dining room was pretty cool.

I did too, as well as the building itself. I liked the cylindrical glass elevator.

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I am assuming that the archery venue will be the open lawn area that is part of the Grand Avenue Project. I can't see it being held anywhere else in that area.

I think swimming, water polo or even archery on drained days here...

ming hearst-castle-pool-area.jpg

Synchornized here ...

Hearst-Castle-indoor-roman-pool.jpg

I am thinking Bunker Hill is just a temporary designation -- until they find something more ideal. It's so weird to throw in an Archery arena there . Last time in '84, it was done in Long Beach. They're going to have to find something better than Archie Bunker Hill for archery. It'll be only for 3 or 4 days. Maybe combine it with the Shooting range??

Edited by baron-pierreIV
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I am thinking Bunker Hill is just a temporary designation -- until they find something more ideal. It's so weird to throw in an Archery arena there . Last time in '84, it was done in Long Beach. They're going to have to find something better than Archie Bunker Hill for archery. It'll be only for 3 or 4 days. Maybe combine it with the Shooting range??

Well, in the previous 2024 bid book, Archery was proposed at the Sepulveda Basin. I don't see why they couldn't keep it there; Bunker Hill seems so arbitrary to me. The only reasons I could think of was that it would be yet another event in the Downtown Cluster and Bunker Hill itself is public transit handy, with a Metro subway station (Civic Center Station) and another subway station (2nd Pl./Hope Street Station) under construction as part of Metro's Regional Connector project, which is being built behind the Broad Museum.

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I'm wondering if grand avenue itself could be used for archery.

Using Grand Ave. itself for archery was one of my first thoughts. I'm wondering though how spectators would be accommodated.

There is also that parking lot across from Disney Hall. Still, I think this one would be in Grand Park, though not all of Grand Park is on Bunker Hill.

Geez, I'm hoping that by 2024, those awful parking lots on Bunker Hill would already be developed into something else.

And when is Angels Flight gonna reopen?? They need to get that up and running again!!

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Well, in the previous 2024 bid book, Archery was proposed at the Sepulveda Basin. I don't see why they couldn't keep it there; Bunker Hill seems so arbitrary to me. The only reasons I could think of was that it would be yet another event in the Downtown Cluster and Bunker Hill itself is public transit handy, with a Metro subway station (Civic Center Station) and another subway station (2nd Pl./Hope Street Station) under construction as part of Metro's Regional Connector project, which is being built behind the Broad Museum.

They're obviously trying to place it at a site accessible by the new Metro system -- not some far out site like Sepulveda. That pretty much negates the pitch of the new LA. I think they might close that Grand Avenue stretch for a week; build the viewing stands on the 2 parking lots + one end; and voila!, you have a downtown venue, easily accessible by Metro and walking. And that's why they use "Bunker Hill" so as not to alarm the citizenry that it'll mean closing an Avenue for probably 2 weeks (building the stands).

It must be at some parking lot block that the city owns and is only leased temporarily by some parking company.

Edited by baron-pierreIV
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Is that the cement pond from the Clampett Estate?

No; that's from the Hearst Castle in San Simeon, or San Luis Obispo.

The BEV Hillbillies' estate (or at least the exterior) is actually a mansion in Pasadena -- not in BH.

And the other photo is the Neptune (indoor) pool at Hearst as well. The castle was Orson Welles' inspiration for Xanadu in CITIZEN KANE.

Edited by baron-pierreIV
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You know once they start putting seating around the archery venue and the spectators fill up those seats, wind won't be that big of a factor. Besides, there's no way to eliminate all of the wind coming in and out of the archery venue, unless you make it an indoor event. If you look at some footage from the last summer olympics you can clearly see the hair of the athletes blowing due to the wind.

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