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27 minutes ago, Rob. said:

and the media egged him on and gave him a platform despite a complete lack of evidence. Is this the "system" you believe in because it looks broken from here! Just give the man with the loudest voice and the most money a platform, **** fact checking!!

or gay people worried about religious liberty bills rearing their head again, or scientists being treated as suspicious - all of whom have REAL reasons to worry - to the Tea Party meltdown about a black "socialist" being in power is fucking insane. There is no way in good conscious anyone can compare this situation to 2008.

Rob, when certain key pieces of your post get omitted, like the ones above, when it's being quoted, then it becomes quite clear that it's really futile to have any type of "good conscious" discussion with said individual.

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So...anybody excited for Paris 2024? I mean this Muslim ban kind of just ended LA's shot. Kind of unprecedented for a nation trying to host the Olympics to ban travel from other Olympic member nations. See ya'll in Paris.

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19 minutes ago, FYI said:

Rob, when certain key pieces of your post get omitted, like the ones above, when it's being quoted, then it becomes quite clear that it's really futile to have any type of "good conscious" discussion with said individual.

To be fair I edited the post a couple of times after I wrote it. I think that's the reason the quoted post has less in it.

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12 minutes ago, mr.bernham said:

So...anybody excited for Paris 2024? I mean this Muslim ban kind of just ended LA's shot. Kind of unprecedented for a nation trying to host the Olympics to ban travel from other Olympic member nations. See ya'll in Paris.

Boy I was thinking that exact same thing. As a major LA2024 supporter I have to concede this is pretty much the death nail of our campaign. Our 1 glimmer of hope is if Le Pen wins the France Elections in May because she's basically the Trump of France and then it cancels 1 crazy for the next But come to think of it if that happens then Budapest starts to look plausible even though they had there own run in with the refugee crisis. 

Wow the 2024 race is not turning out as fun as I'd hoped it would. It's been hijacked by ego maniacs. Hopefully Trump can stay at home during the final presentation. We do not need him reminding voters why not to Vote for LA at a time we should be showing why they should be.

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2 minutes ago, alphamale86 said:

Our 1 glimmer of hope is if Le Pen wins the France Elections in May because she's basically the Trump of France

But Le Pen is a very smart women who happens to know constitutional laws. She wants to make France completely secular, indirectly targeting Muslims as they are the most visible with the hijab and Niqab while other religions are less obvious. She wants to be tougher on immigration but she would never ban Muslim countries specifically. So even if Le Pen wins, it won't harm Paris 2024

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3 minutes ago, Rob. said:

To be fair I edited the post a couple of times after I wrote it. I think that's the reason the quoted post has less in it.

I know you edited to include a portion at the very end of that post. But the parts I quoted were there before, but I digress.

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1 minute ago, Rob. said:

I can't remember...I type in a frenzy sometimes! :lol:

that's the steroids, you drug cheat.

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2 minutes ago, Rob. said:

I can't remember...I type in a frenzy sometimes! :lol:

I know. You have trouble remembering stuff sometimes, Mr. Burns. ;)

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1 minute ago, RuFF said:

Do you actually believe that's going to happen?  Or are you just sharing that for the appearance that the USOC and related entities are going to be proactive in making sure these restrictions (which yes, are temporary) don't restrict travel?  I have my doubts on this one.  US wrestlers are scheduled to compete in Iran next month.  Let's see how well that works out.

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7 minutes ago, RuFF said:

Looks like the ban will turn into a non issue for a 2024 games. Paris also capitalized on the ban, but it's a double edged sword that may come back to haunt them. 

How do you think it would come back to haunt them?  Certainly in comparison to how the ban itself would affect LA

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7 minutes ago, RuFF said:

Looks like the ban will turn into a non issue for a 2024 games. Paris also capitalized on the ban, but it's a double edged sword that may come back to haunt them. 

an old saying in French: "le mal est déja fait"

-Harm has already been done

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I seriously doubt that Le Pen will win the election. She might make it through the second round, like her dad did in 2002, but just like in 2002, the people of France will realize that there's 50% chance that an extremist might be president, and will make sure that this won't happen. I will, anyway. And even she is indeed elected president of France, she is NOTHING like Trump.

So you might be hoping that she wins so that LA gets a better chance a getting the games (and that is a terrible thing to wish), but I don't think it will happen. France is not the US.

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12 minutes ago, RuFF said:

"It's not over till it's over." "Crazier things have happened."

The world isn't the USA. With Trump showing no sign of slowing down, this is only the beginning and the world has a very long memory.

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^L.A.'s bid can be sinking like the Titanic, but as usual, tRuffmp will always try to put a spin on it like it's "no big deal". But not to fret, there's always 2028 to look to! :lol:

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31 minutes ago, RuFF said:

I genuinely believe that for an Olympic Games athletes would have expedited entry into the United States. There is precedent here. 

Also, the harm has already been done is an English phrase as well. So are these phrases. "It's not over till it's over." "Crazier things have happened." Etc.

Let's be fair here for a sec.. the current restrictions are temporary, so it's not like they'll still be in place come 2024.  The issue isn't simply that there is an executive order in place.  It's that you have a president leading this country that is making decisions (and will continue to do so) that make working with the United States a less than appealing option.  And like we've all said, that really sucks for LA because they're saying and doing everything they should through this campaign.  The case can be made that Trump is likely out of office by 2024 and that the US will be more welcoming by then.  Still, saying the damage has been done is more than just a phrase.  If you're holding onto hope because you believe anything can happen, that's understandable.  At the same time though, let's not pretend like Trump's actions haven't irreparably harmed US foreign relations at a time when LA needs the rest of the world to vote for them.  Pretty good chance all this (and whatever else is to come) is weighing on the minds of IOC voters as they make their decision.  For all of the unknown factors we could imagine that might influence then, this is very much a known and cannot be brushed aside.

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7 minutes ago, Quaker2001 said:

Let's be fair here for a sec.. the current restrictions are temporary, so it's not like they'll still be in place come 2024.  The issue isn't simply that there is an executive order in place.  It's that you have a president leading this country that is making decisions (and will continue to do so) that make working with the United States a less than appealing option.  And like we've all said, that really sucks for LA because they're saying and doing everything they should through this campaign.  The case can be made that Trump is likely out of office by 2024 and that the US will be more welcoming by then.  Still, saying the damage has been done is more than just a phrase.  If you're holding onto hope because you believe anything can happen, that's understandable.  At the same time though, let's not pretend like Trump's actions haven't irreparably harmed US foreign relations at a time when LA needs the rest of the world to vote for them.  Pretty good chance all this (and whatever else is to come) is weighing on the minds of IOC voters as they make their decision.  For all of the unknown factors we could imagine that might influence then, this is very much a known and cannot be brushed aside.

100% agree with this.

Even if Trump is unlikely to be president in 2024, there's still a chance he might still be in charge. If not, decision time will be during his current term and working with a nation with a very unpredictable (understatement) leader that could pull off more of these executive orders out of nowhere is very bad for business and a complete turn of for organizations like the IOC and FIFA. Government stability is a heavy criteria before awarding such an event.

As for foreign support:

  • his ban pissed of Africa & Chiite Middle-East and Africa
  • He poisoned the relationship with China who have their own support in the region
  • Mexico, which are supported by pretty much by everyone south of the US
  • His pissing match with Germany and the EU is really pointless (Which usually are the main source of support to counter balance the rest of the globe)
  • Dissing NATO?
  • American UN Ambassador threatening nations to take down their names if they don't support the US
  • Russia? Remains to be seen

That's a lot of pissed of people in just a few weeks...

Good luck repairing all those bridges and Trump doesn't even seem interested to do so regardless. LA2024 would need a miracle aka (lots of bribing) to pull that one off.

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3 minutes ago, RuFF said:

I can't disagree with that. But this story is still being written. France may very well join the United States in electing a leader who many would disagree with. On the idea of Le Pen succeeding alone responses have included that I am "hoping" for a fascist in the interest of LA 2024 to she's smarter than Trump. Instantly the spectrum is wide. Things aren't always as they appear.

Even with Le Pen having controversial ideas, she's light years from Trump. France is the total opposite of the USA.

5 minutes ago, RuFF said:

For many I see them thinking that they are just venting their frustrations and disdain for Trump, but to me I see a man who has become an international sensation.

How cute...Never cease to amaze me how some Americans are so delusional about how/what the world truly thinks of them. International sensation? Don't make us laugh. We're still shocked that he won the election. The world was laughing at the US for months and now that he's a loose cannon, we're not laughing anymore.  

9 minutes ago, RuFF said:

For days this thread has become Trump, Trump, Trump. During the election he dominated media coverage, and right now, perhaps nowhere in the world is an elected leader anywhere near the mentions that Trump has. I hear complaints for sure, but more than that I hear Trump, Trump, Trump. The very people who disapprove are directly responsible for his relevance.

The nutjob has his hands of thousands of nuclear warheads. It's not that we like caring about the US, we have no freaking choice to know who nuclear powers puts at the head of their governments and what they are up too. It's scary that a few fragile egos can end us all and there's nothing reassuring about Trump.

14 minutes ago, RuFF said:

Also, I'd warn Paris 2024 to not buy into this idea because this very card was delt during the 2012 bid cycle where a bid felt they had it in the bag, but didn't. For now it's unimportant. One can believe it's done and Paris' for 2024. It would be incredible disappointment if the opposite proved to be true. 

Tell me you aren't comparing London to LA :rolleyes:

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1 hour ago, RuFF said:

I genuinely believe that for an Olympic Games athletes would have expedited entry into the United States. There is precedent here. 

Also, the harm has already been done is an English phrase as well. So are these phrases. "It's not over till it's over." "Crazier things have happened." Etc.

 

Are you sure you're not Sean Spicer getting on here when Kellyanne isn't looking over your shoulder??   :blink:

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13 minutes ago, RuFF said:

I can't disagree with that. But this story is still being written. France may very well join the United States in electing a leader who many would disagree with. On the idea of Le Pen succeeding alone responses have included that I am "hoping" for a fascist in the interest of LA 2024 to she's smarter than Trump. Instantly the spectrum is wide. Things aren't always as they appear.

For many I see them thinking that they are just venting their frustrations and disdain for Trump, but to me I see a man who has become an international sensation. For days this thread has become Trump, Trump, Trump. During the election he dominated media coverage, and right now, perhaps nowhere in the world is an elected leader anywhere near the mentions that Trump has. I hear complaints for sure, but more than that I hear Trump, Trump, Trump. The very people who disapprove are directly responsible for his relevance. As stated, things aren't always as they appear, and for that reason I wouldn't feel confident in the concept that this spells the end of LA2024. Also, I'd warn Paris 2024 to not buy into this idea because this very card was delt during the 2012 bid cycle where a bid felt they had it in the bag, but didn't. For now it's unimportant. One can believe it's done and Paris' for 2024. It would be incredible disappointment if the opposite proved to be true. 

Maybe it doesn't spell doom, but even you through the rose-colored glasses can't deny that everything that is happening now (and will likely continue in the months before the vote) is having a damaging effect on LA2024.  Yea, Trump is getting all the headlines, but this is not a contest to get the most views or likes on social media.  This is very much negative attention and that's exactly what he wants.  For all the talk of a divided America, he seems content to feed into that to further his own agenda.  And that happens to be terrifying.  You can't minimize the impact of what is happening here and pretend like this is no big deal.  IMO, it's somewhat telling that you're looking at the French elections as a beacon of hope that *maybe* Trump's rule won't have as much of an effect on the 2024 bid as you want to think.

And I agree with Ansem's last point.. are you honestly trying to draw a comparison between this bid and 2012?  Because Paris's over-confidence cost them then so history might repeat itself?  Here's the difference though.. it was Paris that may have done themselves in last time.  It's their opponent that is making the missteps here and Paris may just need to sit back and enjoy the carnage.  Over-confidence is not going to hurt them here when their opponent is the one that is caught in a shitstorm.

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^Thats typical of any bid race - 2024 is not an anamoly in that regard, especially when technically speaking, both bids are competent. So something else has to give.

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11 minutes ago, RuFF said:

I'll pick up on this discussion in a few months. I'm not sure I have rose colored glasses on as much as I think I'm stating a lot of obvious that seems to be hidden behind the dooms day gloom glasses.

No.. you have rose colored glasses.  You're trying to spin this so that it doesn't look as bad for LA as almost everyone else else seems to think and you're even going so far as to project where France might be in a similar negative situation.  Calling Trump an international sensation is hardly whats hidden behind the doom and gloom, less your argument is to compare him to Putin since he got the Olympics for his country.

I won't go so far as some to say that LA's bid is dead and buried.  And yes, we're all reacting to this in the moment.  But again, it's next to impossible to avoid the negative implications, not just of what happened last week but what else may come down the line.

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