los angeles 2024

[JMarkSnow2012]

That's precisely my point. Democratic governments trying to buy up a huge area of land in an already dense city have to go through legal battles and seizures of property. Buying smaller parcels of land can be achieved with willing sellers at a lower cost.

But my point was that if you want to buy up a huge area of land for gentrification, an Olympic Games supplies a brilliant excuse for doing it on a compulsory basis. LA faced something of a paradox with the Piggyback Yard, though, because eminent domain has often been used to acquire land for railroad developments, so using it to acquire land FROM a railroad company gets really messy.

[Nacre]

But my point was that if you want to buy up a huge area of land for gentrification, an Olympic Games supplies a brilliant excuse for doing it on a compulsory basis. LA faced something of a paradox with the Piggyback Yard, though, because eminent domain has often been used to acquire land for railroad developments, so using it to acquire land FROM a railroad company gets really messy.

That is a circular argument, though.

1) We need to buy land through eminent domain so we can build an Olympic Park.

2) We need to build an Olympic Park so we have an excuse to use eminent domain to buy land.

That only makes sense if you want a high profile, massively expensive urban redevelopment program for its own sake.

Edited April 24, 2016 by Nacre

[JMarkSnow2012]

That is a circular argument, though.

1) We need to buy land through eminent domain so we can build an Olympic Park.

2) We need to build an Olympic Park so we have an excuse to use eminent domain to buy land.

That only makes sense if you want a high profile, massively expensive urban redevelopment program for its own sake.

But cities absolutely do want high profile, massively expensive urban redevelopment. A development on the scale seen in London's Docklands towards the end of the last century encourages further developments in the vicinity; another huge development a short distance away, concentrating on housing and creative/leisure industries, can complement Docklands and encourage similar gentrification of the gap between them.

Of course, this process paradoxically encourages the opposite of gentrification in neighbouring areas, because the necessary service industries need lots of low-cost labour on hand. Whether Tower Hamlets will reach favela level before it too is gentrified remains to be seen over the next few decades.

[JMarkSnow2012]

But cities absolutely do want high profile, massively expensive urban redevelopment. A development on the scale seen in London's Docklands towards the end of the last century encourages further developments in the vicinity; another huge development a short distance away, concentrating on housing and creative/leisure industries, can complement Docklands and encourage similar gentrification of the gap between them.

Of course, this process paradoxically encourages the opposite of gentrification in neighbouring areas, because the necessary service industries need lots of low-cost labour on hand. Whether Tower Hamlets will reach favela level before it too is gentrified remains to be seen over the next few decades.

What developers really really don't want is Chinese-style "nail houses"- and general commercial development simply does not, by itself, provide the excuse for compulsory purchase. You have to have something which allows the law to override the wishes of owners, and not many situations allow that- but Olympics do.

[Nacre]

But cities absolutely do want high profile, massively expensive urban redevelopment. A development on the scale seen in London's Docklands towards the end of the last century encourages further developments in the vicinity; another huge development a short distance away, concentrating on housing and creative/leisure industries, can complement Docklands and encourage similar gentrification of the gap between them.

There is little relationship between stadium construction and gentrification, though. Gentrification works because is addresses a fundamental issue of supply in excess of demand. If there is a large amount of demand for housing in a city like San Francisco, London, etc then cities can encourage development simply by changing zoning laws to enable highrises to be built profitably.

Meanwhile in cities that do NOT have strong demand for housing, building stadiums does little for further development.

https://www.google.com/maps/@33.5283936,-112.2646515,1449m/data=!3m1!1e3

I do not believe that politicians would push for an Olympic Park for the sake of gentrification. For one thing, the pol's existing constituents will simply get pushed out of the area by gentrification due to rent increases. That's what keeps Seattle from making zoning changes, anyway: minority groups complain that they won't be able to afford to live in the area if it is gentrified, so their representatives fight against it.

EDIT: Note that I didn't say that Seattle isn't being gentrified (it is) but rather that the city government is lukewarm towards it.

Edited April 28, 2016 by Nacre

[JMarkSnow2012]

There is little relationship between stadium construction and gentrification, though. Gentrification works because is addresses a fundamental issue of supply in excess of demand. If there is a large amount of demand for housing in a city like San Francisco, London, etc then cities can encourage development simply by changing zoning laws to enable highrises to be built profitably.

Meanwhile in cities that do NOT have strong demand for housing, building stadiums does little for further development.

https://www.google.com/maps/@33.5283936,-112.2646515,1449m/data=!3m1!1e3

I do not believe that politicians would push for an Olympic Park for the sake of gentrification. For one thing, the pol's existing constituents will simply get pushed out of the area by gentrification due to rent increases. That's what keeps Seattle from making zoning changes, anyway: minority groups complain that they won't be able to afford to live in the area if it is gentrified, so their representatives fight against it.

In the case of both the Lea Valley in London and the Piggyback Yard in LA, existing constituents are a non-issue. However, we're not just talking of re-zoning from industry to housing in these cases; gentrification goes much further than that, and it needs to create an upmarket infrastructure. In LA there's only one major property owner, so potentially it can be done without an Olympic excuse, but in London it was necessary to bring many different plots into the same ownership in order to impose the new infrastructure.

[TeamBlakeUSA]

Well We Look Forward For 2024.

[Quaker2001]

Alan Abrahmson blasts the USOC for holding the 100 days to Rio event in New York and not Los Angeles.

http://www.3wiresports.com/2016/04/27/memo-theres-la24-bid-going/

I'm not going to pretend to have an objective opinion on this one. I would have stopped by Times Square if I wasn't stuck at work all day that afternoon. Where in LA would they have held an event like this? Having it in Times Square means all sorts of passersby would take notice of it, whether they work in midtown or not. Much harder to get that in LA where far fewer people rely on public transportation and can simply show up at something like this. This whole story reeks of butthurt-itis. "Light up the top of the 73-story U.S. Bank Tower in downtown LA"? As if that's the equivalent of lighting up the Empire State Building? Come on, Alan! Tell us the USOC missed an opportunity to promote LA here, but don't twist this into something where New York City has less marquee value than you want to believe simply because LA is the bid city. And like you said, didn't get to be that way when the idiots at the USOC originally thought they wanted to pick Boston. That still says all you need to know about the USOC right there.

[baron-pierreIV]

Alan Abrahmson blasts the USOC for holding the 100 days to Rio event in New York and not Los Angeles.

http://www.3wiresports.com/2016/04/27/memo-theres-la24-bid-going/

What's he yapping about? The 1984 Torch Relay started at the United Nations in New York. Duh!!

The 1996 Torch Relay began at the Coliseum in LA. I forget where the 2002 Torch Relay began (too lazy to look it up), but I think it also began in New York. If and when LA gets 2024 or 2028, I wonder where they will start the Torch Relay -- in Salt Lake? I'd start it at the base of the Statue of Liberty; then take it by ferry to One World Trade, etc., etc.

Edited April 30, 2016 by baron-pierreIV

[TeamBlakeUSA]

I Think It Would Be Great To Have More Sponsorships For The Bid, Like Best Buy, Domino's, Disneyland Resort, Ford, Hewlett-Packard, Burger King And More.

[Quaker2001]

What's he yapping about? The 1984 Torch Relay started at the United Nations in New York. Duh!!

The 1996 Torch Relay began at the Coliseum in LA. I forget where the 2002 Torch Relay began (too lazy to look it up), but I think it also began in New York. If and when LA gets 2024 or 2028, I wonder where they will start the Torch Relay -- in Salt Lake? I'd start it at the base of the Statue of Liberty; then take it by ferry to One World Trade, etc., etc.

2002 relay started in Atlanta.

[baron-pierreIV]

2002 relay started in Atlanta.

Right. Which means that 24/28 could begin in Salt Lake, the last place the Flame burned. Boy that would be one circuitous route.

[Quaker2001]

Right. Which means that 24/28 could begin in Salt Lake, the last place the Flame burned. Boy that would be one circuitous route.

You mean like this one? ..

Starting from Salt Lake actually wouldn't be a bad jumping off point. Go south through Arizona, turn East, head through the gulf states, then go up the Eastern seaboard, through the Midwest, across the country towards the Northwest, then trek down the West coast. Most of the country is covered.

[FYI]

Lmfao "butthurt-itis". ::-D

[LatinXTC]

You mean like this one? ..

Starting from Salt Lake actually wouldn't be a bad jumping off point. Go south through Arizona, turn East, head through the gulf states, then go up the Eastern seaboard, through the Midwest, across the country towards the Northwest, then trek down the West coast. Most of the country is covered.

Wait when how many days before the the games being does the torch relay begin? I think it would be wise to start from south California, or Nevada and head east then loop around. The last thing you want is to be running in 100+ degree heat in Nevada, Arizona and New Mexico.

As well as Texas during the summer months leading up to a Summer Olympic games. And also heavily humid areas as well like Texas and the rest of the gulf states where the combination of 90+ degrees with 75+% humidity is probably worse than running through a desert in a dry heat.

[Quaker2001]

Lmfao "butthurt-itis". ::-D

Like I said, far be it from me to think I'm objective when I see someone dumping on New York like that. But my goodness, make the point and move on. No need to give us a laundry list of reasons that you're butthurt, particularly #5 talking about the US having their 100 days out event in New York instead of LA whereas France had theirs in Paris and not Lyon or Marseilles. That's the kind of thing someone here would say and would get chewed out for it.

[Quaker2001]

Wait when how many days before the the games being does the torch relay begin? I think it would be wise to start from south California, or Nevada and head east then loop around. The last thing you want is to be running in 100+ degree heat in Nevada, Arizona and New Mexico.

As well as Texas during the summer months leading up to a Summer Olympic games. And also heavily humid areas as well like Texas and the rest of the gulf states where the combination of 90+ degrees with 75+% humidity is probably worse than running through a desert in a dry heat.

Looks like it began in mid-April, so they got through the Southwest states before the brutal part of the summer.

[baron-pierreIV]

Looks like it began in mid-April, so they got through the Southwest states before the brutal part of the summer.

Right now, they do 95-100 day runs. And where there are stretches with no significant towns, vehicles carry the flame.

[TeamBlakeUSA]

2 Days Like In Brasilia.

[alphamale86]

After reading the article from Gamebids writer Robert Livingston about Paris and their day of the sun post. What struck me was Mr Livingston's point that Paris has not create a firm image for their bid as of yet. What are your thoughts on that point. I must admit in my ignorance of the Paris bid I just assumed that the front runner status was all encompassing of a strong bid plan and a strong marketing image. To those of you who are better informed of both bids, do you agree that Paris has yet to forge a strong bid identity or is LA winning the marketing race right now?

[baron-pierreIV]

Gee, Paris is Paris. BTW, Louis XIV did the "Sun" thing already 3 centuries ago. And they'll be using his grand chateau for Equestrian.

[Nacre]

What are your thoughts on that point. I must admit in my ignorance of the Paris bid I just assumed that the front runner status was all encompassing of a strong bid plan and a strong marketing image.

If you are asking which city has been more active in English-speaking media, then Los Angeles wins that category. It wins by default since Paris is a French-speaking city.

if you are asking which city has the better venue plan in the eyes of the IOC answer is neither, since both cities have existing venues scattered through the city rather than the Olympic Park so beloved by the IOC.

Edited May 7, 2016 by Nacre

[neige]

After reading the article from Gamebids writer Robert Livingston about Paris and their day of the sun post. What struck me was Mr Livingston's point that Paris has not create a firm image for their bid as of yet. What are your thoughts on that point. I must admit in my ignorance of the Paris bid I just assumed that the front runner status was all encompassing of a strong bid plan and a strong marketing image. To those of you who are better informed of both bids, do you agree that Paris has yet to forge a strong bid identity or is LA winning the marketing race right now?

here, it's a bit like: I still haven't found what I'm looking for....or ...wait and see...

http://sport24.lefigaro.fr/jeux-olympiques/jo-2024/actualites/lapasset-se-sentir-favori-serait-la-pire-des-choses-pour-paris-2024-798745

I've put some extracts in a translator (not sure the translation is so good...):

What will be the key to success, the French touch, if successful there?

We must find it. We did research on what can be worn as ideal. We want to strive for something French, strong and identifiable by the IOC as being consistent with its charter, its ambitions, its project. Each trading partner - we have already signed seven, one in four being signed, it will happen to fifteen expected shortly - will have a department in its own activity. It will bring its know-how in clean approach elements: sport and women, sport and the environment, sport and health ... The time of the Games, this is not the time of the IOC. The important thing for us is not whether we are happy with what we will do but whether the IOC will be in what we will offer to enroll in a sports culture for years to come . Not just the 17 days of competition of the Olympics and Paralympics 11. It is on permanent watch.

What state of mind are you?

There is no doubt. The team is young, vibrant strength, courage, conviction. We work for the widest possible vision. There is a permanent research. Remember the London bid. Sebastian Coe arrived six months before the vote. He made a film, Inspire a Generation, which swept everything. The IOC was working on how to install the Olympics in new countries, he worked on Rio, the British knew it, not us. The English made an extraordinary film, a boy in the trash who sees his dream scroll. We had the best record, the best expression of what should happen, the best financial guarantees, but the signal of the inheritance was not there. This is what we should look, what will be the legacy in 2024. But it is still too early to tell. Meanwhile, keep the driver and wire work. We need to be supported in everyday life, in tune with what expected by the IOC, but mostly not be in the position that would have almost finished the job. It ends only at the last second, when IOC members press the button of the vote. Feeling favorite would be the worst thing.

[neige]

Gee, Paris is Paris. BTW, Louis XIV did the "Sun" thing already 3 centuries ago. And they'll be using his grand chateau for Equestrian.

and his descendants have been beheaded for conficating such universal things!

[paul]

Parisians follow the sun since at least 1984.

Guerlain is one of the most iconic Parisian luxury brands ever, founded in 1828 and still going very strong. They have been renown for their fragrances and cosmetics for over 150 years. More recently they began chasing the sun with their legendary Terracotta bronzers.........developed by Guerlain in 1984! ........coincidence?

Edited May 7, 2016 by paul