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baron-pierreIV

Another reason to wait 8 yrs before awarding the medals

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Yet another victim/beneficiary of delayed IOC drug tests. Silver and bronze winners in Men's Shot put at (Athens) Olympia 2004 event ascend to gold and silver respectively after original 2004 winner, Yuri Bilonog of the Ukraine, was found to have been doped.

http://msn.foxsports.com/olympics/story/american-adam-nelson-gets-athens-2004-gold-shot-put-yuriy-bilonog-doping-053013

Interesting paragraph: "The Athens Games were already considered the dirtiest on record, producing 26 doping cases and catching six medalists — including two gold winners — at the time. The retroactive tests brought the number of Athens cases to 31, including 11 medal winners and three gold medalists."

Adam Nelson of the US, the new gold medal winner in this event, had stated in another article that he didn't want a newly minted 2004 medal; he wants an original one from 2004. But see how circuitous the route for re-awarding the medals to new winners have become:

1. ask for the old medal back.

What if the original winner does not want to give it back? What legal measures are in place in each respective country for that?

2. If returned (as in the case of Marion Jones), so the medals go back to Lausanne, do the new medalists wait until the old ones are re-engraved or does the IOC require a reserve of maybe 2 dozen medals from each Games; and then just gets from those?

It seems to be a waste of resources to mint a new medal when the event is correctly engraved in the old medal and all that needs to be done to correct it is...cover up the winner's name with the right metal again, and then just re-engrave the new name? Does anyone know if this is how it's done or can be done??

In the case of Jim Thorpe and that of Mohammed Ali, because of the passage of time (or unless the IOC had reserve medals), I think new medals had to be struck.

This siutation just seems to keep happening more and more.

Anyway, my point is, the IOC should NOT award the medals at the particular Games. They should wait 8 years after all their drug tests have been done and THEN award the medals. Therefore, no need to redo the medals or as in the case of Marion Jones' relay titles, only her name was stripped but her teammates kept their titles and medals. Whakindda cockeyed solution is that???

Edited by baron-pierreIV

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Or, the IOC should do away with the asenine processes of retroacively taking away medals.

Or that too. Or maybe make medals with a time-delayed self-destruct mechanism? :blink:

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Or, the IOC should do away with the asenine processes of retroacively taking away medals.

There is already an eight year status of limitation, which seems reasonable.

Though that didn't stop them from taking (but not re-alocating) Lance's Sydney 2000 medal, I guess.

Edited by Fox334

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So because of a couple of dopes, let's not award Olympic medals until 8 years after the fact? Given the source of this post, I know not to take it entirely seriously, but have some perspective here..

The IOC cares about removing doping from the Olympics. We know this. But even if you catch someone that long after the fact, I have no problem with them rewriting history. It's a little asinine for sure. I mean, we all know that Carl Lewis wasn't the first to cross the finish line in the 100 back in Seoul, but he has a gold medal. And that was a cheat that was caught quickly. Even still, you can't let someone get away with cheating. Even if it's years after the fact. That sends a bad message that just because some sort of statute of limitations has run out that you need to let results stand that shouldn't have. Cheaters will always do whatever they can to stay ahead of the curve and not get caught. If there's a means or technology to catch them after the fact, use it. Again, I know it's a little ridiculous to do that, but at least it sends a message to drug cheats that their actions won't be accepted.

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Well Lewis was most likely doping in 88 too. He just wasn't caught.

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Well Lewis was most likely doping in 88 too. He just wasn't caught.

Uhmmm..."most likely" does NOT stand up in any court...except in sharia or kangaroo commie courts. :rolleyes:

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Uhmmm..."most likely" does NOT stand up in any court...except in sharia or kangaroo commie courts. :rolleyes:

But it still makes him a cheat.

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Well Lewis was most likely doping in 88 too. He just wasn't caught.

Says someone from a country whose star WAS caught and shamed. But that's not the point, I just used that as an example of a very prominent doping case.

If they can prove an athlete was doping after the fact whether it's 8 days or 8 years, I have no problem with the IOC or the sport federations retroactively stripped him or her of the medal. There shouldn't be a massive witch hunt looking for something like that (although tell that to the folks that spent years chasing down Lance Armstrong), and it may or may not change how we recall history, but if you cheated and you get caught, you don't deserve to keep your medal.

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Says someone from a country whose star WAS caught and shamed. But that's not the point, I just used that as an example of a very prominent doping case.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Doping_at_the_Olympic_Games

A famous saying is "Don't through stones in glass houses!"

From that list the following countries have:

Russia 7 Bulgaria 7 United States 6 Hungary 4 Ukraine 3 Sweden 3 Belarus 3 Spain 2 North Korea 2 Germany 2 Uzbekistan 1 United Kingdom 1 Unified 1 Romania 1 Poland 1 Norway 1 Netherlands 1 Mongolia 1 Ireland 1 Greece 1 Finland 1 China 1 Canada 1 Bahrain 1 Armenia 1

I wouldn't be pointing the finger at any other country when mine was 3rd on the list!

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I wouldn't be pointing the finger at any other country when mine was 3rd on the list!

Ha! Even that list is ALL DOPED up! They left out the GDR - East Germany, the #1 Cheatingest nation of all. How quickly we forget!!!

And being on top is better than being 3rd from the BOTTOM! Always at the bottom...no matter which way the wind blows!! :lol::P (And remember, we are 10x bigger than u PLUS, we out our own -- even if they are a 7x wonder like Lance Armstrong. What say u to that? ;) )

Edited by baron-pierreIV

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Somebody steps on a line, leaves early, has their scores misscalcuated... once the games are over, they are over. You don't go back and review tapes years later. And you sure as heck don't bump up everybody one place... because they were probably breaking the rules too.

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8 years is a reasonable retroactive test--but award the medals during the Games themselves, obviously. Anything that stops athletes from cheating--which screws up the sport and their own health--is a good thing.

But this "oh noes ur country is teh cheats" stuff is just silly. Particularly since the athletes are reps of their NOC.

I just don't understand why anyone would want to be called "champion" when they know they've cheated to get there. Why not just go directly into finance, make buckets of money instead? ;)

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