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baron-pierreIV

Uh-oh. Riots in Istanbul not good...

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How is Istanbul 2020 going to deal with the "Erdogan problem" now?

Having him present to the IOC at large would probably go down like a lead balloon. But he's going to want to be there isn't he, presenting his nation's bid to the IOC? He doesn't strike me as someone who'll shirk the limelight.

A tricky one. He'll be noticed if he's there for all the wrong reasons which Istanbul 2020 won't want to drag up again. But he'll be noticed (perhaps even more) if he's absent.

He will show up behind a mask of either Dr. Oz, Kemal Ataturk or

animated_businessman_wearing_groucho_mar :lol:

Edited by baron-pierreIV

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I thought this was a very intriguing aside in the article:

...

I sense an incipient dilution in the apparent antipathy I have often felt in Olympic circles for the notion of hosting a Summer Games in the Gulf.

This may, in part, be a by-product of the courting of IOC members from the Gulf region - who include Kuwait's increasingly influential Sheikh Ahmad Al-Fahad Al-Sabah, the ANOC President - by candidates for the top job.

But I would be surprised if the new IOC leadership did not appear less hesitant than the present incumbents about the whole idea of a Gulf Olympics, perhaps as soon as 2024.

And if a Gulf Games is becoming a more attractive prospect, then why would you need to forestall it by voting for Istanbul?

...

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/\/\ I think the IOC will NOT go anywhere near the Gulf until:

1. there are more stable nations in the area; and

2. how 2022 will actually play out. Even that is still unresolved at this time.

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I don't think that aspect is neither here nor there. If the IOC were somehow "attracted" now for a Summer Games in the Gulf, then why did the IOC ditch Doha (& to a lesser extent, Baku) in favor of Istanbul. Istanbul offers so much more of the kind of host that the IOC has awarded lately in it's latest editions than anything any of the Gulf states could, & then some.



Not to mention all the other normal geopolitical factors, & who else might show up raising their hand for the 2024 Games.

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Statement regarding BBC reporters in Turkey

Date: 24.06.2013 Last updated: 24.06.2013 at 12.01
Category: Corporate

BBC Global News Director, Peter Horrocks, has issued the following statement.

The BBC is very concerned by the continued campaign of the Turkish authorities to discredit the BBC and intimidate its journalists.


A large number of threatening messages have been sent to one of our reporters, who was named and attacked on social media by the Mayor of Ankara for her coverage of the current protests.

The BBC and all its journalists are committed to providing impartial and independent journalism. It is unacceptable for our journalists to be directly targeted in this way. There are established procedures for making comments and complaints about BBC output and we call on the Turkish authorities to use these proper channels.

BBC Press Office

http://www.bbc.co.uk/mediacentre/statements/bbc-reporters-turkey.html

#provokatormelihgokcek

Edited by RobH

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Statement regarding BBC reporters in Turkey

Date: 24.06.2013 Last updated: 24.06.2013 at 12.01

Category: Corporate

BBC Global News Director, Peter Horrocks, has issued the following statement.

The BBC is very concerned by the continued campaign of the Turkish authorities to discredit the BBC and intimidate its journalists.

A large number of threatening messages have been sent to one of our reporters, who was named and attacked on social media by the Mayor of Ankara for her coverage of the current protests.

The BBC and all its journalists are committed to providing impartial and independent journalism. It is unacceptable for our journalists to be directly targeted in this way. There are established procedures for making comments and complaints about BBC output and we call on the Turkish authorities to use these proper channels.

BBC Press Office

http://www.bbc.co.uk/mediacentre/statements/bbc-reporters-turkey.html

#provokatormelihgokcek

This is very serious. It just keeps getting worse, doesn't it?

People have said that 2020 was Istanvul's best shot. If they can't win this race, will they ever win?

I think they will, but it may be a very, very long wait.

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This is very serious. It just keeps getting worse, doesn't it?

It's very strange that the Mayor thought this was the right thing to do. I mean, bullying journalists quietly and insidiously probably goes on all time in many countries, but for the MAYOR OF THE CAPITAL CITY OF TURKEY to start a Twitter campaign accusing a British journalist of being a spy and asking his followers to ostracise her is beyond dumb, and seriously damaging to Turkey's image. I really, really don't want to see Rogge shaking hands with anyone from this regime in a couple of month's time.

People have said that 2020 was Istanvul's best shot. If they can't win this race, will they ever win?

I think they will, but it may be a very, very long wait.

Yes, I think they will too, but I wouldn't like to give a timeframe as predicting these things is always tricky.

I don't think a country with a young, educated population who doesn't support this government is going to be on the wrong path for too long. And with every bid they put forward, the infrastructure on offer will get better and better. It's a bid that going forward can only get stronger in my opinion. The only question mark is whether they'll ever be in a position as favourites (or joint favourites) again, which they were in this race until recently.

Edited by RobH

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It seems many anti-Turks have flocked to this thread. Furthermore, some Europeans confuse Turkey's 2020 olympic games bid with the accession of Turkey to the European Union. I simply suggest them to recall Chinese victory for Olympic games 2008 and the democratic situtation in China in 2001 (or now).

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It seems many anti-Turks have flocked to this thread. Furthermore, some Europeans confuse Turkey's 2020 olympic games bid with the accession of Turkey to the European Union. I simply suggest them to recall Chinese victory for Olympic games 2008 and the democratic situtation in China in 2001 (or now).

You mean like Tiananmen square probably helped scotch Beijing's earlier bid for 2000.

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It seems many anti-Turks have flocked to this thread. Furthermore, some Europeans confuse Turkey's 2020 olympic games bid with the accession of Turkey to the European Union. I simply suggest them to recall Chinese victory for Olympic games 2008 and the democratic situtation in China in 2001 (or now).

I can speak for myself when I said Istanbul was my favorite in this race, but saying this public demostrations didn't affect the votes it sounds too naive. Let check again:

You can't compare China with Turkey in this instance:

a. Tiananmen public protests came in 1989, 12 years after the final decission

b. China is one of the top ten countries inside the IOC -Alongside powerful countries like USA, UK, France, Germany, Italy, Russia, Japan and Korea- with clear power and vote. Comparing with that, Turkey has a slim resume inside the IOC.

c.When China was choose it came with this logo - How can we forget 1/5 of the global population? With a growing middle class in the cities and political influence it means money, sponsors and legacy. I don't say Turkey can't offer some of that, but don't forget Japan in the equation. The third economy and the most dinamic city in Asia with clear markets in Asia and a good record in democracy index can help.

d. There's a strong possibility than Russia has a worse regime, but again, they have real power.

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It seems many anti-Turks have flocked to this thread. Furthermore, some Europeans confuse Turkey's 2020 olympic games bid with the accession of Turkey to the European Union. I simply suggest them to recall Chinese victory for Olympic games 2008 and the democratic situtation in China in 2001 (or now).

Anti-Turks, oh dear. Any criticism and you're a hater it seems. Please, you've got to do better than that. What's happened recently in Turkey isn't good, does raises questions over security, and if you think a journalist from the IOC's last host broadcaster being smeared by a senior politician is going to warm anyone to Turkey, think again.

You're right, the IOC has elected cities in worse countries. Doesn't mean we can't talk about these things though, and if we do doesn't mean we're "Anti-Turk"

Edited by RobH
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http://www.guardian.co.uk/technology/2013/jun/27/turkish-government-heads-twitter-showdown

The Turkish government is heading towards a showdown with Twitter after asking it to set up a "representative office" inside the country. The move could presage censorship of the microblogging service it has accused of helping stir weeks of anti-administration protests.

The government hinted that it might even ban communications using the service if it did not comply — as happened when it blocked Google's YouTube video site for two years until the search giant opened an office there last October.

While mainstream Turkish media largely ignored the protests during the early days of the unrest, social networking sites including Twitter and Facebook emerged as the main outlets for Turks opposed to the government.

But the Turkish transport and communications minister Binali Yildirim told reporters on Wednesday that without a corporate presence in the country, the Turkish government could not quickly reach Twitter officials with orders to take down content or with requests for user data.

"When information is requested, we want to see someone in Turkey who can provide this ... there needs to be an interlocutor we can put our grievance to and who can correct an error if there is one," Yildirim said. "We have told all social media that ... if you operate in Turkey you must comply with Turkish law."

Twitter declined to respond to the government request on Wednesday, but a person familiar with the company's thinking said it had no current plans to open an office in that country.

While Ankara had no problems with Facebook, which had been working with Turkish authorities for a while and had representatives inside Turkey, Yildirim said it had not seen a "positive approach" from Twitter after Turkey issued the "necessary warnings" to the site.

"Twitter will probably comply, too. Otherwise this is a situation that cannot be sustained," he said, without elaborating, although he stressed the aim was not to limit social media.

An official at the ministry, who asked not to be named, said the government had asked Twitter to reveal the identities of users who posted messages deemed insulting to the government or prime minister, or that flouted people's personal rights.

It was not immediately clear whether Twitter had responded. The company's general policy is to protect users' identities unless it receives binding decisions from a court; in the US it has fought against orders to reveal user details.

Facebook said in a statement that it had not provided user data to Turkish authorities in response to government requests over the protests and said it was concerned about proposals indicating that internetcompanies may have to provide data more frequently.

Scourge — or saviour?

In the midst of some of the country's worst political upheaval in years, the Turkish prime minister, Tayyip Erdogan, has described sites like Twitter as a "scourge," although senior members of his party are regular users. He has said such websites were used to spread lies about the government with the aim of terrorising society.

Police detained several dozen people suspected of inciting unrest on social media during the protests, according to local reports. Apparently in response to the crackdown, apps offering secure connections from Turkey through encrypted systems saw rapid growth in use during the protests.

Speaking at the Brookings Institution in Washington, Twitter's chief executive Dick Costolo said on Wednesday that he had been observing the developments in Turkey, but emphasised that Twitter had played a hands-off role in the political debate.

"We don't say, 'Well, if you believe this, you can't use our platform for that,'" Costolo said. "You can use our platform to say what you believe, and that's what the people of Turkey ... are using the platform for. The platform itself doesn't have any perspective on these things."

Turkey's interior minister had previously said the government was working on new regulations that would target so-called "provocateurs" on social media, but there have been few details on what the laws would entail.

One source with knowledge of the matter said the justice ministry had proposed a regulation whereby any Turk wishing to open a Twitter account would have to enter their national identification number, but this had been rejected by the transport ministry as being technically unfeasible.

Last year, Twitter introduced a feature called "Country Withheld Content"that allows it to block tweets considered illegal in a specific country from appearing in that country; it caused some concern among users, though the company emphasises that people trying to view the tweet would be told that it had been blocked, rather than it silently vanishing from its feed.

Twitter implemented the feature for the first time in October in response to a request by German authorities, blocking messages in Germany by a right-wing group banned by police.

Turkey said last year that it had won a long-running battle to persuade Google-owned YouTube to operate under a Turkish internet domain, giving Ankara more control over the video-sharing website and requiring the company to pay Turkish taxes. In October, Google opened an office in Istanbul.

Turkey banned the popular website for more than two years in 2008 after users posted videos the government deemed insulting to the republic's founder, Mustafa Kemal Ataturk.

Rights groups have long pressed Turkey to reform strict internet laws, while analysts have criticised the ease with which citizens and politicians can apply to have a website banned.

Turkey cites offences including child pornography and insulting Ataturk to justify blocking websites.

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It's a shame what's going on in Turkey, and Brazil is not helping either in this developing countries category. Anyway, as we are witnessing at the moment, Turkey's capability is high above all when the Sub-20 World Cup and the Mediterranean Games are being held at the same time with no major trouble. The Universiades in Izmir and Erzurum went smooth, however I do agree with some here, I wouldn't like the IOC shaking hands with people from this regime. And I don't think Turkish people want to. I guess Turkey's Olympic dream is fading away. There are priorities, and better to improve a country's democracy than spending a huge fortune in a 2-weeks-party.



I think I will save my Olympic trips until 2024 for a better choice (if South Africa hosts "the Games").

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You've gotta admit the issues being confronted by the Istanbul bid team are a complete game changer and make the campaign that much more difficult - however I'm still certain Istanbul has a solid chance, and will quite likely win, come September. The comparison with Beijing in 1993 bidding for 2000 after the events of 1989 are both relevant, but also not. Relevant because it is arguably what lost the event to the "safer" option of Sydney - and it is easy to see that Tokyo could very well end up the Sydney for the 2020 race - with Istanbul the the candidate sent off to fix itself up *yet again* for next time. However, it need to be remembered that these protests occurring in Turkey are under an immensely different political context, and the events themselves are not comparable - one being a large scale protest more comparable to France in 1968 and Beijing in 1989 seeing the deaths of thousands. It also needs to be remembered, in light of this, Sydney won by just 2 votes.

This is 20 years ago, but it also sheds light on the unpredictability of this race. For me, I still think Istanbul is deserving of 2020, but it depends on how the nation and bid postures itself in the lead up to September. Failing that, I think (however boring it might be) 2020 would then clearly belong to Tokyo. My real concern (as outlined by others) is that Madrid might actually win on some absurd freak of voting - that could see Istanbul or Tokyo eliminated first - and event which, in my opinion, would be a disgrace - particularly if it were to occur to Tokyo.

Edited by runningrings

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nothing change about olympic hunger of people here. we r protesting the government and somehow it goes on smoothly.

but non of the protesters says no to olympics in ıstanbul just the cause of the government. its a national priority and everybody supports it

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