Athensfan Posted May 14, 2013 Report Share Posted May 14, 2013 But how different is that from Hollywood musicals where non-singing actors were dubbed with the more polished voices? Whereas that practice too, has changed in recent years, still...it's an accepted industry practice. And I don't think the Beijing organizers owed the original girl any obligations. Her original contract might have been just for the voice, with no promise of "face-time," so, in effect, Yimou & crew were NOT doing anything illegal. As far as a moral duty, they could've shown the faces of the VIPs and the crowd while the singing was going on instead...so I don't really see the problem. It is a visual medium, you have to present pleasing faces. Who wants to see an ogre with a gorgeous voice?? It's not an accepted industry practice though. I'm sure you've seen "Singing in the Rain." It's been many decades since Hollywood thought it was acceptable to mix one person's voice with another's body. People complained enormously about "My Fair Lady" and that was back in 1964. Sure people do voiceover work for animated films and CGI, but that's a totally different ballgame. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baron-pierreIV Posted May 14, 2013 Report Share Posted May 14, 2013 I think you already know the answer to that! That's kinda petty and a low-blow. I kinda thought u would bring it up. Obviously, you can't tell the difference between unknown people who want to make a name for themselves with a talent they have ...and a COMMISSIONED work as the Beijing opening where the producers control all the levers. I hope the sight of Susan Boyle before haunts you in your sleep!! It's not an accepted industry practice though. I'm sure you've seen "Singing in the Rain." It's been many decades since Hollywood thought it was acceptable to mix one person's voice with another's body. People complained enormously about "My Fair Lady" and that was back in 1964. Sure people do voiceover work for animated films and CGI, but that's a totally different ballgame. If it's a very complicated, one-time only major, global performance, like Olympic ceremonies, presidential inaugurations, I believe it is still the preferred practice. You resolve so many logistical and artistic challenges by doing it that way. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athensfan Posted May 15, 2013 Report Share Posted May 15, 2013 If it's a very complicated, one-time only major, global performance, like Olympic ceremonies, presidential inaugurations, I believe it is still the preferred practice. You resolve so many logistical and artistic challenges by doing it that way. Please take another look at my post. I'm not talking about lip-synching in general. I'm talking about putting one person's voice with another person's body. Apart from Beijing, I don't see that happening in other "one-time only major, global performances, like Olympic ceremonies, presidential inaugurations." You really do not "resolve logistical and artistic challenges" by putting one voice with another body. Having an artist lip-synch to their own voice is a completely different matter and one I already said I understand. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baron-pierreIV Posted May 15, 2013 Report Share Posted May 15, 2013 Please take another look at my post. I'm not talking about lip-synching in general. I'm talking about putting one person's voice with another person's body. Apart from Beijing, I don't see that happening in other "one-time only major, global performances, like Olympic ceremonies, presidential inaugurations." You really do not "resolve logistical and artistic challenges" by putting one voice with another body. Having an artist lip-synch to their own voice is a completely different matter and one I already said I understand. I understand that...but I am talking about lip-synching by the same person. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athensfan Posted May 15, 2013 Report Share Posted May 15, 2013 I understand that...but I am talking about lip-synching by the same person. I know, but you already made that point and I already agreed with you so I'm not sure why you're repeating it in response to my concern about one person's body and another's voice. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMarkSnow2012 Posted May 15, 2013 Report Share Posted May 15, 2013 @baron-pierreIV: "Obviously, you can't tell the difference between unknown people who want to make a name for themselves with a talent they have ...and a COMMISSIONED work as the Beijing opening where the producers control all the levers."OK, you asked for it: @baron-pierreIV: "I am talking about lip-synching by the same person. "Yes you are, in a discussion about lip-synching, in Beijing 2008, by a different person. Even in films, which routinely use doubles for dangerous or difficult physical actions, it's always been a controversial practice Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baron-pierreIV Posted May 15, 2013 Report Share Posted May 15, 2013 (edited) /\/\ @jmark...so what's your point?? Susan is a celebrity of her own making in her own right, whether you like her face or not. How stupid do you think it would be for any producer to attach her voice to someone else's countenance? The original little girl in Beijing was a TOTAL unknown. She had no clout and the show wasn't built around this mysterious, little voice. Without looking it up, do you even know her name? So I still don't get your point. And do you know the voice behind Jeremy Brett here? Edited May 15, 2013 by baron-pierreIV Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
illustrado Posted May 15, 2013 Report Share Posted May 15, 2013 ^ the whole thing like milli vanilli fiasco. the original girl had the vocal and another girl lip-sync to it. the other girl got the fame and the original girl got nothing. i know lip-synching is a common industry practice. but there is a difference between lip-synching to your own locals because you are saving your voice or you have a sore trough and can't actually sing; and lip-synching to someones vocals and claming it as your own. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMarkSnow2012 Posted May 15, 2013 Report Share Posted May 15, 2013 @baron-pierreIV: "@jmark...so what's your point??"My point, if you'll cast your mind back a day or so, was to hint that the answer to your question "Who wants to see an ogre with a gorgeous voice??" is, in Britain, America etc., "Rather a high percentage of the population, actually". I was not attempting, in posting those videos, to address the principal issue- the legitimacy of dubbing one singer with another's voice. I did, however, mention in the second part of my last posting, that "Even in films, which routinely use doubles for dangerous or difficult physical actions, it's always been a controversial practice". As Athensfan pointed out, that was definitely the case with "My Fair Lady" (incidentally, I only know who dubbed Jeremy Brett because I watched the video in its original YouTube page). I sort of accepted it for Darth Vader in the original "Star Wars" trilogy, but only because he wore that mask (using Dave Prowse's own voice would have been very interesting though, as Bill Bailey once demonstrated). Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baron-pierreIV Posted May 15, 2013 Report Share Posted May 15, 2013 @baron-pierreIV: "@jmark...so what's your point??" My point, if you'll cast your mind back a day or so, was to hint that the answer to your question "Who wants to see an ogre with a gorgeous voice??" is, in Britain, America etc., "Rather a high percentage of the population, actually". But the point is people are paying to HEAR a gorgeous voice such as Susan's; and it comes along with whatever face it has. Plus, listening to a CD or sitting in a concert hall, you DON'T have to have her (or any other performer's face in front of you!) all the time. It is a known voice AND face...and you take them TOGETHER. The little girl is Beijing is/was a COMPLETE unknown. So, it's not like they said: TONIGHT - HIghlight of the Opening Ceremony -- nice voice of UNKNOWN LITTLE CHinese Girl!! Nope. The National anthem was just one little cog of the WHOLE evening...whose main sell was the Opening Ceremony of the Event to follow known as the XXIXth SUmmer Olympics. Even Sarah Brightman was just an asterisk to the show. And she is an internationally known artist. The Bill did NOT say "Tonight - the Opening of the XXIXth Olympiad with Sarah Brightman as the main star." Then, it would've been awfully wrong if they used someone else' voice for her to sing to; or put in a fake double using her voice -- neither of which she would've allowed. So, I still don't get the upset over a total UNKNOWN?? The complaints really are meritless in the particular case and I guess, for the PC quarters from whom it came from, had a particularly slow night and found nothing else to complain about and bitch other than that issue. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olympian2004 Posted May 15, 2013 Author Report Share Posted May 15, 2013 May I remind you that the topic here are ceremonial glitches - and that we already established that the lip-synching at Beijing's OC was not a glitch? Thank you. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baron-pierreIV Posted May 15, 2013 Report Share Posted May 15, 2013 Ehhhh....so we DRIFT off to a tangent topic. We always do that IN ALL these threads. There is NO hard and fast rule that confines us strictly to the confines of the topic. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olympian2004 Posted May 16, 2013 Author Report Share Posted May 16, 2013 I'm just saying that it can become tiresome if you expect any new comments about glitches and then find more than two pages about such a tangent subject (a subject, by the way, that we have discussed before and that actually adds nothing new to the debate). I don't oppose drifting off to another topic generally - but it's always good to find a close and then return to the original subject, also out of respect towards readers who are interested in that original subject. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baron-pierreIV Posted May 16, 2013 Report Share Posted May 16, 2013 OH pls, Fab, spare me the lectures. As they say, if you don't want to see it, IGNORE it or move on to the next post or subject. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olympian2004 Posted May 16, 2013 Author Report Share Posted May 16, 2013 OH pls, Fab, spare me the lectures. As they say, if you don't want to see it, IGNORE it or move on to the next post or subject. Frankly, Baron, shut up. I'm fed up with you constantly talking down to people recently, even if they only ask politely for a favour in the interest also of other users (not only of me personally). Seriously, what's wrong with you recently? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baron-pierreIV Posted May 16, 2013 Report Share Posted May 16, 2013 I'm NOT GOING TO shut up just because u say so. Y DON'T YOU SHUT UP for a change??? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olympian2004 Posted May 16, 2013 Author Report Share Posted May 16, 2013 Welcome to kindergarten. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baron-pierreIV Posted May 16, 2013 Report Share Posted May 16, 2013 Welcome to kindergarten. well, u would know, wouldn't you? After all, it is a German term.. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMarkSnow2012 Posted May 16, 2013 Report Share Posted May 16, 2013 OK, I'll get back on topic. But just to show that I'm reluctant, I'M GOING TO TYPE IN CAPITALS.THE BIGGEST GLITCH OF THE LONDON 2012 OPENING WAS THE CUE MISTAKE WHICH MEANT THAT VIEWERS DIDN'T SEE JUNE'S SISTER ABI RECEIVING FRANKIE'S CALL (FROM JUNE'S LOST PHONE) ON HER PHONE AND HANDING IT OVER TO JUNE.ouch, i'll stop it now. the bbc dvd version includes the missed section, which in the live performance was taking place at the same time as frankie's speech bubbles were being shown. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athensfan Posted May 17, 2013 Report Share Posted May 17, 2013 OK, I'll get back on topic. But just to show that I'm reluctant, I'M GOING TO TYPE IN CAPITALS. THE BIGGEST GLITCH OF THE LONDON 2012 OPENING WAS THE CUE MISTAKE WHICH MEANT THAT VIEWERS DIDN'T SEE JUNE'S SISTER ABI RECEIVING FRANKIE'S CALL (FROM JUNE'S LOST PHONE) ON HER PHONE AND HANDING IT OVER TO JUNE. ouch, i'll stop it now. the bbc dvd version includes the missed section, which in the live performance was taking place at the same time as frankie's speech bubbles were being shown. I thought the whole Frankie and June segment was a glitch..... 1 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMarkSnow2012 Posted May 17, 2013 Report Share Posted May 17, 2013 I thought the whole Frankie and June segment was a glitch..... Wot? Dizzee Rascal was miming to his own voice, not Jessie J's. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athensfan Posted May 17, 2013 Report Share Posted May 17, 2013 Wot? Dizzee Rascal was miming to his own voice, not Jessie J's. I'm not talking about lip-synching. I was kidding. Let's just say Frankie and June was not my favorite... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baron-pierreIV Posted May 17, 2013 Report Share Posted May 17, 2013 watch his lips, Jmark. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
JMarkSnow2012 Posted May 18, 2013 Report Share Posted May 18, 2013 Athensfan, have you got a webcam? Baron-pierreIV says I've got to watch your lips. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baron-pierreIV Posted July 25, 2013 Report Share Posted July 25, 2013 (edited) Found another one... At 2:08, look lower right hand corner of the screen...a volunteer is picking up horse mierde with his BARE hands!! Yuck!! And then the camera realizing it had 'picked up' an awkward moment, abruptly cuts to another shot. The guy could've at least used gloves!! For shame, Ric Birch! For shame!!! Edited July 25, 2013 by baron-pierreIV 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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