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No not correct in fact since I have every bid document and final reports from every Olympics to date.

Premature? they were told to remove it.

Farmers - cancelled, LA River not funded and mostly tabled... Where are all your amounts for these projects listed since thats what you're asking for from Boston private pre-approved projects. LA has not even released an estimated operating budget.

And that is the function of Franklin Park LOL

And Google Search is the last thing I would ever do for a resource here. If you Google Boston Bid Books you can find at least 10 by individuals

Really? Do you have the LA 1976 bid book and Madrid 1972? I would love to see them.

To go on to your other points none of those have been canceled and the Olympics would only ramp up their construction. You would also know that their renderings are far superior to Bostons (ATM). And if you do google you will find many of the renderings from the LA plan which all provide links to the sources. Google itself is not a source, but a tool to find information.

For the hell of it here are some of the renders:

la2024logo.png

2024-olympic-bid-p12_0001.jpg

Los-Angeles-Olympics-2024.png

Screen%20Shot%202014-05-02%20at%208.28.2

2870203.png

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Boston, Massachusetts is taking the first big steps towards looking into the feasibility of a Summer Games bid for the earliest year 2024. On Thursday, January 10, 2013, the MA State Senate file a Re

Oslo was an abortion - Boston is a miscarriage.

We prefer "Masshole" to "total douche".

Really? Do you have the LA 1976 bid book and Madrid 1972? I would love to see them.

To go on to your other points none of those have been canceled and the Olympics would only ramp up their construction. You would also know that their renderings are far superior to Bostons (ATM). And if you do google you will find many of the renderings from the LA plan which all provide links to the sources. Google itself is not a source, but a tool to find information.

For the hell of it here are some of the renders:

la2024logo.png

2024-olympic-bid-p12_0001.jpg

Los-Angeles-Olympics-2024.png

Screen%20Shot%202014-05-02%20at%208.28.2

2870203.png

Yes I do infact... go buy them you can have them too if you can find them :-)...

And I don't need to google anything I already have them like I said... Nobody cares about random renderings of a remodel and yes all of their venues are built because none of them are designed for sports.. .We can go put our Taekwondo in Symphony Hall..

What's amusing is I never compared either city, I never said Bostons choices were better and I never said LA's were worse.

This group goes silent for weeks and then I post facts and announcements and then you automatically start attacking me personally, and everything you have said in here about boston you have said verbatim about LA in their thread.

Cool they have to build a new Airport to accommodate the Olympics, Boston's is already done. Cool they have to build an entire Public Transportation System from scratch, ours only needs to be upgraded which is already planned... That is comparing something I haven't done.

Rather then coming after me for posting actual facts attack the ignorant people who don't even know what the bids are. Like nacre who just said Boston has to tear down the city and build or have their Stadium at Gillette which has never been in the bid just the media. Or the whootsuite who accused Boston of being inexperienced and sketchy for not releasing a public bid book when LA released theirs before they were even short listed, half the projects have lost support since and were asked by the USOC to remove all bid books and renderings from online because none of the 4 cities were supposed to publish them yet.

There is not one file, pdf, photo that you have and I need. Guaranteed, hate all you want I havent been some upbeat BOSTON BOSTON person or everyone else sucks kinda guy so continue to ignore the facts and attack me instead of responding to the actual topic of conversation, it's par for the course on this thread since day one.

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Yes I do infact... go buy them you can have them too if you can find them :-)...

And I don't need to google anything I already have them like I said... Nobody cares about random renderings of a remodel and yes all of their venues are built because none of them are designed for sports.. .We can go put our Taekwondo in Symphony Hall..

What's amusing is I never compared either city, I never said Bostons choices were better and I never said LA's were worse.

This group goes silent for weeks and then I post facts and announcements and then you automatically start attacking me personally, and everything you have said in here about boston you have said verbatim about LA in their thread.

Cool they have to build a new Airport to accommodate the Olympics, Boston's is already done. Cool they have to build an entire Public Transportation System from scratch, ours only needs to be upgraded which is already planned... That is comparing something I haven't done.

Rather then coming after me for posting actual facts attack the ignorant people who don't even know what the bids are. Like nacre who just said Boston has to tear down the city and build or have their Stadium at Gillette which has never been in the bid just the media. Or the whootsuite who accused Boston of being inexperienced and sketchy for not releasing a public bid book when LA released theirs before they were even short listed, half the projects have lost support since and were asked by the USOC to remove all bid books and renderings from online because none of the 4 cities were supposed to publish them yet.

There is not one file, pdf, photo that you have and I need. Guaranteed, hate all you want I havent been some upbeat BOSTON BOSTON person or everyone else sucks kinda guy so continue to ignore the facts and attack me instead of responding to the actual topic of conversation, it's par for the course on this thread since day one.

I hope you know that wasn't serious...

I was using your "no released budged plan" (against LA) against you by using the LA's file against Boston to show just how ridiculous it is to base viability off of released information in a very private race.

and LA isn't building transit directly from scratch. A: They have one already that is about 80 miles long, and B: The Pacific Electric Railroad was the Metro's predecessor (and the red and blue line follow almost the exact same route). You seem to be heavily reliant on Bostons expanding MBTA as a positive benefit for Boston, I was just pointing out that on the other site of the country, the same thing is happening. LA's getting new cars, several new lines/extentions are underway/finished, and even in LA's document, it says 100+ miles of transit will be available by the time 2024 rolls around. THe Metro is expanding, not building from scratch

Also, LAX is not getting rebuilt/built (I'm not sure what you mean by 'have to build'), it is going through heavy modernization (not will go through), and even getting a shiny new APM (and a whole bunch of other facilities like a designated rental car facility and ITF) to even make the transfer even more seamless. (and to counter your post about Boston's remodeled airport, other, smaller airports [ONT, John Wayne] are finished with their upgrades). The TBIT is handling a whole bunch of a380's daily.

On the subject of the "fairytale venues", let me just put it this way: it's keeping up with the bid's narrative and theme. They are showcasing LA's beauty, diversity, innovation, and positive change by hosting these events in iconic locations to create a unique environment. To showcase the modernness of LA, but still keeping up with it's history. Utilizing the forward notion by joining the LA Riiver and improved transit (including pedestrians and bikers) with the Olympics. and I guess Boston is doing that too, they certainly are seeking to create a transit and walking Olympiad, which is kinda exciting tbh.

And really, we aren't attacking you because of the announcement. You're just the messenger. However, you did make some comments that certainly caused buzz among the crowd

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Yes I do infact... go buy them you can have them too if you can find them :-)...

And I don't need to google anything I already have them like I said... Nobody cares about random renderings of a remodel and yes all of their venues are built because none of them are designed for sports.. .We can go put our Taekwondo in Symphony Hall..

What's amusing is I never compared either city, I never said Bostons choices were better and I never said LA's were worse.

This group goes silent for weeks and then I post facts and announcements and then you automatically start attacking me personally, and everything you have said in here about boston you have said verbatim about LA in their thread.

Cool they have to build a new Airport to accommodate the Olympics, Boston's is already done. Cool they have to build an entire Public Transportation System from scratch, ours only needs to be upgraded which is already planned... That is comparing something I haven't done.

Rather then coming after me for posting actual facts attack the ignorant people who don't even know what the bids are. Like nacre who just said Boston has to tear down the city and build or have their Stadium at Gillette which has never been in the bid just the media. Or the whootsuite who accused Boston of being inexperienced and sketchy for not releasing a public bid book when LA released theirs before they were even short listed, half the projects have lost support since and were asked by the USOC to remove all bid books and renderings from online because none of the 4 cities were supposed to publish them yet.

There is not one file, pdf, photo that you have and I need. Guaranteed, hate all you want I havent been some upbeat BOSTON BOSTON person or everyone else sucks kinda guy so continue to ignore the facts and attack me instead of responding to the actual topic of conversation, it's par for the course on this thread since day one.

What about Salt Lake City 1972 do you have that one?

The people who care are the USOC, go look at Chicago and LA 2016 and tell me renderings did not show a difference between the effort either city was willing to put forth. Now going on to specifics Los Angles has more venues then Boston that are sports specific, many of the other sporting venues are either under construction now or will be temporary and utilize existing and iconic structures. Los Angeles' airport renovation has been on going and the bid does not propose massive expansions, only slight adjustments because by 2024 LAX will have already experienced the expansions necessary. To compare or even say that Boston has a more 'Olympic ready' airport then LA is a ridiculous statement, Boston may be a big and might I add gorgeous city but LAX is one of the nations top airports ranking close to Atlanta. LA's transportation system also already exists, it is only undergoing expansions of which will be done regardless of the outcome of the event.

We never attacked you, but the bid. The problem is that you view Boston as the best city in the world and expect us to not scrutinize it in the same way we do every single bid. It has been said many times the Gamesbids probably picks apart any bid more then the NOC's or IOC. You have chosen to take our critiques on the bid personally. And if this makes you feel better, you are not the first person here to annoy others. I know for a fact that I have annoyed others (and probably still do) so do not take that as a hash out on you.

I also would not call you the 'savior of this thread', by all means this thread is pointless given there is a USA 2024 thread already existing. By all means your comments have shown that for the most part you have been troubled with accepting the faults and inconsistencies within the bid and its team.

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What about Salt Lake City 1972 do you have that one?

The people who care are the USOC, go look at Chicago and LA 2016 and tell me renderings did not show a difference between the effort either city was willing to put forth. Now going on to specifics Los Angles has more venues then Boston that are sports specific, many of the other sporting venues are either under construction now or will be temporary and utilize existing and iconic structures. Los Angeles' airport renovation has been on going and the bid does not propose massive expansions, only slight adjustments because by 2024 LAX will have already experienced the expansions necessary. To compare or even say that Boston has a more 'Olympic ready' airport then LA is a ridiculous statement, Boston may be a big and might I add gorgeous city but LAX is one of the nations top airports ranking close to Atlanta. LA's transportation system also already exists, it is only undergoing expansions of which will be done regardless of the outcome of the event.

We never attacked you, but the bid. The problem is that you view Boston as the best city in the world and expect us to not scrutinize it in the same way we do every single bid. It has been said many times the Gamesbids probably picks apart any bid more then the NOC's or IOC. You have chosen to take our critiques on the bid personally. And if this makes you feel better, you are not the first person here to annoy others. I know for a fact that I have annoyed others (and probably still do) so do not take that as a hash out on you.

I also would not call you the 'savior of this thread', by all means this thread is pointless given there is a USA 2024 thread already existing. By all means your comments have shown that for the most part you have been troubled with accepting the faults and inconsistencies within the bid and its team.

See it's constant you take what I write, pull it apart, add things and completely make up everything I say... Never have I put forth that boston is the best or better then anyone else.. EVER.

And I am not even commenting on the rest because you changed the context of everything I said and I am done defending things I never said...

Continue the banter about nothing and making assumptions & accusations about things that have been explained in plain english like where the money for this Boston bid is coming from.

See it's constant you take what I write, pull it apart, add things and completely make up everything I say... Never have I put forth that boston is the best or better then anyone else.. EVER.

And I am not even commenting on the rest because you changed the context of everything I said and I am done defending things I never said...

Continue the banter about nothing and making assumptions & accusations about things that have been explained in plain english like where the money for this Boston bid is coming from.

Any and every time I have ever taken something personally is something you said directly about me, not about the bid. Period.

See it's constant you take what I write, pull it apart, add things and completely make up everything I say... Never have I put forth that boston is the best or better then anyone else.. EVER.

And I am not even commenting on the rest because you changed the context of everything I said and I am done defending things I never said...

Continue the banter about nothing and making assumptions & accusations about things that have been explained in plain english like where the money for this Boston bid is coming from.

Any and every time I have ever taken something personally is something you said directly about me, not about the bid. Period.

I'd also like to point out that under the "Future Bid Discussions" this thread is the Most Viewed, Most Responded to and First Posted other than "Toronto"

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Rather then coming after me for posting actual facts attack the ignorant people who don't even know what the bids are. Like nacre who just said Boston has to tear down the city and build or have their Stadium at Gillette which has never been in the bid just the media. Or the whootsuite who accused Boston of being inexperienced and sketchy for not releasing a public bid book when LA released theirs before they were even short listed, half the projects have lost support since and were asked by the USOC to remove all bid books and renderings from online because none of the 4 cities were supposed to publish them yet.

There is not one file, pdf, photo that you have and I need. Guaranteed, hate all you want I havent been some upbeat BOSTON BOSTON person or everyone else sucks kinda guy so continue to ignore the facts and attack me instead of responding to the actual topic of conversation, it's par for the course on this thread since day one.

Actually, that's exactly what you've been. This all is totally par for the course for you. We get that you're extremely interested in Boston's bid for the Olympics. And I mean this sincerely when I say thank you for posting relevant information about Boston because this site tends to get low on fresh news to discuss, so this is a nice welcome break from the usual discussion around here which often centers around what continent's time it will be to host the 2036 Olympics.

That said, don't keep giving us this high and mighty act like you're an expert on all this and we're all a bunch of spiteful idiots who don't know what we're talking about. You did that from the moment you started posting here and you continue to do so. You continue to speak of Boston and their bid as you take it as a given they know exactly what they're doing and they have all their affairs in order and anyone who would dare to question then is either a hater or is ignorant. And you speak so expertly (having read the Boston Globe, of course.. yes, I'm making a joke) about how Boston's budget is all taken care of through TV revenue. As if Boston is the only city who would base their budget around such a thing.

Look, it is the nature of people on this site to find flaws in city's bids. You've defiantly left this site several times over only to come back when Boston is back in the discussion. How about working with us a little here instead of touting Boston's bid as if there is no fault with it anywhere. Either way, stop trying us like we're somehow beneath you and that all of your "facts" are indisputable because someone said so. If it were all that simple, we probably wouldn't be having any of these discussions in the first place.

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I'd also like to point out that under the "Future Bid Discussions" this thread is the Most Viewed, Most Responded to and First Posted other than "Toronto"

What does that tell us? Not much, really. Other than that there are a lot of people here who are interested in Boston. That's the fickle nature of this site. You're responsible for a lot of those views and responses. Again, I credit you for providing fresh information to push the discussion. But if you're going to be the type of poster here who wants to talk about Boston and nothing else, don't take it as an insult when the rest of us aren't gushing over Boston like you are. That there's a long Boston thread and nothing for Los Angeles.. that's only a function of who is here. And there were more than a couple of Boston supporters who just happened to show up here right around when they entered the fray.

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Rik, there's nothing worse than the part-time posters who come on here and shove their city down everyone's throats when they start a bid, and then leave as soon as the bids over. If you contributed to other parts of the forum you'd have more lee-way to discuss Boston so much, but right now you seem no different than the crazy Spaniards and Turks from last years bid race.

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Rik, there's nothing worse than the part-time posters who come on here and shove their city down everyone's throats when they start a bid, and then leave as soon as the bids over. If you contributed to other parts of the forum you'd have more lee-way to discuss Boston so much, but right now you seem no different than the crazy Spaniards and Turks from last years bid race.

Ya know, it is interesting.. Rik claims to "have every bid document and final reports from every Olympics to date" (which we all naturally call bullshit on) and yet he showed up only when Boston first got mentioned as a candidate. One would think that someone with such extensive knowledge and/or interest in Olympic bidding would have an opinion to offer here or there about another city other than Boston. Or wouldn't have entered this site comparing the size and scope of the Olympics to that of another less prominent event.

I really don't get your presence here sometimes (Rik, not you ofan). You have this way of claiming you're an expert on something, only to offer up knowledge that speaks otherwise. I've said this before and I'll say it again.. if you're looking for a site filled with people that share in positive energy rather than looking for negatives, you're in the wrong place. That's the crowd here in threads other than this Boston one. We're happy to have debates and discussion with you, but don't get all defensive when someone questions an element of the Boston bid or offers a counter-point to one of your supposed "facts."

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See it's constant you take what I write, pull it apart, add things and completely make up everything I say... Never have I put forth that boston is the best or better then anyone else.. EVER.

And I am not even commenting on the rest because you changed the context of everything I said and I am done defending things I never said...

Continue the banter about nothing and making assumptions & accusations about things that have been explained in plain english like where the money for this Boston bid is coming from. Any and every time I have ever taken something personally is something you said directly about me, not about the bid. Period.

I have never taken any of your words out of context, what you saw above was simply a retaliation to your previous claims. To say that you haven't said Boston is wrong because you have, refer to what you said about Boston being more prepared infrastructure wise and using inaccurate facts to back it up. Anything I said about you is what your comments and attitude have led me to believe about you. Maybe you are right and I did read it out of context, but if that is the case then try and explain to me what you did mean. From what I read it looks like you think Boston has the best bid and anyone who disagrees with you is totally wrong.

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Ya know, it is interesting.. Rik claims to "have every bid document and final reports from every Olympics to date" (which we all naturally call bullshit on)

Even our infamous bid enthusiast Lord David doesn't have them all. I'm sure he would in his wet dreams, though, lmfao. So maybe he & this guy can get together & do a bid book study group lol.

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We'll, this got ugly quick

It's what happens when people personally associate themselves with their bid and take any bid criticism as criticism on them.

He never told me if he had SLC 1972...I wanna know because I really want to see what they proposed. Rik, if you have pictures post them because I genuinely want to see how similar their proposal then was compared to 2002.

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It's what happens when people personally associate themselves with their bid and take any bid criticism as criticism on them.

That's par for the course here on gamesbids throughout its history. This guy is certainly not an anomaly when it comes to such behavior on these forums. After awhile, any further 'debate' is just futile when it comes to these certain type of individuals.

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Ok so going back to those prospective venue plans, I made this map which plots out the venues name dropped so far (along with other major venues in the city and infrastructure upgrades mentioned as well).

As far as I know, the only special venues that would need to be constructed at this point would be a velodrome and the aquatics center. If some people who have more knowledge about venue plans and Olympic scheduling could clarify how much venue space would be required for the remaining events, or point me in the direction of a good resource to find the information myself, that would be helpful.* The events of interest would be: Basketball, indoor volleyball, wrestling, badminton, boxing, rugby, shooting, tennis, and weightlifting.

I am also unclear on the language used to describe the venue plan in Franklin Park in regards to the modern pentathlon and equestrian, because they describe renovating White Stadium and that damage may occur to the public golf course nearby. Some clarification on how equestrian and pentathlon venues are typically arranged could be helpful to find out what they may be thinking about or planning there.

* I also think that it would be useful for this sort of information to be collected and placed in a sticky somewhere in this forum, as I feel that would help with discussions on this particular sub-forum.

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Ok so going back to those prospective venue plans, I made this map which plots out the venues name dropped so far (along with other major venues in the city and infrastructure upgrades mentioned as well).

As far as I know, the only special venues that would need to be constructed at this point would be a velodrome and the aquatics center. If some people who have more knowledge about venue plans and Olympic scheduling could clarify how much venue space would be required for the remaining events, or point me in the direction of a good resource to find the information myself, that would be helpful.* The events of interest would be: Basketball, indoor volleyball, wrestling, badminton, boxing, rugby, shooting, tennis, and weightlifting.

I am also unclear on the language used to describe the venue plan in Franklin Park in regards to the modern pentathlon and equestrian, because they describe renovating White Stadium and that damage may occur to the public golf course nearby. Some clarification on how equestrian and pentathlon venues are typically arranged could be helpful to find out what they may be thinking about or planning there.

* I also think that it would be useful for this sort of information to be collected and placed in a sticky somewhere in this forum, as I feel that would help with discussions on this particular sub-forum.

- Basketball can use somewhere around 10,000 capacity for preliminaries/quarterfinals, so something like an upgrade to Conte Forum would work, with medal matches at the Garden. Gymnastics would likely be at the Garden during the 1st week, with basketball finals in the second week.

- Taekwondo/fencing, judo/wrestling and badminton/rhythmic gymnastics usually share a venue, with schedules split between the two weeks.

- Volleyball will need it's own venue around 15,000 seats, so something like a new Garden might work.

- Boxing can be put into one of the college arena's nearby, like Atlanta did in 1996.

- Rugby sevens can go at Alumni Field, which could also be used for soccer preliminaries. Keep in mind that the rugby sevens competition is only 2-3 days.

- Shooting is a difficult one, because it essentially requires 2 venues. One, with multiple indoor halls for rifle and pistol shooting, which would likely require a new temporary facility outside of the city. The other is an outdoor shooting range for shotgun events, which could be placed at a nearby skeet shooting range in New England.

- Tennis will need a 10,000 seat centre court, 5,000 seat grandstand court and 3,000 seat 3rd court, with about 10 other supplementary courts. I don't know where you would find this near Boston. Might need to build a new facility.

- Weightlifting works well in a large amphitheater or musical hall in the city. At least 6,000 seats.

For the Convention Centre, there will likely be 3 halls used. One converted to a handball arena, around 10,000 seats, one for taekwondo/fencing or wrestling/judo, around 8,000 seats, and one for table tennis, around 6,000 seats. Handball prelims could happen hear in a small arena, with finals in the arena used for basketball preliminaries.

Finally, equestrian will require a stadium for jumping and dressage, while the cross country portion of the eventing and modern pentathlon will require a large park or golf course to hold the event, which seems to work well for Franklin Park. A temporary pool can be set up nearby for the swimming in the mp, but the IF for mp is looking to hold all events in one stadium by 2016, so you might just need the one stadium for all 5 events.

All IOC venue capacity requirements are on page 38 of this document: http://www.olympic.org/Documents/Reports/EN/en_report_1317.pdf

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I'm curious to see where Boston comes up with all of the necessary venues to satisfy the IOC requirements (cue the part where I'm reminded that the Boston committee folks know better than we do what the requirements are, so certainly they have that issue well in hand). They've got 1 large-scale arena, but Boston's college and universities don't have particularly big arenas. So they'd still need another big arena. Conte Forum only hold 8,600 people, so I don't know they can magically add more seats there. Beyond that, theres Agganis Arena at Boston U, that's a little over 7,000 capacity. And Matthews Arena at Northeastern, they're 6,000. So that's got 3 more sports covered there.

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The original Boston Garden lasted more than 60 years. TD Garden will be less than half that old come 2024. So I don't know it'll necessarily be time to replace that arena.

The original Garden lasted about as long as the other Original Six arenas, which have all been replaced or renovated in the last 15 years. I think in this day and age, it's about evolving and adapting sports venues. The novelty of old stadiums is no longer the norm. I don't think we'll see arenas last 60 plus years anymore with the desire for advancements and modernization. At least a facelift will be necessary.

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The original Garden lasted about as long as the other Original Six arenas, which have all been replaced or renovated in the last 15 years. I think in this day and age, it's about evolving and adapting sports venues. The novelty of old stadiums is no longer the norm. I don't think we'll see arenas last 60 plus years anymore with the desire for advancements and modernization. At least a facelift will be necessary.

Remains to be seen. Look at what they did with Madison Square Garden here in the city. Obviously there's a little more history there than most places, but I'll be curious to see if this building boom continues. Right now the median age of NBA arenas is around 16 years. And if my count is correct, of the 30 NBA arenas currently in use, 19 of them opened between 1994 and 2005 (only 2 new ones have opened since then.. Orlando and Brooklyn). So let's see how long that crap of arenas lasts. A facelift for a place like TD Garden around 2024.. that's to be expected. But build a new arena from scratch to replace it? That I don't know about.

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