Mau2010 Posted March 17, 2013 Report Share Posted March 17, 2013 Having an inside cauldron would be reasonable if the main stadium was totally indoor like in Vancouver, but after London commited and defended their idea of not having the flame as a "touristic attraction" with an open stadium ot would be very nonsense to repeat the same error and defending it. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olympian2004 Posted March 18, 2013 Author Report Share Posted March 18, 2013 The problem is that Rio doesn't have a real alternative, Mau. London had one - because the Olympic Stadium's roof wasn't that obtrusive, a flame on top of an external cauldron tower would have been visible for quite many among the stadium audience. Additionally, London (unlike Rio) actually had enough space around the Olympic Stadium to construct such a tower. If one finds a solution how to put a cauldron on that very fragile-looking roof at Maracana Stadium, I'd gladly accept it. I'm no fan of yet another "indoor" cauldron either. But I have big doubts whether there really is an alternative. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mau2010 Posted March 18, 2013 Report Share Posted March 18, 2013 I guess since Olympic Stadiums started to have 360º roofs over the tribunes cauldrons have become a complete headache Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baron-pierreIV Posted March 18, 2013 Report Share Posted March 18, 2013 I guess since Olympic Stadiums started to have 360º roofs over the tribunes cauldrons have become a complete headache Remember a cauldron is just a ceremonial/decorative thing that is needed only for 17 days. It should NOT determine whether a 360-deg roof should be installed or not. They can always make adjustments for such a temporary thing as a cauldron. It ISN'T the be-all of an Olympic Games. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athensfan Posted March 18, 2013 Report Share Posted March 18, 2013 Then why have a cauldron at all? It's historically been the climax of the OC -- the Olympics' biggest night. If it's such a trivial thing, why make such a big deal out of it in the OC? If the cauldron is merely an inconvenience and an afterthought for Games organizers, then it might as well be eliminated as a symbol. Simplify everyone's lives. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mau2010 Posted March 18, 2013 Report Share Posted March 18, 2013 Not the cauldrons by themselves, but where to put them, only Beijing knew to deal with it in a beautiful way (at least for me) Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mau2010 Posted March 18, 2013 Report Share Posted March 18, 2013 Remember a cauldron is just a ceremonial/decorative thing that is needed only for 17 days. It should NOT determine whether a 360-deg roof should be installed or not. They can always make adjustments for such a temporary thing as a cauldron. It ISN'T the be-all of an Olympic Games. Yes, but it's still important, if it's inside people will complain that visitors can't see it, if it's outside people in the stadium will complain that they couldn't see the cauldron lighting. Obviously if you're going to build an olympic stadium pointing to OLYMPICS you must take that in count. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baron-pierreIV Posted March 18, 2013 Report Share Posted March 18, 2013 Yes, but it's still important, if it's inside people will complain that visitors can't see it, if it's outside people in the stadium will complain that they couldn't see the cauldron lighting. Obviously if you're going to build an olympic stadium pointing to OLYMPICS you must take that in count. Don't worry. There are experienced people at the helm of ceremonies. They will find a way. If some people won't like it; tough titties. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
TheOtherRob Posted March 18, 2013 Report Share Posted March 18, 2013 Then why have a cauldron at all? It's historically been the climax of the OC -- the Olympics' biggest night. If it's such a trivial thing, why make such a big deal out of it in the OC? If the cauldron is merely an inconvenience and an afterthought for Games organizers, then it might as well be eliminated as a symbol. Simplify everyone's lives. Silly response to Baron's post. It's not a case of designing the whole stadium or its roof around the cauldron or else not bothering. There's a huge amount of middle ground for creative people to work in. 1 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baron-pierreIV Posted March 18, 2013 Report Share Posted March 18, 2013 Silly response to Baron's post. It's not a case of designing the whole stadium or its roof around the cauldron or else not bothering. There's a huge amount of middle ground for creative people to work in. That's what I meant...u just said it differently. ANd u quoted Athens, not me...so, the silly response is really to him then? Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
illustrado Posted March 18, 2013 Report Share Posted March 18, 2013 from what i can see the RIO2016 organizers between a rock and a hard place. opting for a 'tower' cauldron does not work for maracana due ti the lack of space and the fact that it's not in the Olympic park give the more reason for the super-fan to complain about, the 'London' type cauldron might be the only solution but there is the problem of visibility to the people outside and also a problem of moving the thing it a match setting after the OC. the 'Vancouver' compromise is won't work as it defeat the purpose of the whole thing. why do we need to light the cauldrun at the OC if there a 'fux' cauldrun being lit somewhere by a man in the back of a pickup truck. ? if me an obvious solution will a light the stadium on fire. the cauldron will be the rim of the maracana stadium. you get the visibility of Beijing et al, and the intimacy of london Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baron-pierreIV Posted March 18, 2013 Report Share Posted March 18, 2013 Ilustrado, the IOC charter says that the "cauldron-lighting" must be visible to the Tribune of Honor (the VIPs) and most of the OC audience who paid gazillions to attend the evening's spectacle. So it will be somewhere on the floor. That is the focal point of the 80,000 first-nighters. They can then relight it elsewhere. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DannyelBrazil Posted March 18, 2013 Report Share Posted March 18, 2013 The problem is that Rio doesn't have a real alternative, Mau. London had one - because the Olympic Stadium's roof wasn't that obtrusive, a flame on top of an external cauldron tower would have been visible for quite many among the stadium audience. Additionally, London (unlike Rio) actually had enough space around the Olympic Stadium to construct such a tower. If one finds a solution how to put a cauldron on that very fragile-looking roof at Maracana Stadium, I'd gladly accept it. I'm no fan of yet another "indoor" cauldron either. But I have big doubts whether there really is an alternative. You are claiming about "fragile" roof structure and in fact, the structure is not fragile at all... Still, I'm not sure how much weight the structure is able to support, and that's why I think the cauldron can be really internal. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athensfan Posted March 18, 2013 Report Share Posted March 18, 2013 Silly response to Baron's post. It's not a case of designing the whole stadium or its roof around the cauldron or else not bothering. There's a huge amount of middle ground for creative people to work in. First, the exaggerated tone of my earlier post was intentional. Second, of course you don't have to design the stadium around the cauldron. However, if the cauldron is going to continue to be the climax of the biggest night of the Games, if it is going to continue to be the one symbol that Olympic bids may not incorporate in their logos because it is so important, then it deserves careful planning and forethought, certainly more planning and forethought that London demonstrated. For me, London's cauldron was a failure. It felt like an afterthought that was squeezed into a convenient corner. Yes, the design of the cauldron itself was interesting, but it was not widely visible (in fact, it was all but invisible for the first week) and was intentionally extinguished after the OC. Every other consideration took precedence over the visibility of the primary Olympic symbol. I would hate to see a repeat of that in Rio. If Rio does choose to follow London's lead and the cauldron is only visible for a couple football matches, I think that the importance of the cauldron as an Olympic symbol should be seriously reevaluated. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
cslopes54 Posted March 19, 2013 Report Share Posted March 19, 2013 Danny I saw on the news the roof supports a few tons of weight on top. Either way I don't think the cauldron would look good up there. I'm expecting more like the PAG sun cauldron, I wouldn't be surprised if they redesign it and make it better, it looked pretty good. Maracana is among the shortest Olympic stadiums so I don't expect a huge cauldron either, it'd block alot of people . Another idea is moving the cauldron to the Olympic Stadium since most events will be held there(?) no point on keeping it at Maracanã for soccer matches. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Rols Posted March 19, 2013 Report Share Posted March 19, 2013 Personally, I think it's too early to speculate much on the cauldron, but I wouldn't be at all surprised to see multiple ones spread across the Rio venues. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DannyelBrazil Posted March 19, 2013 Report Share Posted March 19, 2013 Personally, I think it's too early to speculate much on the cauldron, but I wouldn't be at all surprised to see multiple ones spread across the Rio venues. Exactly, indeed, because it was already announced Maracana will return to works after the World Cup to starts prepartions for Olympic Ceremonies, which means, things will be changes after World Cup... Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
DannyelBrazil Posted March 19, 2013 Report Share Posted March 19, 2013 Meanwhile in the future venue for the ceremonies... The 4 huge LED screens (100m² sized) are under instalattion 60% of the roof already in place Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
runningrings Posted March 20, 2013 Report Share Posted March 20, 2013 (edited) The Field looks so small. In terms of the "stage" the ceremony has to work with, RIo 2016 ceremonies will be more on a Winter Olympic scale - like Sochi, Turin and Salt Lake - rectangular football stadiums. Edited March 20, 2013 by runningrings Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baron-pierreIV Posted March 20, 2013 Report Share Posted March 20, 2013 The Field looks so small. In terms of the "stage" the ceremony has to work with, RIo 2016 ceremonies will be more on a Winter Olympic scale - like Sochi, Turin and Salt Lake - rectangular football stadiums. Then it'll be easier to do. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athensfan Posted March 20, 2013 Report Share Posted March 20, 2013 Shorter parade of nations. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olympian2004 Posted March 20, 2013 Author Report Share Posted March 20, 2013 I don't think it will really matter that Maracana has no running track as additional stage area. I mean, Athens and London concentrated the artistic segments of their opening ceremonies mainly in an oval space in the middle of the infield (Athens had the pool, London had the elevated "Isles of Wonder" stage), without using the running track area excessively. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baron-pierreIV Posted March 21, 2013 Report Share Posted March 21, 2013 No; it doesn't really matter. As a matter of fact, a smaller field gives a more intimate show. Plus, you don't have to fill it up 8,000 performers, You can fill it with 5,500...or something like that. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mau2010 Posted March 21, 2013 Report Share Posted March 21, 2013 I guess this should mean for the athletes parade that there won't be a trackwise footpath like in athetics stadiums, it would be good to see a creatively designed footparh like in Salt Lake Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baron-pierreIV Posted March 21, 2013 Report Share Posted March 21, 2013 NO! That would make the Parade ot Athletes TOO long. A short, direct walk is fine. Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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