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London 2012 Olympic Cauldron...


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If I were a guessing man I would guess that the cauldron will rise from the middle of the stadium to around half the height of the stadium. After the ceremony it will be placed somewhere else within the stadium(I have no idea where). Probably a very rubbish guess but that's what I feel is most likely from what I have read and heard.

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What exactly has been the point of the last 160 pages, then? When did we cross the line into throwing away anything, potentially legitamate, anyone brings up in this thread simply because "it won't ma

The longer I see it "in action", I think that the idea behind the cauldron lighting and the design was extremely clever - but Heatherwick and Company completely failed in realising that the cauldron w

I don't quite understand your reasoning that the 2012 location is showing more people worldwide the cauldron that had it been located elsewhere (ie roofline of stadium etc). The cauldron is always a f

If the cauldron does rise out of the stadium floor then it should be a great moment- plus it'll have been buried under those green fields all that time without us knowing! Do you think if this is the case it's been hidden under there since the stage was constructed? With all the aerial shots of the stadium during the building of the stage I'm amazed none of them caught sight of it!

It's got to be. It's the only place that nobody has focused on. It's in plain sight but underneath all the other activity. That's why they raised the stage like 9-ft from the ground level (& dug a little) to accommodate a cauldron that might rise, what? 15/20+ ft. or so. It's smack in the CENTER of everyone's view. And all it really requires is a very simple, rising mechanism...not something as elaborate as Sydney's or Beijing's.

So something like Calgary's...except theirs was on a much higher platform.

Lighting is around 7:50... At least that's how I think it will be.

Then they'll move the cup to that ledge above the Tor (or have a duplicate ready to go up there) ...which would look great framed by the triangular Light pylon. And it'll probably stay there until it's extinguished at Closing. Of course, it doesn't leave too many options for the Paralympics...but hey, they're always #2 anyway.

Edited by baron-pierreIV
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I'm on board with the cauldron-rising-from-the-center theory. I seem to recall early aerial pics of the stadium including a giant hole in the middle of the infield. But I'm less confident about where the cauldron will actually end up.

Then they'll move the cup to that ledge above the Tor...which would look great framed by the triangular Light pylon.

Wouldn't that mean it would be visible outside the stadium, though? And wouldn't that contradict the (reported!) statement by Denis Oswald?

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Wouldn't that mean it would be visible outside the stadium, though? And wouldn't that contradict the (reported!) statement by Denis Oswald?

It would be partially visible from outside. But I think on a very small scale since it would be sitting on the inner rim of the roof, and then sticking out a few feet in. But 80% of the stadium would have a great view of it and people from the Orbit would see all of it.

Edited by baron-pierreIV
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I'll be interested and a little surprised if the cauldron is within the stadium, but in the absence of any better answers it could be the right one!

I have two words of caution about the lighting and rising theory though (good as it would be to see the Cauldron rise from under the stage into the middle of the field of athletes:

(i) the original planning application for the stadium gives a good indication of whatever underground works have been approved. There is no hole in the middle of the field of play (not to say that this wasn't amended subsequently)

(ii) if the cauldron is to be directly in the centre of the stadium, then the lifting mechanism cannot move it to one side, unless the cauldron is more heavily weighted to one side, as the twelve lifting wires meet at the centre of the field. There is a lateral lifting mechanism but I don't know how much weight it can handle

The more I think about 'the moment', the more I think it is going to blow our tiny little minds. We need to stop thinking about cauldrons as a physical thing, and just be ready to be wowed.

Exciting, no?

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I personally don't mind that the flame/cauldron is likely to be in the stadium. Given the design of the London Olympic Stadium and the park, it really just makes sense to keep it in there. All those protruding triangles and wires hanging about the place and the Orbit tower next door would make a rooftop or tall tower cauldron just seem a bit clumsy. An in-stadium flame would be much more suitable to the environment it is in.

But in my mind, I still think as I have all along that the cauldron is lurking within the Tor. At the end of the ceremony, it will either rise up through the Tor, ripping the ground to shreds emerging in an almost violent eruption of steel and fire, or the Tor will somehow disappear quietly in the dark of the night and a shiny cauldron will emerge in its place.

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I'm sure it will come from a hole in the centre of the stadium. Does anyone remember some webcam images from last year which showed a zorb like ball, on a ramp that led to the centre of the stadium. It was so long ago I can't fine any links :(

On a lighter note, I've been testing my mini cauldron in the garden for my OC party on Friday night. Remember #savethesecret :D

Cauldrontest.jpg

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I am hoping those reports are false. One thing that would make me think they are false is that in Vancouver they had two cauldrons. It was my understanding that according to olympic rules, the cauldron has to be lit at the opening ceremony yet also be visible to the public. The Indoor cauldron solved the first condition and the outdoor solved the latter. The cauldron is a big part of the games. If it was only visible on the inside, it would add another blunder to a growing list.

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/\/\ Nice (the garden torch photo).

I don't know if they're using that zorb-ramp thing. Unless we see something like that; they may have decided it didn't work?? Meaning the idea was junked? I'm saying that because we haven't seen anything else with a "rolling-downhill" idea. I don't know if that 'water-mill' prop will roll downhill and away.

Edited by baron-pierreIV
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Where the architecture of the stadium permits, the cauldron has to be visible also to the public outside the stadium, yes. But that rule was only part of an older version of the Olympic Charter, it has vanished in the more recent versions. And as we know already from Seoul 1988, the IOC also permits cauldrons which can only be seen from inside the stadium.

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I am hoping those reports are false. One thing that would make me think they are false is that in Vancouver they had two cauldrons. It was my understanding that according to olympic rules, the cauldron has to be lit at the opening ceremony yet also be visible to the public. The Indoor cauldron solved the first condition and the outdoor solved the latter. The cauldron is a big part of the games. If it was only visible on the inside, it would add another blunder to a growing list.

The IOC shifts the rules to fit them or the situation. They said NO Global Torch relays on March 26, 2009. Yet the next day, the 27th, they allowed Singapore 2 have a 5-continent relay, altho nothing on the scale of Beijing's and Athens.' The IOC makes those rules to bend them.

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Someone did mention yesturday that the they believe that athletes may still be sitting down.). If the athletes do sit, this would be a strong indication the cauldron is indeed underneath the stadium floor. If it is smaller cauldron then a medium sized hole is probably somwhere, but if it is giant one the whole stadium floor may have to open up. Maybe we will get a "ET" or "Close Encounters" type of effect.

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I've just seen something on BBC news that makes me wonder if the cauldron could be north east of the stadium. The news was being broadcast from the studio overlooking the Orbit. Towards the right hand edge of the screen I briefly saw a yellow flash lasting a second or two (not a beacon on a vehicle). I rewound the clip and saw a column light up (from ground upwards) and then a flame yellow light on top. It could just be a sculpture I suppose as I hav to say the yellow light didn't look very flame like. I'll try taking a few pictures but don't know how to post them.

I've just seen another of these so I'm sure it's NOT the cauldron.

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Think laterally and expect something even grander than Foundation's fine cauldron! There's an 18 minute interview with Heatherwick on the BBC World Service today http://www.bbc.co.uk...and_25_07_2012/ which, infuriatingly, doesn't mention the Cauldron at all. But listen to how he discusses the bridges, buses and temples he has designed. It will be sculpture with form.

So I could imagine the cauldron design process going something like this:

Paul Deighton: "Hey, Tommy boy, loved the rug you made - we've got a little design job for you. Olympic Cauldron"

Thomas Heatherwick: "Great! I love the Games. Count me in."

PD: "Good. We've got the basics in place - there's a nice hole just to the north of the stadium, it's rigged for north sea gas, any height you want up to 150 metres. Got the planning permission. Done the environmental impact assessment. Sorted."

TH: "Hmm, hold on, let's really think about this. What is a cauldron? It's about fire? What is fire? Primal, creative, a spark, the beginning of civilisation. It's sinuous, nebulous, mysterious. It represents life - and death."

PD: "Ur, I guess..."

TH: "So we can't just stick it in a bowl on top of a stick, can we lad? The lighting of the flame needs to be a moment. Imagine a ball rising from the ground, like St Elmos Fire, tumbling from the sky and rising from the ground. That's what a cauldron means - a crucible"

PD: "But what about the gas pipes? We've spent thousands on them."

TH: "Use is as a drain, and to confuse those poor saps on the internet with nothing better to do than speculate, rather than create"

(If the programme isn't available outside the UK, I'll see if I can download and share the file.)

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Having said that, I've just seen something on BBC news that makes me wonder if the cauldron could be north east of the stadium. The news was being broadcast from the studio overlooking the Orbit. Towards the right hand edge of the screen I briefly saw a yellow flash lasting a second or two (not a beacon on a vehicle). I rewound the clip and saw a column light up (from ground upwards) and then a flame yellow light on top. It could just be a sculpture I suppose as I hav to say the yellow light didn't look very flame like. I'll try taking a few pictures but don't know how to post them.

Do you mean like this?

Belisha Beacons.

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Someone did mention yesturday that the they believe that athletes may still be sitting down.). If the athletes do sit, this would be a strong indication the cauldron is indeed underneath the stadium floor. If it is smaller cauldron then a medium sized hole is probably somwhere, but if it is giant one the whole stadium floor may have to open up. Maybe we will get a "ET" or "Close Encounters" type of effect.

One of our fellow members who are ceremonial volunteer mentioned a couple of weeks ago that the athletes won't be seated. And that makes sense actually, because I can't see a large enough portion of unoccupied seats within the stadium on all those leak pictures from the rehearsals.

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The IOC shifts the rules to fit them or the situation. They said NO Global Torch relays on March 26, 2009. Yet the next day, the 27th, they allowed Singapore 2 have a 5-continent relay, altho nothing on the scale of Beijing's and Athens.' The IOC makes those rules to bend them.

It's likely that Singapore had already poured in a lot of resources into the torch relay before the announcement and the IOC allowed them to proceed with it because of that. I just don't think they would compromise on such an iconic image like that.

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I hope this mystery cauldron is water-proof. It'd be a shame for the whole world to anticipate it and then when it gets lit, a sudden thunderstorm erupts, and VOILA! both the cauldron and the torch are extinguished. And then the search for the miner's lamp begins in haste... :lol:

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It's likely that Singapore had already poured in a lot of resources into the torch relay before the announcement and the IOC allowed them to proceed with it because of that. I just don't think they would compromise on such an iconic image like that.

The IOC made a special exception because it was the first YOGs Lighting and Torch relay, and it had ot fly all the way to Singapore anyway. The flame journey to Innsbruck in January this year was one w/o too much fanfare.

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How can the cauldron rise from a hole in the center of the stadium? What about the field events? Does it make sense to do a grand, mind-blowing lighting and then move the cauldron elsewhere in the stadium?

I have to say I'm developing a gnawing feeling that the most impressive thing about this cauldron may be the secrecy surrounding it -- not the cauldron itself or the lighting of it. I hope that proves unfounded...

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The IOC made a special exception because it was the first YOGs Lighting and Torch relay, and it had ot fly all the way to Singapore anyway. The flame journey to Innsbruck in January this year was one w/o too much fanfare.

That might have been another contributing factor but still why would the IOC compromise on a symbol of the games. I don't think its likely.
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Here's something concrete about the cauldron; "I already know the London Cauldron will be the most beautiful ever so this will be my favourite." That's a quote from Clare Amsel, Producer, Paralympic Opening Ceremony (page 6 https://getset.london2012.com/assets-uploaded/documents/WSD_oc_-_Story_E-W.pdf). Denis Oswald is also reported as having confirmed to ATR that there is a cauldron. So I doubt it's going to be a re-cycled bell!

Look at the ATR article and it starts by saying "a cauldron towering over the Olympic Stadium will be missing during the games". It then goes on to say Denis Oswald "confirms it will only be visible within the Olympic Stadium".

None of this says this will be the ONLY cauldron. ATR assume that's what it means or perhaps they 'spin' it that way to make it more of a story?

Anyway, imagine an interview going something like this:

ATR: We are a few months/weeks/days away from the opening ceremony but there's no sign of a cauldron in the Olympic Stadium. Given the design of the stadium, it's very difficult to see where the cauldron would go. Will there be a cauldron in the stadium for the opening ceremony?

Oswald: There is definitely a cauldron.

ATR: Does that mean it will be on a tower outside the stadium?

Oswald: No, it will only be seen inside the stadium.

OK, that's pure guess work but a conversation like that is surely possible. If Oswald was asked, and answering, a question about the opening ceremony; there could be a cauldron outside the stadium without any contradiction. As ATR go on to say: "The absence of a cauldron visible from outside the stadium is a first for the Summer Games of the recent era".

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