baron-pierreIV Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 (edited) It's the method of lighting the Cauldron that this is about, not the Cauldron design itself, isn't it (?) But I think the manner of lighting would seem to be easy enough. It's both the design AND the lighting. The thing is, the IOC would have to know of and approve the whole lighting scheme MONTHS in advance. Their Oversignt Committee would be on LOCOG's tail like a cheap suit if the important deadlines were falling way behind. Who is this mysterious Mexican woman? How does she play into the whole story? Was she like a Mata Hari who carried the final designs in her diplomatic pouch to David Cameron's poolside at Los Cabos to get his signature...ONLY while he was conferring with his delegation and the other world leaders...to get his initials...and then spirit the initialled paper back to London? Is she holding LOCOG hostage and won't release that paper unless she gets to light the cauldron?? Is she also carrying David Cameron's, Seb Coe's or David Beckham's love child?? The whole thing is so intriguing!! Edited July 23, 2012 by baron-pierreIV Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
menegazfelipe Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 I still think the Shard has a part to play in all this. Not sure how, the name of the building, the building itself, and all the renders of their "inauguration" [even though the inside is still a building sire] reflected the London Brand to me. Was their laser and light show some sort of test? Whatever it will be I am sure London will pull it off spectacularly! Indeed, the top of that building leaves me puzzled. Why that top has no access or use? Didn't buy the "aesthetic purposes"... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athensfan Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 It's possible that they only realized after everything had been developed that they needed the PMs permission. The security problem is not a minor wrinkle either. Not only did the firm fail to report a problem they must have known about for months, LOCOG and the government failed to provide sufficient oversight. They should've been on top of this long ago. The fact that something so major fell through the cracks must raise the question of what else has been forgotten or postponed. If you asked me a coupe months ago if this security problem were possible, I would've said, "No way. I'm sure the Brits are on top of it." Though I would expect cauldron details to have been finalized ages ago, I must concede that it's possible they failed to get the PMs permission until 45 days ago. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athensfan Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 I didn't say there was a breach in security. There was a shortfall of THOUSANDS of personnel that was only discovered a few weeks before the Games. Yes, they've called in the troops and the situation has been dealt with. The point is that it never should have been an issue in the first place. The security firm should've notified LOCOG and the government months ago -- as soon as they began to suspect a shortfall. Barring that, LOCOG and the government should've been monitoring the situation much more closely and should've discovered the shortfall themselves long ago. These are serious operational deficiencies. There is simply no other way to describe it. If this can happen with something as major as thousands of security personnel, then they can certainly fail to get the PMs approval for a cauldron until 45 days before the Games. I'm not saying that's what happened. I'm not even saying they shpuld have had the PMs permission earlier because I don't know the specifics. I'm saying that a delay in going through official channels seems totally plausible considering recent events. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olympian2012 Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 i'm sure some people have already suggested this....but i think the location could be under the tree in the northern stands of the stadium. i think it will be similar to Sydney's cauldron.....i.e. it will be silver, disc shaped, and rise up from the tree spot vertically into the air. again, i'm people have mentioned it, that they will not have a cauldron within the stadium, which i think is true, but because there is 1 week between the opening ceremony and the start of the athletics, it will give LOCOG time to re-structure the northern side of the roof in order to hold up a floating cauldron above the stadium. this, i think, is the most likely scenario. unless....LOCOG have planed to light the Olympic flame from the centre of the stage....like Vancouver 2010. i mean nobody really knows what is under there...apart from the shape of the River Thames. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
HJPro Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 I didn't say there was a breach in security. There was a shortfall of THOUSANDS of personnel that was only discovered a few weeks before the Games. Yes, they've called in the troops and the situation has been dealt with. The point is that it never should have been an issue in the first place. The security firm should've notified LOCOG and the government months ago -- as soon as they began to suspect a shortfall. Barring that, LOCOG and the government should've been monitoring the situation much more closely and should've discovered the shortfall themselves long ago. These are serious operational deficiencies. There is simply no other way to describe it. If this can happen with something as major as thousands of security personnel, then they can certainly fail to get the PMs approval for a cauldron until 45 days before the Games. I'm not saying that's what happened. I'm not even saying they shpuld have had the PMs permission earlier because I don't know the specifics. I'm saying that a delay in going through official channels seems totally plausible considering recent events. What you say is true but LOCOG trusted G4S with the security and it was G4Ss fault not LOCOGs, they simply let them down and now it has been fixed, everything else is going to plan I'm sure. Just because there is one problem doesn't mean the whole thing is going to pot. If G4S were in control then I'd be making suggestions that other areas may be experiencing problems, but they're not... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rob2012 Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 It's possible that they only realized after everything had been developed that they needed the PMs permission. The security problem is not a minor wrinkle either. Not only did the firm fail to report a problem they must have known about for months, LOCOG and the government failed to provide sufficient oversight. They should've been on top of this long ago. The fact that something so major fell through the cracks must raise the question of what else has been forgotten or postponed. If you asked me a coupe months ago if this security problem were possible, I would've said, "No way. I'm sure the Brits are on top of it." Though I would expect cauldron details to have been finalized ages ago, I must concede that it's possible they failed to get the PMs permission until 45 days ago. The security thing is major but I don't understand how it links to anything in this thread, The idea London 2012 had to get the PMs permission for the cauldron still isn't something I believe to be true; - I still think people are getting muddled with the fact that Boyle asked the government for more money for the show. So I think your conclusion is based on a flimsy premise anyhow because, in short I don't believe they would normally NEED to get the PM's permission for the cauldron. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Hawk Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 But, RobH, we are going on what Heatherwick said last week. He said, specifically, that Cameron approved the cauldron lighting sequence. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
menegazfelipe Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 According to TEBC on Skyscrapercity, Brazilian TV will be broadcasting from one of the blue studios below the hexagonal BBC studio on top of this complex. http://www.bluebus.c...mpico_pirataria I can confirm that to you at 8:30pm (GMT-3) tonight, when SporTV is unveiling their studios in London. The dispute between Rede Record (free-to-air) and SporTV (pay tv; which is a Rede Globo subsidiary, who lost the rights to Record) is becoming very exciting. Record is dedicating much of its programming to the Olympics, and SporTV announced four HD channels on pay tv. Information that I found: Two forces of the media joined efforts for the Olympics in London. SporTV struck a deal with BBC, the largest broadcaster of the United Kingdom. The BBC is responsible for the construction of SporTV's panoramic studio, and support the staff of the Brazilian channel with structure and logistics in situ during the Olympic period. SporTV and the BBC also jointly produced a series of openers that show a three dimensional air tour, which will be used during the coverage of the Olympic Games in London. Always leaving the panoramic studios, subscribers will get to know - during the interlude between the broadcast of a competition to another - the real paths between the sports arenas. And this is how it looked last night. Low lights over the Olympic Park at 2am GMT... SporTV chose to explore the Union Jack on its graphics rather than the Games logo and look. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
hiroamorim Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 Look the lights Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
menegazfelipe Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 Just watched a broadcast this morning, looked way better than last night. Beautiful and sunny day in London... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Hawk Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 Look the lights What's that thing above the yellow lights??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
menegazfelipe Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 The reflection on the glass of the host's blinding platinum hair... What's that thing above the yellow lights??? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olympian2012 Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 we know for definite that the orbit can not be the cauldron, because there is a different design team involved anish kapoor and cecil balmond designed the orbit and thomas heatherwick for the cauldron. http://www.dezeen.com/2012/06/15/movie-thomas-heatherwick-on-his-top-secret-design-for-the-olympic-cauldron/ in the above link, thomas says that the cauldron will be at the VIctoria & Albert Museum at 9am on 27/07/12 - well not the actual one, but a model of it! What's that thing above the yellow lights??? i think it's a reflection of the man's head in the glass behind him..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
pjpauly2k Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 Just been watching the BBC news which has started coming from their studios in the olympic park from today. The stadium is behind and I have to say I looked carefully but could not see anything at all cauldron related! All looked exactly the same. Dont know if it would be from the right angle though, the Orbit is directly between the stadium and the studios so may be the wrong angle to see anything anyway. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alexjc Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 Watching BBC World at the moment...a practise ceremony is underway...looks good but no sign of a cauldron...Like everyone else out there I think the Orbit will have something to do with it. (the IOC did say years ago that they don't want sillyness and oneupmanship - which nealy came undone in Sydney) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baron-pierreIV Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 (edited) The behind-the-scenes story of London 2012 will come out in good time but I strongly suspect that the Cauldron design and approval, and the Cauldron lighting design and approval process has gone like clockwork - the way it was planned to. I cannot imagine that approval of this will have been forgotten or a last minute rush thing. Agree very much. I didn't say there was a breach in security. There was a shortfall of THOUSANDS of personnel that was only discovered a few weeks before the Games. Yes, they've called in the troops and the situation has been dealt with. The point is that it never should have been an issue in the first place. The security firm should've notified LOCOG and the government months ago -- as soon as they began to suspect a shortfall. Barring that, LOCOG and the government should've been monitoring the situation much more closely and should've discovered the shortfall themselves long ago. These are serious operational deficiencies. There is simply no other way to describe it. If this can happen with something as major as thousands of security personnel, then they can certainly fail to get the PMs approval for a cauldron until 45 days before the Games. I'm not saying that's what happened. I'm not even saying they shpuld have had the PMs permission earlier because I don't know the specifics. I'm saying that a delay in going through official channels seems totally plausible considering recent events. There is a simple and clear explanation for this shortage of security personnel. All qualified individuals instead preferred to volunteer and perform with Ceremonies--any of the 4...or even the Medal ceremonies!! Imagine the 35,000 applications for the Ceremonies positions. Why, all of that would've fulfilled the security personnel needs. But no...everybody wants to perform!! Everyone is such a ham!! And Doha and Baku have the nerve to try and bid for an Olympics??? Edited July 23, 2012 by baron-pierreIV Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ScarletDevil Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 Just seen some latest pictures, theres something being buil to the South of the stadium near the orbit! Any ideas? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athensfan Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 What you say is true but LOCOG trusted G4S with the security and it was G4Ss fault not LOCOGs, they simply let them down and now it has been fixed, everything else is going to plan I'm sure. Just because there is one problem doesn't mean the whole thing is going to pot. If G4S were in control then I'd be making suggestions that other areas may be experiencing problems, but they're not... Yes. G4S screwed up -- big time. But oversight in these matters is absolutely essential. Did LOCOG and the government basically take a hands-off approach and say "we've signed a contract. We're sure you'll deliver. You need nothing from us"? It sounds like it. That's totally inappropriate for something of this magnitude. Somebody from LOCOG and the government should've been in regular contact with G4S and should've been monitoring the situation all along. The cauldron approval SHOULDN'T have been a rush job (and maybe it wasn't), but the government shouldn't have had to call in the troops a few weeks before the Games either. Neither of those things should ever happen. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athensfan Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 The security thing is major but I don't understand how it links to anything in this thread, The idea London 2012 had to get the PMs permission for the cauldron still isn't something I believe to be true; - I still think people are getting muddled with the fact that Boyle asked the government for more money for the show. So I think your conclusion is based on a flimsy premise anyhow because, in short I don't believe they would normally NEED to get the PM's permission for the cauldron. Baron said it was impossible that LOCOG got the PMs permission a mere 45 days ago. He questioned the timeline and the veracity of the story. AustraliaFan had already brought up the security issue in a brief mention. I explained how the security problems proved that serious delays in going through official channels are clearly possible and therefore the "45 days" is not inconceivable. That's how it relates. I am NOT saying "everything is going to pot." While there are several possibilities for the Cauldron's home, the Orbit Tower cannot be ruled out completely yet as we simply do not know what collaboration and co-operation has taken place behind the scenes between the various players, designers, engineers, etc. With this latest news from the Thomas Heatherwick interview posted here in the last 24 hours of Prime Minister David Cameron having given his approval, then can we expect something perhaps quite amazing and stunning on Friday night, unlike any Cauldron lighting we have seen before ? Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
scoif Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 http://www.facebook.com/London2012 HEY GUYS ! look at this! the ring appears on strange structures, maybe functionally! i always hope on the orbit, but..... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
thepianoman Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 Hi everyone! I've finally joined the conversation after a long time reading everyone's thoughts! But as a Brit, it makes me feel very happy that even this one part of the ceremony is generating so much excitement! Firstly, a question- early on in this thread someone posted a link to this: http://planning.london2012.com/upload/publicaccessODAlive/OLY-OLF-APP-DWG-PDZ3-SSU-PAR-001%20%282268%29.pdf This seems to show an area where the cauldron could be- is this now obsolete? (Apologies if it's been covered earlier in the thread, I've not had time to read every page! ) I know a lot of people think the torch could be on top of the Orbit Tower- personally I'm not convinced, although wouldn't it be a fantastic moment if they surprise us all? A couple of pages back someone posted a picture of a tower outside an Ikea? Can anyone explain what this is? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baron-pierreIV Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 http://www.facebook.com/London2012 HEY GUYS ! look at this! the ring appears on strange structures, maybe functionally! i always hope on the orbit, but..... No; that's how the rings have been sitting in readiness for whatever it is they will do. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olympian2004 Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 Baron said it was impossible that LOCOG got the PMs permission a mere 45 days ago. He questioned the timeline and the veracity of the story. AustraliaFan had already brought up the security issue in a brief mention. I explained how the security problems proved that serious delays in going through official channels are clearly possible and therefore the "45 days" is not inconceivable. That's how it relates. I am NOT saying "everything is going to pot." Aaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaaa!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Guys, you totally got wrong what was said in the Mexican interview with Thomas Heatherwick respectively in Mexico68's post. Mexico68 only said that coincidentally, David Cameron was visiting Mexico at the time when that Mexican journalist interviewed Heatherwick. That doesn't mean that Heatherwick had to travel to Mexico to meet Cameron and to ask him for his permission. Why should a Briton have to travel to a country thousands of miles away just to meet his Prime Minister and ask him? That makes no sense. And Heatherwick didn't actually mention a date when he (or Boyle or LOCOG) asked Cameron for his permission. So that could have been already in 2011, the year when Heatherwick was appointed the designer of the cauldron. I suppose that it's getting a bit too much for us all. We are now starting to rack our brains about things that have never been said. P.S. Here's Mexico68's original quote: PS He clearly states that Heatherwick himself told him that it was the lighting method that required an auth from the PM, whom, by the way, at that time, was visiting Mexico. Orbit fans, read the article carefully. "at that time" refers to the time of the interview, not the time of Cameron's authorisation. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
kinetic Posted July 23, 2012 Report Share Posted July 23, 2012 Just seen some latest pictures, theres something being buil to the South of the stadium near the orbit! Any ideas? Not quite sure what you mean by 'south' here, given that this photo is taken from the North West of the stadium. If you're referring to the tower to the left of the picture, that's a long-under-construction residential block. Firstly, a question- early on in this thread someone posted a link to this: http://planning.lond...0%282268%29.pdf This seems to show an area where the cauldron could be- is this now obsolete? (Apologies if it's been covered earlier in the thread, I've not had time to read every page! ) A couple of pages back someone posted a picture of a tower outside an Ikea? Can anyone explain what this is? Welcome thepianoman! I think you'll find different opinions about the planning application. In my opinion it's a no-brainer that this is where the cauldron will stand, but I'm very ready to be proved wrong. (Although not on the Orbit thank you.) The Ikea tower marks the site of a big residential/commercial development in Stratford, and is not directly linked with the Olympics. (Apologies for linking to the Mail.) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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