London 2012 Olympic Cauldron...

[Shrek201 35]

the cauldron is already built and has been for some time now, it's just hidden or located off site where it was built and is ready to be placed just before the games begin! The best way to build something secretly is to build it somewhere else!

Agreed. And it will end up where the known gas lines are...not unless some other secret gas lines have been added. I think the cauldron might still be under wraps at the 3 Mills Studios. It'll probably take 48 hours to shove it into the hole on the north side; and a testing a day or two before July 27.

[kinetic 6]

I am enjoying the discussion around where the location of the cauldron might be, and what it might look like. I'm only a newbie here and haven't delved into the whole thread, but presume that the actual planning permissions have been discussed?

Now, there's the caveat that the ODC is allowed to not publish sensitive or confidential planning applications, and it's possible that the permissions for the Olympic Cauldron will have changed, but the evidence does strongly support that white block as the location:

• The original permissions for the cauldron presume a small, solid foundation
  
• The location of that permission is clearly the exact spot of that white square (look at where the A-A' cross-section is located on the bottom left of that planning submission)
  
• The brief for what became the Orbit offered a number of sites in the park (detailed in the Orbit planning submission) and referenced (i) the Northerly location and (ii) that "a minimum height of 100m was needed for spectators in the Olympic Stadium to see the flame"
  
• The Orbit planning application also states that north of the stadium (PDZ3) was rejected because "The requirement to incorporate the Olympic flame did not meet the Artistic intention of the piece"
  
• Analysis has gone into the zone of visual influence (ZVI) at this location
  
• The Cauldron will be a 'legacy structure', extant on the site in 2021 and beyond (see the title of the planning application here)
  
• Ignore the north-south being literally north-south, and instead look at the line from inside to outside the stadium. That's going to be important.
  

And as for requiring deep foundations and a long construction time, I expect the cauldron will be more of a mast than a robust pillar - in the manner of, but not inspired by, the Skylon (which required few foundations) - that can be erected very quickly. Coincidentally, reading around the topic there are serendipitous parallels in the careers of Heatherwick and Samuely (who designed and engineered the Skylon).

From my calculations I'm predicting that the cauldron will be exactly 100m tall. But will be happily proved wrong about that.

I rest my case!

[Steve10086 23]

Oh my God, I walked over that little iron bridge years ago when I went on a walk to see the old Big Breakfast house. I find it almost impossible to compare the image of that area then with how it is now. Don't think I've ever (or will ever) experience such a transformation of a place.

[Shrek201 35]

Oh my God, I walked over that little iron bridge years ago when I went on a walk to see the old Big Breakfast house. I find it almost impossible to compare the image of that area then with how it is now. Don't think I've ever (or will ever) experience such a transformation of a place.

Actually, Atlanta was first. The area where Centennial Park arose was also a blighted neighborhood of rundown, small indsutrial repair shops, etc. The area was opposite ACOG's Inforum offices. I noticed that on my first trip to ACOG in late November 1993. And then voila, come mid-1996, the ramshackle neighborhood was gone, and in its place was this spanking, sparkling new park with a few bits of Olympic Centennila imagery. Of course, the Parklands area is bigger, but same thing.

[Olympian2004 511]

Now, there's the caveat that the ODC is allowed to not publish sensitive or confidential planning applications, and it's possible that the permissions for the Olympic Cauldron will have changed, but the evidence does strongly support that white block as the location:

• The original permissions for the cauldron presume a small, solid foundation
  
• The location of that permission is clearly the exact spot of that white square (look at where the A-A' cross-section is located on the bottom left of that planning submission)
  
• The brief for what became the Orbit offered a number of sites in the park (detailed in the Orbit planning submission) and referenced (i) the Northerly location and (ii) that "a minimum height of 100m was needed for spectators in the Olympic Stadium to see the flame"
  
• The Orbit planning application also states that north of the stadium (PDZ3) was rejected because "The requirement to incorporate the Olympic flame did not meet the Artistic intention of the piece"
  
• Analysis has gone into the zone of visual influence (ZVI) at this location
  
• The Cauldron will be a 'legacy structure', extant on the site in 2021 and beyond (see the title of the planning application here)
  
• Ignore the north-south being literally north-south, and instead look at the line from inside to outside the stadium. That's going to be important.
  

Great find! But, regarding your second bullet point: To me, that A-A' cross-section seems to be slightly to the south of the white square, namely around the area between the block of five catering pods and the row of four additional catering pods north-northeast of the stadium.

What is interesting, though, is that in that permission, the cauldron seems to be slightly to the east of the stadium's north-south axis. That does coincide with the white square's location indeed.

So it is your and your other ceremonial cast collegues' guess that the cauldron will be located at that white square?

[kinetic 6]

Thanks! You're right, the cross-section is different to what I suggested, although I'd not particularly rely on that as accurate.

The guess about the location is only my own, there's nothing in anything I've seen about the ceremonies that give any hint of the location - and I wonder if it won't even be shown in the dress rehearsals, instead being done in a closed stadium - but even if we did have inside knowledge, I wouldn't tell! All the evidence I've used is in the public domain.

[Shrek201 35]

BTW that iron bridge had uncanny resemblance to Heatherwicks rolling bridge. Pure coincidence or part of the scheme?

Gosh, first the design on the tickets. What has that led to? Nothing so far.

Then the contours of the fake Tor and the fake tree. Now this little bridge. It's all in the eye of the beholder. Why 2 me, under acid, it looks like the Bridge on the River Kwai?!?!

What's next? Too many conspiracy theories me thinks.

I think it's hiding in Big Ben, and on July 21, Big Ben will open up and the cauldron/tower will emerge for its journey to Olympic Park!!

In 8 days before July 27, they can plant the cauldron tower, secure it, test it a few times; and then conduct a rehearsal or two. If nothing is up by July 25, then I would worry.

What about this photo?

Maybe it's that tower to the right?

So will all those streets of London light up? So therefore, you can't have too many performers there covering the LED light show? They're not revealing things in a logical way here, are they?

[Olympian2004 511]

Baron, err... Shrek, maybe you should only post links to such pictures -- just that the "No spoilers, please" group doesn't get angry. That's why I just posted a link to those new pictures in the ceremony thread.

@Kinetic: I'm certain they won't give a hint to the cauldron's location in the dress rehearsals. Usually, the dress rehearsals stop before the lighting of the cauldron segment. But just like Baron/Shrek I'm certain that we will know anyway where the cauldron will be by the time of the dress rehearsals. It's impossible to keep the cauldron completely under cover even during the last few days before the ceremony.

[Shrek201 35]

This whole discussion gets exponenetially more psychotic each year.

And we thought Taichi and his wait for the digital countdown clocks was truly bonkers.

Wait till discussion gets to Sochi and if we get a few Russians in here; it will be complete bedlam!

[paul65 8]

Thanks for the advice SwissO. Seems simple enough. Pics will be up on Sunday evening.

Ok - I was in the Olympic Park yesterday. Lots of activity going on. Really hard to get close to the Stadium so my pics are all long range efforts. Couldn't get any shots that indicated that certain suspect areas to the north of the stadium were being prepared for the cauldron so it is still a mystery. The whole of the east side of the stadium (dignitary and press entry) was no-go to us so I cannot report on whether the barge was there or not. What I did manage to snap was some of the opening ceremony 'Isles of Wonder' grass (meadow and cricket pitch presumably) out sunning itself and several of the large rings up on the roof.

The stadium wrap is really coming on at a pace now too.

By beardyboy at 2012-06-24

[paul65 8]

Some more pics from yesterday:

By beardyboy at 2012-06-24

By beardyboy at 2012-06-24

By beardyboy at 2012-06-24

[SwissO 126]

For me it is definitively not at the pods' location.

May be at the new location spotted today close to the old bridge ! Shame we could not see it on that picture...

[kevzz 146]

One disadvantage of the cauldron at the white plate spot on the river bank is it is behind the pods when viewed from the stadium concourse. Then the best view is always from across the river

[NY20?? 98]

A Skylon-esque cauldron make sense and does indeed take off the need for a big, deep foundation, which has been my biggest qualm with a large outdoor cauldron.

[Olympian2004 511]

One disadvantage of the cauldron at the white plate spot on the river bank is it is behind the pods when viewed from the stadium concourse. Then the best view is always from across the river

Well, if it towers over the stadium, it (meaning its main part, the flame on top) will be also well visible from behind the pods.

[xtclvr05 3]

Don't answer that, kinetic! It's a trick question. Keep your cover.

no it's not a trick question but anybody could say oh in the ceremonies and i know what's going to happen blah blah blah. i could say im secretly the ioc president and ive been checking to see things from the publics point of view. you never know....

[baron-pierreIV 1693]

no it's not a trick question but anybody could say oh in the ceremonies and i know what's going to happen blah blah blah. i could say im secretly the ioc president and ive been checking to see things from the publics point of view. you never know....

Simple ?. Would u reveal yourself?

[adrianme17 127]

Baron, err... Shrek, maybe you should only post links to such pictures -- just that the "No spoilers, please" group doesn't get angry. That's why I just posted a link to those new pictures in the ceremony thread.

@Kinetic: I'm certain they won't give a hint to the cauldron's location in the dress rehearsals. Usually, the dress rehearsals stop before the lighting of the cauldron segment. But just like Baron/Shrek I'm certain that we will know anyway where the cauldron will be by the time of the dress rehearsals. It's impossible to keep the cauldron completely under cover even during the last few days before the ceremony.

It will become obvious during the dress rehearsals where the flame will be - or so I have been told by my section leader!

[munichfan 38]

Anybody knows what that round "ring" of concrete might be used for? It seems to be built between 2008 and 2010 so it should definitely have something to do with the games.

[paul65 8]

Just for a bit of fun ... If you want to gave a go at playing with the stadium model and working out where you'd place your very own Heatherwick designed cauldron open up Google Earth, browse to the Olympic Park and zoom in, ensure you have the Photorealistic 3D Building layer ticked in the left hand sidebar and then work out where you'd put the cauldron if you were in charge. It's fun.

By beardyboy at 2012-06-24

[Foundation 5]

Anybody knows what that round "ring" of concrete might be used for? It seems to be built between 2008 and 2010 so it should definitely have something to do with the games.

It's a building that's part of the sewage system, and has two big pink tanks in it called Pinky and Perky

http://www.thameswater.co.uk/cps/rde/xchg/corp/hs.xsl/14584.htm

[Kenadian 300]

There you go...another crap shoot guess pissed away and flushed down the toilet.

[mattperiolat 35]

A thought... rather than conceal a caldron location, how difficult would it be to assemble something during the ceremony? I mean, obviously NOT a permanent location, but something that can be used during the ceremony and relocating for the athletics competition. It also could go with the theme of the evolution of London as each segment of the ceremony leaving something behind until the finished cauldron is revealed at the end.

[AustralianFan 56]

A thought... rather than conceal a caldron location, how difficult would it be to assemble something during the ceremony? I mean, obviously NOT a permanent location, but something that can be used during the ceremony and relocating for the athletics competition. It also could go with the theme of the evolution of London as each segment of the ceremony leaving something behind until the finished cauldron is revealed at the end.

The idea of assembling a Cauldron and connecting gaslines etc is theatrically creative but safety considerations of performers, or even engineers disguised as performers, would I think be far too risky to do that live during the Opening Ceremony. That sort of fire and flames stuff has to be rigourously tested by qualified technicians and I don't think the safety laws would allow that to be left to a chance mistake and dreadful consequences during the pressure of the Opening Ceremony.

Extraverted and highly organised London does not seem in the mood to go for an intraverted Cauldron that can only be seen by those inside the Stadium. It would be the first Sumer Games to have an 'internal' Cauldron sine the 1988 Seoul Games - just can't see London going backwards down that path again.

Danny Boyle is in the mood to reveal some things about the OC, but he is likely to keep his biggest surprise and wow moment, the Heatherwick Cauldron (we are expecting to be in a high position), firmly under wraps as much as is humanly possible until the very last moment.

Edited June 26, 2012 by AustralianFan

[baron-pierreIV 1693]

SPOILERS!!

Guess what resides inside the black shroud???

It's almost there for everyone to see!! :lol: