StefanMUC Posted January 17, 2014 Report Share Posted January 17, 2014 I think what Paul's saying is that this is a matter for another day. Let's focus on the Olympics at the moment, because after all it's all about the sport, and I for one cannot wait for Sochi. After February we can fret about Russia and how f'd up their country is. I disagree. People who claim politics and Olympics/sports should be kept separate ate usually the first to use the Games or sports events for their own political purposes, Putin definitely making no exception. So he must live with the consequences, i.e. outspoken people naming and shaming the current state of Russia, no matter how shiny the venues are. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony E Loves Architecture Posted January 17, 2014 Report Share Posted January 17, 2014 What I don't understand is is that Putin has said, Homosexuals are welcome to Russia but are not allowed to spread it around. What does he think it is? You can't make someone a Homosexual, you are born straight or Homosexual or both. Putin is so Homophobic, it's just wrong how Putin treats people. The Sochi Games (without the political side, the sport side I mean), will be a brilliant Games. I am a bit worried what Putin would do if a member of his family came out as a homosexual. The Olympics are for everyone. Weather your race, sexual orientation, gender, religion or political belief, if a Country can't accept that, they shouldn't host. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ofan Posted January 17, 2014 Report Share Posted January 17, 2014 I disagree. People who claim politics and Olympics/sports should be kept separate ate usually the first to use the Games or sports events for their own political purposes, Putin definitely making no exception. So he must live with the consequences, i.e. outspoken people naming and shaming the current state of Russia, no matter how shiny the venues are. Let's be realistic for a moment. During the Games you're going to be cheering on Germany's athletes or whoever, and won't be giving a damn about Putin, save for when he appears in the Opening Ceremony. The sports will be the main focus in Sochi, unless something really major happens which I doubt will occur. Sport is supposed to be a diversion from our everyday lives. There's no need to be stressing about this while were watching bobsleigh in our sofas. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
StefanMUC Posted January 17, 2014 Report Share Posted January 17, 2014 Let's be realistic for a moment. During the Games you're going to be cheering on Germany's athletes or whoever, and won't be giving a damn about Putin, save for when he appears in the Opening Ceremony. The sports will be the main focus in Sochi, unless something really major happens which I doubt will occur. Well, I'm not saying I won't cheer for my fave athletes, but it is different if I cheer for them while they compete in, let's say Lillehammer 1994, to Sochi 2014. It will be a different atmosphere, just like London was far more enjoyable than Beijing. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ofan Posted January 17, 2014 Report Share Posted January 17, 2014 Well, I'm not saying I won't cheer for my fave athletes, but it is different if I cheer for them while they compete in, let's say Lillehammer 1994, to Sochi 2014. It will be a different atmosphere, just like London was far more enjoyable than Beijing. Obviously the atmosphere will be different. It changes from Olympics to Olympics. As far as London being more enjoyable, that's of course an opinion. I think Beijing was more of a spectacle because of all the money that went into it, and Canada won more gold than they did in London. My point is that a suppressive regime won't take away from the great sporting action that we are going to see, and I for one look forward to the competition. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul Posted January 17, 2014 Report Share Posted January 17, 2014 everybody's = at game-time. time to .......SHRED Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mr Tickle Posted January 17, 2014 Report Share Posted January 17, 2014 Lets hope we get a Jessie Owens moment. A gay athlete top of the podium, thats when I will be cheering, especially if Putin is giving out the medals : ) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Rols Posted January 17, 2014 Report Share Posted January 17, 2014 Lets hope we get a Jessie Owens moment. A gay athlete top of the podium, thats when I will be cheering, especially if Putin is giving out the medals : ) Me too. I for one will be hoping their will be some statement or act by an athlete that causes controversy and focusses attention on the issue. If you're going to host the games, you have to expect you're going to be under scrutiny. Whether the locals would ever hear much, though.... Russia tightens Internet control ahead of Winter Olympic GamesNSA whistleblower Edward Snowden found refuge in Russia. At the same time, Moscow has tightened legislation to control social networks in the country, and blocks critical entries. Lugovoi is a former Russian agent. The businessman is suspected of having poisoned dissident ex-spy Alexander Litvinenko in 2006 in London. The case caused diplomatic tension between Britain and Russia after Moscow refused to extradite Lugovoi in connection with Litvinenko's death. But this particular conflict was shelved after Lugovoi was voted into Russia's parliament, which gives him immunity from criminal prosecution. Logovoi in turn has found a new enemy: agitators on the Internet. Andrei Lugovoi, a lawmaker for the nationalist Liberal Democratic Party, is one of the authors of strict Internet legislation that goes into effect on February 1, right on time for the Winter Olympic Games in Sochi. The law gives Russian security authorities a handle on websites. In future, Internet providers can be ordered to block not only sites with extremist or child pornography content, but sites and social networks that call for "participation in mass public events." Pressure on Facebook & Co Whenever someone calls for a protest on Facebook, "the telecommunications authorities will be entitled to order the blocking of that network throughout the country unless the provider deletes the offending comments," warns Internet expert Alexej Sidorenko. Russia gradually expanded control over the Internet after Putin's re-election as President in 2012. In particular in Moscow and St. Petersburg, the presidential election campaign was accompanied by protests and calls for demonstrations posted on social networks. After Putin had returned to the Kremlin, the new government immediately began to tighten its hold on the Internet. The first version of the current bill on Internet blocks went into effect two months after Putin's re-election. "Facebook became popular in Russia during the protests," says Andrey Soldatov, who runs theagentura.ru website that keeps an eye on Russia's intelligence agencies. "At that point, the Russian agencies noticed that they had no idea how to deal with foreign providers," the Internet activist said, adding the agencies merely had access to the Russian sites that were the norm then. All of a sudden, they needed a strategy to handle foreign providers. The censorship law was mainly designed to force foreign networks like Facebook and Google to cooperate, Soldatov says. An excuse for censorship Reporters Without Borders this week invited Soldatov and Sidorenko to Berlin to report about developments on Russia's Internet. Russia ranks 148th in the international organization's 2013 press freedom index, down six points from the previous year. Moscowsurprisingly granted refuge to Edward Snowden, the former NSA analyst who leaked documents about the NSA's massive Internet surveillance, but that hasn't had a positive effect on Internet freedom in Russia, according to Soldatov. It was quite the opposite, he says: in the wake of Snowdon's revelations, pro-Kremlin politicians demanded tightening Internet control – allegedly to protect Russian citizens' data from the American companies. Snowden inspired the Russian authorities to "update their systems and resemble the NSA a bit more," Sidorenko says, and appeals to Europe's states to consider taking in Snowden. "He'd be much better of anywhere but Russia." Deutsche Welle Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
intoronto Posted January 17, 2014 Report Share Posted January 17, 2014 30% of seats are not sold either. The atmosphere is going to be a let down from Vancouver and London. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mainad Posted January 17, 2014 Report Share Posted January 17, 2014 I think what Paul's saying is that this is a matter for another day. Let's focus on the Olympics at the moment, because after all it's all about the sport, and I for one cannot wait for Sochi. After February we can fret about Russia and how f'd up their country is. I wish to God Putin and his crowd would just focus on the Olympics and the goodwill this could engender for their country instead of threatening to completely ruin the feelgood factor with their absurd anti-gay campaign and outrageously homophobic comments, of which his latest suggestion that gay people are all natural paedophiles and should keep their grubby little hands off Russian kiddies, is just the latest wacko and downright insulting jibe! What a country! I'll say it again but I feel the time cannot be far off when nations that indulge in repressive persecution of minorities can no longer be seriously considered as suitable to host international sporting events like the Olympics and World Cup. Would anybody indulge a country that continues to practice blatant racism, for instance? Putin and his crowd are already doing their level best to sour the happy and expectant atmosphere ahead of the Games with their peculiar little hang-ups and nasty remarks. You'd think the memory of the boycott of 1980 Moscow would encourage them to go overboard in trying to create a more positive and less controversial atmosphere this time round, but not a bit of it. The Russians never seem to change their spots. Roll on 2016 Rio, I say! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
BTHarner Posted January 18, 2014 Report Share Posted January 18, 2014 Does anybody else think that maybe what Putin is trying to say is that young children should not have to be exposed to anything that seems too grown up for people of their age? A six year old should not be exposed to anything of a sexual nature-either heterosexual or homosexual. Let kids be kids and let the sexual stuff come at a more appropriate time in their lives and then they can explore who they are in that manner. Granted it does sound like he's more concerned about gay influences and that is the way it came out in the report but what he really meant by it is something he only knows. Bring on the Games, I'm not letting all this stuff impair my enjoyment of the event. I apologize if it seems insensitive that I take two weeks to get away from the real world and try to soak in the Olympic ideal. The world and it's problems will still be there when I return to reality on the 24th of February. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
paul Posted January 18, 2014 Report Share Posted January 18, 2014 Abe likely to attend Sochi opening ceremony“Attending the ceremony in the absence of European and U.S. leaders will have a more positive effect in developing bilateral relations,” a senior government official said. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
ofan Posted January 18, 2014 Report Share Posted January 18, 2014 Maybe Putin has some sort of twisted obsession with the Catcher in the Rye and has to protect the innocence of all children. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
runningrings Posted January 18, 2014 Report Share Posted January 18, 2014 Does anybody else think that maybe what Putin is trying to say is that young children should not have to be exposed to anything that seems too grown up for people of their age? A six year old should not be exposed to anything of a sexual nature-either heterosexual or homosexual. Let kids be kids and let the sexual stuff come at a more appropriate time in their lives and then they can explore who they are in that manner. Granted it does sound like he's more concerned about gay influences and that is the way it came out in the report but what he really meant by it is something he only knows. This argument is fundamentally heteronormative. I understand the point you're trying to make, but underpinning that is the idea that same-sex relationships are exclusively sexual in nature- with not much more else to them, which is why it is inappropriate for children to be 'aware' of them. Why is exposing a child to the reality of homosexual relationships exposing them to something sexual? Children are not born with prejudices, it is installed in them from bigotry that surrounds them. Anyway, these Games are so far gone its absurd - there is not a lot Russia can do now to salvage its relationship with the Olympic movement, they have caused them a great deal of grief --- huge costs that are damaging the appeal of their event, the extremely likely possibility of terrorism at an Olympics held by a war zone, Putin's authoritarian regime, and these anti-homosexual laws. Moscow and St. Petersburg and forget about the Olympics - at least under Putin's Russia. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony E Loves Architecture Posted January 18, 2014 Report Share Posted January 18, 2014 Bottom line is is that the Russian Government especially Putin is homophobic, but what @BTHarner is saying is that wheather you are straight or a homosexual, young children shouldn't be exposed to a sexual nature until they are ready. That is weather you are straight or homosexual, not just homosexual. Putin is homophobic. He is trying to hide his beliefs in a sneaky way, by saying one thing, but meaning the other. He is pretending to welcome homosexuals, but really, we all know he is homophobic. Putin is wrong by saying in other words that spreading gay propaganda can influence children. Incorrect. You can't turn straight or a homosexual. You are born like that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barcelona_'92 Posted January 18, 2014 Report Share Posted January 18, 2014 30% of seats are not sold either. The atmosphere is going to be a let down from Vancouver and London. This is really unfortunate. There are going to be a lot of empty seats, especially at the alpine events. And that's if all of the corporate sponsors and hangers-on actually show up, which we know they don't for most events. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ikarus360 Posted January 18, 2014 Report Share Posted January 18, 2014 Bottom line is is that the Russian Government especially Putin is homophobic, but what @BTHarner is saying is that wheather you are straight or a homosexual, young children shouldn't be exposed to a sexual nature until they are ready. That is weather you are straight or homosexual, not just homosexual. Putin is homophobic. He is trying to hide his beliefs in a sneaky way, by saying one thing, but meaning the other. He is pretending to welcome homosexuals, but really, we all know he is homophobic. Putin is wrong by saying in other words that spreading gay propaganda can influence children. Incorrect. You can't turn straight or a homosexual. You are born like that. Not only Putin and the Russian Government. I guess you probably noticed a considerable part of both Russia and Eastern Europe are very homophobic and racist. That's what you get after decades of isolation by the Warsaw Pact. People will be bound to fear and judge the different. As for myself, I honestly don't know what to say. I partially agree that kids shouldn't be influenced by anyone and take their decisions as they mature, regarding their sexuality. However Putin is saying it as if being homosexual is as bad as consuming drugs, and he keeps referring and being obsessive with the issue, which clearly showns an obvious homophobic nature on his actions. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony E Loves Architecture Posted January 18, 2014 Report Share Posted January 18, 2014 Not only Putin and the Russian Government. I guess you probably noticed a considerable part of both Russia and Eastern Europe are very homophobic and racist. That's what you get after decades of isolation by the Warsaw Pact. People will be bound to fear and judge the different. As for myself, I honestly don't know what to say. I partially agree that kids shouldn't be influenced by anyone and take their decisions as they mature, regarding their sexuality. However Putin is saying it as if being homosexual is as bad as consuming drugs, and he keeps referring and being obsessive with the issue, which clearly showns an obvious homophobic nature on his actions. I 100 Per cent agree with you. And Putin does think Homosexuality is wrong, when its perfectly normal. In my view, any sort of sexual nature wheather it is straight or Homosexual, Kids should be allowed to mature at there own pace, and not be forced into sexual knowledge. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alphacarter Posted January 19, 2014 Report Share Posted January 19, 2014 In my view, any sort of sexual nature wheather it is straight or Homosexual, Kids should be allowed to mature at there own pace, and not be forced into sexual knowledge. Could you rephrase that? The wording confused me, and I'd like to understand the point you're trying to put across. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony E Loves Architecture Posted January 19, 2014 Report Share Posted January 19, 2014 Could you rephrase that? The wording confused me, and I'd like to understand the point you're trying to put across. Well kids shouldn't be exposed to any sort of sexual nature straight or homosexual. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alphacarter Posted January 19, 2014 Report Share Posted January 19, 2014 What is a "sexual nature?" If you mean kids shouldnt be exposed to any content of a sexual nature, then yes, i agree with you. But kids certainly need to be educated on the subject matter. and putins law prevents exactly that. it leaves people feeling helpless and alone, which let me tell you, ain't fun. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tony E Loves Architecture Posted January 19, 2014 Report Share Posted January 19, 2014 What is a "sexual nature?" If you mean kids shouldnt be exposed to any content of a sexual nature, then yes, i agree with you. But kids certainly need to be educated on the subject matter. and putins law prevents exactly that. it leaves people feeling helpless and alone, which let me tell you, ain't fun. Kids should start Sex Education at 11 Years Old. 6 Years old for example is too young, they wouldn't even understand. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
alphacarter Posted January 19, 2014 Report Share Posted January 19, 2014 i sure knew that boys made me feel good inside when i was 6. whats your reasoning for these ages? they seem awfully arbitrary. and the reason of course that they wouldnt understand is because they havent been taught. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Olympian2004 Posted January 19, 2014 Report Share Posted January 19, 2014 The stupid thing is: Does Putin really think that gay activists or even only gay visitors to the Sochi Games (if there will still be any, after all those news) will use the Games as an opportunity to "infiltrate" children with information about gay sex? Then he must be outright bonkers. Therefore, regardless which way you turn it: His statement is plainly homophobic, nothing more, nothing less. And the most outrageous thing about is that he made it in an Olympic context, at an even closely linked to the Olympic Winter Games - despite the Olympic Charter that prohibits also sexual discrimination. The best thing were if he got a reprimand by the IOC - but since the IOC doesn't want to tread on the toes of chief honchos like Putin, I highly doubt that this will happen. Correction: "event closely linked", not "even closely linked" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Quaker2001 Posted January 19, 2014 Report Share Posted January 19, 2014 The thing I don't get about the law.. Putin's official line is "gays are welcome in Russia, just stay away from our children." I would love for someone to explain to me what is so dangerous about gays being around children and to share their views? As opposed to someone who is heterosexual sharing his views and information.. why is that okay? I don't understand the logic behind that one. A couple of articles I've read seem to link homosexuality with pedophilia and that's the Russian government's reasoning for the law, but that's completely absurd. And I've heard how 80% of Russians support the law and therefore we should just leave them alone in that regard, but I don't buy that one either. The problem also is that "children" can include anyone up to the age of 18. We're not talking about 6-year-olds here or even 11-year-olds. I've been told that this is centuries of religious teachings that "a man shall not lie with another man" and that homosexuality is a sin, so in a country like Russia, it's difficult for the populace to embrace the idea that's a bunch of bullcrap. And then they'll pass it off as predominantly Western views that we embrace homosexuality as a normal way of life. Who are we to tell them how to live their lives and all that. Especially in the context of the Olympics though, like Tony said, they're an organization that is supposed to be about promoting an atmosphere free of discrimination. Whether Putin and his goons want to admit it or not, that's exactly what this law is doing, and he's hiding behind the "protect our children" line to make it seem okay. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.