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USA 2024

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Hey Thrillos, good to see u back. Wonder what happened 2 u.

What I do want to mention is the fact that the parent company (Comcast) to NBC's parent company (NBCUniversal) is located in Philadelphia (yay un-regulated capitalism). If a Philly bid was to win out the favor of the USOC and be considered by the IOC, one would think that the amount of money spent for the current broadcast rights by NBC (via Comcast) would be taken into consideration. Any American city hosting the 2024 games would help line NBC/Comcast's pockets but a Philly Olympics might just be a bigger boom for Comcast specifically.

Altho, of course, u do realize that the vastly reduced commission structure for the USOC would go into effect at that time; so any big revenues from the US TV contract would not be as large as it would've been pre-May 2012 agmt w/ the IOC.

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So I used to post regularly in this sub-forum about a prospective US SOG bid, specifically about the distinct possibility of a 2024 SOG in Philadelphia. And I agree that a potential Philly bid would allow for a greater urban renewal project than what was seen in London, especially in North & West Philadelphia; but I disagree that it would be a completely random event.

Out of the 12 American cities that claim a team in the four major sports leagues, only Chicago, Denver & Philadelphia can claim that all four of those major sports teams play within their city limits, which helps in building a compact bid if one such desires because of the readiness of these large venues. Add in additional venues from the Universities within the city limits (UPenn, Temple, Drexel, LaSalle) and just outside (Villanova, Rutgers/Rowan (S. Jersey)) and you begin to see the foundation of what a Philadelphia bid would build upon.

And I'd like to focus on UPenn for a moment, specifically Franklin Field. It annually hosts the Penn Relays, a track & field event that is nationally renowned and internationally known and has had representatives that have gold-medaled in every single SOG (excluding '80).

Somewhere in this thread there was a discussion placing an athletics track within Lincoln Financial Field. Being a resident of the area and having gone to the stadiums a bunch of times since it's opening I can honestly say this probably isn't feasible, on both engineering and political terms. In engineering terms, the stadium's lower bowl is built close to the field, i.e. there's not much room between the first rows and the boundary lines for football (American) and soccer. In political terms, the stadium while owned by the City of Philadelphia is operated by the Philadelphia Eagles. Seeing that the organization is one of the NFL's more prominent and wealthy, it would be hard pressed to convince both the league and the team to allow for partial demolition and reconstruction of the Linc for the purpose of a quadrennial sporting event where the venue itself would only be used for a little over a week, total.

This is where I think Franklin Field and by proxy, UPenn comes in. The venue is capable of handling a track and field event on a national level and with some refurbishment could probably handle an international sporting event like the Olympics. The area (University City) in which the stadium and the university is located is one of the cities most vibrant, technically advance and re-developed. UPenn is constantly expanding from it's University City limits across the Schuykill River into Center City Philadelphia and would benefit greatly from an Olympic Park situated within or around University City along the banks of the Schuykill. In tandem with the sports complex situated in South Philly, which is a short distance via highway or alternate transporation (bus, train, etc) the majority of Olympic events could be handled within a matter of five miles distance.

There's other things I could mention that would be a benefit to a Philly 2024 bid and for the sake of not running verbose, I won't do so now. What I do want to mention is the fact that the parent company (Comcast) to NBC's parent company (NBCUniversal) is located in Philadelphia (yay un-regulated capitalism). If a Philly bid was to win out the favor of the USOC and be considered by the IOC, one would think that the amount of money spent for the current broadcast rights by NBC (via Comcast) would be taken into consideration. Any American city hosting the 2024 games would help line NBC/Comcast's pockets but a Philly Olympics might just be a bigger boom for Comcast specifically.

Anyway, this is all theoretical but if Philly was to be favored the ability and the potential exists for it to host the Olympics on the same level as previous SOGs.

NYC can too, in fact they have more then 4 in their city.

-Yankees

-Mets

-Nets

-Knicks

-Rangers

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This is where I think Franklin Field and by proxy, UPenn comes in. The venue is capable of handling a track and field event on a national level and with some refurbishment could probably handle an international sporting event like the Olympics. The area (University City) in which the stadium and the university is located is one of the cities most vibrant, technically advance and re-developed. UPenn is constantly expanding from it's University City limits across the Schuykill River into Center City Philadelphia and would benefit greatly from an Olympic Park situated within or around University City along the banks of the Schuykill. In tandem with the sports complex situated in South Philly, which is a short distance via highway or alternate transporation (bus, train, etc) the majority of Olympic events could be handled within a matter of five miles distance.

I think this has been talked about before in various threads, but for the Olympics, the interior lane has to measure 400 meters all the way around. Franklin Field falls well short of that specific requirement.

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So I used to post regularly in this sub-forum about a prospective US SOG bid, specifically about the distinct possibility of a 2024 SOG in Philadelphia. And I agree that a potential Philly bid would allow for a greater urban renewal project than what was seen in London, especially in North & West Philadelphia; but I disagree that it would be a completely random event.

Out of the 12 American cities that claim a team in the four major sports leagues, only Chicago, Denver & Philadelphia can claim that all four of those major sports teams play within their city limits, which helps in building a compact bid if one such desires because of the readiness of these large venues. Add in additional venues from the Universities within the city limits (UPenn, Temple, Drexel, LaSalle) and just outside (Villanova, Rutgers/Rowan (S. Jersey)) and you begin to see the foundation of what a Philadelphia bid would build upon.

And I'd like to focus on UPenn for a moment, specifically Franklin Field. It annually hosts the Penn Relays, a track & field event that is nationally renowned and internationally known and has had representatives that have gold-medaled in every single SOG (excluding '80).

Somewhere in this thread there was a discussion placing an athletics track within Lincoln Financial Field. Being a resident of the area and having gone to the stadiums a bunch of times since it's opening I can honestly say this probably isn't feasible, on both engineering and political terms. In engineering terms, the stadium's lower bowl is built close to the field, i.e. there's not much room between the first rows and the boundary lines for football (American) and soccer. In political terms, the stadium while owned by the City of Philadelphia is operated by the Philadelphia Eagles. Seeing that the organization is one of the NFL's more prominent and wealthy, it would be hard pressed to convince both the league and the team to allow for partial demolition and reconstruction of the Linc for the purpose of a quadrennial sporting event where the venue itself would only be used for a little over a week, total.

This is where I think Franklin Field and by proxy, UPenn comes in. The venue is capable of handling a track and field event on a national level and with some refurbishment could probably handle an international sporting event like the Olympics. The area (University City) in which the stadium and the university is located is one of the cities most vibrant, technically advance and re-developed. UPenn is constantly expanding from it's University City limits across the Schuykill River into Center City Philadelphia and would benefit greatly from an Olympic Park situated within or around University City along the banks of the Schuykill. In tandem with the sports complex situated in South Philly, which is a short distance via highway or alternate transporation (bus, train, etc) the majority of Olympic events could be handled within a matter of five miles distance.

There's other things I could mention that would be a benefit to a Philly 2024 bid and for the sake of not running verbose, I won't do so now. What I do want to mention is the fact that the parent company (Comcast) to NBC's parent company (NBCUniversal) is located in Philadelphia (yay un-regulated capitalism). If a Philly bid was to win out the favor of the USOC and be considered by the IOC, one would think that the amount of money spent for the current broadcast rights by NBC (via Comcast) would be taken into consideration. Any American city hosting the 2024 games would help line NBC/Comcast's pockets but a Philly Olympics might just be a bigger boom for Comcast specifically.

Anyway, this is all theoretical but if Philly was to be favored the ability and the potential exists for it to host the Olympics on the same level as previous SOGs.

NYC can too, in fact they have more then 4 in their city.

-Yankees

-Mets

-Nets

-Knicks

-Rangers

Not to mention many smaller stadiums located in the city and 2 that have been proposed..

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Any expansion of Franklin Field would also compromise the historic architecture of the stadium. Current capacity is 52,000, so you're probably looking at approximately a 50% increase.

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Franklin Field is no Olympic Stadium!! It if old, dirty, in a very congested area, where there is no room to expand or build parking.

Why would the IOC want to go to Philly, when NYC and DC are nearby?

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I agree with beatles 100 percent. The IOC is into modern stadiums with modern accommodations not a stadium that is over 110 years old. And if they were to renovate it 100,000 seats for the olympics, why would they then renovate it again back to 50,000 seats.

I'm also going to touch on the questions too. Why would the IOC, athletes, and millions of tourists want to go to Philly when NYC and DC are so close. Philly is very historic and interesting, but with NYC just 90 minutes away, I can see many of the Philly tourists going to NYC since there is much more to do there.

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And I'd like to focus on UPenn for a moment, specifically Franklin Field. It annually hosts the Penn Relays, a track & field event that is nationally renowned and internationally known and has had representatives that have gold-medaled in every single SOG (excluding '80).

This is where I think Franklin Field and by proxy, UPenn comes in. The venue is capable of handling a track and field event on a national level and with some refurbishment could probably handle an international sporting event like the Olympics. The area (University City) in which the stadium and the university is located is one of the cities most vibrant, technically advance and re-developed. UPenn is constantly expanding from it's University City limits across the Schuykill River into Center City Philadelphia and would benefit greatly from an Olympic Park situated within or around University City along the banks of the Schuykill. In tandem with the sports complex situated in South Philly, which is a short distance via highway or alternate transporation (bus, train, etc) the majority of Olympic events could be handled within a matter of five miles distance.

Thrillos.. love that there's someone else energized about Philly as an Olympic hopeful. I'm a life-long resident of NYC, but as you may have surmised from my handle, I went to UPenn. So I have some decent knowledge of the city and particular the University City area. I had long thought Franklin Field would be a great potential hub of Olympic action (it's proximity to 30th Street Station would be a huge plus as well). However, there are a couple of issues that might get in the way..

Most notably about Franklin Field is that it's technically not a regulation 400 meter track. I believe the inside of lane 1 represents only 356 meters around and that it's the inside of lane 4 that is 400 meters. So in order to make it an Olympic-caliber venue, they would pretty much have to re-build the entire stadium from scratch. Given the footprint of the current stadium and the buildings that surround it, that could be a tall order if they also need to squeeze 80,000 seats in there.

The other issue is the area surrounding Penn's campus, including, as you noted, the expansion East towards the Schuylkill. That's a long-term plan that's been in the works for years now and has been ongoing for awhile. I fully believe the university would get behind an Olympic bid, but it also means tabling some of those plans and letting someone else take the lead. They may not be so agreeable to that if it means undoing some of the improvements they've made over the past decade.

So, like other cities, Philadelphia faces the same dilemma.. how to craft an Olympic bid around existing city improvements. That's why it goes back to the old logic that long-term planning is probably going to make for a better Olympic bid. Like you, I think using the University of Pennsylvania as the central focus of an Olympic bid could be a winning formula. I'm just not sure how feasible those plans will be.

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Philly has the space to build the venues for the games, but after the games what are they going to use the venues for. They would need to build at least one more arena, an aquatics center, sailing, biking, and much more. What will the venues be used for after the games, will they end up like Athens venues? or Atlanta's? I made this point earlier but its very important. If The USOC wanted to renovate Franklin Field for the olympics then they would be renovating it twice. Once for the actual olympics and once for the time after because I doubt an Ivy league school would get 90k+ for a football or soccer match.

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Hey Thrillos, good to see u back. Wonder what happened 2 u.

Altho, of course, u do realize that the vastly reduced commission structure for the USOC would go into effect at that time; so any big revenues from the US TV contract would not be as large as it would've been pre-May 2012 agmt w/ the IOC.

Got busy living I guess, I've occasionally popped over during the Olympics just to read opinions and whatnot but never really felt the need to comment myself. About the deal though, I wasn't fully aware of that portion, but I would think that NBC/Comcast would want to recoup some of the money spent for broadcasting rights regardless of commission structures? Just a thought I guess, I'll allow others with more knowledge on the situation to explain.

Just to further clarify on a point I made, the suggestion of Philly using (an obviously refurbished Franklin Field) is just that, a suggestion; and was only made because I read a few pages back about placing an athletics track within Lincoln Financial Field. Something that I think would be impossible from a political and engineering view. Using Franklin Field would provide the potential to build upon and expand what is already there.

For those that don't know me from before, I'm from Philadelphia, lived in and around the area all my life. Went to Drexel U. and have been in the area many times after. There's a lot of potential here because both universities UPenn/Drexel continue to expand in all directions. I think placing the Olympics in this area would greatly enhance the neighborhood, the universities, and the City of Philadelphia as a whole because it would finally bridge everything West of the Schuykill River with Center City Philadelphia, a goal that has been long acknowledged by the city.

The question of feasibility comes up, and I think that proper planning would make such an event more feasible. And if not, any potential bid from Philadelphia still has the South Philly Sports complex to fall back upon. All this of course is based on the notion that Chicago and New York are indifferent to hosting and that the USOC would really want to have the SOG in one of the largest metro regions in the world.

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Can anyone here lead me to some newspaper article perhaps in the Philadelphia Inquirer, that shows that there is a real interest in city hall to pursue an Olympic bid?

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Philly has the space to build the venues for the games, but after the games what are they going to use the venues for. They would need to build at least one more arena, an aquatics center, sailing, biking, and much more. What will the venues be used for after the games, will they end up like Athens venues? or Atlanta's? I made this point earlier but its very important. If The USOC wanted to renovate Franklin Field for the olympics then they would be renovating it twice. Once for the actual olympics and once for the time after because I doubt an Ivy league school would get 90k+ for a football or soccer match.

That logic applies to any prospective host city though because how many cities have a major aquatics facility or some of the other venues an Olympics requires. Philadelphia has 6 major universities, so there are plenty of places that could find use for such a venue, just like Atlanta did with Georgia Tech. I agree that Franklin Field is probably not an option (forget renovating it.. it would pretty much have to be torn down and rebuilt from scratch since renovation likely wouldn't be enough to get it up to far). I can't see any American city getting saddled with the types of white elephants that Athens has had to deal with. If that was even a possibility, that city won't even get near the point of having a winning bid.

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Why would the IOC, athletes, and millions of tourists want to go to Philly when NYC and DC are so close. Philly is very historic and interesting, but with NYC just 90 minutes away, I can see many of the Philly tourists going to NYC since there is much more to do there.

The thing is that both the USOC and the IOC have to work with the options that are presented to them. If NYC doesn't want to bid or can't resolve the stadium issue, how does it help the USOC or the IOC to reject other American cities simply because they aren't NYC? If Philly can present a compelling bid on its own terms, I see no reason why they should be penalized because the world's greatest metropolis (which isn't bidding) is 90 minutes away. If anything, having NYC so close gives tourists a perfect opportunity to see a bit more of the country and could be viewed as an added bonus rather than a grass-is-always-greener-what-might-have-been-scenario.

Don't get me wrong -- I'm not campaigning for Philadelphia. I just think that their bid should be evaluated on its own terms. If NYC jumps into the race and presents a superior plan they should get the nod. If Philadelphia out performs NYC or NYC doesn't bid -- the City of Brotherly Love should become the candidate.

Of course, neither Philly nor NYC may bid in which case all this is moot.....

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^This has been explained before. But these newbies keep asking the same old question. New York doesn't look too interested to bid, but Philadelphia & maybe a couple of others might. Plain N simple. No need to overthink this & why some like to make it more complex than it actually is.

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I don't think we will ever see Philadelphia win an Olympic bid. I mean, that's just absurd. They have some of the rowdiest sports fans in the nation. You want them throwing stuff at losers?

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Philly has the space to build the venues for the games, but after the games what are they going to use the venues for. They would need to build at least one more arena, an aquatics center, sailing, biking, and much more. What will the venues be used for after the games, will they end up like Athens venues? or Atlanta's? I made this point earlier but its very important. If The USOC wanted to renovate Franklin Field for the olympics then they would be renovating it twice. Once for the actual olympics and once for the time after because I doubt an Ivy league school would get 90k+ for a football or soccer match.

Firstly, with 6 colleges and a major convention center there is more than enough indoor space for events to be held

Secondly, it may be architecturally possible to gut the interior of Franklin Field, dig down, and provide a 48,000 seat stadium similar to the current stadium. Numerous designs have proven that it is possible to build an extra temporary tier on top taking the capacity up to the USOC minimum.

Alternatively Temple's lease with Lincoln Financial Field ends in 2018. A shorter lease coinciding with an Olympic Stadium which can be downsized might be of interest. Take the Moses Mabhiba Stadium in Durban. It has a capacity of 54,000 seats but was designed with the ability to add another 26,000 seats temporarily for Olympic type events.

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I don't think we will ever see Philadelphia win an Olympic bid. I mean, that's just absurd. They have some of the rowdiest sports fans in the nation. You want them throwing stuff at losers?

People learn and behave. The UK had theroughest, most ill-mannered football fans in the world in the 80s and 90s, always wreaking havoc wherever they visited. Yet, who hosted 2012?? :blink:

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Firstly, with 6 colleges and a major convention center there is more than enough indoor space for events to be held

Secondly, it may be architecturally possible to gut the interior of Franklin Field, dig down, and provide a 48,000 seat stadium similar to the current stadium. Numerous designs have proven that it is possible to build an extra temporary tier on top taking the capacity up to the USOC minimum.

Alternatively Temple's lease with Lincoln Financial Field ends in 2018. A shorter lease coinciding with an Olympic Stadium which can be downsized might be of interest. Take the Moses Mabhiba Stadium in Durban. It has a capacity of 54,000 seats but was designed with the ability to add another 26,000 seats temporarily for Olympic type events.

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Can we just stop with all this rhetoric N just have Tulsa host the fricken thing already, sheesh! :rolleyes:

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I don't think we will ever see Philadelphia win an Olympic bid. I mean, that's just absurd. They have some of the rowdiest sports fans in the nation. You want them throwing stuff at losers?

From the guy who threw out Missoula and Bemijdi as candidates, I don't think you're the guy to be talking about 'absurd.'

If Philadelphia is interested in bidding ('if' of course being the operative word there), here's how I think they should present their story (we'll get to venues and infrastructure in a sec, since those are kinda important too).

1) History - there's a lot of American history that Philadelphia can offer. So while it may lack international recognition, there is something to build on there that few other cities can offer.

2) Legacy - as noted, there are 6 universities in the city. Yes, some of the existing facilities are inadequate for the Olympics, but it's still a city that has a deep history in college athletics. Combine some existing venues and some newer ones and there is definitely a legacy that can be location.

3) Location - a lot of people still are in this mindset that Philadelphia can't bid because they're too close to New York and Washington and that Philly should just cede to them and not even bother. Needless to say, if NYC and DC aren't interested, that's not Philadelphia's problem. And I think that proximity could be an advantage.. gives Philadelphia a reason to say they're capable of being an internationally known city and that they just get lost in the shuffle being between DC and New York. Still, it puts them right at the center of the Northeast corridor and gives them easy access to several other major cities if those IOC bigwigs are concerned about spending 2 weeks in Philadelphia. That certainly could be viewed as a plus.

So again, that's all a start. Obviously they need a venue plan and so far, that plan hasn't come to light (in this forum, no less in public). Franklin Field is probably a no-go. The Linc is probably not workable as well. And I don't think a new stadium for Temple is the answer either. Don't know where that leaves Philadelphia. I'd love to see it, but at this point it's still tough envisioning the plan that's going to be the winner.

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Still, it puts them right at the center of the Northeast corridor and gives them easy access to several other major cities if those IOC bigwigs are concerned about spending 2 weeks in Philadelphia. That certainly could be viewed as a plus.

Somehow, that doesn't sound like a winning attribute to me. Philadelphia has to be convincing as to Y the world should come there. Not, "if you're still concerned about spending time here, you still have New York & DC a stone's throw away from us to visit if you give us the Games".

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Somehow, that doesn't sound like a winning attribute to me. Philadelphia has to be convincing as to Y the world should come there. Not, "if you're still concerned about spending time here, you still have New York & DC a stone's throw away from us to visit if you give us the Games".

I wouldn't think of it as a "winning attribute", just a nice bonus.

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