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USA 2024


Athensfan
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Really hope this thread isn't about to turn into yet another United States vs. Canada debate, as if there haven't been enough of those already.one.

Get use to it. You have the two biggest NOC's in North America (not to mention many members here from those two respective countries) contemplating 2024 bids. So it's only natural that the U.S. versus Canada debates come about from time to time around here.

And if both countries do go ahead with bids, it's gonna get much worse before it gets any better. This is nothing. And Heaven help us all then, cuz it's gonna be a full-fledge U.S. vs Canada mud-slinging match all over these boards. Besides, it's not anymore fatiguing than the "it's possible versus not possible" that the U.S. can host two Games again within 10 years debate that's been going on for the last several pages here already.

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Alright, I'm gonna say it and I'm sure I'm not the only one who's thinking it..

Anyone else find it interesting that mr.bernham joined the forum right around the same time that BR2028 disappeared from existence. And that mr.berhham just happened to find another site referencing a Baton Rouge 2028 Olympic bid? Quite the coincidence, isn't it.

Why are you assuming I am him? I found Urban Planet last year at around the same time I found Gamesbids. I was looking through all the state sub forums and clicked on Baton Rouge to see what all of BR's original fuss was about. Overall the city is not impressing or Olympic quality at all, but I saw "Timelord Nerds" post and it seemed strange, got more strange when he said he would be coming on here.

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Get use to it. You have the two biggest NOC's in North America (not to mention many members here from those two respective countries) contemplating 2024 bids. So it's only natural that the U.S. versus Canada debates come about from time to time around here.

And if both countries do go ahead with bids, it's gonna get much worse before it gets any better. This is nothing. And Heaven help us all then, cuz it's gonna be a full-fledge U.S. vs Canada mud-slinging match all over these boards. Besides, it's not anymore fatiguing than the "it's possible versus not possible" that the U.S. can host two Games again within 10 years debate that's been going on for the last several pages here already.

You know what though.. if there are actual bids from the United States and Canada and that's what we're debating, I'm fine with that. It's just when seemingly any discussion turns into USA vs. Canada for no good reason. Yea, I think we all saw a good preview of what might be in store for 2024 based on the Madrid vs. Istanbul vs. Tokyo debates of recent vintage. That being the case, I'm almost glad New York doesn't seem to be in the picture for 2024 so I don't have to fervently back my city and listen to people insult me as a result.

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I don't mean to be rude - but literally everything you contribute to this forum is mostly misguided and irrelevant.

How was Beijing a failure? How was Atlanta a failure? And despite 1996's shortcomings, how is this of any concern to Toronto?

How were the financial problems faced by Montreal in 1976 of any issue to any future Toronto bid? Different cites, different times.

There are many issues with a near future Toronto Olympic bid, but it is none of the above.

I meant Toronto's failed bids, also the fact that Montreal just finished paying off the debt in 2006 it can still be a big influence on a future bid.

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You know what though.. if there are actual bids from the United States and Canada and that's what we're debating, I'm fine with that. It's just when seemingly any discussion turns into USA vs. Canada for no good reason.

How is that any different than incessantly debating "the U.S. could, or could not, get both sets of Games for 2026 & 2036", though. Cuz I don't see it. And as a matter of fact, there's a much better probability that would could see both the U.S. & Canada bidding for 2024 than the clearly hypothetical of the U.S. 2026 & 2036. So the latter seems much more "for no good reason", imho.

Yea, I think we all saw a good preview of what might be in store for 2024 based on the Madrid vs. Istanbul vs. Tokyo debates of recent vintage. That being the case, I'm almost glad New York doesn't seem to be in the picture for 2024 so I don't have to fervently back my city and listen to people insult me as a result.

And which is also precisely why I'm glad that Chicago has vehemently said 'no' to a 2024 bid as well. I'd be able to deal with it much better if it's any of the others, like L.A., Boston, Dallas or Philadelphia.

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You know what though.. if there are actual bids from the United States and Canada and that's what we're debating, I'm fine with that. It's just when seemingly any discussion turns into USA vs. Canada for no good reason. Yea, I think we all saw a good preview of what might be in store for 2024 based on the Madrid vs. Istanbul vs. Tokyo debates of recent vintage. That being the case, I'm almost glad New York doesn't seem to be in the picture for 2024 so I don't have to fervently back my city and listen to people insult me as a result.

Bashing New York would be interesting to see. Nonetheless it is a city I hope to see host the games in my lifetime whether it is in 2024 or 2084.

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Why are you assuming I am him? I found Urban Planet last year at around the same time I found Gamesbids. I was looking through all the state sub forums and clicked on Baton Rouge to see what all of BR's original fuss was about. Overall the city is not impressing or Olympic quality at all, but I saw "Timelord Nerds" post and it seemed strange, got more strange when he said he would be coming on here.

I'm not assuming anything. I'm merely pointing out what a coincidence it is that 1 member stopped posting all of a sudden and hasn't returned since. And at almost the exact same time, another poster started posting who seems to be a fan of BR2028 and his alleged work. That's all.

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How is that any different than incessantly debating "the U.S. could, or could not, get both sets of Games for 2026 & 2036", though. Cuz I don't see it. And as a matter of fact, there's a much better probability that would could see both the U.S. & Canada bidding for 2024 than the clearly hypothetical of the U.S. 2026 & 2036. So the latter seems much more "for no good reason", imho.

Well if this board had a dollar for every incessant debate or fatiguing argument on these forums, we'd probably have enough money to make our own Olympic bid! That said, I'm gonna try and do us both a favor though and hopefully prevent another argument by not responding to that question.

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I stand corrected. (re: 1996 and 2008)

However, I still fail to understand how a future Toronto bid is threatened by the organisational issues of Montreal 1976. The Montreal Games were pre-LA84, prior to commercialisation restructuring of the Olympics. It was party of the reason LA adopted its model that is used today.

You cannot compare the organisational issues of any pre 1984 Olympics to any after. Los Angeles was a game changer.

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I'm not assuming anything. I'm merely pointing out what a coincidence it is that 1 member stopped posting all of a sudden and hasn't returned since. And at almost the exact same time, another poster started posting who seems to be a fan of BR2028 and his alleged work. That's all.

Just so you know I'm not a fan. And yes it is a coincidence (I guess) that I joined around the time he left, but I think my fight with him might have been his last straw.

I stand corrected. (re: 1996 and 2008)

However, I still fail to understand how a future Toronto bid is threatened by the organisational issues of Montreal 1976. The Montreal Games were pre-LA84, prior to commercialisation restructuring of the Olympics. It was party of the reason LA adopted its model that is used today.

You cannot compare the organisational issues of any pre 1984 Olympics to any after. Los Angeles was a game changer.

I think it would be threatened because there is always the fear of going over budget and for Canada the seem to have a history of it. Citizens in Vancouver now have higher taxes to pay for it's debt and that was a post LA games.

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I stand corrected. (re: 1996 and 2008)

However, I still fail to understand how a future Toronto bid is threatened by the organisational issues of Montreal 1976. The Montreal Games were pre-LA84, prior to commercialisation restructuring of the Olympics. It was party of the reason LA adopted its model that is used today.

You cannot compare the organisational issues of any pre 1984 Olympics to any after. Los Angeles was a game changer.

I agree. I think Canada successfully put the specter of Montreal to rest with Calgary and Vancouver. The PanAm Games should resolve any doubt about Canada's ability to stage financially viable Games.

Their bigger problem is convincing the IOC why Canada should host Summer Games before the United States and I think that will prove a challenge for them.

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Their bigger problem is convincing the IOC why Canada should host Summer Games before the United States and I think that will prove a challenge for them.

It's not even that, cuz that's not a convincing argument, even if its meant in a subtle way. Falls in-line to Madrid's "we're the only major European capital that's yet to host", speil.

The real challenge for the Canadians (& also the Americans, for that matter), is convincing the IOC why should they host Summer Games before the likes of France, Italy, Turkey & South Africa. And that will prove a challenge for either of them.

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The US is due a big summer olympics, the Olympics in the US always have a different feeling in my opinion, that is problably due to the fact that LA84 were the first olympics I saw. Chicago 16 would have been a very good OGs.

The United States isn't due anything. As noted, that's not a great narrative for either the USOC or the COC to bid with. When the USOC comes up with a compelling bid and puts it forth in the right time and place, then the United States will be due an Olympics. It'll happen eventually, but given who they could be competing against, it's going to be a tough sell without the right city and the right bid.

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It's not even that, cuz that's not a convincing argument, even if its meant in a subtle way. Falls in-line to Madrid's "we're the only major European capital that's yet to host", speil.

The real challenge for the Canadians (& also the Americans, for that matter), is convincing the IOC why should they host Summer Games before the likes of France, Italy, Turkey & South Africa. And that will prove a challenge for either of them.

Yes and no.

While no country is "owed" the Games, I believe continents are. That's a key part of what preserves the sense of truly global Games. The IOC ought to get back to North America semi-soon. I believe most IOC members will feel that. They may choose a European host or an African host first, they might choose both ahead of North America, but I would be shocked if they did not feel they needed to return to North America by 2032 at the latest.

Also, I believe that all prospective candidates have learned from recent campaigns that a story is important. That story may be national, but it will also be city-specific. I don't know what Toronto's story will be, but I believe the next US candidate will develop a good one -- if for no other reason than because they can see that they must.

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Would a long term approach from USOC actually be to go for 2026, which they'd be almost certain of getting, thereby handing Canada the next N American SOG. This would clear out their main rival, while also using 2026 to restore American credibility within the IOC. Then, in the cycles for 2040s, put forward a city, & be prepared to lose once or twice, but keep at it, & they'll get it. Also, 2026 would satisfy American hunger for an Olympics, especially as I believe the Winter games get even more viewers in the US than the Summer ones. Obviously if you want an American summer games ASAP, this is no good, but if you're prepared to wait, with a WOG in the meantime, would this work for the US?

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Would a long term approach from USOC actually be to go for 2026, which they'd be almost certain of getting, thereby handing Canada the next N American SOG. This would clear out their main rival, while also using 2026 to restore American credibility within the IOC. Then, in the cycles for 2040s, put forward a city, & be prepared to lose once or twice, but keep at it, & they'll get it. Also, 2026 would satisfy American hunger for an Olympics, especially as I believe the Winter games get even more viewers in the US than the Summer ones. Obviously if you want an American summer games ASAP, this is no good, but if you're prepared to wait, with a WOG in the meantime, would this work for the US?

Going for 2026 wouldn't be a long-term approach. It would be to settle for a short-term gain and handicap your chances at the bigger goal. I doubt the USOC is afraid to go up against the COC, so it's not like they need to let Canada have a Summer Olympics before they go after one (who is to say they'll land it anyway). Besides.. they should prepare to lose? Doesn't seem like a good strategy to me.

As for Winter vs. Summer, don't go off of viewership. More people are in front of their televisions in February than they are in July and August. But in spite of that, the Summer Olympics generate a lot more revenue than the Winter Olympics and they largely always have.

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Going for 2026 wouldn't be a long-term approach. It would be to settle for a short-term gain and handicap your chances at the bigger goal. I doubt the USOC is afraid to go up against the COC, so it's not like they need to let Canada have a Summer Olympics before they go after one (who is to say they'll land it anyway). Besides.. they should prepare to lose? Doesn't seem like a good strategy to me.

Exactly. A bid for 2026 would be settling for instant gratification rather than persevering towards the bigger goal.

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Exactly. A bid for 2026 would be settling for instant gratification rather than persevering towards the bigger goal.

My dear friend athensfan dont get tired yourself for Olympics hosting. There is a solution for all olympics in future, your name gave that solution. Olympic games in permanent base in Athens, Greece, their birthplace... :D

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My dear friend athensfan dont get tired yourself for Olympics hosting. There is a solution for all olympics in future, your name gave that solution. Olympic games in permanent base in Athens, Greece, their birthplace... :D

Oh yeah because that turned out to be a great idea after the closing ceremonies.

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My dear friend athensfan dont get tired yourself for Olympics hosting. There is a solution for all olympics in future, your name gave that solution. Olympic games in permanent base in Athens, Greece, their birthplace... :D

Well, actually their birthplace is in the small village of Olympia. But that idea has been floated around and summarily squelched. The modern Games founder, de Coubertin and his original band of IOC'ers, wanted and so desire to make the Games universal...which is why they are spread around the world -- in all 3 versions and ONLY the Lighting of the Flame is done in Greece. And the present-day IOC has rightfully maintained that concept and which is why it is also headquartered in neutral Switzerland rather then Greece.

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