baron-pierreIV Posted August 1, 2011 Report Share Posted August 1, 2011 OK, here's the latest, August 1 report from The New York Times: USA, S Africa File Papers for Possible 2020 Bids By THE ASSOCIATED PRESS LONDON (AP) — The United States and South Africa are among at least five countries that have filed preliminary paperwork required by the IOC ahead of any potential bids for the 2020 Olympics. The U.S. and South African Olympic committees told The Associated Press they submitted forms confirming compliance with rules of the World Anti-Doping Agency and Court of Arbitration for Sport. The documents were filed before Saturday, the deadline set by the International Olympic Committee. Italy, Japan and Spain said they also sent in their forms. Turkey and Qatar would not confirm they filed the papers, but are believed to have done so. National Olympic Committees have until Sept. 1 to submit the names of any 2020 applicant cities to the IOC. COULD THIS BE IT? Canada 2020 OUT!! Try again in 2036, Toronto. http://www.nytimes.com/aponline/2011/08/01/sports/AP-OLY-2020-Bids.html?_r=1&hp Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
intoronto Posted August 1, 2011 Report Share Posted August 1, 2011 Not so fast. The possibility of a U.S. or South Africa bid remains uncertain. "We submitted compliance papers as a matter of protocol," USOC spokesman Patrick Sandusky said in an email. "We did not submit a city name along with them. We just signed them as the NOC." The USOC reiterated that it would not consider a bid unless and until it finalizes a new revenue-sharing deal with the IOC. "At this point our focus is on completing our financial deal with the IOC and we are not currently considering a 2020 bid," Sandusky said. Toronto please bid. US, SAfrica file papers for possible 2020 bids Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baron-pierreIV Posted August 1, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 1, 2011 Toronto please bid. I know it's all preliminary. But to proceed to Step 2 (which is the August 31st Letter of Interest to the IOC), candidates must first COMPLY with this step. The deadline was Saturday. Surely, Canada would've said so by now, if they did. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
intoronto Posted August 1, 2011 Report Share Posted August 1, 2011 I know it's all preliminary. But to proceed to Step 2 (which is the August 31st Letter of Interest to the IOC), candidates must first COMPLY with this step. The deadline was Saturday. Surely, Canada would've said so by now, if they did. They didn't have too, just like Turkey and Qatar. Remember the article said at least five no only five countries entered the forms. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baron-pierreIV Posted August 1, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 1, 2011 Qatar for sure ISN'T going for 2020. We know that. They already have 2022. Its neighbor Dubai has officially said it will go after 2024. If Turkey hasn't confirmed anything, maybe it's decided to sit out for awhile?? Y would the 3 countires keep quiet about or hide it? That's NOT what you want when entering an OPEN race like this. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
intoronto Posted August 1, 2011 Report Share Posted August 1, 2011 Qatar for sure ISN'T going for 2020. We know that. They already have 2022. Its neighbor Dubai has officially said it will go after 2024. If Turkey hasn't confirmed anything, maybe it's decided to sit out for awhile?? Y would the 3 countires keep quiet about or hide it? That's NOT what you want when entering an OPEN race like this. So it doesn't allow the USA to bid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baron-pierreIV Posted August 1, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 1, 2011 So it doesn't allow the USA to bid What? U're not making sense. The USA will PROBABLY NOT bid...but it just did the required paperwork (as it seems So. Africa has) IN ORDER to proceed at the last minute if circumstances change. But you can infer from this who are serious and who aren't. That's the way to read the tea leaves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
intoronto Posted August 1, 2011 Report Share Posted August 1, 2011 What? U're not making sense. The USA will PROBABLY NOT bid...but it just did the required paperwork (as it seems So. Africa has) IN ORDER to proceed at the last minute if circumstances change. But you can infer from this who are serious and who aren't. That's the way to read the tea leaves. I meant it this way: If the Canada bids wouldn't the USA kind of be forced to bid as well? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baron-pierreIV Posted August 1, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 1, 2011 I meant it this way: If the Canada bids wouldn't the USA kind of be forced to bid as well? Not necessarily. I wouldn't look at it that way because I could not guess the thinking of the 2 NOCs and see if they want to be competitive. If anything, it's a bad move because it would SPLIT the very small regional 1st round bloc of votes that the No. America-Caribbean bloc has. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athensfan Posted August 2, 2011 Report Share Posted August 2, 2011 I meant it this way: If the Canada bids wouldn't the USA kind of be forced to bid as well? No. The U.S. is not going to jump into the race unless there is a qualified city. Their decision is more likely to be impacted by SA's decision than Canada's. Also, if there were absolutely no chance whatsoever of the United States bidding, they wouldn't have submitted the paperwork. I still don't think an American bid is likely, but the chances are at least a little greater than zero. In one of the other threads you said that we don't decide, the IOC does. That's true, but it could be a response to ANY post on this forum. Who cares what we think about anything if the IOC decides? We may not get a vote, but we have been watching these races for years and we have some idea of how they may play out. Of course we can be wrong, but if recent history tells us anything, it tells us that the IOC is DEEPLY COMMITTED to spreading the Games out. I cannot imagine that 2 Canadian Games within 10 years would fit into their vision -- whether or not the US jumps into the race. If the US is dumb enough to bid for Winter Olympics in the 20's then I think Canada will have a much better shot at hosting Summer Games in the 30's, but that's the soonest I see any realistic chance for Toronto. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
intoronto Posted August 2, 2011 Report Share Posted August 2, 2011 Off course your opinion makes a lot of sense, but we have seen weirder things happen in life. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baron-pierreIV Posted August 2, 2011 Author Report Share Posted August 2, 2011 U 2 r nuts. Int hoping for a last-minute Toronto bid and Athens similarly hoping a last-minute US bid JUST TO FORESTALL a possible 2022 Winter bid. What is all this "last-minute chance"? AIN'T GONNA HAPPEN FOR BOTH!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athensfan Posted August 2, 2011 Report Share Posted August 2, 2011 Off course your opinion makes a lot of sense, but we have seen weirder things happen in life. If the COC wants to gamble $100 million on something "weirder" happening, they can go ahead. It would only be a continuation of Toronto's history of very ill-timed bids. And history would repeat itself.... Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
intoronto Posted August 2, 2011 Report Share Posted August 2, 2011 1996 was not badly timed. 2008 was badly timed. I doubt they spend $100 million maybe something in the range of $50 million. Do you know which costs are associated with bids? Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kenadian Posted August 2, 2011 Report Share Posted August 2, 2011 Given the cost of a bid and that Toronto is hosting the 2015 PanAms, they might want to prioritize where that money should be spent. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
intoronto Posted August 2, 2011 Report Share Posted August 2, 2011 Given the cost of a bid and that Toronto is hosting the 2015 PanAms, they might want to prioritize where that money should be spent. TO2015 and a proposed Olympic bid are totally not connected financially. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faster Posted August 2, 2011 Report Share Posted August 2, 2011 TO2015 and a proposed Olympic bid are totally not connected financially. They are connected. Some would rather wait and use a successful Pan Ams as a springboard to the Olympics, just as Rio did. It is easier to show you are ready with a successful games behind you, especially since Toronto has no history of hosting world championships. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
intoronto Posted August 2, 2011 Report Share Posted August 2, 2011 They are connected. Some would rather wait and use a successful Pan Ams as a springboard to the Olympics, just as Rio did. It is easier to show you are ready with a successful games behind you, especially since Toronto has no history of hosting world championships. I meant financially not experience. Toronto has hosted the IAAF indoor championships in 1993, 1994 FIBA World Championship, 2007 FIFA u20 World Cup, Churchill Cup etc.. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
memorabilia Posted August 2, 2011 Report Share Posted August 2, 2011 1996 was not badly timed. 2008 was badly timed. I doubt they spend $100 million maybe something in the range of $50 million. Do you know which costs are associated with bids? Bid committees have to pay fees to the IOC... Bid committees have to conduct feasibility studies, technical studies (Transport, venues, technology, security, environment...), planing (general, financial, strategic) Bid committees have to promote the bid locally and internationality (communication supports, strategic experts, but also a lot of travels) Bid committees have to produce a bid book (and some other official documents) and to ship them all around the world ! Bid committees have to organise an Evaluation Commission Visit, a Presentation at the IOC, a Final presentation and some other continentals one.... So that a lot of costs... A minimum of 30 millions Euros. Over is better to give emphasis to your exposure, but from my point of view is not necessary... the IOC should put a amount cap ! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athensfan Posted August 2, 2011 Report Share Posted August 2, 2011 1996 was not badly timed. 2008 was badly timed. I doubt they spend $100 million maybe something in the range of $50 million. Do you know which costs are associated with bids? I disagree about 1996. The vote was just a year after Calgary and at that time Montreal was still fresh in the memory as well, with monumental debt still hanging over that city. I'm not saying Montreal is a major problem now, but it was during the vote for 1996. Had the timing been better, Toronto wouldn't have finished third. According to CNN, Chicago spent $100 million on their bid for 2016. See reference below: http://money.cnn.com/2009/10/02/news/economy/chicago_olympics_rejection/index.htm Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Faster Posted August 2, 2011 Report Share Posted August 2, 2011 I disagree about 1996. The vote was just a year after Calgary and at that time Montreal was still fresh in the memory as well, with monumental debt still hanging over that city. I'm not saying Montreal is a major problem now, but it was during the vote for 1996. Had the timing been better, Toronto wouldn't have finished third. According to CNN, Chicago spent $100 million on their bid for 2016. See reference below: http://money.cnn.com/2009/10/02/news/economy/chicago_olympics_rejection/index.htm The 1996 was in 1990 not 1989 and it was purely money that motived votes to go in favour of Atlanta instead of Toronto. The 4 anglo-cities had agreed to tell their supporters to back the remaining anglo cities against Athens. The reason Toronto finished ahead of Melbourne was related to the goodwill of Calgary and according to a few people over the years have said that Toronto was the only other city besides Athens and Atlanta to be considered a possibility to win. Ultimately the lobbying failed Toronto but Toronto had a lot better chance of winning in 1990 then it did in 2001. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athensfan Posted August 2, 2011 Report Share Posted August 2, 2011 The 1996 was in 1990 not 1989 and it was purely money that motived votes to go in favour of Atlanta instead of Toronto. The 4 anglo-cities had agreed to tell their supporters to back the remaining anglo cities against Athens. The reason Toronto finished ahead of Melbourne was related to the goodwill of Calgary and according to a few people over the years have said that Toronto was the only other city besides Athens and Atlanta to be considered a possibility to win. Ultimately the lobbying failed Toronto but Toronto had a lot better chance of winning in 1990 then it did in 2001. Didn't do my homework on 1989 vs. 1990. Sorry about that. I'm not saying Toronto's chances weren't better for '96 than they were for '08, I'm just saying that the timing still wasn't good. 2 years after Calgary. 14 years after Montreal with substantial lingering debt. Whatever the IOC's reasons for choosing Atlanta, the timeframe was still really off for Toronto. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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