Madrid 2020

[emre]

i really start to dislike this 20020 bid.will be happy if tokyo or ıstanbul wins but more if madrid elliminates first...

[Amarillo]

Argenitinian and Spanish flags in Buenos Aires before IOC's election

[baron-pierreIV]

Argenitinian and Spanish flags in Buenos Aires before IOC's election

The IOC is NOT going to like that if there are NO Turkic and Japanese flags flying as well. Makes BA a very partisan host. The IOC will ask that those be taken down.

[FYI]

it didn't hurt Rio.

At least Rio actually had a COMPELLING argument!

[Treo]

At least Rio actually had a COMPELLING argument!

I'm yet to see any of the three cities coming up with a compelling argument like Rio did!

[FYI]

That maybe so. But I sure as heck can say which one of the three has the least compelling factor. The one with the austerity, 'fiscally responsible' dictating narrative.

[paul]

At least Rio actually had a COMPELLING argument!

...what was it....oh yea "Chicagoans for Rio"!

[baron-pierreIV]

The one with the austerity, 'fiscally responsible' dictating narrative.

But BUILT all (or 80% of) the venues beforehand WITHOUT certainty of getting the Olympic Games. What kind of "austerity" thinking is that?? And if the Olympics NEVER come to Madrid, what will the city do with all those venues? It would be interesting to stay tuned to the fate of all those premature 'Olympic' venues. It was more 'foolhardy' and 'desperate' thinking rather than an 'austerity-minded' philosophy.

And that's why the spiel of "Giving Madrid will boost the economy" rings so hallow becuz if 80% is already built...then the remaining 20% is NOT enough to boost the economy. If they HADN'T built all those venues prematurely, then Madrid can honestly say...well, building the remaining venues will truly be an infusion of economic activity to the economy. But they are past that, so?????

Edited September 2, 2013 by baron-pierreIV

[Cinderella]

At least in this forums, seems the race have turned into a dirty one. Not a single word about compelling bids and plenty of crap against each other... I really want now for this shitty race to be over.

[paul]

That maybe so. But I sure as heck can say which one of the three has the least compelling factor. The one with the austerity, 'fiscally responsible' dictating narrative.

Now this is a serious question, not trying to argue…

We keep talking about the Austerity aspect of the Spanish bid, but didn’t they build and invest millions…or billions already following up on many projects form the last 2 bids?? If you add all that investment into their current budget where does that put them in spend? Is it fair to keep dwelling on their 1.9 billion stated budget when they have invested a lot already?

Also…this seems like the right time after Beijing / Sochi to avoid overpriced games and make a model like Madrid work, we know they can do it so why not get all the PR windfall of games that are not spun financially out of control? I think this is a valid selling point. But of course we all like extravagance so maybe a loosing point.

At least in this forums, seems the race have turned into a dirty one. Not a single word about compelling bids and plenty of crap against each other... I really want now for this shitty race to be over.

total race to the bottom, that's the modern Olympic "game". Inspiration is in the past.

Edited September 2, 2013 by paul

[FYI]

Now this is a serious question, not trying to argue…

We keep talking about the Austerity aspect of the Spanish bid, but didn’t they build and invest millions…or billions already following up on many projects form the last 2 bids?? If you add all that investment into their current budget where does that put them in spend? Is it fair to keep dwelling on their 1.9 billion stated budget when they have invested a lot already?

But $1.9 Billion is still too low. Remember, the USOC in their letter to the 35 U.S. cities that they need an amount of at least $3 Billion for operational costs alone. NOT including any infrastructure upgrades nor new venues. Even their security budget is extremely low, a mere fraction of what London 2012 was. And it was even criticized by the IOC 2020 Evaluation Committee as "modestly low".

Also…this seems like the right time after Beijing / Sochi to avoid overpriced games and make a model like Madrid work, we know they can do it so why not get all the PR windfall of games that are not spun financially out of control? I think this is a valid selling point. But of course we all like extravagance so maybe a loosing point.

Then this doesn't bode well for a San Diego 2024 bid, now does it. Where even civic leaders have already said a Games there would cost $10 Billion. But by 2024 Olympic dollars, that could easily double.

[Cinderella]

Now this is a serious question, not trying to argue…

We keep talking about the Austerity aspect of the Spanish bid, but didn’t they build and invest millions…or billions already following up on many projects form the last 2 bids?? If you add all that investment into their current budget where does that put them in spend? Is it fair to keep dwelling on their 1.9 billion stated budget when they have invested a lot already?

.

I always thought it was not a that bad argument to defend during the race specially considering the global financial moment that the world is living. Nevertheless, Madrid should have started months ago to sell a joyful, compelling image of the not-that-well-known city instead of insisting on what's already obvious. I sincerely expect a boombastic presentation in Argentina in order to believe the Spanish NOC does really understand what the Olympic movement really wants from host cities.

[paul]

Then this doesn't bode well for a San Diego 2024 bid, now does it. Where even civic leaders have already said a Games there would cost $10 Billion. But by 2024 Olympic dollars, that could easily double.

Not every host would follow this model if Madrid wins, it would however re-set the idea that the Olympic Games are unattainable for all but the biggest capitols, richest countries and questionable governments desperate and willing to fund any Olympics (at any cost) as the ultimate propaganda tool to try to influence the free world.

...regarding San Diego:

Dude, I am not a one-dimensional entity that is beholden only to one idea just because I mention it. I like San Diego because it is so glorious an environment for the games, and I realized that a lot of people reading this site had no clue what San Diego is or could offer, and I know San Diego very well so I though I’d tell a bit about it. It doesn’t mean I am ONLY interested in San Diego or that I am emotionally invested in the idea above others. It would be an interesting bid and I think could be a memorable Olympic Games…..one day, so could many other cities.

Edited September 2, 2013 by paul

[Rob2012]

I spent my holidays in Istanbul one year ago. Dirty city and thiefs everywhere. Taxis and waiters try to thief me five times in a week. I don't want that the Olympic family feel the same that me.

I found Istanbul extremely friendly for the most part, much more open than I'd expected, and whilst it's not as clean as Western European cities and has a lot of stray cats and dogs I wouldn't say it was filthy.

The only "trouble" I had was falling for the apparently well-known "shoe polisher scam", and I fell for it literally as soon as I got off the coach...

The trick is simple:

-Shoe polisher will pass you in a quiet narrow street and "accidentally" drops a brush

-Of course your are honest, pick up the brush and call the crook into his game

-He seems to be thankful and offers you a "free" shoe polish

-In the odd case he guides you to an ever quitener place to be out of sight of local police

-In the end he demands money (coins will offend him in this part of the game) and as soon your wallet is open he will take as much paper money as he can get (in the mean time playing Mr. Innocent in a perfect way)

http://www.virtualtourist.com/travel/Middle_East/Turkey/Istanbul_Ili/Istanbul-1837624/Warnings_or_Dangers-Istanbul-shoe_polishers-BR-1.html

I was stupid enough to fall for the "free" shoe polish but not stupid enough to get my wallet out once he started demanding cash. I fobbed him off with a loose note I had in my pocket.

It is, though, a really great place to visit and such things wouldn't put me off visiting again and seeing more of the city. The only thing putting me off supporting them for 2020 is the politics in the country right now.

Edited September 2, 2013 by RobH

[Tutankamon]

Please spanish, turkish and Japanes people, please be relaxed and enjoy this last week previous to election, and try to dont be disgusting each other, everyone who have said a single word against other is responsible , so try to say now good things about each city and show us the glory of each city.

My hope is Madrid winning hehe obvious.

Enjoy.

[Michelinternational]

^^

+1.000.000

[Sir Rols]

Also…this seems like the right time after Beijing / Sochi to avoid overpriced games and make a model like Madrid work, we know they can do it so why not get all the PR windfall of games that are not spun financially out of control? I think this is a valid selling point. But of course we all like extravagance so maybe a loosing point.

I do agree with you on that. In light of recent concerns about Sochi's extravagant budget and Brazilian protests, I think it actually is a pretty good case to put, and could well resonate with the IOC members. My problem with it though is, as FYI pointed out, they've seriously and disingenuously under-fudged their figures to make it inevitable their gonna get criticised when the budget goes up. And as Cinderella points out, they should have also been pushing a more joyful, positive message about how they'll burnish the image of the games beyond "we'll do it on the cheap".

[runningrings]

But why do it on the cheap when there are other options that propose real (honest) figures that recognise the Olympics for what it is - a big, expensive extravaganza. Bottom line: Turkey and Japan are in a position to do this. Spain is not. They admit this through their no frills bid. I know it has been said over and over, but its almost like Madrid is behaving has if it HAS to host the 2020 Games under duress.

I think you either go hard or not at all. I don't see why the Olympic movement should suffer a lower volume event in 2020 just because some ridiculous European country can't balance its books. I'd be furious if Australia was in such deep turmoil and we were attempting something like the Olympics (in fact, an idea like that wouldn't even get up now, and we are in a substantially stronger economic position than Spain)

[bimbo87]

This is what IOC members will find when they arrive in Buenos Aires. Argentinian and Spanish flags along Buenos Aires streets.

Madrid can surprise to the World this time... I wish.

MADRID2020 It is not a dream... MADRID2020 is already real. We are ready.

[Sir Rols]

This is what IOC members will find when they arrive in Buenos Aires. Argentinian and Spanish flags along Buenos Aires streets.

I'd expectt the IOC will instruct the city to take the Spanish flags down.

[bimbo87]

I'd expectt the IOC will instruct the city to take the Spanish flags down.

Why?? Each city can do what they want... Free opinion... you are like Russians... MADRID 2020 TOO MUCH MORE THAN A FREEDOM CITY!

[paul]

The host city must remain neutral.

If it is private citizens putting them up then so be it.

Edited September 3, 2013 by paul

[Sir Rols]

Why?? Each city can do what they want... Free opinion... you are like Russians... MADRID 2020 TOO MUCH MORE THAN A FREEDOM CITY!

No, IOC rules forbid partisan materials like that to be displayed around the location where the session is held. So it's against IOC rules.

I's also remind you spamming is against GBids rules - and you've posted the same post in numerous threads, some of which, like in the Tokyo and Istanbul threads, are irrelevant to the pic.

Edited September 3, 2013 by Sir Rols

[FYI]

^NO, it's not! The Argentines are hosting a session where THREE cities from three different COUNTRIES are coming to to win over the IOC. Are there other streets with just Japanese & Turkish flags?! If not, then it's preferential treatment at best, or blantant bias at worst! If its the latter, I hope many, MANY IOC members are completely turned off! The Argentines need to be NEUTRAL in this, not be taking sides.

[bimbo87]

No, IOC rules forbid partisan materials like that to be displayed around the location where the session is held. So it's against IOC rules.

I's also remind you spamming is against GBids rules - and you've posted the same in numerous threads, some of which are irrelevant to the pic.

Don't be angry my friend. Tell IOC members what you need to say but don't tell me what I have to do .

Seguro que si fueran banderas de Estambul o Tokyo nadie se quejaría... como son de España ya se quejan, venga hombre! VIVA ESPAÑA y los HISPANOAMERICANOS!

^NO, it's not! The Argentines are hosting a session where THREE cities from three different COUNTRIES are coming to to win over the IOC. Are there other streets with just Japanese & Turkish flags?! If not, then it's preferential treatment at best, or blantant bias at worst! If its the latter, I hope many, MANY IOC members are completely turned off! The Argentines need to be NEUTRAL in this, not be taking sides.

Maybe there are other flags from Turkey and Japan. I just saw that picture in a Spanish newspaper. Maybe it is not real and it is an old picture when King Juan Carlos I visited Argentina. Who knows..