The Great Southern Challenge

[Alexjc]

Really you would only go for a Queenstown/Wanaka Lakes bid.  Still for what they are worth a New Zealand WOGs would be a VERY expensive affair.  

Although both towns have good airports, they would need massive upgrading, especially Wanaka.  Invercargill's airport could be used as an overflow destination as the roads between there and Queenstown are pretty good.  Invercargill lacks first rate accomodation though.   :oh:

[Sir Rols]

Surely having Christchurch as the anchor city would lessen the cost somewhat _ less infrastructure to upgrade and more future scope for continual use of any venues that would have to be built. I also think it would be easier to sell to the IOC than Queenstown (after all, the indications are the WOGs are moving towards larger host cities rather than the village-type affairs that used to be able to host them).

One thought _ it would be good for NZ to build a luge/bobsled run _ even without a WOG it would help cement NZ's reputation as an adventure travel destination.

[Alexjc]

One thought _ it would be good for NZ to build a luge/bobsled run _ even without a WOG it would help cement NZ's reputation as an adventure travel destination.

Yes and they would- with a set of ski-jump track towers as well.  And which field(s) would get them? Who would pay for them? The NZ Government would have to step in with some cash(they've got enough of it stashed away!!).

It's just a matter of where?  To which Queenstown would be the favorite for these EXPENSIVE facilities.  Once they are in, it's permenant.  And your right, they are alot of fun, and Queenstown's extreme sports nature is the place for them.

So the WOGs stand a better chance there even if Christchurch is the Host City.

[Sir Rols]

One thought _ it would be good for NZ to build a luge/bobsled run _ even without a WOG it would help cement NZ's reputation as an adventure travel destination.

Yes and they would- with a set of ski-jump track towers as well.  And which field(s) would get them? Who would pay for them? The NZ Government would have to step in with some cash(they've got enough of it stashed away!!).

It's just a matter of where?  To which Queenstown would be the favorite for these EXPENSIVE facilities.  Once they are in, it's permenant.  And your right, they are alot of fun, and Queenstown's extreme sports nature is the place for them.

So the WOGs stand a better chance there even if Christchurch is the Host City.

Yes, I agree, they would be pricey, big ticket items. Which makes me think they wouldn't get built without the incentive of an imminent Winter Games, and a bit of government monetary assistance.

I also agree they would make more sense in the Queenstown district, really cement the extreme sports destination reputation.

[Alexjc]

One thought _ it would be good for NZ to build a luge/bobsled run _ even without a WOG it would help cement NZ's reputation as an adventure travel destination.

Yes and they would- with a set of ski-jump track towers as well.  And which field(s) would get them? Who would pay for them? The NZ Government would have to step in with some cash(they've got enough of it stashed away!!).

It's just a matter of where?  To which Queenstown would be the favorite for these EXPENSIVE facilities.  Once they are in, it's permenant.  And your right, they are alot of fun, and Queenstown's extreme sports nature is the place for them.

So the WOGs stand a better chance there even if Christchurch is the Host City.

Yes, I agree, they would be pricey, big ticket items. Which makes me think they wouldn't get built without the incentive of an imminent Winter Games, and a bit of government monetary assistance.

I also agree they would make more sense in the Queenstown district, really cement the extreme sports destination reputation.

I Hope so... However I can tell you this, once these facilities are in, EXPECT some of the silliest, mind numbingly stupidest and downright dangerous extreme sports to be invented on them!!!  As New Zealanders, they just can't help themselves whoa for the Olympics :grinning:

[Alexjc]

...And to cap that all off, Dunedin has opened it's Olympic ice skating rink(25/10/04), so now three rinks of  that size exist in the South Island (Gore, and Christchurch also) .  Leaving Queenstown to build theirs, soon.

:grinning:

[Aronious]

...And to cap that all off, Dunedin has opened it's Olympic ice skating rink(25/10/04), so now three rinks of  that size exist in the South Island (Gore, and Christchurch also) .  Leaving Queenstown to build theirs, soon.

:grinning:

But do any of these facilities have Olympic seating capacities, or the ability to have them?

[Alexjc]

But do any of these facilities have Olympic seating capacities, or the ability to have them?

Dunedin can with resonable ease,  Christchurch is looking to rebuild it's rink with a Winter OG in mind  (ice-hockey etc...), baring in mind the have a 10 000 seat indoor stadium already.

Gore would only be used for team practise, if Queenstown built theirs they would consider the fact that the ice-hockey would have to go somewhere, probibly Chistchurch.  

Invercargill's huge indoor Stadium Southland would easily cater for a temporary rink.

[mattygs]

If Christchurch does bid , they will need to be careful that they are realistic.

By that, I mean they will have to make sure not to take the high and mighty morralistic road of preparing ultra ultra no frills indoor venues.

They may have all the best intentions in the world, but there is no point putting together a pile of #### if they know the members will never vote for it. LOL.

Might as well do it properly I think.

ie: They may think it is a bloody marvelous idea to make the venue for figure skating a yucky old air hanger with a temporary ice sheet and temporary seats - but if the IOC members by and large thing that is la la land stuff, why put it in the bid.

[baron-pierreIV]

I swear I had posted this before.  My question is:  OK, well and good, southern sites have all the venues, etc.  Now - how do you get the winter sports federations to line up with your schedule?

I mean the training schedule of the winter world is geared to the northern schedule -- and on Olympic years, it is all timed to peak in February.  How do you motivate the SFs and the athletes to peak early in Sept/Oct?  What do they have to look forward to after Sept/Oct?  If I were a top winter athlete, I know that would throw me for a loop, and maybe only GOBS of Money would force me to accept that abnormal schedule.

[KRATK]

I think the athlets will be OK to train in their own countries in the northern winter. And the top winter athlets train all the year... in Europe or USA in northern winter, but in middle of year they train in Chile or New Zealand... so I don't think it could be a big problem... Maybe if in the same year there will be other winter tournments, but I don't think so.

[Sir Rols]

As Kratk said, the elite athletes train all year round anyway if they're anywhere near serious. Plus, if it's an Olympics year, if an athlete is hungry for gold, they'll do what they have to do. If it was a non-Olympic year and it was a one-off, or even a couple, of World Cup events down south you would probably find a lot of the stars sitting them out. But an Olympics _ they'll come what may.

Whoever hosts in the South _ be it NZ or Chile _ it certainly would make sense to try and strike a deal with the federation like FIS and try to get some lead-up series in the months before the WOG _ An FIS-sanctioned southern hemisphere World Cup series taking in Aust, NZ, Chile and Argentina, for example, leading up to the games would be great for incentives, training, acclimatisation and publicity.

[Alexjc]

Whoever hosts in the South _ be it NZ or Chile _ it certainly would make sense to try and strike a deal with the federation like FIS and try to get some lead-up series in the months before the WOG _ An FIS-sanctioned southern hemisphere World Cup series taking in Aust, NZ, Chile and Argentina, for example, leading up to the games would be great for incentives, training, acclimatisation and publicity.

Yes the only way to raise an Olympic bid profile.  Skiing is the bread winner for future ambitions. Would also need to host an Ice-Hockey championship on a regular basis from now and prehaps the occasional figure skating championship as well.  These would generate Televison revenue and thus raise New Zealand, Australia and Chile's winter sports profile.

[Sir Rols]

Whoever hosts in the South _ be it NZ or Chile _ it certainly would make sense to try and strike a deal with the federation like FIS and try to get some lead-up series in the months before the WOG _ An FIS-sanctioned southern hemisphere World Cup series taking in Aust, NZ, Chile and Argentina, for example, leading up to the games would be great for incentives, training, acclimatisation and publicity.

Yes the only way to raise an Olympic bid profile.  Skiing is the bread winner for future ambitions. Would also need to host an Ice-Hockey championship on a regular basis from now and prehaps the occasional figure skating championship as well.  These would generate Televison revenue and thus raise New Zealand, Australia and Chile's winter sports profile.

That should really be the first big step _ someone in the South _ NZ, Chile, Argentina or Oz _ really has to go all out and win rights to host the World Figure Skating Championship. It's certainly achievable by any of the countries in the immediate future and would be a great kick-off to future winter games ambitions.

Even this could be a bit of a difficult fight (As Australia found out bwhen brisbane was slated to host the championships in, I think, 2001) but even that could be good practice in how to play hardball in the world sports events bidding stakes.

[baron-pierreIV]

Whoever hosts in the South _ be it NZ or Chile _ it certainly would make sense to try and strike a deal with the federation like FIS and try to get some lead-up series in the months before the WOG _ An FIS-sanctioned southern hemisphere World Cup series taking in Aust, NZ, Chile and Argentina, for example, leading up to the games would be great for incentives, training, acclimatisation and publicity.

Yes the only way to raise an Olympic bid profile.  Skiing is the bread winner for future ambitions. Would also need to host an Ice-Hockey championship on a regular basis from now and prehaps the occasional figure skating championship as well.  These would generate Televison revenue and thus raise New Zealand, Australia and Chile's winter sports profile.

That should really be the first big step _ someone in the South _ NZ, Chile, Argentina or Oz _ really has to go all out and win rights to host the World Figure Skating Championship. It's certainly achievable by any of the countries in the immediate future and would be a great kick-off to future winter games ambitions.

Even this could be a bit of a difficult fight (As Australia found out bwhen brisbane was slated to host the championships in, I think, 2001) but even that could be good practice in how to play hardball in the world sports events bidding stakes.

Following up on a renewed idea for a southern World Figure Skating Championships (since as roltel said, the first attempt at one in Brisbane ended in a fiasco); here are 2 questions the ISU and the major national FS assoc. ask:  

1.  Can the prospective southern hosts guarantee full and enthusiastic live audiences for the week of competition (think early Athens events)?  

2.  Will the distance be worth the cost for northern skaters' families and friends to fly down there and support their athletes?  FS is an expensive enough sport as it is, how about added expense of flying down family and friends of the competitors?  You can be sure, if those are unsatisfactory Championships, the unhappy stories that will filter back to the ISU, then to the IOC, in this regard will dim/doom any future southern WOG bids.

[Sir Rols]

Crowd suppprt shouldn't be a worry _ just as in the north, the ice dancing events are amongst the most popular and highest rating evcents of the WOGs (and of course cross the gender barrier, bringing in a very high proportion of women viewers _ mjuch to the delight of advertisers). In the Brisbane Goodwill Games, ice sports were among the most popular and sold out events (plus, if you're talking Australia at least, you'd get a crowd to attend a paint drying contest if it had an international cachet to it).

As to flying in friends and family _ hmmmm. What's the usual policy for FIS events? Is that routine? They'd do it if they have to, I suppose, but just remember _ if a competitor was based in, say, the west coast of the USA, it's probably the same travel time and distance (and maybe even less) to fly to Aust or NZ as it would be to go to Nice, Belgrade or Moscow.

[Eruedan]

By the way so y'all know it wasn't a balls-up on Brisbane's end regarding the 2001 Champs - the ISU didn't like the idea of one southern hemispherian city hogging 2 major Ice Skating competitions so close too each other.

[baron-pierreIV]

As to flying in friends and family _ hmmmm. What's the usual policy for FIS events? Is that routine? They'd do it if they have to, I suppose, but just remember _ if a competitor was based in, say, the west coast of the USA, it's probably the same travel time and distance (and maybe even less) to fly to Aust or NZ as it would be to go to Nice, Belgrade or Moscow.

You're probably right, Roltel, about the distances.  I guess it's just a psychological thing for me in thinking that flying over those long distances over water seems longer than say flying over the more crowded European and North American continents.  

Actually, even better than a World FS Championships for starters, is get into the Grand Prix -- since that has like 5 stops.  But like a FS Championships, the ISU wants that in a major city, so pretty much something a Santiago or Auckland could do -- but not a Bariloche.

[KRATK]

Whoever hosts in the South _ be it NZ or Chile _ it certainly would make sense to try and strike a deal with the federation like FIS and try to get some lead-up series in the months before the WOG _ An FIS-sanctioned southern hemisphere World Cup series taking in Aust, NZ, Chile and Argentina, for example, leading up to the games would be great for incentives, training, acclimatisation and publicity.

Yes the only way to raise an Olympic bid profile.  Skiing is the bread winner for future ambitions. Would also need to host an Ice-Hockey championship on a regular basis from now and prehaps the occasional figure skating championship as well.  These would generate Televison revenue and thus raise New Zealand, Australia and Chile's winter sports profile.

That should really be the first big step _ someone in the South _ NZ, Chile, Argentina or Oz _ really has to go all out and win rights to host the World Figure Skating Championship. It's certainly achievable by any of the countries in the immediate future and would be a great kick-off to future winter games ambitions.

Even this could be a bit of a difficult fight (As Australia found out bwhen brisbane was slated to host the championships in, I think, 2001) but even that could be good practice in how to play hardball in the world sports events bidding stakes.

Following up on a renewed idea for a southern World Figure Skating Championships (since as roltel said, the first attempt at one in Brisbane ended in a fiasco); here are 2 questions the ISU and the major national FS assoc. ask:  

1.  Can the prospective southern hosts guarantee full and enthusiastic live audiences for the week of competition (think early Athens events)?  

2.  Will the distance be worth the cost for northern skaters' families and friends to fly down there and support their athletes?  FS is an expensive enough sport as it is, how about added expense of flying down family and friends of the competitors?  You can be sure, if those are unsatisfactory Championships, the unhappy stories that will filter back to the ISU, then to the IOC, in this regard will dim/doom any future southern WOG bids.

About Chile..

1. I don't think it would be lot of people watching winter sports in live... But it will be the Olympics, so I think the stadiums will be complete and other events in the city. The problem could be the events in the mountain. It will be hard, but not impossible. With new transport it would be ok. And in more than 10 years, I think Chile could learn more about winter sports and make them popular. If Halloween was, why curling can't be a success?

2. I don't think fly to Europe is so different than fly to Southamerica. And if they do this to Sydney 2000, Korea/Japan '02 or Beijing 08 (further than Santiago) why they can't do this to Santiago 2018? Maybe Christchurch is more expensive and further, but I don't think this will be a BIG problem.

[Sir Rols]

When it comes down to it, wherever you hold the games, there's always some region that faces a long haul trip to get there.

[Alexjc]

When it comes down to it, wherever you hold the games, there's always some region that faces a long haul trip to get there.

:ooh: Too True!!!

[Aronious]

When it comes down to it, wherever you hold the games, there's always some region that faces a long haul trip to get there.

Exactly, its not all about the North Americans..

[roca_jack]

When it comes down to it, wherever you hold the games, there's always some region that faces a long haul trip to get there.

Exactly, its not all about the North Americans..

Well, there must be sometime when you will have to go down there....

Korea/Japan was far away from the soccer powers areas (europe/south american) and without complain they had to do the long trip.

[Sir Rols]

I'd also posted this link about Australia's Torino Winter Olympics team on the Torino thread.

Aussie Torino Team, Medal Hopes

So it seems the Aussies are starting to take the WOGs seriously, and are touting 10 medal hopes, four of them Gold hopes (I don't know how many of them depend on mass pile-ups in short-track speed skating, however).

A continued and sustained strong showing in the WOG results would be great ammunition if Australia had realistic hopes to host a WOG (which I personally think are slim, if not impossible).

A lot of the Aussie success has been very targetted. The AIS in particular chose freestyle aerial skiing as a discipline where talented gymnasts could be groomed as potential medal-winning winter athletes _ resulting in Alisa Camplin's breakthrough in SLC.

So what about NZ, Chile or Argentina? A sporting tradition is probably a huge factor in snaring a games, and it would boost southern hopes immeasurably if any of the southern hopes could point to some good sustained Winter Olympic results.

So the questionis _ are there any strong Kiwi, Chileno or Argentinian medal hopes for 2006? And are there any strong programs to build for future success.

[baron-pierreIV]

Uhmmm...notice who's posting -- all southpaws.  You haven't heard any agreement yet from the northies, have you??