FYI Posted October 12, 2010 Report Share Posted October 12, 2010 Why Annecy's achilles heel is that France has already hosted the Winter Olympics 3 times. We've been over this already, Tulsa. However, after their new compact concept, & whatever insidious ways some IOC members might have, I think their chances have improved somewhat from the preliminary evaluations. So as a result, I wouldn't bet any money that Annecy would be the 1st one out at the vote anylonger. Although, to what extent have their chances improved is still cloudy. Surely when the full bids books are in & then the Final Evaluation Report comes out we'll have a much clearer picture. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rafa Posted October 12, 2010 Report Share Posted October 12, 2010 Munich surprisingly are proposing to build quite a few venues. It still has the X-factor, and presents a great opportunity for the IOC, making peace with its own demons. throw in some great renders and you're on your way. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baron-pierreIV Posted October 12, 2010 Report Share Posted October 12, 2010 Katarina!!!! That isn't photshopped? Munich is now resorting to copying my first Rio 2016 logo w/ Juliana Paes. I thot Katrina had a much bigger butt than that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
memorabilia Posted October 13, 2010 Report Share Posted October 13, 2010 Annecy's achilles heel is that France has already hosted the Winter Olympics 3 times. We've been over this already, Tulsa. However, after their new compact concept, & whatever insidious ways some IOC members might have, I think their chances have improved somewhat from the preliminary evaluations. So as a result, I wouldn't bet any money that Annecy would be the 1st one out at the vote anylonger. Although, to what extent have their chances improved is still cloudy. Surely when the full bids books are in & then the Final Evaluation Report comes out we'll have a much clearer picture. I think the issue of the 6th July vote is around the message that IOC would want to send to futur winter bidders... and if IOC really want to perenize their winter games... If they want to get more than 3 bid cities to the next process.... they should send a strong sign to the world, by showing that we could return to medium size cities and not continue to go to big megalopolis with millions inhabitant ! They would also to think about reducing the size of those games... if not pretty soon the OCOG budget for the Winter Olympics will reach the USD 2 billions !!!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FYI Posted October 13, 2010 Report Share Posted October 13, 2010 ^All of that though, has absolutely nothing to do as to why there are only 3 cities bidding this tine around. I mentioned on another thread some days ago, that cities now are simply just weighting in their chances more carefully instead of just foolishly throwing their hat in the ring when they know they'll have virtually no chances whatsover in winning. Like Sofia & Almaty for example. Many thought that Almaty was surely going to bid for 2018, but then when the 2018 application deadline came & went, Almaty was nowhere to be found. Surely that was because the Kazaks came to the conclusion that that their bid wasn't going to get very far when nearby Sochi is going to be hosting 2014. Same with Jaca/Zaragosa & Reno & Denver & so forth. The Spanish Olympic Committee & USOC were very exhausted from their previous Summer Games attempts that went nowhere & weren't gonna waste any more time & money with jumping back in the bandwagon with winter bids. Cities are just being more frugal now instead of being frivolous about going at it, since it is very expensive just in bidding if you're only going to lose, & it has nothing to do because the IOC lately is going to much bigger cities for the Winter Games. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Westfale Posted October 13, 2010 Report Share Posted October 13, 2010 Why now Annecy has a bid very similar like Munich or PC, The 3 bid are very strong for different reason. For Munich it's the Olympic past and Munich is bigger than the other, for PC it's their third attempt and a new frontier, Annecy is the history with Chamonix and the most important tourist area (very famous place) moreover it's a 4 bid after Paris for France... Each city has a good reason to win... But i don't think Annecy has less chance than other, with the new map, Annecy become very serious for the final victory Still France is the nation, that has hosted OLYMPIC WINTER GAMES in the SAME region only 19 (!) years (in 2011) ago. There is no need to go back to the French Alps so quickly. I wished, France withdrew and throws its support behind its neighbor. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FYI Posted October 13, 2010 Report Share Posted October 13, 2010 The only way France is getting the Winter Games a 4th time, is so to shove a 'possible' (not saying it's definite) Paris 2020 bid outta the way, &/or as a 'consolation prize' for all 3 Paris' failed summer bids. Other than that, there's no compelling reason to give it to France for a 4th time, regardless of Annecy's attributes. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tulsa Posted October 14, 2010 Report Share Posted October 14, 2010 Still France is the nation, that has hosted OLYMPIC WINTER GAMES in the SAME region only 19 (!) years (in 2011) ago. There is no need to go back to the French Alps so quickly. I wished, France withdrew and throws its support behind its neighbor. Annecy and Chamonix (french Alps) are the most popular winter area in the world. France is the first country for the winter sport (ski) tourism (compared Munich or PC are less famous or just unknown...) It's the best choice to promote winter activity, this economical aspect must be consider... And it's one of reasons why Annecy can win in July... About that Munich or PC can't compete. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FYI Posted October 14, 2010 Report Share Posted October 14, 2010 So? That isn't good enough to give it to France for a FOURTH time, & they won't win 'simply' because of that. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Rols Posted October 14, 2010 Report Share Posted October 14, 2010 Annecy and Chamonix (french Alps) are the most popular winter area in the world. France is the first country for the winter sport (ski) tourism (compared Munich or PC are less famous or just unknown...) It's the best choice to promote winter activity, this economical aspect must be consider... And it's one of reasons why Annecy can win in July... About that Munich or PC can't compete. But there's more to the winter games than just downhill skiing. Anyway, if it's the most popular ski tourism area in the world already, it doesn't really need a winter games to boost it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
4seasonscentre Posted October 22, 2010 Report Share Posted October 22, 2010 I think the issue of the 6th July vote is around the message that IOC would want to send to futur winter bidders... and if IOC really want to perenize their winter games... If they want to get more than 3 bid cities to the next process.... they should send a strong sign to the world, by showing that we could return to medium size cities and not continue to go to big megalopolis with millions inhabitant ! They would also to think about reducing the size of those games... if not pretty soon the OCOG budget for the Winter Olympics will reach the USD 2 billions !!!! That would make sense if the IOC acted as one collective mind, or if it was just the executive board making the decision. However, each of the IOC members will have their own reasons for voting the way they do. Common criteria: - Good experience for athletes? - Will this benefit the candidate I want to see win the 2020 Games? - Good spot for a free vacation? "Will the winning of this candidate discourage cities/towns of a small/medium size from bidding to host the Winter Games in the future?" Isn't the first question IOC members ask themselves. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
aluz Posted October 22, 2010 Report Share Posted October 22, 2010 I don't know much about the technical criteria for the WOG, but it seems clear to me that there is a major difference between SOG and WOG potential hosts: natural conditions. Most SOG sports do not depend as much on specific climatic and geographic features as the main winter sports do. Downhill skiing, though not the only sport, is one of, if not the most important attraction on the program, in terms of audience. This natural factor is the only advantage that Annecy has, on the technical stand point. However, the real game has started and technical matters should not be that important anymore, especially with Annecy working on its plans to address the issues raised in its applicant file. If France can maneuver politically, Annecy may take this. I am not saying that it is the favorite, but it stands a chance. And please, let's avoid bringing up the scores from the applicant file, because, as it happened in the 2016 race, they are not applicable anymore (Annecy changed the plan) and they will not be considered by the vast majority of the IOC members. Since the bid index was issued after the analysis of the applicant file, it is well done, but it should change in the following months. Nevertheless, we should not forget that the vast majority of the IOC members have no interest whatsoever in the WOG, because they are representatives of summer sports IFs and athletes or because their NOCs are from countries where winter sports cannot be practiced. These members might be willing to trade their votes in support for other matters to be voted by the IOC General Assembly like SOG host cities, inclusion of new Olympic sports, or funds for the several IOC programs. So, there is a lot of room for political maneuvering in this election. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
jawnbc Posted May 19, 2011 Report Share Posted May 19, 2011 With today's update the race is getting closer. Ostensibly. I still see a first ballot win for Pyeonchang! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Tulsa Posted May 19, 2011 Report Share Posted May 19, 2011 Bid Index is totally stupid Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
FYI Posted May 19, 2011 Report Share Posted May 19, 2011 ^N we all know that you know the meaning of stupid very well. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Rols Posted May 19, 2011 Report Share Posted May 19, 2011 Still no surprises - in fact pretty clearly mirroring what has been pretty obvious looking at recent events - PC still comfortably in front, but the momentum slowly building for Munich, and Annecy still scrabbling to gain traction (I don't know where all this talk elsewhere in various threads about things firming for Annecy has come from - probably the French booster press - but if anything, the coverage I've been reading it's more and more becoming acknowledged that Annecy is a rank outside). I'm getting a bit more heartened by Munich's chances - it seems to be making its run at the right time - similar to what London and Sochi managed in the final stretches of their races. This could be closer than I expected. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athensfan Posted May 20, 2011 Report Share Posted May 20, 2011 I'm getting a bit more heartened by Munich's chances - it seems to be making its run at the right time - similar to what London and Sochi managed in the final stretches of their races. This could be closer than I expected. Agreed. Eerily similar to London and Sochi. My gut tells me PC will still win, but I don't think it's going to be a runaway victory. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baron-pierreIV Posted May 20, 2011 Report Share Posted May 20, 2011 Bid Index is totally stupid Yet Tulsa hangs out here!! Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nature Posted May 20, 2011 Report Share Posted May 20, 2011 Still no surprises - in fact pretty clearly mirroring what has been pretty obvious looking at recent events - PC still comfortably in front, but the momentum slowly building for Munich, and Annecy still scrabbling to gain traction (I don't know where all this talk elsewhere in various threads about things firming for Annecy has come from - probably the French booster press - but if anything, the coverage I've been reading it's more and more becoming acknowledged that Annecy is a rank outside). I'm getting a bit more heartened by Munich's chances - it seems to be making its run at the right time - similar to what London and Sochi managed in the final stretches of their races. This could be closer than I expected. They did their best. There is nothing better, they can't do it anymore. It is natural that Munich's win, regardless of wins and losses. Katarina Witt said, ‘When you choose the Olympic host city, it is about more than just geography. It is a choice about the kind of Olympic experience the athletes of the future should have. In Munich in 2018, every Olympian and Paralympian will have just what they deserve: the single greatest experience of their lives. Because the atmosphere will be everything they have ever dreamed of.' Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
baron-pierreIV Posted May 20, 2011 Report Share Posted May 20, 2011 Katarina Witt said, When you choose the Olympic host city, it is about more than just geography. It is a choice about the kind of Olympic experience the athletes of the future should have. In Munich in 2018, every Olympian and Paralympian will have just what they deserve: the single greatest experience of their lives. Because the atmosphere will be everything they have ever dreamed of.' What does Katerina know? She can't land Alberto Tomba nor a triple axel...and she becomes a geopolitical expert? She should just stick to her broadcast commentaries. BTW, "nature," (or whomever u r) thanks for the "fractured" English you post on this board. I am sure it is driving a few prospecive IOC voters PC's way. Good strategem. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sir Rols Posted May 20, 2011 Report Share Posted May 20, 2011 They did their best. There is nothing better, they can't do it anymore. It is natural that Munich's win, regardless of wins and losses. Katarina Witt said, ‘When you choose the Olympic host city, it is about more than just geography. It is a choice about the kind of Olympic experience the athletes of the future should have. In Munich in 2018, every Olympian and Paralympian will have just what they deserve: the single greatest experience of their lives. Because the atmosphere will be everything they have ever dreamed of.' There is plenty they can do. The set piece presentations, except for the final one in Durban, are over, but any bid who thinks they can sit on their arses and have nothing more to do will be sadly mistaken. Now is the time for the lobbying, both in public and behind closed doors, to shift to a crescendo and to market! market! market! to keep that momentum high and fresh in people's - both the IOC and the public's - minds. I'm not too worried that Munich aren't aware of this - with experienced operators like Bach to direct and Miss Charisma Katarina to charm, they've got the ammunition. I'd expect they have to have very full diaries for the next month and a bit. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
neige Posted May 20, 2011 Report Share Posted May 20, 2011 Annecy is progressing (more than what the index says). What's the best concept for 2018? New horizons : PyeongChang like Socchi 2014 Big city + skiing resort: Munich like Turin 2006 and Vancouver 2010 snowy village atmosphere: Annecy like Lillehammer 1994 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nature Posted May 20, 2011 Report Share Posted May 20, 2011 What does Katerina know? She can't land Alberto Tomba nor a triple axel...and she becomes a geopolitical expert? She should just stick to her broadcast commentaries. BTW, "nature," (or whomever u r) thanks for the "fractured" you post on this board. I am sure it is driving a few prospecive IOC voters PC's way. Good strategem. They did everything they could do. Germany showed the contributions to the winter sports in the last 100 years. This is more important than a mere slogan. They are guaranteed to the best atmosphere and the best stage for every athletes and visitors, No risk. Now, IOC members need to respond to it. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Athensfan Posted May 20, 2011 Report Share Posted May 20, 2011 Personally, I've always been most excited about Munich, but I still think PC will win. Favorable geo-politics -- it's time for Asia again and there is significant European interest in 2020. First time winter host with over-the-top enthusiasm. This is their 3rd consecutive highly competitive bid. Although Munich is my preference and although Bach and Witt are a formidable twosome, PC has great hand to play. If Munich surprises us with the win, it will be because they worked their tails off. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
nature Posted May 21, 2011 Report Share Posted May 21, 2011 Personally, I've always been most excited about Munich, but I still think PC will win. Favorable geo-politics -- it's time for Asia again and there is significant European interest in 2020. First time winter host with over-the-top enthusiasm. This is their 3rd consecutive highly competitive bid. Although Munich is my preference and although Bach and Witt are a formidable twosome, PC has great hand to play. If Munich surprises us with the win, it will be because they worked their tails off. Königssee also 3rd consecutive highly competitive bid If Munich get different results it should think that God don't admit Munich. I hope Pyeongchang 2026 or 2034. Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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