Toronto?

[Gangwon]

I've been to NYC before, and Toronto has those kind of enclaves too. Those kind of enclaves aren't that bad, as it is confined to a small area. But how to describe Markham, think of Chinatown in Manhattan, now think of that concept to Markham, Ontario. A place with over 300,000. What is scary, is that in Markham, just 38% of people who live in a city of 300,000 have English as their mother tongue. Think about this for a second, there is no need to integrate, they can stay in thse places and not integrate whatsoever into society. The immigrants that took that ship to Ellis Island, back in those days, people were in search of the American Dream cause frankly, their old country sucks. They wanted to become American. If their old country is so great, why not simply go back there? If 38% of people know English as their first language, that is kind of dangerous to our society. Is it racist that in Quebec, they have such laws protecting French, that if you want to have a storefront in any other language besides French, it must be a 60/40 ratio. Is that racist? Check out the kind of immigration laws Japan has, is that not racist?

Brampton is the kind of place now, where you see more fireworks on Diwali than Canada Day. The kind of place where you try to order a coffee at Tim Hortons and the people have a difficult time understanding you, and the employees of the store babble to each other in Punjabi. While there are some of the Indian population in Brampton that wants to be Canadian, the vast majority have a big family home in India, as soon as they make some money, they send it back to India. That in turn wrecks our economy.

38% of people having English as their mother tongue doesn't mean the other 62% don't know English. It's possible to know two languages. For the rest, it's no different than the immigrants who came to Ellis Island, they didn't know English either and many went to their graves not knowing English. The only difference is that, unlike for some immigrants in Toronto, time passed so the next generation popped out, knowing English.

[intoronto]

I've been to NYC before, and Toronto has those kind of enclaves too. Those kind of enclaves aren't that bad, as it is confined to a small area. But how to describe Markham, think of Chinatown in Manhattan, now think of that concept to Markham, Ontario. A place with over 300,000. What is scary, is that in Markham, just 38% of people who live in a city of 300,000 have English as their mother tongue. Think about this for a second, there is no need to integrate, they can stay in thse places and not integrate whatsoever into society. The immigrants that took that ship to Ellis Island, back in those days, people were in search of the American Dream cause frankly, their old country sucks. They wanted to become American. If their old country is so great, why not simply go back there? If 38% of people know English as their first language, that is kind of dangerous to our society. Is it racist that in Quebec, they have such laws protecting French, that if you want to have a storefront in any other language besides French, it must be a 60/40 ratio. Is that racist? Check out the kind of immigration laws Japan has, is that not racist?

Brampton is the kind of place now, where you see more fireworks on Diwali than Canada Day. The kind of place where you try to order a coffee at Tim Hortons and the people have a difficult time understanding you, and the employees of the store babble to each other in Punjabi. While there are some of the Indian population in Brampton that wants to be Canadian, the vast majority have a big family home in India, as soon as they make some money, they send it back to India. That in turn wrecks our economy.

But what made the English the owners of the land? Were they here first? No. This is a multicultural society and as a Canadian I am proud of it. Is it a prefect concept? No, but it isn't bad as you make it seem. Like the others said if you don't like it leave.

[MisterSG1]

But what made the English the owners of the land? Were they here first? No. This is a multicultural society and as a Canadian I am proud of it. Is it a prefect concept? No, but it isn't bad as you make it seem. Like the others said if you don't like it leave.

It is a multicultural society because a man named Trudeau said it was. He did a lot of things to try to create an artificial Canadian identity. He imposed the metric system on us, despite everyday people in everyday life not using most metric units. Really, how many of you buy a piece of furniture, or measure a room in centimetres and metres. I was born in the late 80s and I work in feet and inches. Anyone actually weigh yourself in kilograms? I'm not denying that the metric system doesn't hold its place in science, but in everyday life, the old system is better. We may think of the temperature outside in Celcius, because tv forced us to learn it, but if you own a swimming pool or hot tub, you almost always measure it in Fahrenheit....anyone here in Canada use an oven set in Celcius, I don't think so.

My ancestors who went to Newfoundland 100s of years ago were not immigrants by any means. They were settlers. As for Newfoundland, a fudged vote in 1948 caused Newfoundland to join Canada. The vote was said to be rigged because Britain was deathly afraid of the alternatives, that Newfoundland wanted a responsible government and then would seek union to the US. My relatives there who were alive then claim to this day that it was a fixed vote. Newfoundland was in great shape financially after World War II, and then after joining Canada, it became that outpost no one cares about.

What makes today's situation different from the Ellis Island example. About a generation ago, you could have had a bunch of immigrants from lets say Italy. They had kids, the parents could speak Italian as well, but the kids were raised to be Canadian, and well the kids cannot speak Italian. Nowadays, due to the so called "cultural mosaic", the same kind of family from India, their kids are raised to be Indian and they can speak fluent Punjabi and communicate to their parents in Punjabi only. See, there is a big difference here.

[intoronto]

What makes today's situation different from the Ellis Island example. About a generation ago, you could have had a bunch of immigrants from lets say Italy. They had kids, the parents could speak Italian as well, but the kids were raised to be Canadian, and well the kids cannot speak Italian. Nowadays, due to the so called "cultural mosaic", the same kind of family from India, their kids are raised to be Indian and they can speak fluent Punjabi and communicate to their parents in Punjabi only. See, there is a big difference here.

I can only speak English though even though that isn't the language my parents spoke to me from birth. Its not always like that.

[Gangwon]

What makes today's situation different from the Ellis Island example. About a generation ago, you could have had a bunch of immigrants from lets say Italy. They had kids, the parents could speak Italian as well, but the kids were raised to be Canadian, and well the kids cannot speak Italian. Nowadays, due to the so called "cultural mosaic", the same kind of family from India, their kids are raised to be Indian and they can speak fluent Punjabi and communicate to their parents in Punjabi only. See, there is a big difference here.

False. Indian kids born in Canada can not "only" communicate to their parents in Punjabi. It is impossible for any kid born here not to know English by the time they're in grade school.

[MisterSG1]

False. Indian kids born in Canada can not "only" communicate to their parents in Punjabi. It is impossible for any kid born here not to know English by the time they're in grade school.

That is not what I was saying. I'm not saying that the kids do not know English. I was saying that the language they speak at home is Punjabi. That kid who was born in Canada learns a foreign language. But if the kid does not know English by grade school, oh don't worry, government funded ESL will do the trick. As I said, this is not racist, how come a first world nation like Japan is extremely strict about any immigration, how come they are never called racists. European countries and the rest of the Anglosphere has been forced to adapt multiculturalism, why? It does not work.

[Gangwon]

That is not what I was saying. I'm not saying that the kids do not know English. I was saying that the language they speak at home is Punjabi. That kid who was born in Canada learns a foreign language. But if the kid does not know English by grade school, oh don't worry, government funded ESL will do the trick. As I said, this is not racist, how come a first world nation like Japan is extremely strict about any immigration, how come they are never called racists. European countries and the rest of the Anglosphere has been forced to adapt multiculturalism, why? It does not work.

That's exactly what you were saying. You brought up the immigrants who came from Italy and had kids. Meaning they were born in Canada. Then you say "the same kind of family from India." So immigrants from India who then had kids.

Anyway, what does it matter what people speak at home?

[StefanMUC]

So, if children cannot speak English by grade school, and the govt funds programmes to support them learning it, giving them the opportunity to better integrate - just what you demand - that is wrong?

If you really want them to be more integrated, you should be happy there are efforts made to achieve that, at least for the younger generation.

What they speak at home is irrelevant. If they can only communicate with their elderlies in Punjabi or whatever, because thise cannot really speak English, that is only natural.

[Quaker2001]

That is not what I was saying. I'm not saying that the kids do not know English. I was saying that the language they speak at home is Punjabi. That kid who was born in Canada learns a foreign language. But if the kid does not know English by grade school, oh don't worry, government funded ESL will do the trick. As I said, this is not racist, how come a first world nation like Japan is extremely strict about any immigration, how come they are never called racists. European countries and the rest of the Anglosphere has been forced to adapt multiculturalism, why? It does not work.

The fact you keep saying you're not racist.. I don't know, that sounds like something someone who is racist (and may not know it) would say.

Okay, I get your point that you're not a fan of foreigners coming to your country and not assimilating themselves with your country and it's culture. You know what.. I get that plenty of times here in NY and yea, maybe it's not the most pleasant experience trying to understand and communicate with someone who's first language isn't English, but so what? And your defense is that other countries have different rules and regulations so you sound like you're pissed that Canada doesn't do that? Grow up, dude. We don't live in a world where all the Canadians live in Canada, all the Americans live in America, all the Japanese live in Japan, etc. What exactly isn't working? There's 200 countries out there, most of them with distinct culture and language that make them unique. Do you not expect them to inter-mingle? That would make for a pretty boring world.

This is a pretty stupid debate here (as if that's a first for this site). But thank you MisterSG1 for painting a picture of what type of person you are. Good to know that, as an American, I probably wouldn't be welcomed by you in Brampton. Hopefully most of the residents of Brampton are not like you in this regard.

[alphacarter]

MisterSG1, What I'd like to say to you, is best summed up by Lily Allen:

[ofan]

What he said^. You're not welcome here.

[Tony E Loves Architecture]

It is a multicultural society because a man named Trudeau said it was. He did a lot of things to try to create an artificial Canadian identity. He imposed the metric system on us, despite everyday people in everyday life not using most metric units. Really, how many of you buy a piece of furniture, or measure a room in centimetres and metres. I was born in the late 80s and I work in feet and inches. Anyone actually weigh yourself in kilograms? I'm not denying that the metric system doesn't hold its place in science, but in everyday life, the old system is better. We may think of the temperature outside in Celcius, because tv forced us to learn it, but if you own a swimming pool or hot tub, you almost always measure it in Fahrenheit....anyone here in Canada use an oven set in Celcius, I don't think so.

My ancestors who went to Newfoundland 100s of years ago were not immigrants by any means. They were settlers. As for Newfoundland, a fudged vote in 1948 caused Newfoundland to join Canada. The vote was said to be rigged because Britain was deathly afraid of the alternatives, that Newfoundland wanted a responsible government and then would seek union to the US. My relatives there who were alive then claim to this day that it was a fixed vote. Newfoundland was in great shape financially after World War II, and then after joining Canada, it became that outpost no one cares about.

What makes today's situation different from the Ellis Island example. About a generation ago, you could have had a bunch of immigrants from lets say Italy. They had kids, the parents could speak Italian as well, but the kids were raised to be Canadian, and well the kids cannot speak Italian. Nowadays, due to the so called "cultural mosaic", the same kind of family from India, their kids are raised to be Indian and they can speak fluent Punjabi and communicate to their parents in Punjabi only. See, there is a big difference here.

You discust me. As a Londoner, someone who is English, and surrounded by diversity, I think what your saying is down right discusting. London is not just for English people. Toronto is not just for Canadian people etc. I bet your a hypocrite. I bet you go on holiday? Anyway, as long as people contribute to society, economy and general life, and don't commit crimes, anyone is welcome in any city, and it's people like you that causes friction between people. If you haven't got nothing nice to say, say nothing at all.

You discust me. As a Londoner, someone who is English, and surrounded by diversity, I think what your saying is down right discusting. London is not just for English people. Toronto is not just for Canadian people etc. I bet your a hypocrite. I bet you go on holiday? Anyway, as long as people contribute to society, economy and general life, and don't commit crimes, anyone is welcome in any city, and it's people like you that causes friction between people. If you haven't got nothing nice to say, say nothing at all.

And here in England, we use feet and inches, Stones, Degrees Celcius for our Measurements.

[Lord David]

MisterSG1 is simply ignorant of the fact that his "Canada" was created by immigrants themselves, much like my "Australia" is. We should be grateful for the immigrant populations from all corners of the world who helped forge our two countries to what they are today.

So what if your part of the world is population by a reasonable Indian/Bangladesh etc population? They just want to live a better life like all of us. They're doing their best to assimilate. It's of course up to the government to help in programs in which they learn or better their English skills and so forth. They're not trying to take over or could never possibly take over a significantly large Anglo-White population.

One should be grateful in the diverse world we live in and appreciate all good people who help contribute to society and not be concerned about petty things like xenophobia, which has absolutely no place in multicultural Canada or Australia or anywhere else for that matter.

I'm sure most Canadians here and elsewhere are proud of the fact that they were one of the first predominantly white nations out there who officially stated that they were multicultural, that it was in their national interest to pursue such a goal and acknowledging well fact that the multicultural aspect of Canada has made it what it is today, one of the world's greatest nations.

Oh and as for that Metric System remark, it's a system which works just as well as the Imperial System (though let's face it, much more simplified and better). Canadians have a choice to choose which system they prefer (where the Imperial measurements are a link to Great Britain), but should also be aware that the Metric System is the most widely used measurement system in the world. Even the US is using Metric measurements more and more abroad because wherever such a person is based, it's pretty likely that the nation he/she is in uses Metric measurements as opposed to Imperial ones. Just deal with it!

Edited January 26, 2014 by Lord David

[mr.bernham]

Maybe the day after Hell freezes over.

Or after the closing ceremony of the Toronto Olympics.

Dude looks like he's gonna be mayor...Hell frooze over last week.

[MisterSG1]

You discust me. As a Londoner, someone who is English, and surrounded by diversity, I think what your saying is down right discusting. London is not just for English people. Toronto is not just for Canadian people etc. I bet your a hypocrite. I bet you go on holiday? Anyway, as long as people contribute to society, economy and general life, and don't commit crimes, anyone is welcome in any city, and it's people like you that causes friction between people. If you haven't got nothing nice to say, say nothing at all.

And here in England, we use feet and inches, Stones, Degrees Celcius for our Measurements.

London for everyone? Get real. I don't hear that Tokyo is for everyone now, do I? See what your open door policy has done for immigrants, take a look at this:

This should be an act of treason, yet they are not punished by any laws. Any real English person such as yourself who tries to speak out how their society is in danger has hate laws used against them. But this following image infuriates me even more:

These animals are burning poppies during the 2 minute silence for Remembrance Day. The two minutes that our relatives fought and died for. The countries that we all died for. You say this is a positive contribution to society? Perhaps honor killings are a way of our life.

I've stated it over and over again, I only supported the Olympic Bid, because it would give the feds a reason to give us money, and not spend hundreds of millions of dollars on middle eastern countries, who would destroy us at any time. Harper just gave hundreds of millions of dollars to Jordan.

[intoronto]

Well that is an extreme form, something that would anger myself as well.

[MisterSG1]

MisterSG1 is simply ignorant of the fact that his "Canada" was created by immigrants themselves, much like my "Australia" is. We should be grateful for the immigrant populations from all corners of the world who helped forge our two countries to what they are today.

So what if your part of the world is population by a reasonable Indian/Bangladesh etc population? They just want to live a better life like all of us. They're doing their best to assimilate. It's of course up to the government to help in programs in which they learn or better their English skills and so forth. They're not trying to take over or could never possibly take over a significantly large Anglo-White population.

One should be grateful in the diverse world we live in and appreciate all good people who help contribute to society and not be concerned about petty things like xenophobia, which has absolutely no place in multicultural Canada or Australia or anywhere else for that matter.

I'm sure most Canadians here and elsewhere are proud of the fact that they were one of the first predominantly white nations out there who officially stated that they were multicultural, that it was in their national interest to pursue such a goal and acknowledging well fact that the multicultural aspect of Canada has made it what it is today, one of the world's greatest nations.

Oh and as for that Metric System remark, it's a system which works just as well as the Imperial System (though let's face it, much more simplified and better). Canadians have a choice to choose which system they prefer (where the Imperial measurements are a link to Great Britain), but should also be aware that the Metric System is the most widely used measurement system in the world. Even the US is using Metric measurements more and more abroad because wherever such a person is based, it's pretty likely that the nation he/she is in uses Metric measurements as opposed to Imperial ones. Just deal with it!

Multiculturalism is a polarizing concept among people here, it's not hunky dory like you all seem to think it is. If that were the case, how come one of the most "xenophobic" people around, that's right, Don Cherry, is usually labelled as one of the greatest Canadians ever? Multiculturalism allows them to bring their own garbage here, take for example, the Sri Lanka-Tamil situation back in 2009:

Here we have Tamil Tigers supporters, who we know are terrorists. They are outright blocking the Gardiner Expressway, yet no one involved in this was arrested whatsoever. They were using tactics that are commonly used in third world countries like lining up babies with strollers in front of the front line of the police. This was a major disruption to the city, yet no one seems to care about that.

[Rob2012]

You've shown us about 20 people in those photos. Would you mind showing us photos of the other 4m foreign born people living in the UK, or the other 1.5m Muslims?

And actually, I find it hard to get even slightly angry about these small, very vocal protest groups. The fact they are allowed to protest means they have a freedom of expression they'd never be allowed in the theocracies they claim to support. Don't they see this?! That comical paradox means that all these protests end up looking utterly cretinous and actually, they don't rile me because they're very, very easy to laugh at. They do a MUCH better job than any politicians at undermining political Islam. Let them speak, let them put up their placards I say!

To give you some due though, there are issues within certain minority groups which mean the positives of immigration are easily overlooked. There are a minority of Pakistani immigrants for whom rape is almost acceptable (yes, really), some religious groups insist on setting up their own misogynous religious courts (this is a mainly Islamic but also Jewish problem), certain other ethnic groups (predominantly African) deem female genital mutilation acceptable, and forced marriage is also an issue amonst South Asians. Mostly, the victims of such practices are individuals within those minorities so it's easy to overlook. It's up to the law to come down hard on all of this rather than worry about upsetting certain communities.

None of that means I support your wider point though. Posting a picture of 20 nutters to generalise about a population of 4m foreign born, or immigration policy in general, is ridiculous.

Edited January 26, 2014 by Rob.

[MisterSG1]

The fact you keep saying you're not racist.. I don't know, that sounds like something someone who is racist (and may not know it) would say.

Okay, I get your point that you're not a fan of foreigners coming to your country and not assimilating themselves with your country and it's culture. You know what.. I get that plenty of times here in NY and yea, maybe it's not the most pleasant experience trying to understand and communicate with someone who's first language isn't English, but so what? And your defense is that other countries have different rules and regulations so you sound like you're pissed that Canada doesn't do that? Grow up, dude. We don't live in a world where all the Canadians live in Canada, all the Americans live in America, all the Japanese live in Japan, etc. What exactly isn't working? There's 200 countries out there, most of them with distinct culture and language that make them unique. Do you not expect them to inter-mingle? That would make for a pretty boring world.

This is a pretty stupid debate here (as if that's a first for this site). But thank you MisterSG1 for painting a picture of what type of person you are. Good to know that, as an American, I probably wouldn't be welcomed by you in Brampton. Hopefully most of the residents of Brampton are not like you in this regard.

You know, that's kind of the ironic thing. I am not anti-American by any stretch of the word. But Canada could arguably defined as one of the most anti-American places in the world. Truth be told, most of the residents of Brampton would hate you, as Canada defines itself culturally as being "not American". Canadians define themselves still as the result of a silly hockey game 4 years ago in Vancouver. They define themselves on supposedly believing they torched the White House 200 years ago in 1814. If you don't believe me, look at this public art they commissioned at the corner of Bathurst and Lake Shore in Toronto, which is completly incorrect regarding what happened:

Yeah, Canada really is a peaceful country isn't it?

You've shown us about 20 people in those photos. Would you mind showing us photos of the other 4m foreign born people living in the UK, or the other 1.5m Muslims?

Neverthless, I find it hard to get even slightly angry about these small, very vocal protest groups. The fact they are allowed to protest means they have a freedom of expression they'd never be allowed in the theocracies they claim to support. Don't they see this?! That comical paradox means that all these protests end up looking utterly cretinous and actually, they don't rile me because they're very, very easy to laugh at. They do a MUCH better job than any politicians at undermining political Islam. Let them speak, let them put up their placards I say!

But if a white Londoner dare to burn one of their Jihadist flags, off to The Clink they go.

[ofan]

This guy may be more insane than okeydokey was...

[Tony E Loves Architecture]

London for everyone? Get real. I don't hear that Tokyo is for everyone now, do I? See what your open door policy has done for immigrants, take a look at this:

This should be an act of treason, yet they are not punished by any laws. Any real English person such as yourself who tries to speak out how their society is in danger has hate laws used against them. But this following image infuriates me even more:

These animals are burning poppies during the 2 minute silence for Remembrance Day. The two minutes that our relatives fought and died for. The countries that we all died for. You say this is a positive contribution to society? Perhaps honor killings are a way of our life.

I've stated it over and over again, I only supported the Olympic Bid, because it would give the feds a reason to give us money, and not spend hundreds of millions of dollars on middle eastern countries, who would destroy us at any time. Harper just gave hundreds of millions of dollars to Jordan.

You have a valid point. They are disrespecting our soldiers.

[Rob2012]

But if a white Londoner dare to burn one of their Jihadist flags, off to The Clink they go.

Evidence or it didn't happen.

[MisterSG1]

You have a valid point. They are disrespecting our soldiers.

And you see, that's what I'm trying to say. You almost never hear "moderate" muslims condemning this type of behavior. This is the problem with multiculturalism, when the immigrants come in such large numbers, there is no natural integration which takes place. In other words, they bring their problems that they supposedly wanted to escape from into the new country. Pierre Trudeau is polarizing as I said, he ranks at the top of the greatest and worst Canadian lists.

[StefanMUC]

London for everyone? Get real. I don't hear that Tokyo is for everyone now, do I? See what your open door policy has done for immigrants, take a look at this:

This should be an act of treason, yet they are not punished by any laws. Any real English person such as yourself who tries to speak out how their society is in danger has hate laws used against them. But this following image infuriates me even more:

These animals are burning poppies during the 2 minute silence for Remembrance Day. The two minutes that our relatives fought and died for. The countries that we all died for. You say this is a positive contribution to society? Perhaps honor killings are a way of our life.

I've stated it over and over again, I only supported the Olympic Bid, because it would give the feds a reason to give us money, and not spend hundreds of millions of dollars on middle eastern countries, who would destroy us at any time. Harper just gave hundreds of millions of dollars to Jordan.

These extremists don't represent the majority of immigrants I dare say. But they are smart enough to know such iconic demonstrations will trigger enough dumbass extremist reactions like your own. One fanatic side fuels the other.

But of course it's easier to freak out over flag burning and overlook the daily issues like providing assistance to children getting to learn the official language of their new homeland properly.

[intoronto]

Here we have Tamil Tigers supporters, who we know are terrorists. They are outright blocking the Gardiner Expressway, yet no one involved in this was arrested whatsoever. They were using tactics that are commonly used in third world countries like lining up babies with strollers in front of the front line of the police. This was a major disruption to the city, yet no one seems to care about that.

You are an idiot! LEARN to understand the situation before you label someone a terrorist. How does someone supporting the cause of an independent Tamil-homeland constitute terrorism to you? Are you f*cking retarded? In hindsight it wasn't the best way to protest but they did it only to draw attention to the cause.