Jump to content

Is Rio Still The Favourite In Overall Analysis?


Recommended Posts

  • Replies 69
  • Created
  • Last Reply

About continental rotation...

Barcelona 1992, London 2012, Sochi 2014 - hurts Madrid 2016?

Atlanta 1996 - Salt Lake City 2002 - hurts Chicago 2016

Nagano 1998 - Beijing 2008 - hurts Tokyo 2016?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It's not unfair at all. It's the truth. And its the crux of every argument I hear about why Rio should host.

The bid does have some strengths, but if it were coming from Canada or France or Korea it would not be one of the favorites because there are too many weaknesses. The big issues: travel times, accommodation, questionable sports organization in the past, crime. And that doesn't even take the World Cup into account.

And speaking of the shortlist, why do you think that Doha got passed over in favor of Rio, despite having scored better in the preliminary evaluation? At every turn, the IOC is making exceptions for Rio. Not just in terms of the shortlist, but even in the evaluation report.

Rio is in South America -- that is the only reason the bid has so much traction. I'm sorry, but it's true.

The IOC has the prerogative to make these exceptions if they choose, they just have to be prepared to accept the risk as well.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

I'm a newbie here but wanted to comment 2 things:

1st - There are only two countries which could host Winter Games - or "Snow Games" - in South America, so i don't understand why to put in this rotation argument the Winter Games, unless the Cuiaba project is not a joke :blink:

2nd - Sochi is in thee board of Asia, it almost isn't Europe :lol:

Link to comment
Share on other sites

It's not unfair at all. It's the truth. And its the crux of every argument I hear about why Rio should host.

The bid does have some strengths, but if it were coming from Canada or France or Korea it would not be one of the favorites because there are too many weaknesses. The big issues: travel times, accommodation, questionable sports organization in the past, crime. And that doesn't even take the World Cup into account.

And speaking of the shortlist, why do you think that Doha got passed over in favor of Rio, despite having scored better in the preliminary evaluation? At every turn, the IOC is making exceptions for Rio. Not just in terms of the shortlist, but even in the evaluation report.

Rio is in South America -- that is the only reason the bid has so much traction. I'm sorry, but it's true.

The IOC has the prerogative to make these exceptions if they choose, they just have to be prepared to accept the risk as well.

I agree in part with you...

The bid plans of Rio de Janeiro are very good... There are good points in Rio's master plan that should be counted too...

It's not fair and not accurate saying if Rio wins, it will be only because South American turn...

Other things will be counted. PanAm Games were successfull (except for baseball tournament, because a Storm reached Rio in during the games). Which incident PanAms had? How many traffic jams? No issue happened. And indeed, PanAms is a card Rio is putting on the table and IOC accepts it.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

PanAm Games were successfull (except for baseball tournament, because a Storm reached Rio in during the games). Which incident PanAms had? How many traffic jams? No issue happened. And indeed, PanAms is a card Rio is putting on the table and IOC accepts it.

Do you really, really believe in what you wrote? Have you ever made any cost-benefit analysis?

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Danny,

Yes, Rio's bid does have strengths, but so do the other bids. It is being a "new frontier" that helps Rio.

If Rio wins the 2016 Games, they must do a far better job with them than they did with the Pan Ams. You must accept that the Pan Ams were not an unqualified success. They got mixed reviews. Here's a link to one recent article that affirms this:

http://www.timescolonist.com/sports/2010wi...2548/story.html

Here's a quote:

“I’ve never been to Rio but heard about the [2007] Pan Am Games and Rio’s level of readiness could be a question,” said 2008 Beijing Olympic bronze-medallist and 2009 world championships silver-medallist swimmer Ryan Cochrane of Victoria, who will be 27 and competing in his third Olympics in 2016.

At least some of the athletes were not pleased with the Pan Ams or these negative opinions would not be circulating.

Here's another article:

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/olympics_b...o-2016-bid.html

The focus is on Rio's serious crime problem. One athlete (a rower) said that during the final week, the atmosphere of the Pan Ams was one of "danger and paranoia."

Here's another link with a questionable view of the Pan Ams:

http://featuresblogs.chicagotribune.com/th...he-2016-ga.html

The emphasis here is on the infrastructure projects that were promised, but not delivered, "massive overspending, and poor organization that was described as "somewhat chaotic."

Here's yet another link that raises questions about the Pan Ams: http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8...1926094,00.html

On the whole, this article is pro-Rio and says that although the Pan Ams were a success, there were a great many problems and deficiencies.

Here's a quote:

The Pan Ams might have provided a three-week jamboree for millions of athletes, locals and visitors, but when the closing ceremony ended, the city returned to its usual mess, said Chico Alencar, a Rio Congressman who campaigned for investigations into the massive overspending at the Pan Am Games. "The chronic problems that we have here are the same as they always were," Alencar said. "I want Rio to win the right to host the games, but we need to learn from our past mistakes and the myth of the Pan American Games and all that they didn't leave behind. If we get the Olympics, then all sectors of society need to unite to ensure that there is a social legacy and no overspending."

There has been so much talk about how Brazil "needs" the Games and "deserves" the Games, but will the Olympics actually make a difference to the people? If they go the same way the Pan Ams did, the answer is "no."

I'm not saying Rio can't do it in 2016, I'm just saying that you should not point to the Pan Ams as proof.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

2016 has attracted 17 Japanese companies serving as official sponsors for the 2016 Summer Olympic bid, organizers said Thursday.

A Tokyo 2016 press release said it gives the Olympic Movement the potential to reach more than three billion prime-time viewers across the Asia Pacific region, unprecedented in the history of the Games.

The sponsors include sports apparel companies Asics and Descente, beer make Asahi, toy maker Bandai, commercial carriers Japan Airlines and All Nippon Airways, Internet giant Yahoo Japan, and parcel service Yamato Transport, reports the Associated Press.

During the remaining two months of Tokyo's bid the partners will campaign on behalf of Tokyo 2016 as well as collaborate with the bid committee.

Also the Tokyo Chamber of Commerce and Industry - a body representing more than 80,000 companies from across the city - has established an Olympic and Paralympic Bid Special Committee to coordinate its support for Tokyo 2016. Nippon Keidanren (Japan Business Federation), a comprehensive business organization, also offers its overall support to the bid.

The Tokyo Metropolitan Government has set aside a $4 billion fund for the Olympic Games said organizers.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Danny,

Yes, Rio's bid does have strengths, but so do the other bids. It is being a "new frontier" that helps Rio.

If Rio wins the 2016 Games, they must do a far better job with them than they did with the Pan Ams. You must accept that the Pan Ams were not an unqualified success. They got mixed reviews. Here's a link to one recent article that affirms this:

http://www.timescolonist.com/sports/2010wi...2548/story.html

Here's a quote:

“I’ve never been to Rio but heard about the [2007] Pan Am Games and Rio’s level of readiness could be a question,” said 2008 Beijing Olympic bronze-medallist and 2009 world championships silver-medallist swimmer Ryan Cochrane of Victoria, who will be 27 and competing in his third Olympics in 2016.

At least some of the athletes were not pleased with the Pan Ams or these negative opinions would not be circulating.

Here's another article:

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/olympics_b...o-2016-bid.html

The focus is on Rio's serious crime problem. One athlete (a rower) said that during the final week, the atmosphere of the Pan Ams was one of "danger and paranoia."

Here's another link with a questionable view of the Pan Ams:

http://featuresblogs.chicagotribune.com/th...he-2016-ga.html

The emphasis here is on the infrastructure projects that were promised, but not delivered, "massive overspending, and poor organization that was described as "somewhat chaotic."

Here's yet another link that raises questions about the Pan Ams: http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8...1926094,00.html

On the whole, this article is pro-Rio and says that although the Pan Ams were a success, there were a great many problems and deficiencies.

Here's a quote:

The Pan Ams might have provided a three-week jamboree for millions of athletes, locals and visitors, but when the closing ceremony ended, the city returned to its usual mess, said Chico Alencar, a Rio Congressman who campaigned for investigations into the massive overspending at the Pan Am Games. "The chronic problems that we have here are the same as they always were," Alencar said. "I want Rio to win the right to host the games, but we need to learn from our past mistakes and the myth of the Pan American Games and all that they didn't leave behind. If we get the Olympics, then all sectors of society need to unite to ensure that there is a social legacy and no overspending."

There has been so much talk about how Brazil "needs" the Games and "deserves" the Games, but will the Olympics actually make a difference to the people? If they go the same way the Pan Ams did, the answer is "no."

I'm not saying Rio can't do it in 2016, I'm just saying that you should not point to the Pan Ams as proof.

Why cant the Bid rely on the PanAms? after all it was the best edition ever, also the biggest competition brazil has ever hosted.. (WC 1950 cant count on it..)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Danny,

Yes, Rio's bid does have strengths, but so do the other bids. It is being a "new frontier" that helps Rio.

If Rio wins the 2016 Games, they must do a far better job with them than they did with the Pan Ams. You must accept that the Pan Ams were not an unqualified success. They got mixed reviews. Here's a link to one recent article that affirms this:

http://www.timescolonist.com/sports/2010wi...2548/story.html

Here's a quote:

“I’ve never been to Rio but heard about the [2007] Pan Am Games and Rio’s level of readiness could be a question,” said 2008 Beijing Olympic bronze-medallist and 2009 world championships silver-medallist swimmer Ryan Cochrane of Victoria, who will be 27 and competing in his third Olympics in 2016.

At least some of the athletes were not pleased with the Pan Ams or these negative opinions would not be circulating.

Here's another article:

http://latimesblogs.latimes.com/olympics_b...o-2016-bid.html

The focus is on Rio's serious crime problem. One athlete (a rower) said that during the final week, the atmosphere of the Pan Ams was one of "danger and paranoia."

Here's another link with a questionable view of the Pan Ams:

http://featuresblogs.chicagotribune.com/th...he-2016-ga.html

The emphasis here is on the infrastructure projects that were promised, but not delivered, "massive overspending, and poor organization that was described as "somewhat chaotic."

Here's yet another link that raises questions about the Pan Ams: http://www.time.com/time/world/article/0,8...1926094,00.html

On the whole, this article is pro-Rio and says that although the Pan Ams were a success, there were a great many problems and deficiencies.

Here's a quote:

The Pan Ams might have provided a three-week jamboree for millions of athletes, locals and visitors, but when the closing ceremony ended, the city returned to its usual mess, said Chico Alencar, a Rio Congressman who campaigned for investigations into the massive overspending at the Pan Am Games. "The chronic problems that we have here are the same as they always were," Alencar said. "I want Rio to win the right to host the games, but we need to learn from our past mistakes and the myth of the Pan American Games and all that they didn't leave behind. If we get the Olympics, then all sectors of society need to unite to ensure that there is a social legacy and no overspending."

There has been so much talk about how Brazil "needs" the Games and "deserves" the Games, but will the Olympics actually make a difference to the people? If they go the same way the Pan Ams did, the answer is "no."

I'm not saying Rio can't do it in 2016, I'm just saying that you should not point to the Pan Ams as proof.

Well, Ryan Cochrane was not there, but Gary Hall Jr. was and said that the swimming venue was of Olympic standard. Gary Hall Jr. is multi-gold-medallist, including back-to-back Olympic Champion of the 50m freestyle ('00 and '04).

The sense of paranoia was not widespread. Polls with most athletes considered the experience in Rio 2007 to be a very good one. Among all participants, the athletes tend to have enjoyed it the most.

On the infrastructure side, we have already talked about this. There were several delays and cancellation in infrastructure projects, because the municipality made this event its trademark driving away the opponent State Government - only Maracana was delivered among their investments - and made it difficult for the Federal Government to invest. As a result, the preparations were severely impacted as well as the budget, with the Federal Government and the NOC coming to rescue the games at the last moment. The lack of experience with multi-sport events was also a factor back then. But similar problems are arising during London 2012 preparations and I don't see anyone comparing both here. There is a lot people doubting Rio capacity to organize the Games, but when London did run, there were no such expectations.

What the Rio 2016 bid has successfully portrayed is that the mistakes of Rio 2007 were key for building a solid project for the 2016 Olympic. No other city bidding for 2016 has had such an experience in recent times. If they have to cope with the logistics of the organization their plans might be difficult to execute. So, the PanAm 2007 is a big asset for the bid and paved the way for a solid Olympic bid. It's benefit to the general population was limited due to the non-accomplished infrastructure investments, which are unlikely to be repeated this time, but the legacy for the sports and for the surrounding areas where the Games were staged were also significant.

So, people would say it was successful or not based on their own perspective. On the perspective of a sporting event, it was very successful. The vast majority of accounts from the participants attest that, but you cannot please everyone, so there might be some negative statements. Apparently you couldn't gather many, since you had to take one from an athlete that heard something and was not actually there.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Well, Rio got a lower rank than Doha indeed...

And then got the a great evaluation last report, when IOC come to Brazil TO SEE AND FACE the city...

The scores were based in the old "Can they really do this?"...

Remember of 2012 where all Rio plan was titled as "too much optimistic..."

Rio have two fights in this race, the contenders and the notorious pre-discredit by rich countries in everything above Equator line...

----

About PanAms, if we compare Rio with previous PanAms, Rio put the games in a higher level. (See pictures of the previous Olympic stadiums and JH's one... Or the Swimming Park... take a look).

Challenges were faced (mainly during that damn storm and heavy rain!!!), but EVERYTHING was well-done.

Concern and paranoia about crime will exist in developing countries since media tend to put things bigger than generally it is. BTW, only one athlete was mugged in Rio...

If you compare with Santo Domingo (some was robbed or Chicago 1959 when a Brazilian athlete was MURDERED), Rio made it well...

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Rio and Chicago are about 50/50 to me. Rio has the edge in having a variety of NOC votes to support it (allegedly) and the untapped Brazilian enthusiasm, but Chicago is a lucrative market and has the two big O's: Oprah and Obama.

Based on recent media reports, I would say Rio is coming off as a little annoying, no thanks to Lula. Hopefully votes don't take that stuff into account too much for their sake.

Link to comment
Share on other sites

And then got the a great evaluation last report, when IOC come to Brazil TO SEE AND FACE the city...

The scores were based in the old "Can they really do this?"...

Remember of 2012 where all Rio plan was titled as "too much optimistic..."

Rio have two fights in this race, the contenders and the notorious pre-discredit by rich countries in everything above Equator line...

----

About PanAms, if we compare Rio with previous PanAms, Rio put the games in a higher level. (See pictures of the previous Olympic stadiums and JH's one... Or the Swimming Park... take a look).

Challenges were faced (mainly during that damn storm and heavy rain!!!), but EVERYTHING was well-done.

Concern and paranoia about crime will exist in developing countries since media tend to put things bigger than generally it is. BTW, only one athlete was mugged in Rio...

If you compare with Santo Domingo (some was robbed or Chicago 1959 when a Brazilian athlete was MURDERED), Rio made it well...

Dannyel,

Don't waste your time. The EC was pretty convinced that Rio 2007 was a very positive experience. Those are all the remarks they made about Rio 2007 in their report:

VISION, LEGACY, COMMUNICATIONS AND OVERALL CONCEPT OF THE GAMES

"The Commission recognises that the Rio 2016 bid has benefitted from the experience, knowledge and teamwork already gained from organising the 2007 Pan-American Games. Furthermore, the transition from bid to OCOG would benefit from that experience in terms of structure and personnel."

LEGAL ASPECTS > OCOG structure and transition

"The transition to the OCOG would draw on the experience of the 2007 Pan American Games."

PARALYMPIC GAMES > Organising Committee

"Rio would also take advantage of the management experience gained through hosting the 2007 Para Pan-American Games."

OLYMPIC VILLAGE(S) > Post-Olympic use

"The Olympic Village would be converted into a residential community based on the model used for the 2007 Pan-American Games, offering medium to high quality accommodation in a rapidly growing part of the City."

MEDICAL SERVICES AND DOPING CONTROL

"The staging of the 2007 Pan-American Games in Rio led to significant improvements in processes for importing, taking care of and exporting horses."

TECHNOLOGY > Frequency control

"The Ministry of Communications, through the national telecommunications agency (ANATEL), is responsible for the allocation and control of frequencies and has guaranteed the free allocation of frequencies. ANATEL has event experience from the 2007 Pan-American Games."

Link to comment
Share on other sites

No doubts Obama can make something for Chicago. I can't see Oprah as a key person to change votes... Many people outside English-speaking-countries or Africa (she have a lot of actions there) doesn't know much of her after the Color Purple (She is a powerfull woman, but inside USA)

Link to comment
Share on other sites

Archived

This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.


×
×
  • Create New...