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World Cup Eclipses Olympics


Athensfan

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I attended to the PanAm 2007 Games and it WAS NOT a flop...

Baseball and softball had problems because a storm reached Rio de Janeiro in the mid-week 2 and winds were too strong that destroyed part of the temporaries venues at Rock'n Roll City in Rio.

But, we can't blame the nature...

It happened costs overruns, but less bigger than pointed here, thus people "forgot" to discount inflation rates approx. 25% in 5 years and forgot that the original plan was entirely changed... (HSBC Arena was not in the first plan...). BTW, how are the costs overruns for London 2012???

PanAms was not perfect, but was a great events, that putted PanAms in new stage...

Compare Rio 2007 with Winnipeg 99 venues or Santo Domingo 2003... It's visible the difference...

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I attended to the PanAm 2007 Games and it WAS NOT a flop...

Baseball and softball had problems because a storm reached Rio de Janeiro in the mid-week 2 and winds were too strong that destroyed part of the temporaries venues at Rock'n Roll City in Rio.

But, we can't blame the nature...

It happened costs overruns, but less bigger than pointed here, thus people "forgot" to discount inflation rates approx. 25% in 5 years and forgot that the original plan was entirely changed... (HSBC Arena was not in the first plan...). BTW, how are the costs overruns for London 2012???

PanAms was not perfect, but was a great events, that putted PanAms in new stage...

Compare Rio 2007 with Winnipeg 99 venues or Santo Domingo 2003... It's visible the difference...

It was a great event for the politicians and Nuzman/his gang at the COB.

They got a lot of public money to "invest"

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I attended to the PanAm 2007 Games and it WAS NOT a flop...

Baseball and softball had problems because a storm reached Rio de Janeiro in the mid-week 2 and winds were too strong that destroyed part of the temporaries venues at Rock'n Roll City in Rio.

But, we can't blame the nature...

It happened costs overruns, but less bigger than pointed here, thus people "forgot" to discount inflation rates approx. 25% in 5 years and forgot that the original plan was entirely changed... (HSBC Arena was not in the first plan...). BTW, how are the costs overruns for London 2012???

PanAms was not perfect, but was a great events, that putted PanAms in new stage...

Compare Rio 2007 with Winnipeg 99 venues or Santo Domingo 2003... It's visible the difference...

"forgot"......."it happens".........these are unacceptable excuses in business, let alone big business. How could an organization possibly forget to estimate the inflation rate??? :blink:

...and then I've read in a few posts people sort of brush it off as if somehow this is not an indication of disorganization.

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I said the critics of Rio forget to calculate the inflation for overrun cost... Not the CO-RIO...

And I've said it happened cost overruns just like London 2012...

Why don't go to London threads to accuse him of being disorganizated...

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Not to mention cariocas were SHAMELESSLY jeering foreign teams instead of at least being polite to them as hosts...

Tsk! Tsk!! I feel ashamed for my fellow cariocas!!

Yes, World Cup is definitely MORE exciting in Rio!! Which is why I want the Olympics in another city, like maybe Chicago, so I can savor ANOTHER ambience. In my calendar, I already have 2014 penciled in: Brasilia, Belo, Manaus, Rio and Sao Paulo!! For 2016, I X'ed out Rio; and put in Chicago!!

I WANT ANOTHER CITY FOR 2016!! Not the same old Rio again!!

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Not to mention cariocas were SHAMELESSLY jeering foreign teams instead of at least being polite to them as hosts...

Tsk! Tsk!! I feel ashamed for my fellow cariocas!!

Yes, World Cup is definitely MORE exciting in Rio!! Which is why I want the Olympics in another city, like maybe Chicago, so I can savor ANOTHER ambience. In my calendar, I already have 2014 penciled in: Brasilia, Belo, Manaus, Rio and Sao Paulo!! For 2016, I X'ed out Rio; and put in Chicago!!

I WANT ANOTHER CITY FOR 2016!! Not the same old Rio again!!

:lol: :lol: :lol:

9/10

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Why were they booed at Pan Am? What did they do?

I think mainly because someone from the US team wrote on a board "welcome to Congo" and soemone took a pic and it spread on the Internet and news pages, so I think that mightve been it, it's a racist affirmation .

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Doesn't the Superbowl every year eclipses Olympics in the US? Or am I wrong?

If I'm right, according to TV ratings american football gets much more attention than the Olymplics. And it happens every year.

Football wasn't popular in the US and still they hosted the WC'94. For strategic reasons. The same ones benefiting Rio now.

South America represents a market with big potential and which needs to be captivated.

Moreover, Chicago - for one reason or the other - gave away a SOG before, hasn't it?

If so, I wouldn't try to use this "prestige" argument.

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Doesn't the Superbowl every year eclipses Olympics in the US? Or am I wrong?

If I'm right, according to TV ratings american football gets much more attention than the Olymplics. And it happens every year.

Football wasn't popular in the US and still they hosted the WC'94. For strategic reasons. The same ones benefiting Rio now.

South America represents a market with big potential and which needs to be captivated.

Moreover, Chicago - for one reason or the other - gave away a SOG before, hasn't it?

If so, I wouldn't try to use this "prestige" argument.

EXCEPT THAT it comes too close after another gargantuan World Cup in 2014!! That's why.

And to correct you: Chicago didn't "gave away" a SOG before. It was taken from them by Teddy Roosevelt and the Missouri delegation who wanted 1904 to coincide with the World's Fari being held in St. Louis at that time...and just like Paris hosted BOTH the 1900 Games and WOrld Exposition four years earlier. Obama was NOT YET the occupant of the White House then.

Lame "Superbowl" argument. That is one sport thing HELD every year in the Winter which does NOT CUT INTO any prospective Olympic sponsors or audiences since it is NOT an Olympic sport. And uhmm...the Summer Games come once year FOUR years in the middle of the northern summer.

Get it right, ken. We aren't kids here.

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Several things to address here:

1. Multiple posters acknowledge that "the World Cup is more exciting in Rio." They are just interested in the Olympics because they would like to experience "another ambiance" -- in other words a different flavor. (Doesn't this sound like "dessert".) Nobody is contesting that the World Cup is far more important to Brazil than the Olympics. By hosting the events ONLY TWO YEARS APART, I am concerned that the Olympics will pale in comparison. Lula himself has described the Olympics as "the world's second-most prestigious sporting event behind the World Cup."

2. I understand that Maracana is the iconic stadium -- I really do. But it is iconic BECAUSE OF FOOTBALL. Rio is asking the IOC to break with tradition for the first time in this regard to honor an icon that IS ALL ABOUT FOOTBALL. It is a powerful symbolic indicator, though of course I agree it is not an intentional "statement."

3. Brazil does not make all sports a priority. Baseball and softball, sports without much Brazilian following, suffered at the Pan Ams. Also, we are now learning that funding couldn't be secured for an upcoming FINA World Cup event. Consequently, FINA was forced to cancel the event. I have no doubt that the funds would be there for the Olympics, but these kinds of things do show that certain sports just aren't a priority and as a result the organization and forethought is not always what it should be. The real issue here is the extent to which Brazil actually cares about the Olympics versus the extent to which they are just hungry for a status symbol.

4. There is no comparison between the Super Bowl and the Olympics. The ratings for the Super Bowl are huge -- but that's an audience for one day. The ratings of the Olympics are high and spread over two weeks. The Super Bowl has never "overshadowed" an Olympics and it never will. It's not an international sporting event and it doesn't have the same ideals behind it. Americans recognize this.

5. Bringing up the 1987 Pan Ams in Indianapolis is an extremely far-fetched comparison and has no bearing on any of this.

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I lived in Rio for some time, and now i live in New York.

In my view, there's no problem to host both events.

First of all, the WC is huge and is a country event, not just a city event. Brazil will probably receive more than 2 million visitors, including a huge number of people from closer Countries, like Argentina.

And the legacy for the city (Rio) will be fantastic: more hotels, services in general being improved and people better qualified. Airports improved (a key point), and the main stadium (Maracana) updated and ready 2 years before. Plus: Communications, Security, Public Services, Transportation... all will got a chance to better understand what (if) need to be improved !

So, in my view, it's nice that Rio got such chance.

And yes, i support Rio de Janeiro to see the games happen there ! And will not only support but also expect to go !

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4. There is no comparison between the Super Bowl and the Olympics. The ratings for the Super Bowl are huge -- but that's an audience for one day. The ratings of the Olympics are high and spread over two weeks. The Super Bowl has never "overshadowed" an Olympics and it never will. It's not an international sporting event and it doesn't have the same ideals behind it. Americans recognize this.

Also, having lived in a SuperBowl city a few years back, I personally found it rather ridiculous and silly that some people were anxious to volunteer for the SuperBowl - a competition between American millionaire players playing for billionaire owners that focused on a single game played in front of thousand dollar seats on a Sunday night.

And remembered how some people had outsize expectations for what a single, annual game and a week of festivities could do without any planning beyond that one week (REALITY: Added a lot of traffic, cleared out business and concentrated it at the stadium, etc.). And also saw how another downtown changed drastically before and after the SuperBowl (Detroit) but, clearly, it wasn't enough to sustain the city through the current recession.

Some of those experiences are affecting how I see the Chicago 2016 effort. But, as Americans, we've always considered the Olympics something different and special and valued for reasons beyond the sports themselves.

CHItown '16

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Stop being so childish. We're talking about one event two years ago and one half a century ago. What was Brazil like in 59?

The event was in 1959. We are in 2009. The case remains unsolved to this day.

But, you want a recent example of disorganization? Atlanta 96.

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Well, now I want to see your cynicism. Can you answer? It is easy to use cynicism to question facts about Rio, but I want to see your cynicism now, my friend :)

stirthesoul? stirthesoul?

1959 - Ronaldo Duncan Arantes, Brazilian Rowing Team Captain in Naperville:

http://www.suburbanchicagonews.com/beaconn...-090906.article

He apparently got caught up trying to smuggle guns to Brazil:

But dreams of international glory apparently were not all that was on the minds of Arantes and some of his fellow sportsmen. Romulo Duncan Arantes, younger brother of the doomed man and captain of their rowing team, told anyone who would listen that Ronaldo had brought $2,000 with him from Brazil, determined to smuggle home or perhaps resell as many guns as that money would buy.

At least 10 handguns were purchased by or for Pan-Am athletes during their stay here. Authorities could not or would not say why any of the men might have wanted the weaponry.

and with relations with other national teams in town for the Pan-Ams:

Happenstance, rumor and plain bad luck would vex police over the course of their ultimately fruitless investigation. Two of the dead-ends included two Chilean athletes who might have had crucial information about Arantes, and a North Central College housekeeper who discovered price tags from two newly purchased guns as she was cleaning the men's dorm room.

The Chileans had left the United States for their homeland by the time their names surfaced in the probe, and authorities were unsuccessful in efforts to extradite them or persuade them to return to Naperville on their own. Investigators later contacted them in the Chilean capital of Santiago, but neither man was able to shed any light on the mystery.

as well as additional questions about his behavior just before he was shot:

Romulo Arantes sneered at such notions, saying his brother was not despondent and was engaged to be married in three months.
Then there was the possible love triangle. Arantes, the night before his death, had gone to a social that was held in the athletes' honor, where he danced and may have flirted with an 18-year-old Naperville girl.

The girl was known only as Janet -- who was going steady with a young local man. And Arantes, only hours before dying, had bragged to his friends of how he was about to go on "a honey of a date with a beautiful woman."

From the reports, he seems like he could have ticked off quite a few of the wrong people.

Aside from that, we're talking about 1959-era police investigation methods, 1959-era technology, 1959-era security, and a city that is now completely different (it was also in Naperville, then a small town over an hour from the city). And it's very unlikely that anyone responsible from 50 years ago is still around. Random acts of violence do happen in Chicago as they do in almost every other major city.

Unfortunate occurrence but this is really a stretch as a reason for criticism.

CHItown '16

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Several things to address here:

1. Multiple posters acknowledge that "the World Cup is more exciting in Rio." They are just interested in the Olympics because they would like to experience "another ambiance" -- in other words a different flavor. (Doesn't this sound like "dessert".) Nobody is contesting that the World Cup is far more important to Brazil than the Olympics. By hosting the events ONLY TWO YEARS APART, I am concerned that the Olympics will pale in comparison. Lula himself has described the Olympics as "the world's second-most prestigious sporting event behind the World Cup."

2. I understand that Maracana is the iconic stadium -- I really do. But it is iconic BECAUSE OF FOOTBALL. Rio is asking the IOC to break with tradition for the first time in this regard to honor an icon that IS ALL ABOUT FOOTBALL. It is a powerful symbolic indicator, though of course I agree it is not an intentional "statement."

3. Brazil does not make all sports a priority. Baseball and softball, sports without much Brazilian following, suffered at the Pan Ams. Also, we are now learning that funding couldn't be secured for an upcoming FINA World Cup event. Consequently, FINA was forced to cancel the event. I have no doubt that the funds would be there for the Olympics, but these kinds of things do show that certain sports just aren't a priority and as a result the organization and forethought is not always what it should be. The real issue here is the extent to which Brazil actually cares about the Olympics versus the extent to which they are just hungry for a status symbol.

4. There is no comparison between the Super Bowl and the Olympics. The ratings for the Super Bowl are huge -- but that's an audience for one day. The ratings of the Olympics are high and spread over two weeks. The Super Bowl has never "overshadowed" an Olympics and it never will. It's not an international sporting event and it doesn't have the same ideals behind it. Americans recognize this.

5. Bringing up the 1987 Pan Ams in Indianapolis is an extremely far-fetched comparison and has no bearing on any of this.

That´s It. COB is asking IOC to break with tradition to honor an icon that IS ALL ABOUT FOOTBALL. IOC believe that the most prestigious sport event in the World is the SOG, and this is the truth. SOG were used as propagand all over the time, just see during the Cold War period. When Lula said that, it´s just how brazilians see the thing: don´t realise that WC is not about sporting...is only about football, and only about 32 countries.

It´s also true that Brazil is not interested in developing the sport in this country, it´s only interest in status and to show to the world that "a new world power is rising". Let´s stop saying that if Brazil wins, South America wins. Brazil is a country completely different from whole continent. People here don´t even know the difference between Bolivia, Peru and Venezuela. If Rio wins, Brazil wins. If Chicago wins, USA wins, not North America...

But I don´t agree with the concerns about Word Cup two years earlier. It is a concern only for the sponsors, and for the people who are interest in Olympics for money. People in Brazil will be even more excited for Olympics after the World Cup. There will be a felling "I want more" going around. Olympics being here will be good for Brazilians to change the sense that we are enable to do good things. We suffer of lack of self-confidence. Brazil is a rising power in the world, and people should understand that this is what Rio 2016 represente. This thing about "a new era begins for IOC" is bulls***t. Give the Olympics to a poor south american country like Paraguay, Uruguay, and you can say that a new era had begun. Few countries in the World can use the public money as we can.

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