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Lula Says Ioc Must Give Rio The Olympics


Athensfan

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I hadn't heard that comment about "main dish" vs. "dessert".

I think Lula's comments make it pretty clear that the Olympics would be the latter for Brazil -- even to the point of using the football stadium rather than the athletics arena as the home of the cauldron and the ceremonies. It makes it very clear where Brazil's priorities are.

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Like I said - I think Rio's lack of experience of being in the position they are is starting to tell. It may not be fatal (I sure hope it isn't), but nevertheless they're doing and saying some silly and unneccesary things lately.

Lula have made some speechs that can hurt some IOC members that didn't decided yet. I agree.

But I think their speechs will not lose already promised or taken votes.

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Lula have made some speechs that can hurt some IOC members that didn't decided yet. I agree.

But I think their speechs will not lose already promised or taken votes.

Oh, I'd agree. I would, at a guess, think maybe two-thirds to a three quarters of IOC members have already made up their minds. But that still leaves a lot who have to be convinced - and which could mean the difference between winning and losing.

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Athensfan, may I disagree you?

First. Lula is not the head of the Rio bid. So he is only a "star" promoting the campaign in his way (controversial, including for many Brazilians).

I don't like much the idea of having Maracana as the "ceremonies stadium", but Rio wants to make a difference. Maracana and the marathon ending in Samba-drome were well evaluated by IOC Evaluation Report.

South America is a continent mad for soccer/football, true, and why not make a huge Olympic party in one of the major Soccer stadiums of the world? It's symbolic for southamerican-way-of-make-Oympics.

It can be a good idea. Why not?

I repeat, I prefer the tradition of having cauldron in Olympic Stadium, but it will be new have the cauldron in Maracana and it will be amazing. Trust me.

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Roltel, really, Lula is not the key person of Rio bid as Obama can be for Chicago - Maybe a great advatage for Rio is not depending in someone be present or not.

The key person for a Rio victory is Joao Havelange, former Fifa president, with great acess for many IOC voters above Equator line.

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I’m a bit disappointed how Rio has managed the last few weeks of this campaign. Up until the Eval Report, I thought they seemed to be doing everything right. But it just seems to me that the team hasn’t handled their new found “possible (and definitely arguable) front-runner” label well. It just seems to me a worrying trend that statements like this are starting to appear when it should be a time for closing the ranks and maintaining strict discipline. Having a charismatic leader who speaks his mind is one thing, but this is a game of diplomacy now. All bids are begging for a privilege. Making demands is definitely the WRONG thing to do.

I’m still hoping for Rio, but I just hope they don’t shoot themselves in the foot. It would be a shame to come so far and only have themselves to blame if they come up short.

This was my interpretation from a few weeks ago:

http://www.gamesbids.com/forums/index.php?...st&p=218696

To parse potential additional possible meaning from the EC report:

* "Ambitious but achievable" => Chicago 2016 thinks that we've left a lot of money on the table during the past few Olympics. We've concluded that they are probably right.

* No major concerns => Not in the public report. We'll send an addendum through private mail to answer the questions you've been asking. In the mean time, we'll see how reliable and trustworthy they'll prove themselves to be over the next 30 days.

=> If we're not receiving straight answers now (we know everything isn't perfect and some issues with their plan will require considerable effort to address but their defensiveness while answering questions has increased by a magnitude since the last presentations; we expect their defensiveness to continue to increase if this report establishes them as front-runner), will we receive reliably accurate answers during the next 7 years? Will we need to dispatch a standing evaluation team to assure that we can accurately gauge progress? Could some of these projects be completed, established, and adapted for Games needs in 7 years?

I have no means to know what the IOC was thinking but, given what we've already seen, this interpretation is starting to look more likely. Not very straightforward but it's apparently a pretty effective means to find an answer before making a final decision.

CHItown '16

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Danny -- thanks for such a considerate post -- I mean that sincerely.

You are right -- Lula is not the bid. However, right now he is the voice of the bid. He has been very vocal and very public about why the IOC must give Brazil the Games.

Regarding Maracana -- it is a beautiful stadium, with large capacity. However, I agree with your personal preference. I think Olympic tradition counts for something and it would be best to have the cauldron at a venue that features sports that were actually contested in ancient Olympia.

The athletics stadium is historically the "centerpiece" of the Games. By breaking with tradition for the first time ever and staging the ceremonies and the torch in the football venue, Rio sends a clear message: "FOOTBALL IS THE MOST IMPORTANT THING TO US." It seems very clear that World Cup will be far more important and exciting for Brazilians -- meaning the Olympics will just be a pleasant "denoument". This troubles me greatly.

For me, and for most Americans, the Olympics are as big as it gets. There is no greater celebration on earth. It doesn't sound like Brazil sees it that way.

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Roltel, really, Lula is not the key person of Rio bid as Obama can be for Chicago - Maybe a great advatage for Rio is not depending in someone be present or not.

The key person for a Rio victory is Joao Havelange, former Fifa president, with great acess for many IOC voters above Equator line.

True, but as the leader of the nation of a bidding city, he IS a spokesman.

Remember, it's legendary now how many people think Jacques Chirac's comment about British and Finnish food may have cost Paris 2012.

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I really didn't watched 2012 campaing after Rio cutted.

Well, If Chirac messed up, so it's a real concern for Rio if Lula make a improvised speech.

But I think he will make a speech approved by the Rio 2016 comittee, and he only will something improvised at the end. I hope so!!!! LOL

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Danny -- thanks for such a considerate post -- I mean that sincerely.

You are right -- Lula is not the bid. However, right now he is the voice of the bid. He has been very vocal and very public about why the IOC must give Brazil the Games.

Regarding Maracana -- it is a beautiful stadium, with large capacity. However, I agree with your personal preference. I think Olympic tradition counts for something and it would be best to have the cauldron at a venue that features sports that were actually contested in ancient Olympia.

The athletics stadium is historically the "centerpiece" of the Games. By breaking with tradition for the first time ever and staging the ceremonies and the torch in the football venue, Rio sends a clear message: "FOOTBALL IS THE MOST IMPORTANT THING TO US." It seems very clear that World Cup will be far more important and exciting for Brazilians -- meaning the Olympics will just be a pleasant "denoument". This troubles me greatly.

For me, and for most Americans, the Olympics are as big as it gets. There is no greater celebration on earth. It doesn't sound like Brazil sees it that way.

agree! Hate the idea of using Maracana.. Like cmon there's an olympic stadium to be used and the most modern of Latin America. Despite maracanas capacity is has less ground space in comparison to Havelange Olympic stadium. it's a very egoist idea to have the Olympics in the center of a world cup monumentum. Btw maracana will be used in the 2014WC and the olympics stadium will stay aside. So if Rio 2016 let Things stay traditionally as it is, ceremonies and torch at the main stadia.. =\

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Maybe with a Rio victory IOC can request to change it...

I think bid wants to honour Maracana as a stadium that hosted PanAms Opening Ceremony, two World Cup final matches and a Olympics Opening Ceremony...

I prefer JH, but I will not be sad if Maracana host the Opening Ceremony. Maracana is the most important Brazilian stadium and the third most visited place in Brazil.

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Why should the IOC "request" anything from Rio. It's the other way around. Rio is asking for the *priviledge* of hosting the Olympic Games, so Rio should be bending over backwards to accommodate whatever the IOC asks for.

If the IOC really wanted the change, they wouldn't request it. Just make the OCOG a suggestion they couldn't refuse.

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If the IOC really wanted the change, they wouldn't request it. Just make the OCOG a suggestion they couldn't refuse.

^^^

Made me chuckle, Roltel.

The important thing here is not where the ceremonies would be held. The important thing is what the proposal of Maracana reinforces about the Brazilian mindset: FOOTBALL IS THE MOST IMPORTANT THING. Everything else (including the Olympics) is second place. So far nobody has contested this. Nobody has contested the idea that the Olympics would just be a denoument to the World Cup. I think it is a very real concern.

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As people like to say here Lula stated a FACT.

Olympic games are the second biggest sports events... fact...

Could he be more simpathic saying only a major sports event, yes, and he should did... But that's Lula, unfortunatelly or otherwise...

This is a load of rubbish!

The Olympic Games are the biggest sporting event in terms of participation and number of countries involved FACT! The majority of the world and opinions would agree with this.

I agree with rotel that the Rio bid team were doing a swell job up until the evaluation report and have lost their way a little since then.

These comments from Lula will not help at all! Discipline will be critical for Rio if they wish to host the games. This is where Chicago will have the advantage in the days to come before the vote.

It is a privilege to host the games and not a right! I am not saying that this is how Lula is behaving but everyone should remember that.

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^^^

Made me chuckle, Roltel.

The important thing here is not where the ceremonies would be held. The important thing is what the proposal of Maracana reinforces about the Brazilian mindset: FOOTBALL IS THE MOST IMPORTANT THING. Everything else (including the Olympics) is second place. So far nobody has contested this. Nobody has contested the idea that the Olympics would just be a denoument to the World Cup. I think it is a very real concern.

Thais can actually be turned into something positive for the Rio bid. It's no secret that football is the most important thing for Brazilians. So it is for Italians, Greeks, Argentinians, English, Spanish, etc. However, Brazil is a growing market for Olympic sports. Sports like swimming, athletics, sailing and judo already have many people practising and are becoming a regular in TV broadcasting. This is not to mention the already popular Basketball and Volleyball.

So, staging the Games outside a saturated market for those competitions is a way of pushing that momentum forward. Why do you think the Brazilian bid keeps repeating that South America has one of the largest young populations in the world?

By the way, the decision to host the OCs at Maracana has to do with preserving the city investments. There is no need to build a second 80.000+ stadium in Rio. And there is no point in spending a lot of money to build a track in the stadium to host athletics.

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The important thing here is not where the ceremonies would be held. The important thing is what the proposal of Maracana reinforces about the Brazilian mindset: FOOTBALL IS THE MOST IMPORTANT THING. Everything else (including the Olympics) is second place.

It's unfair to state this...

Many, but MANY Brazilians would disagree.

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Why should the IOC "request" anything from Rio. It's the other way around. Rio is asking for the *priviledge* of hosting the Olympic Games, so Rio should be bending over backwards to accommodate whatever the IOC asks for.

No doubts, that's what I meant.

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This was my interpretation from a few weeks ago:

http://www.gamesbids.com/forums/index.php?...st&p=218696

I have no means to know what the IOC was thinking but, given what we've already seen, this interpretation is starting to look more likely. Not very straightforward but it's apparently a pretty effective means to find an answer before making a final decision.

CHItown '16

Well, I wouldn't be that critical. After all, the main activity for the final month is lobbying, which would not get a lot of attention from the press, since it happens behind closed doors. Actually, I would say that it is more over the phone. Some small insider notes released by some Brazilian blogs, together with the big fuss that Lula does indicates that lobbying is at full throttle in the Rio bid.

While Chicago and Madrid have been announcing acts to fix their problems (Chicago guarantees and Spanish anti-doping laws), Rio is focusing at the job at hand: convincing IOC members. So, the question is who is winning this battle, and that's difficult to judge. The momentum is with the best lobbyists.

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Well, I wouldn't be that critical. After all, the main activity for the final month is lobbying, which would not get a lot of attention from the press, since it happens behind closed doors. Actually, I would say that it is more over the phone. Some small insider notes released by some Brazilian blogs, together with the big fuss that Lula does indicates that lobbying is at full throttle in the Rio bid.

While Chicago and Madrid have been announcing acts to fix their problems (Chicago guarantees and Spanish anti-doping laws), Rio is focusing at the job at hand: convincing IOC members. So, the question is who is winning this battle, and that's difficult to judge. The momentum is with the best lobbyists.

According to Brazilians newspapers, in the last weeks Nuzman (NOC president) and Osorio (Bid comittee high member) were travelling the world make campaigning...

That's why only Lula showed up lately...

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Danny -- thanks for such a considerate post -- I mean that sincerely.

You are right -- Lula is not the bid. However, right now he is the voice of the bid. He has been very vocal and very public about why the IOC must give Brazil the Games.

The athletics stadium is historically the "centerpiece" of the Games. By breaking with tradition for the first time ever and staging the ceremonies and the torch in the football venue, Rio sends a clear message: "FOOTBALL IS THE MOST IMPORTANT THING TO US." It seems very clear that World Cup will be far more important and exciting for Brazilians -- meaning the Olympics will just be a pleasant "denoument". This troubles me greatly.

For me, and for most Americans, the Olympics are as big as it gets. There is no greater celebration on earth. It doesn't sound like Brazil sees it that way.

Brazil don't sees it that way. WC is far more important and exciting for Brazilians. Thats a fact and it wont change. At least not in the next 20 years. Giving SA the opportunity to host the Olympic Games would be the only way to make it change. You can't win a new market by staying away.

The top5 most popular sports in Brazil are: Football, Volleyball, Auto Races (mainly F-1), Futsal and Basketball. 2 of them aren't olympic sports and the most popular one - Football - sends amateur teams to participate in the Olympics..

So yeh, If IOC doesn't want that they shouldn't let Rio host it. This discussion about Maracana vs. JH is useless. Choosing Maracana wont send a message that IOC don't already know.

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Brazil don't sees it that way. WC is far more important and exciting for Brazilians. Thats a fact and it wont change. At least not in the next 20 years. Giving SA the opportunity to host the Olympic Games would be the only way to make it change. You can't win a new market by staying away.

The top5 most popular sports in Brazil are: Football, Volleyball, Auto Races (mainly F-1), Futsal and Basketball. 2 of them aren't olympic sports and the most popular one - Football - sends amateur teams to participate in the Olympics..

So yeh, If IOC doesn't want that they shouldn't let Rio host it. This discussion about Maracana vs. JH is useless. Choosing Maracana wont send a message that IOC don't already know.

Good point

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Brazil don't sees it that way. WC is far more important and exciting for Brazilians. Thats a fact and it wont change. At least not in the next 20 years. Giving SA the opportunity to host the Olympic Games would be the only way to make it change. You can't win a new market by staying away.

The top5 most popular sports in Brazil are: Football, Volleyball, Auto Races (mainly F-1), Futsal and Basketball. 2 of them aren't olympic sports and the most popular one - Football - sends amateur teams to participate in the Olympics..

So yeh, If IOC doesn't want that they shouldn't let Rio host it. This discussion about Maracana vs. JH is useless. Choosing Maracana wont send a message that IOC don't already know.

That's not exclusive to Brazilians. I live in France - pretty good Olympic power - and, last year, Euro 2008 got more coverage than the SOG. And France is not the most football crazy nation in Europe. On the contrary, Italy, Spain, UK, Germany and others are even more "football countries".

In many countries, the WC gets 100% coverage with all matches being broadcast in network TV, regardless of the countries playing. On the other hand, the Olympics typically have only the most prospective events broadcast. By the way, the cable channels in Brazil show much more events in the SOG than their counterparts in France.

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