Qatar 2022

[Lord David]

Canada would be a great host now that they're getting new stadiums and such.

12 venue plan spread in 3 "regions"

West:

Vancouver - BC Place - 54,000
Calgary - McMahon Stadium (or new stadium) 50,000

Edmonton - Commonwealth Stadium - 54,000

Regina - New Taylor Field - 40,000

Central:

Winnipeg - Winnipeg Stadium - 40,000

Toronto - New Stadium - 100,000

Hamilton - New Ivor Wynne Stadium - 40,000

Ottawa - Frank Clair Stadium - 40,000

East:

Moncton - Moncton Stadium - 40,000

Montreal - Olympic Stadium - 60,000

Quebec City - New Stadium - 42,000

Halifax - New Stadium - 42,000

Ideally, you should have 32 municipalities hosting the 32 teams, but realistically it would probably be 16, hosting 2 teams each, possibly drawn from non host cities to spread the World Cup feel a bit.

Victoria, British Columbia

Kelwona, British Columbia

Fort McMurray, Alberta

Saskatoon, Sakatchewan

Brandon, Manitoba

Windsor, Ontario

London, Ontario

Gatineau, Quebec

Sherbrooke, Quebec

Fredricton, New Brunswick

St John's, Newfoundland

Charlottetown, Prince Edward Island

Cape Breton, Nova Scotia

Whitehorse, Yukon Territory

Yellowknife, Northwest Territories

Iqaluit, Nunavut

Perhaps it could work.

[intoronto]

Iqaluit? lol not a chance, though they will host a Canada Games in the 2020's they might get facilities.

The new Regina stadium is being built to 33,000 and I don't think there is expansion built into it.

[Lord David]

Iqaluit shouldn't be left out, the same with the other Territory capitals. They should be offered training facilities and at least 2 standard sized football fields as a legacy of the World Cup for use in training. If weather is deemed a little to harsh (even during June/July), then make such facilities fully indoor, using artificial turf if need be.

There has to be expansion (possibility) built into Regina's stadium. What would happen to future Grey Cup games then?

[Quaker2001]

It would appear that IF Platini were President of FIFA, he would strongly pressure Qatar to change dates to January, which although unfavorable with the whole football schedule, will allow Qatar to host in favorable temperatures.

This could theoretically see a Winter Olympics bid from a Southern Hemisphere nation be successful as to avoid a clash or the direct following of 2 major sporting events (the World Cup being held in January with the Winter Olympics immediately following it in February).

Does the IOC strike you as the type of organization that's going to be swayed what someone else is doing, let alone FIFA? It's probably going to be years before FIFA and the Qatar 2022 folks come to a decision on when to hold the World Cup. The vote for the 2022 Olympics takes place in 2015. The deadline to submit a bid is in November of THIS year. So unless some Southern hemisphere country pulls a bid out of their ass in the next few months, it's not happening.

Why the heck didn't they just bid as a joint group back in 2010? That is a total game changer. A Gulf World Cup is completely different to just Qatar. Throw in the UAE and Bahrain, and we've actually got something palatable. This appears to be a concession that the current plan is unfeasible. On one hand I quite like the idea of the entire Gulf co-hosting, and on the other (seeing as we have 9 years) I want the bid reopened. Perhaps between just the USA and Gulf, or even allow other bids to come forward again (I have a feeling Australia wouldn't be interested again - the 2022 World Cup is to Australia what the 2016 Olympics is to Chicago).

I mentioned this elsewhere.. I don't want the United States to take FIFA's sloppy seconds. They had a chance to grow the sport in this country at a time when interest in international soccer is as strong as its ever been here. But they said no, opting instead to follow the money and go to Qatar. If FIFA is interested, come talk to us about 2026. Let them crash and burn for 2022.

Iqaluit shouldn't be left out, the same with the other Territory capitals. They should be offered training facilities and at least 2 standard sized football fields as a legacy of the World Cup for use in training. If weather is deemed a little to harsh (even during June/July), then make such facilities fully indoor, using artificial turf if need be.

Iqaluit needs to be left out. It's laughable to even suggest them. It's a town of less than 7,000 people, remotely isolated from the rest of Canada and probably doesn't need the types of facilities a World Cup would bring. You're talking about the 2nd largest country by area on the planet. You can't expect to spread this event to every conceivable corner of the country and think that's going to work for the participating countries and the tens of thousands of fans that would come along with them.

[Lord David]

Well to answer your first remark, then sure, if nothing regards to the scheduling of the Qatar 2022 World Cup is changed immediately, then perhaps we won't expect a Southern Hemisphere bid, let alone one that has a big advantage because of the scheduling changes.

As for your last remark. Iqaluit could use such facilities. It has been mentioned that they're going to host the Canadian Summer Games in 2033, so such indoor venues would be a great boost to help them in their hosting of said event. Not to mention a legacy for sport in general to the city and Territory. It'll only be hosting in terms of the training camp for the lead up of the World Cup, during the WC teams would naturally be traveling around the country in at the host cities they have matches scheduled in. The die hard fans will meet them at their training camps for sure. The rest would naturally just follow the team at their group matches and beyond.

Imagine a legacy for the Territories in 2 indoor FIFA standard football fields (which post WC could be converted for use as exhibition/convention type facilities, indoor arenas, community centers etc and in the case of Iqaluit be of great use for the 2033 Canadian Summer Games ) as well as a full scale professional sports gym. A chance for the Territories to be involved and not feel left out, alongside the smaller Provinces not hosting.

Edited March 4, 2013 by Lord David

[BABYLON]

It'll either be Canada or the US with their gridiron football venues.

I think we are fine! Qatar can have it again. Maybe they can buy some private island in the Caribbean and host the whole thing there.

[Lord David]

I'd like to see them do Baron's idea from a while back, get a hold of Comoros!

[stryker]

I think it's just a matter of time before FIFA moves the 2022 World Cup to the winter months. The Qataris can talk all they want about cooling technologies, but let's face it, the prospect of playing in 110 degree heat isn't going to go over well especially as 2022 gets closer.

As far as a joint bid goes, the problem with a Gulf Cup would be handling qualification issues especially if you include the UAE, Kuwait, Oman, Bahrain. I think a much better option would be including Saudi Arabia who could supply the necessary venues in Riyadh, Jeddah (the new King Abdullah Stadium is set for construction), Dammam, and possibly Buraida. At least the Saudis have a couple WC qualifications under their belts.

[iceyone]

Well 2026 can't go to Australia unfortunately.

We wouldn't want it anyway.

If there are any changes, the losing bidders should sue Fifa.

Fifa shouldn't change a thing - the bid was for a summer world cup - if Qatar cannot deliver the air conditioned stadiums then too bad - Fifa/Qatar have made their bed - let them lie in it.

[intoronto]

We wouldn't want it anyway.

If there are any changes, the losing bidders should sue Fifa.

Fifa shouldn't change a thing - the bid was for a summer world cup - if Qatar cannot deliver the air conditioned stadiums then too bad - Fifa/Qatar have made their bed - let them lie in it.

2026 hasn't been decided though

I think it's just a matter of time before FIFA moves the 2022 World Cup to the winter months. The Qataris can talk all they want about cooling technologies, but let's face it, the prospect of playing in 110 degree heat isn't going to go over well especially as 2022 gets closer.

As far as a joint bid goes, the problem with a Gulf Cup would be handling qualification issues especially if you include the UAE, Kuwait, Oman, Bahrain. I think a much better option would be including Saudi Arabia who could supply the necessary venues in Riyadh, Jeddah (the new King Abdullah Stadium is set for construction), Dammam, and possibly Buraida. At least the Saudis have a couple WC qualifications under their belts.

Where would people drink alcohol in Saudi Arabia? How would women and LGBT people be treated? Its a non-starter if you ask me.

[gotosy]

FIFA medical chief against summer 2022 World Cup

KNOKKE, Belgium (AP) - FIFA's medical chief is against holding the 2022 World Cup in the summer heat of the desert nation Qatar.

Michel D'Hooghe added a strong voice on Friday to the debate about whether Qatar should stick to the traditional slot of June for a World Cup or shifted to a time of the year when the climate is more temperate.

Even though D'Hooghe said games and trainings would be held in climate conditioned temperatures of 21 degrees (70 F), the thousands of fans and other officials following the month-long tournament would have to deal much more with the scorching heat.

"Personally, I think it would be a good thing if we could play this World Cup in better temperatures than in full summer in Qatar," D'Hooghe said.

FIFA President Sepp Blatter said that for the time being "it is a problem without solution."

D'Hooghe's comments came after a meeting of FIFA's medical committee on the Belgian coast, and followed FIFA Secretary General Jerome Valcke's remarks last weekend about the tournament possibly moving to winter if medical evidence showed that playing in intense summer heat would be dangerous.

"From a medical point of view, I can say we are concerned," D'Hooghe said, and he looked beyond the plight of the players, arguing he had ironclad guarantees that the game and training grounds would offer ideal conditions.

"The problem is of course the life beside all that. And the problem is much bigger for the other people surrounding the World Cup. The public that has to move from city to city and that has to live in temperatures that are very elevated."

Blatter insists that if any change is made it will have to come from local organizers.

"The movement must come from Qatar," Blatter said.

Valcke has said that the executive committee could decide on the shift to winter if the summer heat, which can exceed 40 degrees (102 F).

UEFA President Michel Platini has already said he would prefer the cooler winter months, but such a shift would be a major headache for clubs and leagues who are in the midst of their own seasons at that time.

CONCACAF, which governs the sport in North and Central America and the Caribbean, is still backing the summer World Cup, whatever the climatic challenges. FIFA says the options could remain open until the 2019-22 international calendar is set. There is no precise deadline to approve it.

AP

[Rob2012]

Someone needs to sue FIFA over this mess. Rivals bidders, European leagues and clubs, TV networks, sponsors, players...all are being mucked about because of FIFA's inability to think properly.

The bid was for a summer world cup, and the chief medical officer made the same claims BEFORE the 2010 vote so it's not as if the ExCo didn't know about these concerns. They voted for Qatar anyway, so they either keep it in the summer, or be prepared for a backlash.

[runningrings]

Someone needs to sue FIFA over this mess. Rivals bidders, European leagues and clubs, TV networks, sponsors, players...all are being mucked about because of FIFA's inability to think properly.

The bid was for a summer world cup, and the chief medical officer made the same claims BEFORE the 2010 vote so it's not as if the ExCo didn't know about these concerns. They voted for Qatar anyway, so they either keep it in the summer, or be prepared for a backlash.

Several weeks back i was talking about this very issue at the pub with a few people, one of whom is a football fanatic, and an interesting point was made about the FIFA executive committee. It is too unregulated, too small, and there is an internal culture of being above the law. They are not held to anywhere near the same standards and protocol as IOC members are.

It's almost as if these former players do not engage in any kind of critical thinking whatsoever. The results from the 2018 and 2022 bids reflect this. I don't doubt for a second that Russia will host a marvellous World Cup in 2018 - but for England to rank where it did reflects something truly rotten. We're talking about that gave birth to association football, and logistically proved its abilities with London 2012. You don't get a better selection of venues, either. As for 2022, the selection of Qatar over the other candidates is simply foul. The USA should be outraged. Australia was outraged. What kind of logic, sees a country like Australia, an emerging and fast growing football market, with the hosting experience we have, and the plan we offered, get just ONE vote. Still can't get over it.

FIFA - you **** in your bed, you sleep in it.

[Quaker2001]

I'm okay with Russia 2018. It's a white zone for FIFA. It expands the game to a new region of the globe that haven't hosted a major international tournament before. And yea England was last in the voting, but much like Chicago in the 2016 Olympic vote, is it really that big a deal between 2nd place and 4th?

Qatar 2022 though was, is, and will remain a joke until it's held. I don't know if anyone has grounds to sue FIFA, but Qatar's bid was predicated on them being able to stage a World Cup during the summer. That was questionable from the start. And it sounds like they won't be able to figure this one out until 2019 at the earliest.

I've said it before and I'm sure I'll keep saying it because runningrings is 100%.. FIFA made this decision. Now they have to live with the consequences. I really hope this is as big a disaster as we all believe it will be and that they can't wait to come to the United States in 2026 when clearly they should have been there for 2022.

[intoronto]

The IOC should be taking notes.

[runningrings]

I'm okay with Russia 2018. It's a white zone for FIFA. It expands the game to a new region of the globe that haven't hosted a major international tournament before. And yea England was last in the voting, but much like Chicago in the 2016 Olympic vote, is it really that big a deal between 2nd place and 4th?

I think in the context of Chicago 2016, England 2018 and Australia 2022, the crux the anger comes from three fantastic, highly competent options being not only rejected, but rejected in first rounds, with an almost offensively low level of votes garnered. Australia only managed to get one vote, one to Qatar's 11 in the same round. Bias aside, Australia tabled a magnificent bid for 2022, that would have given the FIFA Tournament that magic spark Sydney gave the Olympics in 2000. Instead, we get Qatar. Another dumb aspect of FIFA's selection (albeit bribed) is the fact that the global economy is volatile, and will be for the next decade at least. Who knows what state the Qatari economy will be in 9 years from now? It's a one trick money economy. It's already slowed dramatically over the past 12 months.

[Quaker2001]

I think in the context of Chicago 2016, England 2018 and Australia 2022, the crux the anger comes from three fantastic, highly competent options being not only rejected, but rejected in first rounds, with an almost offensively low level of votes garnered. Australia only managed to get one vote, one to Qatar's 11 in the same round. Bias aside, Australia tabled a magnificent bid for 2022, that would have given the FIFA Tournament that magic spark Sydney gave the Olympics in 2000. Instead, we get Qatar. Another dumb aspect of FIFA's selection (albeit bribed) is the fact that the global economy is volatile, and will be for the next decade at least. Who knows what state the Qatari economy will be in 9 years from now? It's a one trick money economy. It's already slowed dramatically over the past 12 months.

At the risk of sounding like the arrogant American here, I think you're over-selling Australia's bid just a touch. I have no doubts the Aussies would put on a great show, but there are stadium stadium issues they'd have towork throuhgh. Easier said than done.

That said, they certainly didn't deserve to finish with fewer votes than Qatar. No one did. Although it's worth noting.. with Olympic bidding, it's common, if not expected for a losing bid to return for the next cycle. With FIFA and the World Cup, that's not usually going to be the case because whatever country wins will eliminate that whole confederation for the next time around. So with Qatar winning, Australia doesn't return to the fold for a while.

Still goes without saying that Austrlaia deserved it more than Qatar. I had said that if the United States didn't win it, I had hoped it would be Australia. Which makes it a darn shame that we're now looking at it being at least 2 decades before Australia could host a World Cup

[runningrings]

At the risk of sounding like the arrogant American here, I think you're over-selling Australia's bid just a touch. I have no doubts the Aussies would put on a great show, but there are stadium stadium issues they'd have towork throuhgh. Easier said than done.

That said, they certainly didn't deserve to finish with fewer votes than Qatar. No one did. Although it's worth noting.. with Olympic bidding, it's common, if not expected for a losing bid to return for the next cycle. With FIFA and the World Cup, that's not usually going to be the case because whatever country wins will eliminate that whole confederation for the next time around. So with Qatar winning, Australia doesn't return to the fold for a while.

Still goes without saying that Austrlaia deserved it more than Qatar. I had said that if the United States didn't win it, I had hoped it would be Australia. Which makes it a darn shame that we're now looking at it being at least 2 decades before Australia could host a World Cup

If FIFA is largely the same type of organisation in two decades from now, I'd rather Australia didn't bother with a World Cup, and perhaps put its energy into a bid for a third Olympics.

I don't think I was over selling Australia's bid, I was putting it into a context against the one vote it received. I wasn't really aware of any stadium issues? None that would hinder the execution of the event in any way.

[Sir Rols]

Without the rose coloured glasses on, we had a workable bid, but it had its weaknesses. We were getting stick for our distances (though we're on par with the US on that), and the A-league in hindsight hasn't been as strong and vibrant as we tried to sell it (though winning the WC may have sparked the comp more). Then there was the others codes, the AFL especially, pissing on it for their own reasons.

But of course, losing so disgustingly to Qatar sure wasn't a fair reflection on it.

Edited March 16, 2013 by Sir Rols

[Rob2012]

I think in the context of Chicago 2016, England 2018 and Australia 2022, the crux the anger comes from three fantastic, highly competent options being not only rejected, but rejected in first rounds, with an almost offensively low level of votes garnered.

Not for me. I was shocked at getting one vote, but the 2018 field was stronger than the 2022 field anyway. In all honesty, I was shocked (but not surprised) we didn't finish ahead of the Dutch bid which didn't even have proper government support, but we all knew Russia would win so losing was not a great surprise.

The anger comes from the shoddy process FIFA ran, the amount of ExCo members caught accepting bribes, the apparent distain for England (e.g. Jack Warner's inverse racism every time our press questioned FIFA), and later the disgusting reception the head of our FA received when he (bravely) stood in front of FIFA Congress and expressed his belief that an election for FIFA President with the only candidate (after Blatter's opponement was suspended on corruption charges) was not good for the game. We had two BBC documentaries on FIFA corruption, one before and one after vote, we had the Argentine member openly admitting he wasn't basing his vote on the good of the game but on the fact we claimed the Falklands, and we also had Mr Blatter "reminding" voters before the host election about the trouble the media had caused.

Chicago 2016 had every reason to be shocked becuase they were publically humiliated in the election. And there might've been some IOC members who went back on promises - which is annoying, not very nice, but sadly their perogotive to change their mind. I did feel sorry for Chicago. But Chicago wasn't part of the shoddiest sporting election in the last decade and a half. England and Australia, though, were. At least England can say we were beaten by a bid that makes sense. Australia, on top of the anger of going through a bid process marred by corruption, also has to watch Qatar hosting! Poor sods.

Edited March 16, 2013 by RobH

[Quaker2001]

I don't think I was over selling Australia's bid, I was putting it into a context against the one vote it received. I wasn't really aware of any stadium issues? None that would hinder the execution of the event in any way.

Really? None at all? You don't consider this an issue?..

I'm not arguing with a stadium that could hold 100,000 people for a World Cup final, but that's some pretty awful sightlines for those in the lower deck. As Rols noted, there would be grounds sharing issues with the AFL and NRL. Not sure how easy those would be to solve. And if you're dealing largely with oval-shaped stadiums, that's going to be something of a hinderance. Certainly not a deal-breaker, but these factors don't exactly work to Australia's advantage in that regard.

Again, we could argue the merits of this bid versus the United States and who should have won that election since we all know who should NOT have won.

[runningrings]

The MCG wouldn't have been the first round field a FIFA match had been played in. And is this a bid killing point? Does this equal our 1 vote to Qatars 11?

As it happens, the MCC (who are the executive trustees of the MCG) were/are open to temporary seating from the lower tier out onto the field, to reduce the round shape.

Anyway, I saw the football there at the 2000 Olympics, and the it was not that bad, it's a pretty immense stadium.

[Quaker2001]

The MCG wouldn't have been the first round field a FIFA match had been played in. And is this a bid killing point? Does this equal our 1 vote to Qatars 11?

As it happens, the MCC (who are the executive trustees of the MCG) were/are open to temporary seating from the lower tier out onto the field, to reduce the round shape.

Anyway, I saw the football there at the 2000 Olympics, and the it was not that bad, it's a pretty immense stadium.

Nothing equals 11 votes for Qatar except for rampant corruption. It amazes me that in a committee where there are only 24 votes that when a country gets eliminated after the first round with only 1 vote that no less than 4 other votes changed hands into the next round. I know the IOC has a similar issue, but with a fraction of the number of votes, it makes it that more more egregious.

Yes, Australia deserved more than 1 vote. The grounds sharing issues alone were hardly reason for them to finish in 5th place when it should have been Qatar there. But it may very well have hold them back in future voting if they can't find a good way to make that work.

[reindeer]

I would have chosen Australia for 2022. US may have been better technically but hosted it very recently and like Russia, Australia is a new region for World Cup. Concerning Qatar, I hope nothing changes now. If there's a proposal for a winter WC I wish the European clubs and nations will put up a hell of a fight against it. A decision so inmensely corrupt, made for all the wrong reasons and none of the right ones should not be saved by any means. Qatar 2022 will be either forgotten quickly or remembered as an utter failure and most likely will become a "lost" World Cup, but if that's the price to pay for a complete FIFA clean up, then I'm ready to pay it.

[Lord David]

Australia's problems were not just ground sharing, that would have been solved (not easily) if we got the World Cup.

It was at least half of our proposed venues were of oval shape: Perth, Adelaide, Gold Coast, Melbourne, Geelong (which although oval is the most acceptable of the other oval stadiums due to a narrow field, making it almost similar to Maracana in Rio de Janiero). Where the rectangle stadiums were of course: Townsville, Brisbane, Newcastle, Canberra, Sydney x2, Blacktown.

Perth was proposed as a new stadium, which could have been retractable if that were the case. Adelaide would have been comparable to an athletics track sized field, without the track.

Aside from the ovals problem, a major problem was transport. Without high speed rail, or even a nationalized rail network (with interstate services done erratically by various companies), the only real way to travel would be via a reasonably extensive air network, which although reasonable would have been under strain during the World Cup, even with improvements done in place.

A good boost to our bid was the hotel situation, being excellent in major cities, reasonable in minor ones. But most importantly, it was the presence of reasonably large convention centres in major cities for media operations.