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F1 2009 - The Official Thread


Rob.

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Can you blame him after last 2007 when he did the opposite and ended up losing? He raced tactically, like every Champion in history has done.

Can you tell me a driver who would have been more deserving last season?

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Can you blame him after last 2007 when he did the opposite and ended up losing? He raced tactically, like every Champion in history has done.

Can you tell me a driver who would have been more deserving last season?

Yea the driver that went for the win and got the most of them. Massa. (And I hate Ferrari btw)

Hamilton shut it down in a fair number of races, the sport is about winning not placing.

The points system needs to be fixed when you can realistically win the championship without winning a race.

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Yea the driver that went for the win and got the most of them. Massa.

the sport is about winning not placing.

Well, you've just destroyed your own argument there:

Massa got the most number of wins according to the stats, but his win in Belgium was only given to him by the stewards! Hamilton won that race on the track after, guess what, racing for the win and racing wheel to wheel with Kimi in what were the some of the most exciting laps of the entire season! Massa drove a really dull conservative race, finishing second on track only because the other driver racing for the win, Räikkönen, crashed out in the rain. Hamilton finished first on track, the driver who was racing him for the win crashed out, and Massa cruised to second. Massa was then promoted to first by the stewards! It was the most undeserved race win I've ever seen.

Hamilton finished first on the race track more times than Massa did last season. That's a fact.

Hamilton went for the win on at least six occassions (the six in which he finished first on track). Massa went for the win on at least five (the five he finished first on track). Therefore, even going by your strange criterion which gives no merit to consistency and makes winning the be-all-and-end-all, Lewis was indeed deserving of his WDC more than any other driver.

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Ooh, this is going to be one hell of a season! After Oz Qualifying:

  • Two Brawn's at the front blitzing the field with Button on top
  • Red Bull, Toyota, Williams and BMW looking good
  • Ferrari can only make 7th and 9th (although we don't know their fuel loads)
  • Alonso makes an uncharacteristic mistake and misses on out Q3, starting 12th tomorrow
  • McLaren have a pig of a car which can't go flat out round corners without losing the rear end and start 14th and 15th with Hamilton having to pull out of Q2 because of gearbox troubles.

Full Grid Here

:o

I can't wait for this race!!

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Hamilton has to change gearbox before the race so is relegated to the back.

Also, the Toyota cars' rear-wings have been declared illegal and both Glock and Trulli have to start at the back! Toyota have screwed up.

So...

18th Hamilton

19th Glock

20th Trulli

I'm predicting first corner carngage tomorrow with the grid as mad as it is!!

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We have five drivers in the field. But only one good one. Vettel! And next year will probably the last season with a German GP. Since the absence of Schummel-Schumi less fans are at the track, but in the same time Hockenheim and Nürburg have to pay more to Ecclestone. The circuits cant any longer afford these payments. Last year Hockenheim made a 6mio € loss and the city council (the owner) doesnt want to extend the contract with Ecclestone on the current basis. The contract ends next year.

BTW: Faster is right, Hamilton is an undeserved champion.

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I'm not arguing over Hamilton anymore. We'll have to agree to disagree and since I haven't heard a single good arguement as to why he is undeserving put it down to sour grapes (or if I'm being generous sporting differences) and leave it at that.

If today's race is anything to go by even Bernie's money-grabbing won't destroy F1 Faster (though I didn't know the German GP was also threatened, what a shame)!

Near-perfect drive from Button to put a Brit on top for the second Oz GP in a row, determined if scrappy drive from his team mate to get second, Vettel and Kubica got carried away and should have prevented a Brawn 1-2, and a small well done to both Trulli and Hamilton who kept their noses-clean and both did some skilled overtaking to get third and fourth from the back of the grid. Ferrari got their strategy spot-on but reliability (again) and a moment of madness from Kimi sees them go to Malaysia with nothing - I can't remember a race where so few people are talking about this team afterwards; and after today's showing I don't think they'll be unhappy with that.

If that's how the season continues we're in for a hell of a year! B)

_45612951_champagnebutton416.jpg

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Hamilton promoted to third as Trulli illegally re-overtook him whilst behind the safety car. Trulli gets a 25 second penalty and finishes outside the points.

http://www.autosport.com/news/report.php/id/74053

And Vettel handed a ten place grid penalty for the next race because of his crash. Both him and Kubica fined also.

http://www.itv-f1.com/News_Article.aspx?id=45387

The Hamilton/Trulli decision was black and white, you can't overtake during a safety car so that was a correct decision to promote Hamtilton. Harsh to give Trulli a 25 sec penalty; surely demotion to fourth would have been sufficient?

Vettel's penalty looks harsh. It looked to be slightly more Vettel's fault than Kubica's but it was a racing incident and that seems like a rather heavy-handed punishment to me. Stewards shouldn't penalise accidents which happen because of a desire to race unless they're ridiculously dangerous; otherwise what's the point?

EDIT: It may be the case the Vettel's punishment was harsher than Kubica's becasue he carried on driving with a severely damaged car (a wheel hanging off and bits falling off!) which you're not allowed to do. In which case, the stewards may have got this punishment right. We'll have to wait and see what's said....

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Oh Lord, where is the road to Canossa? My "favourite" F1-driver has won a GP. I hope it will change very quickly. Push the Button, push it!

Well all these penalties and protests make F1-racing so disturbing. You never know, if the winner will keep the points afterwards.

The City Council of Hockenheim has postponed a decision over the future races at the circuit. Mario Theissen (BMW) and Norbert Haug (Mercedes) have said, that the federal state Baden Württemberg should give money to Bernie. Baden-Württemberg is our richest federal state, but i really hope that the state government wont do that. The car makers itself can pay the debts.

Ironically, Germany is also part of the Moto-GP-calender. The German GP is at Sachenring in Hohenstein-Ernsthal. Despite we dont have any good driver in the field, this event was always sold out in recent years. Think about that Bernie!

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So what happens when the questionable aerodynamic pieces for Braun through out the results for Australia and Malaysia ? Yeah this Formula One racing is really for the birds . half of what goes on is in a court room in France for some reason . Probably the only place in Formula one where a pole sitter will get passed physically and while in Motion .

I just don't understand why a Ron Dennis can't get Nascar when he visits North America . There are passes for the lead every race and the top teams can win on any sunday without 80 engineers in Japan working on Ferrari's Tire compounds. I love the skill shown by these drivers but in most case it is just a contest between how the engineers can read the specs and exploit then with aerodynamic experiments .

I would laff if F1 overturned the victories today in favor of Ferrari LOL.

Jim Jones

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Let's keep this discussion to F1. If the NASCAR season it soon, start a new thread. :)

As for the diffusor row:

It's highly unlikely, from what I've been reading, that any results will be overturned.

It may be that these diffusors are declared illegal but that will probably only stop teams using them after the hearing with results before it still upheld. However, even this decision would screw up Brawn, Toyota and Williams and probably also harm McLaren who are strongly rumoured to be developing a double-decker diffusor similar to these teams'.

If they are declared illegal it would benift Ferrari and RBR, both of whom have protested (along with Renault). Neither of these cars (particularly the Red Bull) have designs which would allow this compenent to be easily fitted without a complete redesign so if the diffusors are declared legal, they are both in a bit of trouble:

Below: From my understanding the tight, low rear of the RBR (first picture) will not allow them to develop a solution like Brawn's (see second picture)

RedBullRB5DiffuserLegal.jpg

brawn_diffuser_1374043c.jpg

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Yep and he's dead right. I wouldn't have minded getting up a couple of hours earlier to watch it (as US F1 fans have to do for all the European races). At times you couldn't tell the differences between the cars because of the low sun and a few drivers found the light very tricky, Button included and he didn't even have to worry about passing cars.

This was another example of Bernie trying to have his cake and eat it too.

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Yep and he's dead right. I wouldn't have minded getting up a couple of hours earlier to watch it (as US F1 fans have to do for all the European races). At times you couldn't tell the differences between the cars because of the low sun and a few drivers found the light very tricky, Button included and he didn't even have to worry about passing cars.

This was another example of Bernie trying to have his cake and eat it too.

Completely agree, it was at a ridiculous start time for us in North America, its much easier for us to watch something for an hour at 1am, than get up at 5am to watch it. It was an unnecessary risk and Bernie again is being a complete idiot about things. He is doing everything in his power to move races from Europe to Asia and than demands that the races in Asia have start times suitable for European audiences. Go figure.

Why does the Persian Gulf need two races? Why does China, Korea and Japan need a race (and at some points 4). Why go into India when they can't see beyond the cricket oval. And why does Spain have two GPs. 1 per country, end of story.

Next year they already have the 18 GPs without even having a race in North America. And than you have the Mexicans, Russians, South Africans and Argentines wanting a race.

Inevitably this will lead to probably a 22 race calendar.

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My favourite April Fool press release today:

Toro Rosso To Use Kers At Sepang

01 | 04 | 09

Although it wasn’t planned to introduce KERS until later in the season, recent progress made at our Faenza R & D facility means that Scuderia Toro Rosso will now use Kinetic Energy Recovery Systems on its cars in Sepang, for the second round of the World Championship, it was announced today (April 1).

In the interests of maximising car reliability in the high temperatures and humidity usually encountered in Malaysia, the KERS systems will not actually use the recovered energy to boost engine power in the usual fashion. Instead, the teams plan to use KERS as a sophisticated DCA (Driver Cooling Aid.)

“We are indebted to Professor Hugh Masterby-Jerrkin of Imperial College, London for his department’s assistance in moving this project forward so quickly,” commented Wayne Kerr, Toro Rosso’s Head of KERS. “While the team was racing in Melbourne, we came directly to Kuala Lumpur to evaluate the system in real conditions and for this we were given invaluable help by the Thermal Energy faculty of the Kuala Lumpur Polytechnic, particularly the head of department, Doctor Ku Lin ‘Ng Phaan.

Energy recovered under braking is used to drive a refrigeration unit to chill down the cool store. This is connected into a special driver suit, so when the driver presses the KERS button (for a maximum of 6 seconds per lap) cold liquid is circulated around his suit reducing his body temperature. Studies have shown that an increase in core body temperature of just 1 degree can reduce driver performance by as much as 23%, and so while this system does not give any actual power gains, it should still be a significant performance advantage.

http://www.scuderiatororosso.com/Season/20...Sepang-Circuit/

I particularly like Doctor Ku Lin ‘Ng Phaan (Cooling Fan). :lol:

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McLaren and Hamilton lied to the FIA at the stewards inquiry and have had their points taken away

Thoroughly pissed off with McLaren, and if he went along with this lie of his own choice rather than being ordered to, extremely dissapointed in Lewis as well; especiallly after what was a drive worthy of a WDC.

They have A LOT of making up to do. Making a bad car I could forgive. Getting confused during the race and giving up a legitimate 3rd place is harder to forgive but human error. Trying to lie and allow another driver to take a penalty is below the belt.

:angry:

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It doesn't prove anything of the sort. It shows at that moment in time he, whether under pressure from his team or on the spur of the moment, decided to lie or (since we don't have the transcripts from the steward's hearing) at least not tell the whole truth. He comes across to me as very gracious most of the time (he was full of praise for Button and the Brawn team in Australia for example), if disarmingly confident in his own ability. Nothing I've seen before tells me this is typical behaivour from Lewis. I wish I could say the same of McLaren who seem to go from one disaster to another!

He's a fantastic driver and had a fantastic drive on Sunday to drag his pig of a car up to 4th, which is what makes this all the more annoying and dissapointing from my point of view.

This is a bad week for Lewis, but he's more than good enough to bounce back and learn from this.

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Contrite Hamilton says he was misled by McLaren

A contrite Lewis Hamilton finally broke his silence on his disqualification from the Australian Grand Prix this afternoon and apologised for his part in misleading race stewards.

Hamilton was excluded from the classification for last weekend's race after it was determined that he and the team's sporting director, Dave Ryan, had deliberately misled stewards in their investigation into an incident towards the end of the race.

Ryan has been suspended by the team and Hamilton, the reigning world champion, still faces the possibility of further sanctions from the FIA, which could include suspension or disqualification from the championship.

"In Melbourne I had a great race and as soon as I got out of the car I did TV interviews at the back of the garage and straightaway I told them what had happened during the race," Hamilton said.

"Straight after that we were requested to appear before the stewards and whilst waiting for the stewards, I was instructed and misled by the team manager to withhold information and that's what I did.

"I sincerely apologise to the stewards for wasting their time but really, I'm very sorry for the situation and for my team and for Dave, because he's been a good member of the team for many years and I don't think that it was his intention. He's a good guy.

"When I went into the meeting, I had no intention (to lie). I just wanted to tell my story and see what happened. I was misled and that's just how it went.

"I would like to say a big sorry to all my fans who have believed in me and supported me through the years. They watched me for what I am the last two years - that's who I am.

"I am not a liar. I'm not a dishonest person. I'm a team player and every time I've been informed to do something, I've done it.

"This time I realise that it's a huge mistake and I'm learning from it.

"I apologise for not speaking to you (the media) yesterday but it's a lot to take in and a lot to deal with it so I'm hear to apologise to everyone."

Hamilton felt that he owed it to his fans and supporters to explain his side of the story.

"This is not an easy thing for anyone to do, to put their hand up and to step back and to realise that they're in the wrong," he added.

"But the fact is I was in the wrong and I felt that I owed it to my fans and I owed it to my people to let them know.

"I was misled - it's easy to be misled sometimes - but that was the situation and that's why I'm here.

"I acted as a team member. When I've been asked to do something, I've generally done it.

"I didn't have time to think about what I was going to do. I went in and I did it and felt awkward and very uncomfortable and I think that the stewards could see that.

"I've never felt so bad. Try to put yourself in my position. As I've said, I'm not a liar and I've not gone through life being a liar or dishonest. So for people to say that and for the world to think that way, what can I say?"

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A correct decision to suspend the team manager who instructed Lewis before the meeting, but it only goes a little way to making up for their actions in the last week.

As far as Hamilton goes, that needed to be said. Hamilton's pretty-much off the hook now as far as I'm concerned and I'll continue to support him. Still mightily pissed off with McLaren; they're supposed to be a multi-million pound professional outift. That none of them thought this course of action was bound to be disproved by radio evidence is remarkable! They instructed their driver to withold information which he did and allowed another team to get a penalty. Not good enough guys.

As I've said, I disagree with your assertion that Hamilton is, in general, a bad-sport and a bad-character, but he does seem to be very impressionable still and not a little naive.

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Haha - the idiot is reaping what he sows with the Malaysian GP now under a red flag which wouldn't have happened if it was ran at its more traditional race time. The commentators are saying the Malaysians aren't happy about the time change.

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Ridiculous; race now over, no restart. All the drivers that stayed on track in those final laps deserve a lot of credit. Having said that, it's something of a lottery because if you hit a particularly wet patch even the best driver in the world can't do anything if the car slides underneath him.

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One other thing, I have to say these new regulations have worked. The battle between Weber and Hamilton before it rained where there were four or five overtaking moves in one or two laps would never have been possible under the old high-downforce cars. You can see the cars are able to get physically much closer to one another than the last few seasons. So hats of to the FIA and the teams for that at least.

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  • 3 weeks later...

So nothing to write about Vettels victory? Third race of the season, first worthy winner. Vettel is THE future driver of F1, Many compare him with Schumacher, but i think Vettel is much more sympathetic.

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