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MKA

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  1. The IOC clearly needs to become a more democratic and "honest" organization, and thinking a few more steps ahead. Of course, Europe has had a predominance of Olympics up until recent times, so it's not bad that cities in other parts of the world bids for and hosts the Olympics, even though this means awarding the Games to countries that are still in developing and to countries that are, well, "democratic", to say it in a more gentle way. However, the Olympics will return to more classical European hosts soon - I hope in Oslo 2022 - and if the IOC doesn't want to end up needing to award the Olympics to a bit unreliable hosts (like Rio, hope it turns out well though) or another "democratic" country (Kazakhstan, China etc.) every time, they need to focus more on cost - and also on they're own "glam factor". The image people have of sports aren't IOC members eating canapés and drinking champagne, and while that (hopefully) isn't what they do all the time, the press gives us that image. However, I do believe the "Agenda 2020" to be a step in the right direction. Let's just hope it doesn't turn out changing nothing...
  2. I can't find any information online on the Bergens Tidende poll, and the article on the Dagbladet poll is behind they're paywall. It seems like the numbers from Dagbladet are accurate, but the Oslo2022 poll from the same period showed a little better result (35,5 %) and had a larger "basis" in the poll (more people asked), and the question asked was a little different: Dagbladet asked "Do you wish that Oslo should bid to host the Olympic Winter Games in 2022?" while Oslo2022 asked "Are you positive or negative to Oslo applying for the Winter Olympics and Paralympics in 2022?". Just a minor difference, but Dagbladet only asked about the Olympics while Oslo2022 also asked about the Paralympics. And I've find a number from prior to the 1994 Lillhammer Olympics. At some point the support was down to 38 percent, so I don't think today's numbers are that bad (well, those below 30 percent are clearly bad), taken into account the new "Internet democracy". Of course, the numbers prior to the 1994 Olympics varied, so I guess the common picture wasn't as negative as it is these days. And I do understand most of the arguments against the bid, and even agree (at least parly) with some of them: It's not wrong to say that 21.7 billion NOK (3.5 billion USD) is a lot of money, and I think it's very important to work hard to keep the cost low and make the best use of all the money spent on the Olympics. I also agree that the IOC needs to reform itself, becoming more democratic and more "honest", but I do believe that IOC is "better than it's rumour" in Norway (90 percent of the IOC income back to the Olympic organizers/the sport in general, hard work on reducing corruption etc.). However, I do not agree that it's "terrible" that it's Oslo applying for the Games, as many Norwegians outside of the Oslo area thinks. The way I see it, it's only Oslo that can host an Olympic Games these days, both due to the Games becoming bigger, due to the Games simply becoming more complicated to host etc., and the need of the infrastructre and the arenas built for the Games is large enough in Oslo (and a lot of the infrastructure and arenas are already in place, so we can re-use it with only some minor upgrades). I do agree that it'll be a little short time between the 1994 and 2022 Olympics, but as I see it, we have a very, very good chance to be awarded the Games this time, and since we anyway will host the Games at some time in the future, I believe it is right to go forward with the bid - so we don't spend a lot of money on a future bidding race with a smaller chance of getting the Games. In total, I see the positive opportunities the Games will create as larger than the cost, and I really hope more Norwegians will se it the way I do. If you make polls on most of the billions on the national budget, quit a few of the billions won't get a majority... But, well, as I've stated before, the Conservatives and the Labour Party makes a majority in the Parliament by themselves, and I don't see it as unlikely that they will secure support for the bid: Of the leaders of the 19 local county organizations in the Conservatives, eleven was positive to the bid and only one was negative while four was uncertain, and the newspaper (Klassekampen) didn't reach three of the leaders. http://www.dn.no/nyheter/politikkSamfunn/2014/07/09/0512/olja-fra-hoyres-fylkesledere Of the leaders of the same organizations in the Labour Party, eight was positive and seven was negative while four was uncertain/wouldn't answer. Very close, indeed, but it's a majority in favour of the bid. http://www.bt.no/nyheter/lokalt/Ap-flertall-for-OL-soknad-3156135.html?xtor=RSS-2#.U8heZeN_srU Of the Conservative Mayors, 53 was positive to the bid and 30 was negative, while 31 was uncertain and three wouldn't answer. http://www.nrk.no/norge/grasrotskepsis-til-oslo-ol-i-hoyre-1.11832889 The new leader of the Labour Party, Jonas Gahr Støre, is positive to the bid, and has been for quit some time. As stated earlier in this thread, the Minister of Culture, Thorhild Widvey, is positive to the bid, while the Prime Minister, Erna Solberg, (understanebly) hasn't publicly announced either way. Still, I do think that an (at least small) increase in favour of the bid in the polls would be very helpfull, so I really hope we'll see that soon...
  3. But let's just not hope that changes after tonight's match...
  4. Thanks for this reply, since I was borned a few months after the 1994 Olympics, I don't know that much about the process so it's helpful to read some about it. I think I'll go to the library some day soon and borrow some books about the 1994 Lillehammer Olympics and see if they say something about this, and maybe lists some of the polls from that period. And you're very true about the new "Internet democracy"; since the "no" side is in majority in every comment field at all the newspaper's websites, it's very hard to be the almost only Oslo2022 supporter, standing in the storm... Besides, it leads to a snowball effect, where people easily are convinced by the "no" side - people are happily supporter of the team that is in the lead in such matters as this. I think you're correct saying that the situation in Norway will be rather similar to what happened in Brazil with the World Cup, dough hopefully it turns earlier than in Brazil. Yeah, I have read a bit about this. I guess they subtract all the permanent investments, which I guess makes sense, but I still find it very hard to see that Sochi was profitable. Especially considering that Vancouver say they "only" made break even. I find it possible to believe in that, but it makes it hard to believe that Sochi - who spent much more money, without apparently having any more income - made a profit. Does anyone know how Vancouver and Sochi respectively have calculated these numbers? It would be great to know what is included and excluded, so it may be possible to use at least Vancouver as an argument for Oslo2022 application (I think it would be impossible to convince people that Sochi made ​​a profit - especially since I do not believe in it myself ...).
  5. The public support is precisely the same in the most recent Oslo2022 bid committee poll as the February poll by the bid committee (36 percent in favour, 49 percent against). It was hoped that the public support would increase after good results in Sochi. However, I assume that this effect was overshadowed by the mourning bond case, by some slightly unfortunate statements by persons within the IOC (both Gerhard Heiberg and Thomas Bach, I think - at least the statements were a bit misinterpreted by Norwegians), by a case about Heiberg using his position as IOC member to promote his family business in China and by the huge spending in Sochi. All this appeared during the Sochi Olympics, and together it led to the public support staying at status quo - Norwegians got a rather bad (but I would say wrong) impression of the IOC and they assume that any Olympics is more expensive than it really is, due to the Sochi spending. I do believe that if Oslo is awarded the Olympics, it will be very hard to find a single person opposing hosting the Olympics during the Olympics and after the Olympics. According to the president of the NOC, it was a pretty similar situation prior to the 1994 Lillehammer Olympics. On the national evening news earlier tonight, he stated that the polls for Oslo 2022 currently actually is better than the polls were seven years prior to the Lillehammer Olympics. However, I haven't any numbers on this, but I assume the NOC president is correct. And today, you won't find a single person that regrets hosting the 1994 Olympics. Still, I hope that people will get more in favour of the Oslo 2022 bid, and I'll do my very best in making that happen.
  6. Thanks, it's good to see at least some support! Well, I guess it after all is the money that's the most used argument against the bid, in different forms (the money itself, the risk of cost overruns, the huge spending in Sochi etc.), as well as the "pampering factor" of the IOC. I do have some more "local" arguments for why Norway can afford having the Olympics, but to understand those, I guess you must understand local, Norwegian politics. Regarding the "pampering factor", it's easy to answer that the IOC members pay for all expences during their stay in Oslo except transport to and from the airport, and hence try to show that they pay for their stay, but I guess the "mourning band" scandal from Sochi is hard to understand for Norwegians. And it's of course very hard to argue back if that's being used as an argument, especially considering the flagging at half mast during the Sydney Olympics in 2000, for Samaranch's wife - which appears to be a paradox. I do understand why the IOC have these rules, but if people makes this argument against the bid, it's impossible to argue back. I guess we just needs to focus on the positive. But here again, the Bid Committee meets a problem: if they start talking positive about the bid, or even present some facts about it, it's "manipulation" and "propaganda" - it's even called "Goebbels propaganda", which I think is way out of line. It's not easy to be in favour of the bid, neither for the Bid Committee or for us "normal" people who are in favor of the application. I guess the easiest is to just stop the bidding process, but that wouldn't really be a good idea (hey, we've spent quit some money making this application, it's not smart to stop it already now!).
  7. Well, as stated in the article: it could've been worse... But it just means that us in favour of the bid needs to do a better job convincing people about the opportunities an eventual Olympics will give, and of course pointing out all the fun and the "folk festival" an Olympics will bring to Norway
  8. Fewer are negative to the Olympic application - the youth clearly says yes Source: http://www.oslo2022.oslo.kommune.no/aktuelt/article280695-61809.html In a recent nationwide poll, conducted by TNS Gallup, now less than half of the population is negative to Oslo applying for the Winter Olympics and Paralympics in 2022. - The "no" side seems to have gone down significantly after the Sochi Olympics, and we sense a movement in which more people are open to listen to the opportunities. And the youth wants an opportunity to create and participate in "their own" Olympics, says Eli Grimsby, Chief Executive Officer of Oslo2022. The youth are positive: Olympic athletes Alexander Aurdal and Henrik Kristoffersen gave the thumbs up on the Olympic ambassador event in Oslo on 17th June. Photo: Oslo2022 Website TNS Gallup has, on behalf of Oslo2022, conducted a nationwide poll in the period of 11th-22nd June. The poll was done through telephone interviews with a large data basis, 1,883 interviews. Stable yes-share - descending no-share Several external, published polls has, after the Olympic Games in Sochi in February, showed a "no"-side at around 60 percent. The recent poll suggests that the negative trend is about to reverse. The question asked is: "Are you positive or negative to Oslo applying for the Winter Olympics and Paralympics in 2022?" In total, 35.5 percent said they are positive, while 49.7 percent said they are negative. 14.8 percent reported that they have no opinion/uncertain. Eli Grimsby, Chief Executive Officer of Oslo2022. Photo: Oslo2022 Website - The percentage of positive remains relatively stable from previous studies, but we think it is very interesting that the proportion of uncertain increases. The media image has in my opinion become more nuanced recent, and we see that both businesses and engaged youth has focused on the opportunities of the Olympic project. People may become more open to listen to what opportunities the Olympics and Paralympics can help create for the country. I am among those who believe it is possible to be 60 percent adherent, and land on the "yes" on an overall assessment, says Grimsby. The youth want 'their own' Olympics The respondents who were not born or were children during the Olympics at Lillehammer in 1994, differs with a definite "yes" majority. Among the under 30, 52.3 percent are positive to the application for the Winter Olympics, while only 28.3 percent are negative. - We see the strong commitment of many young people, especially among our own Olympic ambassadors, as I have been fortunate to meet many of recently. It inspires. It is clear that those who did not experience the Lillehammer Olympics, but has only been hearing about the wonderful folk festival from their parents' generation, want to be able to create something similar themself. In addition, the young people are more focused on the potential for the future with this project, especially in education and human resource development, says Grimsby. Even if it's not a majority in favour of the application, the numbers are going in the right direction. Of course, the "no" side claims the poll asked the wrong question - the question should've focused more directly on the economy and the government guarantee, but I find the question wording perfectly reasonable. And, by the way, I'm one of the Olympic ambassadors Grimsby has met recently
  9. The Oslo 2022 Bid Committee expects the government to send a bill regarding the application for government guarantee and subsidies to the Norwegian parliament around August/September, and that the Norwegian parliament will handle the application for government guarantee and subsidies some time during the fall of 2014. The Parliament must approve the government guarantee no later than January 2015, according to Bærum municipality's website https://www.baerum.kommune.no/Forsidenyheter/Barum-kommune-i-soknadskomite-for-OL-og-PL-til-Oslo-i-2022/ (Telenor Arena is located in Bærum, and after Oslo 2022's plans figure skating will be arranged in Telenor Arena - hence Bærum municipality is a part of the Bid Committee).
  10. Well, the Labour Party and the Conservative Party makes a majority on their own (103 MPs, 85 needed for majority in the Norwegian Parliament), so if both parties go for Oslo 2022 (which I don't see as very unlikely), it's even possible to make a majority even if some of the MPs votes against the government guarantee (which I, again, don't see as very unlikely). Still, the best is of course to have a very large majority voting in favour of the government guarantee, especially since the descision will tie up several future national budgets. But after all, I hope it - in the end - is a majority voting in favour of the government guarantee. If you refer to the "demands" made by the MPs Svein Harberg and Ib Thomsen (page 75 in this thread), I don't think they were ever sent to IOC, actually - only to the Oslo 2022 Bid Committee. They responded to the letter from the MPs in April, telling for example that the IOC members pay for all expences during their stay in Oslo except transport to and from the airport, which the OCOG organizes. Short article about the reply: http://www.oslo2022.oslo.kommune.no/aktuelt/article276559-61809.html The full reply: http://www.oslo2022.oslo.kommune.no/getfile.php/Oslo2022/Internett%28O22%29/Dokumenter/Brev%20stortingsrepresentantene%20Thomsen%20og%20Haarberg.pdf
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