cfm Jeremie

You think that's rough and brutal? I have seen much much worse in France. The police are just dragging them the way. They are not beaten.

At least the IOC broadcast did show the incident...

Well the IOC has just issued this press release: Statement by Jacques Rogge

Yeah, very brave statement indeed. I am sure the Chinese leaders are scared. He is as convincing as Sarkozy when he said "I did mention 'Human rights' during my diner with the Chinese President". This is exactly why I am pissed off by our leaders.

I agree with most of what you said except for the "lost revenues" part. The Beijing Games will see record revenues and you won't hear any major sponsors criticise China and/or the IOC and withdrawing from the TOP programme. Even if there is some controversy around the Beijing Games, Vancouver and London are safe choices for the sponsors and you can expect theses Games to break all records in term of revenues (London has already signed more top tier domestic sponsors than any previous OCOG at this stage of preparation). But I do agree that the more negative coverage Beijing gets, the more likely the IOC is going to go with a safe choice for 2016, in which case Chicago, Tokyo or even Madrid would have the edge over Rio.

No. As Faster and several pointed out, there are real means to put pressure on China and it is to become less dependent on goods manufactured in China. This would mean that the average Joe (including myself) would have to make an effort and change his consumption habits. Again, much easier to call for athletes, who have just been training their entire lives for this, to boycott the Games and have a clean conscience.

Comparing Chinese government acts with those of the Nazis back in 1936 is an exaggeration and could actually be counterproductive, giving the Chinese food for their "the West is biased" counterattack.

I agree 100%. But it's much much easier and less painful to call for a boycott (I mean who cares about the athletes anyway?).

We all know that awarding the Games is never based on technical merits alone. TO 2008 team knew it when they entered the race for 2008 as did the other candidate cities. The Games are in Beijing there is no point in whining about "How great Toronto would have been"... The real effects of the Beijing Games will have to be assessed also in the years following the Games. A 1.5-billion society needs time to evolve. Although I strongly disapprove some of the Chinese government actions and policies, I think there is something incredibly hypocritical in expecting the Olympic Movement to achieve in China what most of our "all so virtuous" democratic governments haven't even tried (why is France willing to sell pretty much anything to China? why is Bush going to assist to the Games?). Have you heard any of our Western leaders making a clear statement about Tibet?

Simple enough, don't watch.

And "Why punish the athletes" is a very good argument. I always like when people impose their views on the athletes. If some athletes make the informed decision of not taking part in the Games then I applaud them but who are we (and more importantly, who are our politicians) to decide for them? There are plenty of ways to pressure China: as far as the Olympics are concerned maybe the head of states can decide not to attend the Games. Braver would be to hit China where it hurts, the wallet (but yeah, that could hurt our wallets too so let's punish the athletes).

30 reported dead in the French media. I fear that unfortunately, the Beijing Games won't be remembered for the sports competition.

Which leaves just one month for the final rehearsal of the ceremonies... It seems that - just for this part - we are heading to a new Athens.

That's an interesting one: in the Olympic Charter from 14th July 2001, rule 68 states that "The Olympic Flame must be placed in aprominent position, clearly visible and, where the structure of the stadium permits, visible also from outside the stadium" such rule is not present in the 1St September 2004 version of the Charter However, I would be very very surprised if Vancouver doesn't have a Flame outside BC Place.

Exactly. I don't think China's record has significantly decreased recently... Talk about hypocrisy. I suspect his role was minor anyway.

I am also in.

I am not sure. Raffer Jonhson, final torch bearer in LA, was on LAOC board.

Canada being a developing country

Indeed, all is gone ... Nice try.

Which temporary stadium? They used the ski jump arena. I think you are refering to Albertville that used a temporary theatre for its ceremonies. Back to Vancouver, I am not one of the forum ceremonies guru but isn't it kind of late in the process to have this kind of questions? With more or less two years to go to the Opening, I would think that some of the major logistical aspects of the ceremonies linked to the stadium would have been settled.

What does that mean? James, you have to learn to read, listen and think. I never said Singapore was not capable of or that its infrastructure was outdated. What I said is based on facts (read Singapore and Moscow bid books as well as the various IOC reports): at the moment, Moscow has more infrastructure related to its YOG concepts than Singapore (not by much, I gladly admit) as well as more experience. And BTW, should you actually read an actual document, you would see that Moscow, besides its Olympic Stadium for the Ceremonies, is not really going to use "mega structure" and that its plan is in line with what the IOC has in mind for the YOG concept. Again, based on the last IOC report, it seems that Singapore is indeed more than capable of hosting, in which case I would like for them to host. But a Moscow victory wouldn't be a scandal.. "And, we have seen enough of Russia hosting this or that." Hmm I wonder how many events you have seen hosted by Russia....

You don't get it. The main question is: which city, within the less than two and a half years left to the inaugural YOG, has the greatest capability of staging the Games? All other considerations ("It's Asia's turn", "I don't like Moscow"...) are secondary. Clearly, Moscow is one step ahead of Singapore at the present time (all the venues more or less ready including YOV, loads of experience to build on). This being said, it's clear that from the last IOC Evalution Report, that Singapore does not present significant risk and would be a great host as well. In which case I do think that Singapore hosting the inaugural YOG would be a greater symbol than Moscow (but there is little question in my mind that Russia would have zero problem hosting both the YOG and the 2014 Olympics: the YOG budget represents a tiny portion of the 2014 budget, the Russian federation could support it).

I also understand it's an analogy.

Based on the second part of his quote " Still, people don't question Singapore's right to host the Youth Olympics just two years after Beijing", I think he was actually making the point that Sochi shouldn't prevent Moscow from hosting. Anyhow, I think it's besides the point. The question is not so much a question of continental rotation or not, of whether the cities are capable of hosting the Games or not but rather is the IOC willing to let "smaller" cities host the YOG or will it go with the "traditional" hosts. As I have stated before, I think it woul dbe a great symbol for the YOG to start in Singapore.

Indeed. And yes Paris was lacking a powerful selling line. Basically, Paris was "boring". Technical strength alone was not enough, especially with candidate cities with more or less technically equivalent bids.