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Posts posted by Kenadian

  1. I don't know very many Canadians who refer to themselves as American. How many of us in North America or South America have the kind of continental sentiment that they do in Europe or even Africa? For the most part, the countries here are bigger in size and more spread out than in Europe. Three of the countries on the two continents are almost the same size as Europe! I think we tend to refer to ourselves by our own nationality. To me, American refers to someone who lives in the United States of America, just as German refers to someone who resides in the Federal Republic of Germany or Australian refers to someone from the Commonwealth of Australia - not necessarily someone who resides in either North or South America.

  2. I agree with Henderson's assessment. Being twelve years after London, 2024 is almost certainly stamped for Europe. Durban's chances (and South Africa's for that matter) are pretty much only based on sentiment and a maligned desire to put a five ringed dot on the map of Africa. It would be nice to see African games some day, but I'd rather Africa focus its resources and energies on their big bag of real problems, not a party for the world's elite.

    For 2028, Toronto certainly won't have an easy fight, but the case for going to North America in 2028 will be stronger - 32 years after Atlanta, 12 years after Rio, and 18 after Vancouver. The USOC's bid will be a huge threat, though. As would an emotional plea from Africa.

  3. The Winter Paralympics have about 1/5th the number of athletes as in the Winter Olympics. Vancouver had 4 venues for 5 sports with 500 athletes. That's the kind of event a city the size of Ostersund could handle. What is the vertical drop requirement for the Paralympics? The rule is 800 m for the men's downhill at the Winter Olympics. Is it the same at the Paralympics?

  4. But other than Charlie Sheen's house, LA doesn't have snow. Remember, Stockholm is only proposing to host one sport (alpine skiing) at Are. So yeah, something like Boston and Smuggler's Notch is probably the more comparable comparison in the U.S. Perhaps Quebec City and some other ski area? Although other than resorts in Alberta and British Columbia, none on Canada's eastern ski resorts have the required vertical. So the could add the double whammy of a far off mountain and a binational bid with a hill like Sugarloaf USA in Maine - like Helsinki proposed for 2006.

    This situation might be rather unique to Stockholm. Sweden, Finland and the Netherlands are all strong winter sporting countries that do not have an easy option for a hosting modern, relatively compact Winter Olympics. Sweden's problem is distance and Finland and the Netherlands don't even have ski hill mountains.

  5. I just feel this bid is a waste of time. Yeah, it will probably get the marks to make it through to the Candidate Phase and China has the resources and experience, but with those 'other' Beijing Games being just five years ago and Nanjing hosting the next YOGs next summer and of course the 2018 Winter and 2020 Summer Games in Asia, is it geopolitically correct to rush back to Beijing after so short a period?

  6. While I haven't seen Quebec City's bid book for the 2002 Winter Games, they too suffered from this new kind of "Stockholm Syndrome" - or "Helsinki Hangup" or "Krakow Konundrum" - of being an almost ideal winter city, but have a serious mountain problem. Le Massif was at the center of the "Quebec Question", but one proposal I recall was shipping the downhillers out to Mount Allan in Alberta, the 1988 venue, nearly 4000 km away.

  7. Every Olympic Games - Winter or Summer, Youth or Special - got them for one reason only: they got more votes than their competitors. There's none of this nonsense that everyone prattles on about. No conspiracy, punishment or condolence theories. The IOC awards one Olympic Games at a time to one city at a time, voted on by about 100 individuals with their own personal set of reasons, reasoning and agendas.

    There's no: "Poor Rome. *sniff*. I hope Torino makes them feel better".

    There's no: "I didn't like this year's Chanel collection. Curse you Paris!"

    There's no: "If I vote for Rio de Janeiro this time, my Brazilian friends will vote for Istanbul next time."

    It is simply this: "Do I like this bid? Do I trust these people? Is this in the best interest of the sport and the movement?" and possible "Might be nice to get some sushi and drive around in a Lexus...Tokyo it is!"

    • Like 1

  8. I actually believe the shortlist would be Stockholm, Krakow and Almaty. Yes, your worshipped Oslo would be out, as many said here, there is nothing new to offer or any legacy to leave. The IOC voters just use the WOG as a consolation prize for those cities which attempted to get the SOG. So, this time Sweden has a lot of chances, as well as Krakow (for being geographically far away from Sochi and in time by PC) and Almaty (the same case of Krakow).

    That's a pretty glib and reckless interpretation of the Winter Olympics. Torino, Vancouver and Sochi were successful bids in their own right because they earned it, not because Rome, Toronto and Moscow were failed bids. The people of Italy, Canada and Russia did not need to be consoled when they lost the summer games just like the French, the Turks, or the Spanish who faced multiple losses.

  9. Because the 5 rings have not touched African soil...

    And 'winter culture' to me also means 'been there-done that.'

    Number one might be a compelling enough reason if Africa didn't have more pressing matters. Someday, an African Olympics might be possible. But right now, I think it would be immoral for the IOC to have a lavish party in a region with so many serious and difficult problems.

    And number two, in my experience, if a country doesn't have a 'winter culture', that's because it probably doesn't have snow.

  10. If the Winter Olympics have outgrown a country like Sweden (10 million citizens, 129 winter medals, a $400 billion economy, and a strong culture of winter sport) or Norway (5 million citizens, 303 winter medals, a $300 billion economy, and an even stronger culture of winter sport), than how can South Africa entertain the idea of the much much much larger Summer Games? Just because Russia's estimated spend for the Sochi Olympics is $50 billion, basically the total economy of Uruguay or Uganda or a tenth the size of South Africa's, doesn't mean that others have to do the same. The highest estimates put Vancouver's Games at a seemingly bargain $6 billion. And a big chunk of that was picked up by the province of British Columbia (4.5 million people and a $200 billion economy). So while the Winter Games have grown bigger in the last 30 years (from 1200 athletes in 40 events in Sarajevo to 2500+ athletes in about 100 events in Sochi), a well organized country with a good infrastructure, a sound economy and a solid vision can pull it off.

  11. I think the point they are hinting at is going back to small towns like Lake Placid, Albertville, or Lillehammer. Ostersund would fit that style, but the Winter Olympics haven't been trending that way since the 1960s and they've grown significantly since the 1990s. In the last 50 years, only three Winter Games have been held in towns with under 100,000 residents. Pyeongchang is sort of reverting back to that a bit, although they are getting heavy support from the more populous Gangneung and the resort isn't a great distance to the much more massive Seoul.

  12. All of these bids are less than five days old at this stage, so there will be a lot of news and information coming out in the weeks and months ahead. The application files are due March 14, 2014, candidates will be announced in July, and then candidate files are due in January 2015. And right off the bat, I think we have the most interesting winter race in a long time.

    • Like 1

  13. And again, timing is a factor.

    Ostersund came very close (losing by 6 votes) to hosting the 1994 Olympics. Losing to their Norwegian neighbours in Lillehammer also threw a huge geopolitical wrench into their subsequent bids for 1998 and 2002. The IOC wasn't going to hop the Olympics over the border when they had offers from Japan and the USA. And then around the same time, we had a series of increasingly bigger cities host (Nagano, Salt Lake, Torino, Vancouver) followed by a couple of new big spenders looking to do some national branding (Russia and Korea). So essentially, a town of 45,000 far from a major populations center would never again host the Olympic Winter Games.

    So, this 2022 bid from Stockholm will address the size issue, but it will have a distance issue. The competition isn't unbearably strong here and other than Oslo, all of them have major logistics, experience and legacy questions to address. So this is also probably the best chance for this kind of bid to pass through to the next phase. I don't believe anyone would dare question Sweden's ability to host a spectacular and successful games, nor would they question Sweden's winter sport legacy and culture.

    It's just those 500 miserable kilometers to get to those 800 miserable meters.

  14. It isn't a threat. It is just the reality. Are is the only resort in Sweden that has the required vertical for the men's downhill. And while it was very close to winning the 1994 Olympics, Ostersund is now simply too small to host the Winter Olympics. Stockholm has the infrastructure, size and facilities to host all of the other Olympic Winter events, but needs Are for the Alpine events. So if the IOC tells Sweden that the distance is too great for them to allow the bid to proceed to the Candidate Phase, then the best Sweden can ever hope for is a Youth Winter Olympics based in Ostersund, but their quest for the real show will be over.

  15. I don't think anyone can argue the historic value and beauty of Krakow. I've heard nothing but great things about the city and am planning on going there some day.

    Anwyay...this bid. Not much is known yet, but I'm curious why they are doing this with the Slovaks. What mountain did the Zakopane 2006 bid propose? And why isn't that an option now?

    And with the two countries in this bid, how will the events be split between the two? Kinda like the ice and snow split of Vancouver and Whistler? Or is the Slovak side just there for the big mountain? It would seem to me that the Polish side of the Tatry Mountains would have lots of snow for cross country and the like.

    Anyone have answers?

  16. The Are Ski Area is essentially just the ski resort with a small local population around 1500. The area/municipality around Are has about 10,000 people. And the resort is located about 100 km west of Ostersund, which has a population of about 45,000. The local international airport is on an island just west of Ostersund and the two communities are linked by a rail line. Are has hosted a number of championship competitions for various winter and summer sports and have been named one of the world's top ski resorts, so it goes without saying that they must have some sort of infrastructure in place to deal with outside visitors.

  17. I'm not really sure where you stand on this issue...could you elaborate more? ;)

    Are regularly hosts FIS Alpine World Cup events. Sweden has produced 6 World Cup winners, one more than Norway (the only other 2022 bidder to have had such success). There must be some sort of infrastructure in place.

    Oslo probably has the least, but all of these bids will have some issues to over come. Lviv's infrastructure is practically non-existent. The Krakow-Jasna bid has many of the similar issues. A three hour drive from the main city to a tiny village, two countries, two languages, two currencies and no airport or railway links nearby.

    You can say otherwise all you want, but I still think this is the only bid that would prevent Oslo 2022 from pulling a Tokyo 2020. All the others might look fun or exotic, but cold harsh reality doesn't give them a snowball's chance in hell when compared to a supremely technical, competent and experienced giant.

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