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Everything posted by aluz

  1. The plan was ridiculous. Moving those sports would put 1500 athletes which would walk from the OV to their venues through a 40-minute travel to the Port. Besides, it would leave all the media 40 minutes away from most of the venues, the OV, the IBC and the MPC. Terrible plan. What will end up in the Port are residencies for referees, as before, and the Press Center and housing for the journalists with no credentials. That means the ones who have no access to the venues and competitions, but only work on news and articles about the city life, live sites and so on. IMO, the Mayor knew it was absurd, but agree to present it to avoid future criticism. After Rio won the Games, the IAB (Brazilian Architecture Institute) started to make a big fuss about moving events to the port to benefit the city even further. Paes let them carry this idea, build the plan and accepted the rejection. Now, if anyone tries to blame for this, he can say it was the IOC. He was politically smart.
  2. I believe it was Julio Maglione's idea to hold the test event in the future Olympic venue as a test event, that's why he wants to secure the win for Rio.
  3. Let's not forget that current FIFA regulations for the WC is not to allow more than 2 stadia per city.
  4. Stadia will be significantly bigger in Curitiba, Brasilia, Manaus and Cuiabá. In the other cities, capacities will be kept roughly the same. Besides, the teams which play on the Libertadores are the ones who are going to play in existing stadia, such as Rio, SP, Belo Horizonte and Porto Alegre. The stadia mighht look more modern though.
  5. We can fly them over from the Jacarepaguá Airport (5 km from the OV) to the Santos Dumont airport (2 km from the Port). The only problem is that we can't use big jets. Jacarepaguá is for executive airplanes and Santos Dumont can only support jets the size of a Boeing 737. It's an idea...
  6. Indeed, it is not a proper cluster. The reason for it is that JH Stadium does not fit in any clusters. The Maracanã cluster is the bundle of the existing venues that lie on the North Side of Rio. Since it includes many large venues, it was included in the plan. However, if you remove JH Stadium you have a 3km-side triangle, which means something around 1,5 km radius. It is pretty compact and it is well connected. Copacabana cluster is also spread out. The reason is the same, since the Gloria Marina (on the edge of the Flamengo Park) and the Rodrigo de Freitas Lake were included in the cluster. In reality, it is just the inclusion of 2 existing venues (rowing/canoeing and sailing) with the events to be held in the Copacabana beach (open water swimming, thriathlon and volleyball). Besides, many of the events that have produced the size of the cluster are long length competitions such as road cycling, thriathlon, walk and marathon. Most of them will be held by racing from the Copacabana beach to the Flamengo Park. However, the Deodoro and Barra clusters are really compact, with several events being held within a 1 or 2 km radius.
  7. They are not. They have already come up with the plan and it will be pitched to the IOC in the next meeting. If the IOC accept it, changes will be made, otherwise the original plan will be implemented.
  8. The problem with the urbanists is that they do not consider the financial aspect of it. The choice of Barra is the most logical due to several issues. First, no place can hold more events than Barra, since Rio Centro, Maria Lenk and the HSBC Arena are all there. Second, the area is one of the few places where you can build and easily sell a residential compound to the middle class, which will attract private investors, saving government money to build an OV. Third, it is in an area where it would be easier to implement a security plan. However, the mayor has great expectations in the Port and wants to promote this change. Indeed, the renovation of the Port area will yield much more dividends to the city than the investments in Barra. However, the Port is mostly a bet and it is not clear if the area will be a successful business or residential pole. It seems more likely that it will become a comercial area, since it is adjacent to the downtown Rio, which has nowhere to grow. So, the decision to move events to the Port might be interesting, but it will be more expensive. Looking at the aspect of the mobility of athletes and media, the move to Port will be irrelevant to the media, but will increase by more than 10% the average travelling time for the athletes. So, it is a significant change especially for the events planned to be moved, which in several cases demand a big number of athletes to be transported early in the morning. To worsen the situation, there are not solid plans regarding mass transit to the Port. In the Olympic proposal, the plan to build a tram line was not mentioned and there are no BRT or subway lines reaching the Port.
  9. That's the proposal that I meant. Apparently those venues would be moved to old warehouses and to the structures used to build the cars for the Carnival parade. However, I think it would have a dreadful impact on travel times for athletes.
  10. Put Brazil out of this. Football has enough attendance in Brazil to support the stadia. As a matter of fact, most of the stadia are being scaled down for the WC.
  11. Itanhangá is also stunning and I have played there where my father is a member. However, both courses though official have holes which are not long enough for the modern golfers. Both courses were built around the 30's. There are rumors of new courses being built before 2016. The most promising one is in a new high profile residential compound where a new public 18-hole course would be built. If this course is actually built it will probably be chosen since it would be less than 5 km away from the OV and will probably be built according to the latest trends. Regarding the name of Gávea. In the past, the district now called S. Conrado used to be called Gávea, due to the mountain (Pedra da Gávea). Then, the S. Conrado church was built in the old district which became know for the name of the church. The other district that grew on the road that connected Jardim Botânico and Gávea (Gávea Road), then started to be called Gávea. P.S.: Gávea is the circular threshold where observers would stay in old ships.
  12. Yes, the most spread out. Actually it is JH stadium which falls out of place. Maracanã, Sambódromo and São Januário make a kind of triangle with 3 km on each side. However, all the venues are permanent and existing. It was defined as a cluster to justify the use of these venues and the cluster was sold as the most densely populated area of the city. If you remember the venue plan presentation, each cluster had a particular social-economic feature to justify its use. It was a way to portray that Rio 2016 will reach all the social groups that make up the population of Rio. JH stadium, however is well connetced to the OV through the Linha Amarela highway. By the way, unlike what Danny said, it is far from being midway to the Deodoro cluster which is pretty far from there.
  13. Maracanã (football and OCs) is kind of in the center of the cluster and Maracanãzinho (volleyball) is in the same place. The other venues are JH Stadium (athletics), which is 7 km away, and Sambódromo (archery and end of the marathon) which is around 2,5 km away. If São Januário is confirmed as the Rugby 7 venue, it will be around 3km away. By the way, yesterday a proposal to move some new venues to the Port (near Cidade do Samba) was also proposed. They would also be in the Maracanã cluster, around 3.6 km away.
  14. I would put the main matches issues in a very straight forward way. I will analyze the stadia project and the accommodation and the transport available. All considerations will be weighted with the legacy issue. 1. Rio (almost certain to host the final) - Stadium project was fully approved and there is no funding issue. However, the State Government has recently changed the approach from a public-private partnership to fully public funding. This change will required the state government to detail its project, which would be part of the prospective private partners effort. So, the new approach has delayed the work by a couple of months. Satdium capacity is above 80.000 people, so the final should be there. - Accommodation has still some gaps to be filled. However, the former Meridien Hotel should be open within a year and the former Hotel Nacional is going to be sold in an auction after years of judicial battles after its bankruptcy. If additional rooms are needed, the city can resort to cruise ships. Price of hotel rooms are above the major cities average, indicating a strong demand for additional accommodation. - Transport infrastructure is among the best for the event. Maracanã is currently served by subway and rail links with the main hotel concentration area. By December, the link will be possible without a transfer. By 2014, new stations should allow the whole South Zone of the city to be directly connected via subway. A railway and subway connection will also be established in the Maracanã station. The airport is still under its full capacity, but the old Terminal 1 should be reconfigured to provide more comfort. 2. São Paulo (favorite to host the opening match) - Stadium project is being roughly criticized by FIFA, despite the sufficient capacity of 65.000 seats. Since the funding is fully private (the stadium is owned by the São Paulo FC), there is uncertainty if the club can cope with the additional investment required for the opening match. The location of the stadium is also a problem, due to the narrow roads and to the lack of space to install temporary hospitality services and broadcasting infrastructure. If the stadium is not approved, it will probably lose the opening match or any semi-final. - Accommodation is easily compatible with the FIFA requirements. - Transport infrastructure upgrade is under way with a new station being built around a 1km from the stadium. There is the possibility of a tram to be installed linking the subway station to the stadium. Airport upgrade needed, since both airports are way over their capacity. 3. Brasilia (fighting for the opening match) - Stadium project is for a new venue fully compliant with FIFA recommendations. The government has made contradictory remarks informing that the stadium would be built for 70.000 only if the city is chosen to host the opening match, otherwise it would be downgraded to 45.000. There are serious doubts about the legacy of this project, since the city has no football clubs and its inhabitants mostly support teams from Rio and SP. - Accommodation needs to be upgraded, but the city has both available space and demand to meet the requirements. - Transport is being upgraded with a new LRT linking the airport to the city area where hotels and the stadium are located. 4. Belo Horizonte (fighting for the opening match) - Stadium project has received many compliments from FIFA. Its capacity will be for 70.000 seats. - Accommodation needs a very big upgrade and there are serious doubts about the capacity of the BH to support this legacy. The amount of rooms needed would be too much for the demand forecast. The alternative would be using accommodation in Rio and SP which are 1h away by flight, since there is a smaller airport close to the stadium. - Transport must be upgraded with a new rail or subway link from Down Town, where most hotels are, to Pampulha and with its main airport which is located far from the city. The airport will also require upgrades. 5. Porto Alegre (fighting to receive the Brazil side of the draw semi-final) - Stadium project has been approved with a capacity for 60.000 fans. Financing will be fully privately funded (stadium owned by Internacional SC), so there are still some doubts about the source of the resources. There is an alternative option which is the new stadium where Internacional main rivals, Grêmio, will play. This new venue would be built by a private company that would be partner of the club in the administration of the stadium. However, if the Gremio stadium is used, the semi-final will be lost since its capacity is for 52.000 seats. - Accommodation also needs to be upgraded by a large margin. There are also doubts about the city supporting the additional hotel rooms, but the problem is smaller than for BH. - Transport must be upgraded to link the stadium and airport upgrades are also needed. Well, combining the above info with what has been said by the main officials (Ricardo Teixeira, Blatter and Valcke) the desired configuration is final in Rio, opening in SP and semi-finals in BH and Brasilia as a consolation prize. If SP can't get the stadium approved, I think the opening match will move to Brasilia and Porto Alegre will get its semi-final. If Brasilia decides to downgrade the stadium in case it gets passed for the opening match, Porto Alegre might also get a semi-final in return. In the worst case scenario of many cities messing up during the preparations, Rio can get a more prominent place with more than one of those games played at Maracan: opening and final or 1 semi-final and final or even opening, 1 semi-final and final. It will be very difficult for Rio to mess up the preparations because of the OCOG pressure on it, which is larger than that of the WCOC. However, I think this scenario is highly unlikely. The 4 games will probably be held in 4 different cities.
  15. I think the main question is what PASO wants to do with the PanAm Games. They can accept Olympic standard PanAms to be a rare thing and continue with the level seen in Mar del Plata and Santo Domingo or they can try to raise the bar and have more Torontos and Rios. In the latter case, Central America will have a hard time hosting it. By the way, I don't know how Panama is doing right now. After all, its growth seemed to be fed by the financial and real state bubbles in the American economy. If they are still doing fine, they would be a good option in Central America, maybe with a second choice in San Jose in Costa Rica.
  16. Not yet. JJ might be bent and do the amendments to the project.
  17. There is no plan B, because the mayor and the governor have gathered around Morumbi. He also said that SP would only lose the opening match for itself. Apparently, SP is trying hard to lose it. Good luck, convincing Juvenal Juvencio to go through with a decent refurbishment for Morumbi.
  18. The Federal Government is only participating through a BNDES credit line. The SP, Porto Alegre and Curitiba stadia will be financed by the football clubs: SPFC, Internacional and Atlético Paranaense. The rest of the stadia is going to be financed by the state government in the vast majority. Actually the Brazilian government has more commitments with the SOG, in relation to the WC. And in Rio, all the construction will be done by the state government and will be used for the SOG. On the media side, I believe the Brazilian market is big enough to accommodate both events. The WC should rely on the CBF sponsorship (Vivo, Ambev, etc), while the SOG in some of its competition (Coca-Cola, Embratel, etc). Besides both OCs are working together in the communication plan.
  19. I support the decision of the Rio government to delay the invitation for bids with the new BNDES credit line. Even if the public-private partnership approach remains, the conditions have to be reassessed to make sure that the state government is going to get a proper proposal from the bidders. The new credit line changes the return on investment, so the assumptions of the project should be reviewed. The absence of interested party is for the government to blame, since the clubs were forbidden to participate with blew the consortium created by CBF, Flamengo, Fluminenese and the English company that runs the O2 Arena. Regarding the beginning of the constructions, the analysis should be the opposite. The stadia to be privately funded can start the works whenever is suitable, while the state owned stadia will have to go through a complex bureaucratic process to hire the company to deliver the renovations and constructions. So, the private stadia are probably going to start earlier. By the way, Curitiba has already started. If you watch a match from Atletico Paranaense on TV, take a look at the new seats being constructed there.
  20. By the way, until this Morumbi thing is not settle, SP still remains the favorite for the opening match. However they will have to pray for GMP (the German company responsible for the project) to come up with a miracle.
  21. I think the problem is not with Serra and Kassab, but with the political climate created around this whole subject by the direction of the big São Paulo football clubs. If we were in the 80's, no one would hesitate to do whatever was needed to get the stadium ready. This whole discussion about giving up on taxes is just a lame excuse, since it has nothing to do with the opening match but the WC as a whole. The problem is that, if the government steps in, it will be taking sides with one of the clubs in São Paulo. In the 80's Morumbi was used by all big teams for their main football matches, so government money invested in it would be for the benefit of all clubs. Now, the directors of the clubs have become so sectarian that each one has chosen its own stadium and refuses to play their home games in other stadia even if they lose money for that kind of decision. This issue has created situations like the President of São Paulo FC making fun of Corinthians because it doesn't have a stadium and the president of Corinthians promising never to play in Morumbi again. It's obvious that this situation is bad for both clubs, since São Paulo FC loses the rent and Corinthians, with the most fans in the city, loses the potential 30.000 seats to sell in tickets. Now, if Serra decides to pay for part of the Morumbi renovation, he would be taking sides with São Paulo FC. He would be heavily criticized for using government funds for the benefit of a private institution. If he builds a new stadium, he will be criticized for helping Corinthians, the only club which would be interested in the new venue. So, he is in a political snooker. It is quite clear now that the absence of a viable public stadium in SP is getting in the way of them hosting the opening match. To make it even worse, SPFC President has the habit of bragging about the city being able to host the WC with little government participation. He convinced the governor and the mayor about it and now it seems clear that this was not true. Now, the people from SP have embraced this speech and turning it over will be almost impossible. So, there are real political obstacles for the government of SP to make this opening match happen. Now, Serra must find a way out, otherwise this could be used against him during next year campaign.
  22. Blatter could get Manaus through and that will be as far as he can get. President Lula was in favour of Belém and Ricardo Teixeira sat out for this battle. I can start with a laundry list of reasons why an opening game in Manaus is just a crazy idea and it is never going to happen. The decision of the opening match is really between SP and Brasilia. BH is a dark horse, since the investment in accomodation they need would be totally useless after the event. And if none of those cities solve their issues, the opening is also going to be in Maracanã. I think no one will deny the right that SP has to host the opening match, since Rio is locked for the final. The only thing SP misses is a decent stadium project, which could even be a refurbished Morumbi. However, the main obstacle is the lack of will of both SPFC and the SP state and municipal governments to put in the money to complete those projects. The SP government would probably come with the urban renovation of the surroundings, while the SPFC would have to spend a lot more money in the renovation of Morumbi, besides closing the stadium for a large period. Morumbi has problems of insufficient surrounding area and of internal structure of the stadium (seats too far from the pitch, inclination angle of the lower ring, blind spots and distance for the location of TV cameras). There is no way SPFC will be able to use the stadium if all the renovation is carried out and that's a big loss for the club. SPFC now has hired a German company to help them with their stadium project, but I think they are still far from a good result, because of the demands of the club, which will not be able to handle the financial burden required.
  23. Manaus's stadium is under 60.000, so no opening, closing or semi-finals. A second round match would be a great achievement. Besides, for the opening the infrastructure requirements are quite high. BH doesn't have enough hotel rooms and their gap seems too big to be solved in time. Brasilia also has infrastructure gaps but an expansion is feasible. So, it really seems like Brasilia will be the second choice if SP doesn't come up with a decent stadium project. Rio has no competition for the final match, since it is the only stadium over 80.000 capacity and CBF is building a new training center for the national team next to Rio Centro where the media and broadcasting centers should be implemented.
  24. Both FIFA and the IOC have more countries represented on them than the UN. The IOC probably accepted the Palestine because it is an autonomous territory, like most of the Commonwealth small fiscal havens, and the Palestinians would not be able to compete under the Israeli flag.
  25. That's the opposite. CBF alone makes more money than any other federation or club in Brazil. The big cash cow is the Brazilian national team. FPF, as all other State Federations, needs CBF money to survive. Nike's sponsorship contract and the money they get for the friendly games is more than enough for them to take care of themselves. So, they distribute it to state federations to buy their support. How do you think Ricardo Teixeira gets elected over and over again? A completely different situation. The FIFA Club World Cup did not require the same broadcast infrastructure. By the way, FIFA is not complaining about the stadium, but the surroundings. FIFA still says that the project for Morumbi is good enough for any WC match except 4 (opening, finals and semifinals).
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