Jump to content


  • Posts

  • Joined

  • Last visited

Posts posted by Raphael

  1. Just keep in mind it can take much longer than you expect to get between venues. The Organizers priorities are security, crowd control, VIPs and the press. Continence for pion spectators is low on their list. Entrance and exits aren't necessarily where you would expect.... crowds can be directed on long winding paths... obvious cut-through can be blocked, extra security can pop up where you don't expect, etc. I learned my lesson after it took an hour to get between two somewhat close venues on the Beijing Olympic Green.

    Then again, sometimes access can be easy. The London committee had the logistical issues down pat; everything went smooth. Vancouver was the worst. There's no good way to predict. So just plan for things to take a long time, and be happy if they don't

    In a straight line, they are very close to each other, indeed. But, as you said, crowds management and safety barriers will surely make it a longer way.

  2. The old roof of Maracana has begun to be removed


    Credit: Genílson Araújo / Ag. O Globo

    (Google Translator)

    Brazil will host the World Cup in 2014? Certainly yes! The possibility of FIFA lose patience and choose another country is very remote. It would be a shame spectacular. So no one should bet on it. But Brazil will host the FIFA under what conditions?Here's the problem. The SEE this week made a radiograph of the works in the 12 stadiums that are hosting the world. The picture is bleak. Only one - the Castellan, Ceará - advancing at a pace that can be considered adequate. Maracanã, a symbol of Brazilian soccer, chosen to host the final match of the tournament, everything else constant, will be ready in 2038 ...!

    Asks the reader: "If you say that the finals will take place, then what's the problem? There are now delayed, but then things come at a proper pace. " Not so, and even Brazil knows it. Rio hosted the Pan American Games 2007. The works of infrastructure to host the competition were estimated at $ 400 million. Delay Delay, lack competence, of shamelessness in shamelessness, it was everything to the last minute. Result: Pan cost 10 times more - $ 4 billion - and a bunch of thieves filled his pockets with public money.

    This is the main problem: incompetence, negligence and roguery raise costs dramatically. Brazil has already done a stupid thing: instead of distributing the games of nine stages, the example of South Africa, decided on grounds of populism Lula-PT, spreading them by 12, bringing brutally account. Below, I publish a picture, drawn extensively from the data collected by the reporting team of SEE, which bears the name of the stadium, the budget, how much was spent so far and when the stadium would be ready if the pace of construction was maintained:


    Budget Spent today Stadium is ready in ...

    Corinthians (SP) R $ 1 billion Zero Never

    A. Dunes (RN) R $ 400 million Zero Never

    A. Baixada (PR) R $ 220 million Zero Never

    Maracanã (RJ) R $ 957 million $ 26 million in 2038

    Arena Pernambuco R $ 532 million $ 60 million in 2025Arena Amazônia R $ 499.5 million $ 30 million in 2024

    Mineirão (MG) R $ 666 million 2020 $ 86.6 million

    Nacional (DF) R $ 670 million $ 45 million in 2021

    Arena (MT) R $ 355 million $ 48 million in 2017

    Beira Rio (RS) R $ 290 million $ 30 million in 2017

    Fonte Nova (GO) R $ 591 million $ 99.9 million in 2015

    Castelão (EC) R $ 519 million $ 80 million in 2013

    The year of completion is not defined only by the amount invested.Came to him also evaluating the quality of spending. Read the story. The thing is far worse than it looks. Here are some misfortunes:

    1 - The renovation project of the National Stadium, DF, not provided for the installation of nonsense as lawn, lighting, chairs and big screen ... Think, reader, that a stadium should have a lawn ...?;

    2 - only after demolishing much of the bleachers is that the Maracana discovered that the entire concrete structure that covers it is compromised by leakage;

    3 - a new breakthrough discovery on new stadium for Corinthians already reached the fabled $ 1 billion (just do not know who will pay for) one hour appears a Petrobras pipeline here, another hour, to a stream channel there ... ;

    4 - U.S. $ 27.5 billion of investment planned for all the works of the World Cup, were not spent so far £ 590 million;

    5 - If the situation is dramatic in the stadiums, not better, as we know, at the airports of the 13 projects listed in the Cup, the work only started in six;

    6 - Brazil has pledged 50 works of urban mobility and to facilitate transit access to stadiums, to date, only four started.

    Read the report. There are other scandalous details. I go back to the beginning: Brazil will make the 2014 World Cup? Go, yes! It happens that all this carelessness scandalously raise costs.Already today there is an ongoing effort to take it easy TCU with robbery in the name of honor of the fatherland. An example: The Amazon Arena is still in the earthworks, as shown above. The court examined contracts of $ 200 million, only this niche, found overpricing of $ 71 million. This stage, incidentally, is an example of the madness that has gripped these people. Ready, it can hold 44,500 people. Good for the World Cup? Could be. Then it will be for the local championship. The average attendance of the tournament Amazon is paying less than one thousand. This year, attracted more people than confrontation occurred between National and Penarol: 2,869 witnesses. Guess who will foot the bill now and then ...

    It is the Lula-PTism Towards 2014: poor planning, incompetence, and megalomania robbery. The treasury will pay the bill.Something must be done, or the shame is right. I suggest hiring the company of Antonio Palocci. Costs may rise somewhat, but, say, this "solves"!

    By Reinaldo Azevedo

    Tags: World Cup 2014

  3. (Google translator)

    Delays in the preps for 2014 and 2016. Revista Veja today's issue shows the situation of each stadium. Only one of them will be ready for 2014. And it is not tne Maracanã. FIFA no longer hide his concern over the 2014 World Cup in Brazil.For the second time in just one month, the federation president Sepp Blatter has said publicly that he is concerned about the possibility of Brazil not ready to make the finals in three years. In a news conference Monday in Geneva, the hat left no doubt in his assessment: for him, the country is lagging behind in preparations for the tournament.

    Brazil was confirmed as host of the World 2014 in October 2007, less than seven years before the date set for the start of the event.Never had any country had been chosen so far in advance to receive a World Cup. Still, the possibility of delay in the works for the party has always been a concern of Brazilians - fear that was always denied by the CBF and FIFA. Last year, for example, Blatter said repeatedly that he was quiet.

    In early years, the discourse has changed. Earlier this month, FIFA president Sepp Blatter has already stated that the delay in the works - mainly in Rio de Janeiro and Sao Paulo - was cause for alarm. In this second interview, Blatter spoke again about the two cities. At first, the Maracana is already in the works, but the pace is slow - progress in the work and lack of infrastructure. On Monday, the construction of the future stadium for Corinthians in Itaquera is still far from starting.

    "If they keep working at this pace, we will not have matches in Rio and Sao Paulo when it happens the Confederations Cup, a year before the World Cup," warned Blatter. The tournament is considered a great dress rehearsal for the World Cup and FIFA usually use the event to assess the preparedness of the host country to a year's biggest sporting party in the world. In South Africa, the FIFA Confederations Cup in 2009 went smoothly - and in 2010 the Cup was successful.

    Blatter cited the example of South Africans themselves to criticize the Brazilians on Monday. "If we make a comparison between South Africa and Brazil three years before the World Cup, Brazil is behind, no doubt. I should not say this but it is a fact," he warned.Finally, the FIFA president gave a clear message to Brazil and CBF: "From now on, we expect a little more rapidly in Brazil, because for now, the country is not advancing at the speed it should."

    (With Agence France-Presse)

    Tags: South Africa, Brazil 2014, nfl, confederations cup, world cup, FIFA, Sepp Blatter.

  4. Some people in Argentina considers the last Pan Am Games held in their country (Mar del Plata 95) as being tarnished by politics (they were used by Menem to promote a bid for the 2004 Olympics). They were also remembered by the corruption scandal with the ATC channel and the producer Gerardo Sofovich, on which the channel lost arround 36 millions of argentinan pounds because of ''fraudulent administration''(the channel had the exclusive rights for the transmission of those games). I hope those mistakes aren't repeated again next time they host the games.

    Mar del Plata Games were a mess. Only Santo Domingo presented a worse edition. Argentinian people have to prove their country is ready to have the honour of hosting the Pan Ams again. This time a Rio 2007 level editon.

  5. "The Bradesco sponsorship of the Rio 2016 Olympic Games is our way of demonstrating trust in the entrepreneurship of the Brazilian people and of the city of Rio de Janeiro. It is going to be one of the best Olympics in history," said Bradesco Administration Board President, Lazaro de Mello Brandao. "It is notorious the calling for the Brazilian people to produce grand, beautiful things, we want to be together from the very first moment in the construction of this sport, social and economic landmark of Brazil."

    Yesterday I saw Eike Batista on Globo News and could learn a little more about him. Despite been one of then richest people in world, he is concerned about Lagoa Rodrigo de Freitas at his house sorrounding zone in Rio. He said he supported Rio's bid almost exactly for what Mr. Mello Brandão said.

  6. Here are some cities that have discussed the posibility of bidding for 2019:

    Mar del Plata, Argentina

    Bogotá, Colombia

    Medellín, Colombia [1]

    Lima, Perú [2]

    Puerto Rico [3]

    IMHO, Colombia has a good chance. I've heard also about Panama City and Santiago, but nothing serious at the moment.

    yWith the due respect, are you kidding? Mar del Plata after those terrible games? IMHO, Rio 2007 has set a for the PAN AMS a new level, a new status which will be followed by Guadalajara this year and, for sure, by Toronto. None of the cities you mentioned are likely to follow Rio 2007 pattern.

    yWith the due respect, are you kidding? Mar del Plata after those terrible games? IMHO, Rio 2007 has set a for the PAN AMS a new level, a new status which will be followed by Guadalajara this year and, for sure, by Toronto. None of the cities you mentioned are likely to follow Rio 2007 pattern.

    Course, Rio had the SOG in mind and money, much money to pursue their dream and used the PAN AMS to make it come true.

    Totally different. Starting with the fact that the PanAms were held in a different city with venues that could never be used for the SOGs.


    Baron loves kidding. Don't mind.

  7. After so many decades witnessing the government inercia agains drug lords and, what is worse, a pernicious relationship among them, it becomes very dificult to believe once more. However, the invasion of Vila do Cruzeiro and Complexo do Alemão give us hope, anyway. The sad part of the history is nothing would had been done if Rio was not to host the 2016 SOG.

  8. I don't knowif Ikarus already posted these but here are some highlights of Medellin 2010 - the South American Games


    There's a whole slough of them but they're not all labelled properly so it's hard to find anything of sequence.

    It's very...Sydney (the fire), Athens (the little pond of water), very Johannesburg 2010 (the lighting, etc., etc.0> In fact, it looks like they used ideas from every other Ceremony. These ceremonies are all getting to be too much already.

    Many thanks, Baron, for posting the links about the last SA Games. In fact if were you not to post them I would not know the games had hapened. I also agree to your considerations on the ceremonies.

  9. I would like to ask you to keep availlable the thread on the IOC vote in October 2, 2009. That belongs to the history of GB and its members who shared their feelings, their fears, their hopes, dellusion and celelbration during that historic moment, on real time. Please, consider this. That moment in GB belongs to the history of each one of us, members from all around the world. Thank you. God bless you. Stay under the protection of the Holy Virgin. Have a nice week.

  10. IMO, BOC should not be worried about the number of medals Brazil will get in 2016, but in building the conditions needed to a ever increasing performance of Brazilian competitors, since venues to formation: a long time plan, not a short time search for results of a inexistent infra.

  11. Jim, the project shown is for the World Cup.

    I'm sure some modification will be done between both events.

    Indeed, they need to "invent" a place to put the the cauldron.

    It's too early to assume this or that.

    What I see now is: the project for the World Cup Final match seems enough to me.

    Agree, Dannyel.

    Sometimes people forget Maracanã is hosting FIFA WC matches in 2014 and the Ceremonies and footballing in 2016. They are different things. Of course, there must have been some talking among those people responsible for the WC and the SOG, in order to avoid waste of money and time. But, I insist, WC an SOG are different events. I am not concerned about the cauldron: they will find a way to deal with this question. But not in a hurry, it's too soon. I also believe some changes will be done in Maracanã for 2016, mainly those needed to the ceremonies. But nothing like the pics we have seen posted by people that seem have never been to the stadium. About the things that might oblige some changes for 2016 is the Parade of the Nations. But everything will be all right at the end.

    I don't see any reason for being worried about the cauldron and the Parade at this time. It is too premature.

  12. "Para o conforto de todos assista ao jogo sentado"... How many times do people do as the sign says? laugh.gif

    During a football match, it's unlikely. Mainly in Maracanã, where the big four RJ teams play very often. I support Vasco da Gama, but I am not a fool to ignore that Flamengo has around 30.000.000 supporters all over the country. As you can imagine, people come from every corner of the country to watch games in Maracanã. Botafogo and Fluminense also use the stadium for matches against Flamengo. If in your question you mean that people in Rio do not follow rules, you are wrong. But if you are talking about the Brazilian national sport, then you have to consider that remaining sitting during the 90 minutes of a football match is something almost impossible. What is it like in spain? People stay sitting during football matches? I don't know, but I think it is not so different from Brazil.

  13. Yes there must be room for new things. But sometimes the risk is great. Vancouver's BC Place tried many new things when it came to this aspect. Many were unfortunately not as successful in terms of immediate impact and long term legacy in people's minds, as it could have been. (Multiple Cauldrons being one of them, the inflated roof etc..) to justify having it this way in the future.

    It would have been fantastic if it succeeded and became the new way of doing things, like how Sydney succeeded in ceremonies that it is defined as the turning point in theatrical ceremonial productions and every host city has been trying to outdo each other since then, but unfortunately the impact of vancouver's cauldrons was lackluster and even controversial at times.

    I will say BC Place was an exception that they attempted, but will try to be avoided in the future if possible, same for Maracana, at most it will be a one off.

    Besides Maracana will have it's moment of glory as the 'anchor venue' at the 2014 world cup because of it's soccer status. It will be strange associating it as the 'olympic stadium' as soon as 1.5 years later - some how I think.

    How did they do the cauldron at the 2007 games with two stadiums? Sorry I don't live in the Americas so I have no impressions or memories of 2007 Pam Am.


    There was only one cauldron, in Maracanã Stadium.

  14. I think the main question is what PASO wants to do with the PanAm Games. They can accept Olympic standard PanAms to be a rare thing and continue with the level seen in Mar del Plata and Santo Domingo or they can try to raise the bar and have more Torontos and Rios. In the latter case, Central America will have a hard time hosting it.

    By the way, I don't know how Panama is doing right now. After all, its growth seemed to be fed by the financial and real state bubbles in the American economy. If they are still doing fine, they would be a good option in Central America, maybe with a second choice in San Jose in Costa Rica.

    I agree to your opinions, Aluz. Rio 2007, even with the lack of experience and organization and disrespect to some sports which had not popular appeal to the Brazilian people, stablished a new standard to the Pan Am Games. Toronto will surely try to present a better edition. I don't know how are things going on in Guadalaraja, but, for sure, they will try to follow the same track. The question is clear. If Rio 2007 standard is chosen as the pattern, then the PanAm Games will become financialy prohibitive to CA and most countries in SA. I can't see any CA country with conditions to follow the new patern. On the other side, that would be politically hard to put an end in the rotation.

    I would be happy if Santiago were awarded, but I don't know if they will bid after the problems of infra they have due to the earthquke. I think their priorities might have been changed.

  15. I really would appreciate Santiago as hosting City of a Pan AM Games edition. And it is more likely after a NA edition in Toronto. A kind of rotation has been informally stablished. Then that will be SA time again, since Mexico is culturally a Central America country, IMO.

    2003 - Santo Domingo

    2007 - Rio de Janeiro

    2011 - Guadalajara

    2015 - Toronto

    2019 - Santiago

    Unfortunatelly, after the earthquakes, I think Chile will not bid for 2019. I also think no other SA country will be able to bid. Brazil, due to the too recent 2014 WC and 2016 SOG. The other countries for economic problems. So, differently to what I said before, a NA bid seems more likely.

    2003 - Santo Domingo

    2007 - Rio de Janeiro

    2011 - Guadalajara

    2015 - Toronto

    2019 - Any USA city

  16. The rotation is North, Central, South

    Since 1975

    1975 - Mexico (N)

    1979 - Puerto Rica ©

    1983 - Venezuela (S)

    1987 - United States (N)

    1991 - Cuba ©

    1995 - Argentina (S)

    1999 - Canada (N)

    2003 - Dominican Republic ©

    2007 - Brazil (S)

    2011 - Mexico (N)

    2015 - Canada (N)

    This is the first time since 1955-1959 that the same region has hosted the games consecutively. The Caribbean and Central America have bequeathed their 2015 to Canada.

    I am surprised Jamaica is not interested. Jamaica and Chile seem to be the two glaring misses, and maybe now that Guetemala and Costa Rica have been stable for awhile (or Panama) they would and should be considered so that Central American hosts and not just the Caribbean as their representing their region.

    You are right, thanx. However, the most important question I think ODEPA has to solve is which kind of standard they want the Pan Am Games delivered in. Editions like San Domingos of Rio? This question must be analized because, if they choose Rio's standard - and, for sure, Toronto's as well - that will be very difficult to pick up a CA city, at the least by now.

  17. Minneapolis should bid for this, something that is within their reach, instead of dreaming about something that is beyond their realm of possibility. But I don't think that the USA is interested at this time in the Pan Ams.

    Let's us not forget Rio won the race with San Antonio, Bush's hometown, if I'm not wrong.

  18. I really would appreciate Santiago as hosting City of a Pan AM Games editio. And it is more likely after a NA edition in Toronto. A kind of rotation has been informally stablished. Thenthat will be SA time again, since Mexico is culturally a Central America country, IMO.

    2003 - Santo Domingo

    2007 - Rio de Janeiro

    2011 - Guadalajara

    2015 - Toronto

    2019 - Santiago

  19. Really these inter South American relations don't matter when it comes down to it . Toronto is the largest Media Market that the Pan Am Games would be hosted in for North America since Chicago 1959. The Rotation is clear. North America is due in 2015 and Toronto is certainly a Candidate well above Indianapolis or Winnipeg. The extent of the Media Market Toronto is actually in this day and age is well beyond Chicago in 1959 considering ENG TV and sports speciality Channels that did not exist in 1959.

    The Caribbean is certainly behind this as are two south American countries who were stood up at Canoc 2009 by both Bogota and Lima.

    Toronto I am sure could count on the US and maybe a good part of central america.

    Jim jones

    I agree completely. And more: after Rio's edition, Pan Am Games have been given a status they did not have before ( remember S. Domingos? Such a kind of organization are unthinkable by now), a new standard. I don't know if any SA city - but Brazilian ones - would host the games following this new level. Mexico will face this difficult question. Toronto will, too.

  • Create New...