NY20??

Athens' stadium's roof and cauldron were both designed by Santiago Calatrava simultaneously. It wasn't a matter of them squeezing their cauldron in wherever it would fit. Beijing on the other hand was indeed a case of the stadium being designed long before the cauldron. But I think they did a good job of attempting to incorporate the cauldron into the stadium design with the entire unfurling scroll concept during the lighting.

Unless the stadium is suspended above the field (highly unlikely) or there's a small cauldron on a stage (this has its fair share of points against it), not everyone in the stadium will see London's cauldron either.

If they never put a set of floodlights right above one of the screens (the one bent over in the above rendering), that area on the roof would have worked well for a cauldron I think. *If they had never, I should say

I would hardly call that imposing. Imposing would be the Orbit appearing taller than the floodlights.

Barcelona's lighting sometimes comes off a bit too much like a circus act with the very dramatic music and the sheer impossibility of it all. It was a stunning lighting, but I feel like the showmanship was a bit heavy handed. Sydney's, even with it's sheer size and mechanical wizardry, has always been beautiful and stunning to me. The sound of the cascading water coupled with the fantastic choice of music, Freeman's bodysuit giving her a bizarrely appropriate androgynous aura, that absolutely gorgeous shot of her bending over to light the circular flame around her on running water with thousands of cameras flashing in the darkness as the backdrop. That whole sequence feels to me like the Olympic Cauldron lighting benchmark. No nerve-wrecking drama, just an elegant and beautiful set-up.

When these things are considered - the location of most of the park's venues, the position of the VIP box / broadcast tables inside the stadium, and where the Orbit stands - a cauldron tower on the north end of the stadium just makes so much sense to me. And if not outside, than at least somewhere on that northern half of the stadium.

Reading that Beijing thread is great--the cauldron ideas for that one are ridiculously hilarious in retrospect. Giant fire-breathing swallows! I now want London to start setting up something of interest that must be for the cauldron just for the wacky speculation that would ensue.

For once, I want a cauldron actually shaped like a cauldron ala Barcelona, Seoul, etc.

If they remove one set of those floodlights (by that I mean one triangle for lack of better wording), a lightweight cauldron perched on the outer structural ring of the roof could work--specifically above one of the screens. Beijing's cauldron actually covered one set of floodlights so lack of adequate lighting would not have been much of an issue. But I suppose if this was always the plan, they would of never put up all the floodlights in the first place.

Well actually, as you can see here, the Bird's Nest's floodlights were actually on the rim of the roof. They were just covered during the opening ceremony where theatrical staging lights were used instead. But your point remains nonetheless. If I remember correctly, Beijing's massive and technically intricate (it moved into it's final position during the Parade of Nations while no one was looking up at the roof--brilliant!) cauldron didn't begin to be constructed until around May or June. So if London designed its stadium's roof with a cauldron on top of it in mind, we may start to see activity up there in a month or two. But who knows really--the cauldron could be rather simple and light weight and take nothing more than two weeks in the summer to put up. My bet is on some sort of tower outside the stadium, nothing too intricate or complicated to install. Tall and simple.

Ding ding dinggg.I've always said it, if the those five rings are in the background somewhere, people will be more inclined to watch whatever sport is on their television. And not at all surprised that NBC will air the YOG's on Universal Sports. I mean, that's where they aired the last two Paralympics and where they cover all the Olympic sports that no one cares about outside the Games. Good fit for the YOG's to catch an audience.

Yes, the fact that the Olympic Games is the time when the most people pay attention to doubles and the time when the most top players enter a double draw and are excited about it arguably makes the Games the pinnacle of double tennis. Also, the entire presence of tennis in the Olympic program isn’t’ taken as another event on tour by top players; but a unique event to aspire to win and to stick around for, an event that means something more than playing for yourself. Any reason or cause to take tennis out of the Games at this point would come from mere scheduling, not level of prestige or reception by players. With all this said, I don't need a condescending tone, a rolleyes smiley, nor the occasional bold italics combo to communicate and support my thoughts

The Games is the pinnacle of doubles Tennis, only time when a player like Federer bothers to play in a doubles draw. I mean, he acted like he won another Grand Slam when he won the Gold in Beijing with Warwrinka. And it's not like the Olympic singles tournament is just another event on the tour. It's not the pinnacle of sport, but it's definitely something top players aspire to winning. A number of them have said they will stick around to have a chance at 2012 or beyond.

I don't think there was anything particularly interesting about Whistler to look at, but Vancouver's another story. The shots of the harbor with the flame in the foreground, Olympic rings in the distance, and the mountains in the background were really memorable. The city itself is really telegenic anyway.

If New York were to host, I'd prefer Liberty National Golf Course in Jersey City. It's right across the harbor from Downtown Manhattan with great views of the Statue of Liberty. Really telegenic.

I think Madison Square Garden would host Baskteball and the new arena in Brooklyn would host Gymnastics - or vice versa. Either way, I can't see those two sports getting too far from the city, whether to Nassau or to Newark / The Meadowlands.

As per the 2012 bid, Manhattan would host the triathlon at Central Park, basketball at Madison Square Garden, some indoor sports at the Javits Convention Center, boxing at a renovated 369tht Regiment Armory, and field hockey at the northern tip of the borough at Columbia University's Baker Field. Road cycling and the marathon would be involved too of course. The 69th Regiment Armory might be able to host a small indoor sport, but it wasn't included for 2012. Javits was suppose to be expanded, so it's possible that it may not be able to host as much sports as intended for 2012. And I can't see where a temporary venue would fit inside this island. Maybe a temporary pier somewhere in the vicinity of the West Village or Chelsea? The 2012 bid called for Beach Volleyball and the Aquatics Center in Brooklyn right across the river from Manhattan. But I'm not sure if that land is or will still be available, seeing as how quickly northwestern Brooklyn is getting gentrified.

It's not an opinion to suggest Queens is separate from New York, because that is in fact wrong. I've always lived in Manhattan but it is ample time that people star realizing that New York City is not Manhattan. Queens is an amazingly diverse borough in every respect - anchoring the Olympic Games there makes perfect poetic (and practical) sense. It really shouldn't be OLYMPIC STADIUM IN THE MIDDLE OF MANHATTAN... or nothing.

I think Flushing Meadows in Queens screams more Olympic Park than the Meadowlands. And indeed, if the 2012 had been won, Flushing Meadows would of acted as a as a traditional Olympic Park, hosting Athletics, the Ceremonies, Tennis, Archery, Rowing, White Water Canoe Kayak, and Water Polo. That Water Polo pool intended for 2012 has since been built. And barring the USTA's approval / scheduling with the US Open, I think it may be possible to retrofit some of the outdoor and indoor facilities at the National Tennis Center to host other sports as well as Tennis. Archery would still be a temporary venue and Rowing / Canoe and Kayak would have to be built as per the 2012 bid (redeveloping an adjacent lake and fountain respectively). That leaves the Olympic Stadium. I've always said if New York would ever try again, the London model should be fallowed here; a mostly temporary venue at Flusing Meadows that after the Games, could possibly replace Ichan Stadium on Randall's Island (which was going to be a training venue for 2012). Since the 2012 bid, the site of the Olympic Village on the East River across from the UN has since been developed, so that's out. Not 100% on this, but I also think the Harlem River waterfront area next to Yankee Stadium where new venues would have been built for 2012 has also been developed. Which brings me to say if any future NY bid wants to be successful, with local support at least, it should be very outer-borough legacy heavy and anchored. The city is now currently in the process of making NY more of a "harbor city" by greening up waterfronts and whatnot. As the NYTimes recently said, this may very well be the most important legacy of mayor Bloomberg. A future NY Olympic bid should echo these efforts across the city, as well as London's - that is, urban regeneration where it is needed.

I don't think you have to worry about 27 or so world championships of sports getting lost in this city. You just have to feel the electric atmosphere of post-midnight matches at the US Open; New York loves sports. This city would truly embrace the Olympics as much as any. Any I would draw similar comparisons to London; yet no one really worries about the Games getting "lost" in that city I've said it before, but in in general, I've found most average opposition to the Games is based around questioning the city's actual capabilities to host the Games efficiently what with traffic, waterways dividing the city, availability of space, etc. This reverts back to that failed process of trying to cram a stadium into Manhattan for 2012. It was that stubborn mindset and difficult process of trying to approve that West Side Stadium that stung the civic will of New York, not the actual rejection from the IOC in Singapore. Most of the NY "doesn’t need the global stage for approval" discussion within the city really comes from the Manhattan wealthy folks that leave the city every summer anyway, not from most average people at least. Any future bid will most likely be anchored by and focused on the outer-boroughs anyway, not in Mnahattan. I really do see any future New York Olympics leaving a legacy akin to what London hopes to achieve - urban and social regeneration in parts of the city that need it, not a change in international perception or whatever. That would be the legacy - a tangible, physical one. Everything has to fall in place perfectly. The vision and leadership has to be there, civic will, a solid enough plan,... and of course timing. It's A LOT of if's, more so than with most cities, but we'll see.

The Olympic Movement in general has that lofty goal of inspiring people to take up sport. The Games themselves, whether regular or Youth, is the thing for people to look up to, to idealize, the spark that inspires. London 2012 has a number of initiatives to engage people to take up sport. These programs and aspect of the Games are not really talked about around here. I think the Youth Olympic Games will just have a stronger focus in this department within whatever region they're being hosted in.

Most average people don't really care that much about a cauldron's design unless its extremely, extremely bad which is not the case judging from the crowds of people who wanted to take a picture of it during the Games.

Yes, in the realm of Olympic design, Vancouver has a monopoly on wavy lines. So wavy lines are off-limits to anyone but Vancouver. Anyway, this design isn't horrible. But what I don't like is the constant use of that same figure to represent "youth" in general. It's soooo tried.

And my city's rejection inspired me to follow the Games more and join this forum!

See, it's stuff like that makes me hesitant to want anyone else to broadcast the Games in the US. They do awesome stuff like that all the time. I was hoping for a London preview but oh well.