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Everything posted by LuigiVercotti

  1. And if you want further evidence of how Qatar's NOC views women in sport take a look at this link from their NOC homepage: Qatar Sport Women's Committee Not only was the article produced in before the 2008 Beijing games (hence showing the institutional apathy towards promoting Qatari female Olympians notice how the story refers to: And yet this same NOC can't find one single female athlete to send to Beijing? Hmmmm...looks like equal rights for women is best done by non-Qataris. Then take a look at the list of sports that were being developed for Qatari women in 2007/2008 (unless the whole scheme went dead since then perhaps the Qatari NOC didn't have the results to report or the athletes to support after this time). Basketball, Handball, Table Tennis, Swimming all feature. What about field hockey? Gymnastics? Athletics? Rowing? Softball? Is it a lack of resources? Is it a lack of a competitive female population? Is it because of modesty concerns? Who would know? However considering that in 2004 Greece was able to field female athletes in all sports, or that in 2016 there will be a Brazilian women's rugby team in Rio, can the Qatari NOC deliver anything similar? If not why not? And if not (and in light of their Olympic history) then considering this is not an equitable distribution of access to sport on gender basis then the Qatari NOC are effectively breaking the IOC's own Charter which states: If we were talking about Jews, Muslims, Gays, Blacks, Sikhs, Mormons, Kurds or any other religious, sexual or racial grouping who have been effectively held back or kept out of mainstream Olympic competition (as Qatari women have historically been) and this history was associated with a Chicago, Toronto, Madrid, Paris or whatever western bid then there would be howls of protest from anyone with a (quite justifiable) degree of integrity or a commitment to the ideals that the IOC supposedly focuses on. However some people here would rather go oooh and ahhh over pretty renders and forget that an Olympic bid should be more than just a grab for jingoistic fame and fortune. It should be about individual rights no matter your gender, race, creed, religion, wealth or political view. One last point for you sophists out there defending the Qataris...in 2000 the IOC banned Afghanistan from participating in the Sydney SOGs partly due to the Taliban's attitude to women in sport. Considering Qatar's record is barely better concerning the Olympics (from 56 women in Doha 2006 to none in Beijing 2008) why is the IOC so lenient to their NOC?
  2. Which is indicative of an attitude that is actually contra guiding principles behind every host city and it's raison d'être for an Olympic bid as recited again and again by both Jacques and his predecessor the Wily Old Falangist. The Olympics are at least nominally built around the athletes best interests and a home country that actually wants to do well at the games. It's well and good to build fantastical and opulent facilities but what dies it signify if the host nation has no ability to actually contribute beyond funding them. And I find it ridiculous that the Qatari NOC can go on about the increasing representation of women at the Olympics when they can't even send a single female Qatari athlete to Beijing. If this was another megarich state with a total population smaller than Brisbane (perhaps such as Brunei, Lichtenstein or Luxembourg) there would be justifiable derision of their potential bids purely on the basis of their Olympic history. Throw in the attitude that the Qatari government has towards it's guest workers contrasted with their minority of native citizens as well as the anti-gay legislation in place (which would mean that the likes of Mark Mitcham and Greg Louganis would be thrown into jail for their personal sexual activities if committed and caught in Qatar), and the paucity of an Olympic heritage ( unlike the last 20 odd Olympic hosts) and the IOC has no right to contravene it's own charter and it's own much spruiked principles of history, honour and athlete's rights. And until one or a million Qatari contributors to this forum can contextualise and demonstrate that concerns that many people hold about their country's representations to the likes of MaFIFA or the IOC and their country's open and honest relationship with Israel, gays, women and a free and fair press then a Qatari bid would be no better than Beijing's. If you want the Olympics to actually stand up for what are rights and equalities we all should share it's tantamount to blatant hypocrisy to turn around and support bids from the likes of Doha (or for that matter Alexandria, Tehran or even Haifa if they ever eventuated). PS QatarSon I respect your right to post here and I respect you as an individual. I do not respect however the manner in which your nation's leaders have rorted world football, as well as the manner in which individuals post here as nationalistic cheerleaders for their respective bids. If you consider totally accurate and demonstrably relevant facts about Qatar's insignificant Olympic history somehow a personal sleight then you have no ability to differentiate between ad factum or ad hominem debate. If you think highlighting your countries iniquitous attitudes to women and gays, or the absence of Olympic glory in Qatar's history is hate speech then get over yourself.
  3. Well we'll hopefully find out...I've dropped an email in the electronic aether to Andrew Jennings and hopefully he'll be able to either give some answer in a reply or on his web site. The manner in which Jennings seems to get his info is either through off the record conversations with key contacts, court records or disgruntled associates of the various IOC/MaFIFA bigwigs. My suspicion is that Lee is as you say clever enough not get his hands dirty. But I wouldn't be surprised if someone in his spin company has let the fingers dip into the merde on behalf of a big wealthy bid patron/. And all it takes is one subpoena, one whisper in the wrong ear or one ill-judged sacking and AJ will be onto the dirt like a starving dog on a bone.
  4. Oh please don't be so humble about Qatar's proud Olympic heritage. Shout it from the roof tops loud and proud, so it reverberates in the corridors of IOC HQ Lausanne. After all if a Football Association that has been caught violating player registries by FIFA, is ranked 77th in the world (just behind that football powerhouse the Central African Republic) and has never qualified for a WC on merit then your NOC can certainly dream the dream of midnight marathons and gay Olympians strutting their stuff in Doha
  5. Thanks to Supreme Shite-stirrer Andrew Jennings for this nugget which will also give more credence to the Qatar win = corruption of MaFIFA and vice versa: Join the dots on this little story...nephew of Blather has lucrative contract with part-Saudi owned sports marketing company with links to Arab TV and world cup film and archive rights. Send the 2022 WC to a Gulf state which will undoubtedly benefit the same part-Saudi owned companies and nephew Phillipe gets perhaps a nice bonus and maybe a share of future WC broadcast revenue. No wonder the Yanks and Aussies stood no chance.
  6. I see in the article Mainad that Mike Lee cites a Middle Eastern population of 700 million by 2022. Intriguing figures considering that the largest Middle Eastern country right now is Egypt with approx 79 million, and Qatar having the second lowest at approx 1.7 million. Where did he get these population predictions from? And how easily managed and how sustainable will an influx of say hundreds of thousands of (for example) Iraqi, Iranian, Lebanese and yes even Israeli fans be into a tiny oil emirate? Methinks Lee is a very talented spin doctor with some very savvy connections, backed by some serious money. I wonder if Andrew Jennings has ever talked to him
  7. By the way, just in case our Qatari brethren get a little miffed at how we perceive their bid hopes for future SOG glory, perhaps we should look at Qatar's glorious Olympic history: Participated in 7 SOGs No OWGs 2 bronze medals in total (1 to a naturalised Qatari runner from Somali, 1 to a naturalised Qatari weight lifter from Bulgaria) Qatari Female Representation at the Beijing 2008 SOGs: Nil Now of course this grand tradition deserves recognition from the viziers of Lausanne does it not? Or are we going to see the IOC pander to those South Africans with their measly 20 gold medals from SOG participation or heaven forbid the Italians with 190 gold? It would be such a shame to think that the IOC limits itself to countries that actually have contributed something to Olympic sport when it comes to considering a Qatari bid.
  8. You have to remember Triffle that in Qatar they can hire someone from Bangladesh or the Phillipines at a pittance to have their common sense for them. So long as they have their Hummers, their egregiously over the top Meccas to unsustainable tourist industries and the money to fly into any western capital to get on the piss because their own societal norms would mean they would be thrown in jail, then common sense is not part of their agenda. No.1 in the 'What You Wont Be Seeing in Qatar 2022' Pictorial Essay
  9. Forget Doha, Dubai, Istanbul, Cairo, Dasmascus, Riyadh, Manama...and all those hot as buggery, prone to sheikdom despotism, petrodollar sponsored virtual slave labour-based feudal fiefdoms etc etc. If anything has been shown in the decision by MaFIFA to award the 2022 WC to Qatar you need to have one very astute and very very powerful person in your corner at the highest echelons of the sporting body (i.e. MaFIFA and the IOC) to get your bid across the line. And when it came to Bin Hammam and his no doubt co-conspirators Chung Moon-Joon, possibly Michael Platini and perhaps even Septic Blather himself the Qatari bid showed its not what you know or even how much you are willing to spend on what you know, but who you know and how to make sure they have their palms greases, their egos massaged or their idiotic fantasies realised. These power brokers did just that; they broke the power of what should have been a sane and simple process into one which saw 14 votes go to a country that has never qualified for the WC, has little demonstrable capacity to hold such an event and has a social and political environment which are the antithesis of almost everything concomitant with the WC. Jacques is peddling the barrow big time and making sure that the rich sheiks throw some dosh towards the coffers of the IOC, whilst all and sundry mouth platitudes in favour of a middle eastern bid. But there is no one in a position of significance at the IOC who will provide the initial powerful focal point for their bid. There is no Samaranch Jnr, there is no Havelange, no Dick Pound, no Mario Pescante, no Thomas Bach, no Danny Jordaan in the emirati and Arabic back pocket in the Lausanne bunker. Without a strident and politically powerful protagonist within the deepest corridors of the IOC's corridors of power a Middle East bid is as dead as the Dead Sea.
  10. Well unless Canada can (1) find someone who is willing to push their barrow on their behalf within the FIFA ex-co and has the prestige and financial backing of a Bin Hammam then there is simply no reason to bid and (2) Canada are not going to be able to impress FIFA with its footballing abilities unless things drastically change over the next 10 years. Unlike the Qataris who can obviously point to their financial and political clout within FIFA the Canadians would (assuming their is a continuance of rotational policies) be tremendous pressure from either a possible US bid (lets face it, the US would have won the 2022 race if money and technical bid quality were the two most important criteria in the selection), or perhaps depending upon the sophistry and political machinations a potential Chinese bid. Canada is just another western democracy with all the capacity to hold a great WC however they do not have anyone on the inner circle (and their appears to be no one emerging in parallel with developing Canadian football) to thus attract a body that seems to find the most batshite-crazy reasons to justify the most unlikely and least technical proficient locations for a WC.
  11. In the first round I'm almost certain he went with Australia (his relationship with Frank Lowy was very close in the bid plus he served as an advisor in the selection of Holger Osieck as the Aussie coach). After that round I suspect he went with the US bid (which I assume is due to his past experience in the US and interest in American football). There would have been zero chance if him ever voting for Qatar.
  12. Actually there are plenty of reasons why the region should be made to wait to host. Expense, lack of structures for fans, security, gender inequalities, political interference with the sport's activities (go look up the history of Iraq, Kuwait and Iran's FAs as an example), blatant corruption of the games' ethical standards (e.g. the manner in which Qatar and other FAs in the region 'buy' players from other countries), heat, the lack of recognition of Israel, failure to qualify for the WC from most of countries in the region (only Iran & Saudi Arabia has a history of WC participation and in the case of Qatar it's most recent games saw it lose 3-0 and 4-0 against subsequent qualifier Australia)...I could go on and on. And by the way consider this little incident from Qatar's WC history in its game against Iraq in Doha on March 23rd 2008) and tell me why they should be allowed to host: When the Qatari's and their ilk start living up to the same standards that the rest of footballing world are supposed to both in terms of the games ethics, the demands of society and respecting rights that MaFIFA itself trumpets then the region may deserve a WC. But for now they are simply a cashed up feudal oil emirate who can bribe whomever they want and get away with it because one of the chief crooks in Zurich is one of their own oligarchs.
  13. Whilst I've disagreed with Keitho in the past I am a 100% behind what has been posted above and unlike the naive and whitewashing 'think it's neat' kind of statements made by stir think that there are two as yet unresolved issues at stake. First off MaFIFA has set itself up as a moral guardian (particularly seen in its publicised stance on racism) whilst extolling the benefits of going to the Middle East in 2022 as some kind of new frontier action that will have social justice ramifications (as extolled by the Qatari's own bid propaganda). And yet these are some of the standards of society and law that Qatar holds onto: At the end of 2003, Qatar remained one of only three Arab countries (with Oman and the UAE) that had not signed the Convention on the Elimination of All Forms of Discrimination against Women (CEDAW). Qatar has signed very few international human rights conventions. Most foreign women laborers work as domestic workers in Qatar and have only moderate access to justice. These women are often isolated within households, where their employers may restrict their freedom of movement. While they do have some legal rights and appear before the same court system as Qatari citizens, fear of expulsion and job loss often prevents these workers from exercising what rights they technically possess. The state does very little to protect foreign women, especially domestic workers. Qatari citizenship is difficult to acquire. A 1961 law grants citizenship only to descendants of those who resided in Qatar before 1930. While some non-nationals have received citizenship, such exceptions are very rare and usually occur as a result of specific circumstances (e.g., soccer players admitted to make the country eligible for international competitions). Discrimination in favor of Qataris, especially citizens with power and influence, such as members of the large ruling family, occurs in all spheres of economic and social life. Qatar's interpretations of Islamic law deem the testimony of two women to be equal to that of one man. However, judicial discretion works to make the courts flexible in applying this rule, and the judge ultimately decides the credibility of witnesses. Women usually attend court proceedings in legal cases but are typically represented by a male relative or, increasingly, a (male) attorney, although women may represent themselves if they choose. Half of Qatar's judges are non-Qataris who are at-will employees who can be fired and consequently deported at any time, a circumstance that limits their independence. There are no women judges in Qatar (source: Freedom House) Now how is it that the Zurich robber barons can pontificate about awarding the WC to Qatar as a (partial) means to using football as a force for social change when the society and polity that generated the bid for Qatar is based on such gender and racial prejudice? Then consider the bias in the Qatari position re Israel (they won't recognise the state nor will they allow its FA to be part of the Confederation where it logically should sit geographically) however they promise that conditional on qualification Israel will be allowed to send a team. On the much trumpeted moral grounds that Blather's cronies continue to validate their management of the game Qatar fails miserably. Another issue that Keitho brings up which should make everyone pause and thing again is that there will be a dearth of fans willing to travel to Qatar for the very reasons why its society is so quarantined to the male local Arabic Islamic oligarchy. If Keitho doesn't want to go to a Qatari WC (and I can but assume the 5 he has been to has meant a considerable investment on his behalf) imagine the damage to the WC's reputation and the potential loss of revenue if 10,000 of Keitho's ilk don't attend. Or 50,000, Or 100,000? By disenfranchising the interests and support of the most passionate fans (such as those who arguably may do thing en mass that Qatari society would find morally, socially and under their restrictive legal codes unlawful) then Blather, Bin Hammam etc are reinforcing and rewarding the feudal attitudes of an oil rich emirate that has contributed nothing to world football and nothing to the moral development of its immediate geographic area.
  14. No, what Qatar and Russia promised was to build a whole slew of fantastical, very expensive and arguably redundant stadia that would serve as reminders of just how important MaFIFA is for its members plus create billions in revenues for the various consultants, architects, builders, government bureaucrats, MaFIFA media types etc etc. Spinning out a motherlode of cash which reinforces the egos of the puffed-up corrupt mini-Machiavellis in Zurich by building so many new stadia gives Blather's cronies reassurance that they are worthwhile. All the other bidders to varying extents had real and concrete venues in place that were better simply because they are already there. And in cases like Wembley or the MCG they have hosted huge events (football and non-football related) which have in turn demonstrated efficiency, atmosphere and quality of experience. Unfortunately they don't serve as Albert Speer-like architectural tributes to a gang of 22 robber barons.
  15. And already the incongruity of Qatar's win and indeed threats against the 2022 WC have started:
  16. A Qatari Football crowd going berko with enthusiasm and passion for the game and the event: Respectful Brazilians showing modesty for South Africa 2010:
  17. I'm sure there will be the usual conglomeration of brand spanking new hotels and possibly cruise ships berthed to add extra rooms/beds. However there will be probably an over supply of rooms because thousands of fans who might have travelled to the other four bidding countries won't be turning up in Qatar. The expense, the heat, the social restrictions, hell...the paucity of decent boozing locations and the 'there's no there, there' attributes of Qatar mean the 2022 WC will be souless, with little local culture or colour, and a vast write down for the tourist dollar. Can anyone imagine this happening in Qatar? or this Instead we will see mostly this:
  18. Mon dieu Baron, do you not know that the French are staging a secretive WC contre le MaFIFA in 2016. It is to celebrate the 201st anniversary of getting the merde kicked out of them by les Anglais et les allegagnes en Waterloo
  19. Throw in Monaco, Bermuda, Brunei, Luxembourg and Lichtenstein...the cashed up petite WC future hosts according to the new MaFIFA guidelines
  20. Another thought...how is it that the same MaFIFA that obviously listened and liked the Russian bid where venues will be separated by hundreds of kilometres, with teams possibly having to jet from Vologograd to Sochi, or Kaliningrad to Yekaterinburg, then turns around and reacts positively to a bid with venues all within an hour's drive? I guess so long as you build shatloads of new stadia doesn;t matter how far the poor bloody footballers and tourists have to travel...so long as the MaFIFA execs have their concrete wonders built in their name. By the way found this nugget of information...Albert Speer Jnr's architectural firm is behind at least 5 of Qatar's stadia design. Keeping up Vati's tradition of big game architecture hmmm
  21. Athan, the IOC won't be touching Doha or for that matter an Indian city with a ten foot barge pole for at least 20 years because in the former case the stench around MaFIFA's selection process is something the IOC will never ever want to endure (and as discussed above probably is now incapable of sinking to such a depth) and as for India the whole Delhi shatfight has soiled the Indian brand for any major sporting event aside from cricket for the foreseeable future. South Africa on the other hand...well 2020 is a definite maybe. Plus now there could be a bit of oneupmanship between the IOC and MaFIFA as the IOC tries to keep up with the football world's interest in hosts such as SA, Russia and Qatar. The IOC may now want to spread the Olympic vision (and hence revenue and publicity gains) to Africa to counter MaFIFA's evangelical spreading of football and SA (i.e. Durban) could be the place to mount the counter-attack.
  22. Okay, some question that have got to be asked...how much money will Qatar be spending on security, will the claustrophobic nature of Doha in a heavy security environment have a serious impact on the event (putting aside the obvious problems with heat and expense) as a deterrent for tourists/fans, and will Qatar be more vulnerable to terrorist attack or interference because of it's proximity to Middle Eastern countries with a history of terrorist activity (e.g. Yemen and Saudi Arabia)?
  23. Assuming that the bid rules don;t change then first off you'd have to say that a CONCACAF bid would be front and centre for prime pozzie. However there is every chance that the US may take their ball home and not bid. Also there is no reason to expect things will stay the same in terms of the voting rules; they will change just like the format of the WC itself have changed when it suits the president. For example hypothetically Blather could be gone by 2018 replaced by say Bin Hamman who could then argue for either a dumping of the rotation policy or even (depending on the Chinese) the MaFIFA could give the AFC two bites at the cherry (Qatar the Mid East WC followed by the east Asian Chinese WC). There could also be the potential (remote yes) that Australia either disengages with AFC entirely or again depending on China pushes itself as a joint Oceania/AFC bid with Hamman onside (if possible). Having said that I can't realistically believe an Oz bid could be seriously considered. So maybe we might be looking at Canada and the US as separate bids from CONCACAF, Morocco or Nigeria for CAF and China or Australia as a bolter from AFC. Not sure about Argentina & Uruguay, but maybe Chile or Venezuala for Conmebol.
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